FWIW, Jeff Miller (Pinball Pimp Stencils) was the one who recommended Durham's. He said he uses it all the time as part of his cabinet painting process.

I'm going to work on stripping the rest of the paint this weekend and then touch up some edges with wood epoxy. That'll give me more time to think about how to address the planking (Bondo, Durham's, Fix It All, or other). I picked up some Durham's today and practiced on some spare plywood with different mixing ratios for viscosity, from thicker putty for filling in holes to thinner glaze to smooth out scratches. Not too bad. It's more flexible than bondo in that way, and more importantly it does not set as quickly as bondo giving me more time to work. Within 20 minutes it was set hard and touchable. In under an hour, it was sandable. 4 hours later, hard as rock. At that 4 hour mark, I poured a little water on it and it did NOT soften up....still hard as a rock.

Yeah I’ve used Durham's for years I’m just surprised you could use it on a moisture damaged piece, good to know. I used it to fix German Shepherd claw marks in my front door a month ago. Good stuff.

Has anyone tried using a thin laminate to remove all grain from a project?

As I mentioned before I'm still learning wms games. I wasn't aware of the coil difference so I ordered what ever coils the manual called for. Is there a benefit to using parallel coils?

The reason to switch is so your EOS (End Of Stroke) switches last longer. Here is a link to a thread that talks about doing it. There are lots of discussions on the subject.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-upgradingrebuilding-flippers/page/2#post-453694

What product? Would need to be something thick/rigid enough to bridge the gaps so that nothing would telegraph through. That’s why RadCals don’t need much prep.

No, that would add thickness to the cab, that would have to be accounted for, similar to the radcal cut outs for side rails and coin doors—just not a good look.

If you want to do it right:
Sand the artwork down (or use the acetone strip method—preference)
Remove dust
Skim with fiberglass resin & let dry
Sand with 60 or 80 grit, leveling as needed.
Remove dust then sand with 100 or 150 grit
Skim with dolphin glaze
Sand with 150 grit, then 220 grit, checking for level with you hand.
Clean and paint primer.
Sand with 220 and fill with dolphin glade and sand/primer as needed until fully smooth.

It would work, but filler is fast and easy.

Chris Hutchins just fiberglasses the whole thing if needed with tiger hair or similar glass fiber resin.

Then final glaze, primer and paint.

Its quick and easy and can be done in a couple hours.

I saw this and though I would try it.

Ya I know some people trash this guy but I like what he did on this cab. I have several cabs that need to be restored. My Seawitch has the worst planking I have seen so far. Yes I know there will still be work that needs to be done to get the cab ready for veneer. The veneer is from Rockler, birch and is only 1/42 inch thick. It's fairly cheap, $60 for a 96 x 24 inch roll. So 2 of these will be more than enough to do an entire cab I think, depending on if the rear of the backbox needs it.

I hate sanding, also hate the fast setting of epoxy and the smell. I already have the tools and the cement, so I thought why not?!

Ah ya threw me off, different thread but I got ya. If I hadn't of bought the flipper coils already, I would go for it. I was reading through the HS manual on the flipper page about how to correctly gap the EOS and lane change switches. I think if I follow this, the EOS should last a while. Well I hope anyway. Is there a specific parallel coil for HS in case I ever do upgrade?

Another thing I noticed, is the EOS mounting brackets on my game are short and there's no space to zip tie the caps in place.

The coils for HS are FL-11630 Here is a thread: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/high-speed-flipper-coils#post-6048325

You will need new base plates as well. It is a big upgrade but worth it.

Looking for a method on how to flatten a cabinet side after applying bondo. I've used bondo to do similar work on a couple of previous cabinets but hadn't run into this problem: After sanding down the bondo, I've got high and low areas that feel "wavy" as you run your hand across the surface. I likely caused this by applying to much pressure on the orbital sander as I was sanding down the clumpy areas of the initial bondo application. I'm not sure how to rectify this without potentially making it worse. My research on belt sanders suggests that might be too aggressive. The area of needed coverage might be too large for a hand or electric planer - I've never used either, and the only usage examples I can find on YouTube are with small boards or 2x4's and not with something this large.

What do you guys suggest for getting this surface flatter?

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Fiberglass resin. Skim the entire thing with it. See my post above.

I just did a heavily planked cabinet. Came out glass smooth.

The bondo is already smooth. Wouldn't the fiberglass resin just follow the high and low contours of the bondo and wind up with the same wavy-ness? Or are you suggesting to sand off the bondo entirely and start over? I'm happy with the bondo coverage and smoothness...there's got to be a technique, method, or tool to get it flat.

Skim with a wide blade spreader so it spans gaps and deposits material in the low spots. A wide sanding blockwill also help.

