I should dig out my roll of frisket and start practicing, this weekend might be a good time for it! And Mona lisa... Wouldn't that be a pretty odd but interesting theme for a pin? =)
I should dig out my roll of frisket and start practicing, this weekend might be a good time for it! And Mona lisa... Wouldn't that be a pretty odd but interesting theme for a pin? =)
here is a good candidate for restoration ebay.com link: The Machine Bride of Pinbot pinball machine Williams NO RESERVE
Quoted from freddy:here is a good candidate for restoration ebay.com link » The Machine Bride of Pinbot Pinball Machine Williams No Reserve
I thought my playfield was rough before my restore. That one is going to be a project....
Yeah i agree! "This machine works great, looks great, and is a blast to play." and "Playfield does have some minor wear".. a blast to play sure but looks great and have minor wear... not so sure =) Look at the tip of the left flipper! Anyways, pictures are there and seller says its worn.. so up to the buyer. If I got the chance earlier I might have bought it, if it was closer that is. Though the price is a bit high for this particulare one.
Quoted from BadBrad97:I thought my playfield was rough before my restore. That one is going to be a project....
i meant a good candidate for the new play field, and rest as the overall cab looks good
Yeah, the cab looks allright and the PF is probably salvageable but not really worth it now with the new pf around the corner.
Have you been keeping tabs on your costs Ringmaster? Or are you living in ignorant bliss of that? I'm always curious how much it costs to do a really detailed job like this. The stuff I do usually doesn't end up being more than a couple hundred usually, depending on how badly it is beat up.
I have all the reciepts and orders saved but have not yet dared to summarize them... I might do it later on. It feels expensive so for but mostly I think its because of all the special tools ive bought. Tumbler, socket wrenches (we only have mm style in our garages over here), air compressor, paints, paint gun, the screen for the backbox text, ink for the backbox, sanding paper (a lot), orbital sander, heat gun, soldering station, mask for protection when painting, 2 part auto clear, airbrush colors and the list goes on and on...
Next project, which will probably be my high speed, wont be the same since i will have all the tools ready. I hope I will still enjoy the hobby after this restoration and maybe even do some restorations without having to build a new cabinet.. .. and.. if I can sell one or two machines after that maybe I can break even with the tools and things. In the end it will hopefully be worth it, both economically and fun-wise.
Quoted from freddy:i meant a good candidate for the new play field, and rest as the overall cab looks good
I agree with you on that. I wish a new playfield was available last year when I did mine. Its about the same effort almost doing a playfield swap as doing a playfield restore.
More pictures of the insert fixing process. I noticed that wetsanding the inserts in alcohol when sanding with 300 and finer grit works like a charm! And as vid 1900 said, the micro cracks were in the old top coat which is great because I am able to completely remove it. My biggest concern is if the epoxy glue will be able to hold the inserts in place. Fingers crossed...
Top left pic shows how I masked one of the 3 bumper areas with painters tape to sand the bare wood part. Its not the cutest masking but it works good for sanding. This is something that takes a lot of time since it requires a lot of concentration. Not so fun but as usual I am looking forward to see the first layer of clear.
Will post a pic of the whole field soon to give an idea of what its