You could try using a straight edge by dragging it from end to end and mark the low spots with a pencil. Use an 8 inch taping blade for drywall to fill in low spots with resin. Remember plywood is a natural material and your working with a 43 year old cab that has seen better days. There will most likely be some warpage of the wood that you may have to live with.

This is the correct technique to address the issue.

You may need to pour the fiberglass resin twice. First time use the large spreader. Then use a large flat sanding block, or 1/3rd sheet sander. Once you start to see the wood show through on the peaks, apply the resin a second time, building up the valleys more.

Not sure why fiberglass has to be used?
buy a cheap black can of spray. very lightly spray dust the area that you want to work. let if dry for a few mins. then use a sanding block and sand it. All the paint will we remove from the high spot first so now you know your high spot. any painting that still there, is your low spots which bondo can taken care of. repeat this a few times until you get a nice level surface

I think it has to do with how warped a cabinet is. Some are mild enough to just get by with primer and paint. Others need more extreme measures where the fiberglass resin and Bondo come in.

In my case, it's pretty minor. The cabinet side was flat after stripping and sanding the paint but I've got some highs and lows after applying bondo to cover up/protect the planking that was present. I just need to remove some of those highs where I apparently got a little bondo-happy.

I like the idea of the black paint dusting to mark the areas and using a sanding block to get them down. Will be trying that this weekend.

I've been reading this thread with some interest - I've been painting and stenciling cabinets for at least 15 years. There are so many new techniques and certainly people willing to make the cabinets of EM and early SS machines far superior to what they looked like off the factory floor. Hearing about using fiberglass to glaze is a new one for me, and it seems fantastic if you're willing to go that far. Like anything, I suppose if you are willing to learn the techniques and invest in the tools / supplies you need, you will have great results. Seems like a lot for a guy doing a single cabinet. I expect someone seeing that level of result will want to do more. I can see myself in that regard - just not with cabinet refinishing.

My process has changed a little over the years but it still remains pretty much the same. I always sand cabinets - no stripping - just my preference. I use an orbital and let the old paint fill imperfect & planking areas by not sanding it all the way to the wood. Troubled areas get bondo in most cases. An orbital with 120 grit grinds that down in short time. I shoot with primer / filler and sand most of that away with 240 / 320 grit, examining the result. I can usually see where attention is needed as I see some of the original cab color bleed through. I use wood fill sparingly, mostly Bondo since I know it'll stay in place. Another coat of primer / filler. Another sanding in the 300/400 range. On decent cabinets, this usually leaves a nice smooth finish that is ready to spray the base color. On cabinets that have been in barns for years or have had other moisture issues - or were built with crappy plywood (Stern / Bally / WMS all have occasional crap grade plywood), and depending upon the title, I tend to let the planking be. Some of that deep grain look can actually look cool. But I agree with what I think most on here want as an outcome - a perfectly smooth cabinet. It is hard. That Meteor cabinet is very rough. If I had one in that condition, I think I would try the fiberglass skim technique. I would hate to deal with Bondo on such a large surface area.

Good luck everyone. It's great to see so many people making these cabinets look better and the games live longer!
-Rob Craig

Making progress on that Meteor cabinet - got the first primer coat on this morning. Have a few drips to correct - will do that tomorrow morning and apply a second primer coat as well. Targeting next weekend to get the base color black down.

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I like the fiber glass resin idea for the planking. I just got through locking all my planked wood in with 8 oz. of superglue. Resin would be cheaper and do a good job of penetrating the planks. I would not trust just Bondo to lock in planked wood since Bondo is topcoat material. But opinions were all over the place on my thread.

Get a 2 x 4 about 2 feet long. Get some peelable spray adhesive from an automotive paint supply shop. Get a couple of sheets of sandpaper. Spray some adhesive and stick the sandpaper to the 2 x 4. You now have a nice, long, flat surface that you can block sand with. You will be knocking down the high spots and not digging into the low spots. When the sand paper is worn out, peel it off and add some fresh sandpaper.

As mentioned by some others, spray on a real light dust coat of black and sand it lightly. The reveal coating will be sanded away from the high spots, The black dust coat will remain in the low areas. Apply what ever your favorite filler is and repeat.

How did it turn out?

2x4 isnt flat enough.

Just get aluminum T-bar with a 2 or 3 inch base and glue the sand paper to it with contact cement or spray adhedive.

I originally made them for perfecting the leading and trailing edges of my R/C model airplanes and to flatten out any bumps in the sheeting.

You can get it in 2 or 3 or 4 ft lengths

I have an assortment of them. I rounded the sharp edges to eliminate scuffing.

https://store.buymetal.com/aluminum/tee-hex-zee/tee-6063-t52/aluminum-tee-6063-t52-2-0.75-0.125.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&adpos=&scid=scplpT632.34.125T52&sc_intid=T632.34.125T52&gclid=CjwKCAjw5c6LBhBdEiwAP9ejGwhNVyguF_0knbjYgTKCln9rGMfNAPC25Nt8YdcgbJz4geyXXdEMKxoCWNIQAvD_BwE

If I’m building a modern cabinet, what do I need to consider, or know when I’m attaching the playfield slider brackets in the cab? (I’m using the Stern ones from Pinball Life). Are there specific measurements that they need to align with? I’m guessing they can be placed lower, or higher depending on the desired angle, and height of things attached to the playfield. But are there any common rules?

I hope this isn’t already answered somewhere in this, or another thread. I couldn’t find it anywhere, but that could just be a user error.

I haven't gotten to it yet. I got side tracked with a Cyclone pf swap and doing a hardtop on an HS.

Getting ready to strip the paint and start the sand/fill/prime/paint/stencil process.

Any pointers on how best to tackle the stains? My plan was to sand as best as I could and prime. Is there another method (chemical or otherwise) to address the stains before I sand and prime?
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After sanding, all I do is prime with original oil based kilz.

Yeah, I would consider using Kilz. In a perfect world you could leave it just sanded, but I think for preservation (and mold prevention) in this particular case it might be best to prime the whole thing. Took a beating!

Thanks. Yeah, it’s seen a few beers dropped inside the cabinet in its 40 years.

Acetone almost done, sanding and fill next.

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Getting ready to restore my first cabinet (Paragon) and have no prior experience.
I read through most of the thread but still have a few questions:

Since it's lead paint that I'm removing I was thinking about using Citristrip for the majority of the paint (never worked with it before) but I have heard mixed reviews. Most of the stuff that is recommended seems to be very caustic and fumy. Anybody worked with Citristrip before?
I figure I'll have to neutralize and clean it afterwards as well, but getting water onto a stripped cabinet seems not like a bright idea to me. Any insight into that?
Sorry for the stupid questions, but I have zero experience and aside from the Garage I don't have really a workspace, so I don't want to contaminate it too much with lead if I can avoid it. It's getting into the freezing temps here too, that's gonna be a problem as well I imagine.

I tried it briefly for paint removal, not so good for me. Great for getting sticky gunk off, but did little to remove the original paint from a 40 year old cabinet. Acetone is caustic and fumy, but for me it's the safest way to (easily) remove these old paint jobs and get down to bare wood. What's more....as you pointed out, these old paint jobs are lead-based. With chemical removal, you don't have to worry about lead dust flying around and getting into your lungs, or someone else's lungs, or settling on things in your garage to be kicked up in the air later and affect someone.

Sand away the dirt and grime either with a power sander or by hand. When you put on your first primer coat, use Kilz.

You can hook up a shop vac to your power sander to minimize the dust/debris that flies around, but I still wouldn't do it in a garage (especially with lead based paint). You may want to wait for warmer weather and do it outside if you're not chemically stripping (and you should that outside as well unless your garage is well ventilated and you leave the garage door open). Even if you get the cabinet stripped now, you won't be able to put down any primer or paint until temps get north of 55F. Or you have a heated, well ventilated garage.

I've done four restores now and one of the biggest lessons I've learned is......patience. Use the winter months to do "indoor" portions of the project:

- Make a detailed list of new/replacement parts you'll need when you reassemble your pin, then spent the winter chasing them down!
- If you're using Pinball Pimp stencils, know that the adhesive used on them is good for 12-18 months, so keep that window in mind if you're buying your stencil ahead of time.
- Strip the playfield of parts
- Clean and rebuild mechs, tearing them down and running what you can through ultrasonic cleaners and tumblers
- Clean your wire harness in the dishwasher, reflowing all the solder points when you put it back on
- Repair / bullet-proof your PCBs (or send them to someone who can do that). Have them all nice and ready for when you're cabinet's done and you're ready to re-assemble.
- Send bling-worthy stuff out to be powder coated if that's your thing.

I was afraid you would say that, but it is what it is then and I'll have to wait for temps to raise and do it outside.

I got a Paragon that's in players condition and I found another one that's from a usability standpoint just a cabinet, mechs and playfield wiring harness. The majority of the rest is missing or in so bad condition its pretty much useless. So, I was hoping I could start restoring this while still being able to play on the other one.
I already got a new board set from Alltek and got on the list for a CPR playfield. This machine will be bolted down to the floor once its finished and with the spare parts i may be able to create another players condition machine for someone else to enjoy. Gonna buy legs, flipper rebuild kits and whatever else may missing or broken. Looking also into one of those ultrasonic cleaners for that.

Since I'm a total noob and don't have any equipment whatsoever I was thinking to purchase this sprayer: Fuji Semi Pro 2
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00D4NPMJE/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_9CVJ5Z73SKQ8S3YX9ZBN

Rustoleum in the colors that I would need seem to be sold out everywhere so I was thinking Sherwin Williams ProClassic Waterborne Interior Acrylic Enamel because I can tint that to what I need and it should dry quicker than oil based, but am not sure how well that would spray with the above mentioned device and how much to thin it and what tip size is needed. I figure the Killz I will have to roll/brush and let sit for 30 days no matter what.

The only other option from what I have seen in the thread if I don't want to spend a lot on a huge compressor is to parallel connect two 6 Gallon Pancake compressors and hope thats enough for the HF Spray gun that Vid mentioned...

Any insight there is welcome as well and thank you for your advise, appreciate it!

Acetone worked great for me. Two gallons of acetone, two rolls of tough paper towels, and chemical gloves. Should take less than an hour if you really take your time.

Good luck with your project! When I did my first one a few years ago, I had no idea what I was getting into, and it only piqued my interest more to gather additional skills around electronics, wood repair, painting, and the like. And you'd be surprised (maybe not) that for virtually anything you want to try to do but don't know how, there's a video of someone doing it and explaining it on YouTube. Some good, some bad, some great. But the more info the better! And it's a great hobby that, unfortunately, takes up a lot of space....

All my painting, including Kilz primer applications, is done with rattle cans. One of these days I might invest in better air compressor (mine's a little portable 2-gallon job) and explore painting that way. But in the meantime....nothing wrong with laying done Kilz from a rattle can (Lowes, Home Depot). FWIW, lay down one coat of Kilz, wait 48hrs, lay down the second coat of Kilz, wait a week, then put down the first base coat color. I usually let 3-4 days elapse between color applications.

Someone suggested Rustoleum Painters Touch 2x Marigold, Apple Red and some color of blue that within a 100 mile radius I can find like almost no stock anywhere or via Amazon $150 for 6 cans (which seems ridiculous).

That's why I started looking at the HVLP stuff, but the initial cost is pretty high...

https://www.walmart.com/search?q=Rustoleum+Painters+Touch+2x+Marigold

Looks like Apple red is on clearance but might be available, not sure about Marigold. Go check your local Walmart, don’t rely on what their website says is in stock because their paint department always tends to be a hot mess. You can also pick up some Krylon triple thick while you are there

Yikes! I picked up a 6-pack of Marigold Yellow from Amazon back in May for $24 (perfect yellow for Mata Hari). The same 6-pack is now listed on Amazon for $105!! Crazy...

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Found some of those rattle cans an hour away, how many do you need per layer of the base color coat?
I have absolutely no idea.
4 for outside, 2 for head and 2 for the top half of the inside maybe after 2 layers of kilz?

That should be good for two layers of base coat plus having a little extra for touch-ups. Plus maybe 1 can per stencil color for the combined cab and backbox with another can as just-in-case extra.

Another dumb question:

When I use shop towels drenched in acetone to solve the paint and scrape it off, i was thinking to throw the waste into a 5 gallon home Depot bucket.
Now the question is, will the acetone drenched paper towels and paint slurry dissolve the bucket.
Not planning to reuse the bucket but can i safely put a lid on and throw it away after i leave it standing outside for a day, or what is the proper process there?

I know i will need rubber or neoprene gloves because acetone will attack nitrile ones and a respirator.

Don’t put a lid on it. Just set it outside, uncovered, until everything is fully dry. Then you can cover it and dispose.

I usually leave them in a bucket, lid off, in the sun (driveway) to accelerate them drying. Even when dry, do not dispose them in the regular trash - they should be dropped offed at a local hazardous waste center.

https://www.wikihow.com/Dispose-of-Acetone

When I paint my cabs and use spray, I usually use the amount of cans below to finish a game. I use a little more than most since I paint the INSIDE of my cabs as well

BASE = 14-16 cans
PRIMER = 14-16 cans
STENCILS = 1-2 cans for each color

I only do 2-3 light whispy coats on stencils just enough to cover. You DO NOT want to go thick or full coat on stencils like you would a basecoat

Pimp

Got the Fuji Semi Pro2 as a Christmas present from my best friend, so I'm going to use that out now. Am really excited!

I'll be ordering the stencil from you as soon as I have the cabinet prepped, may be a little though due to temps.

I restored my 1975 Bally Wizard cabinet
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Seriously? Home depot and Walmart have them for little over $5

None in a 150 mile radius when I was looking. May have restocked since.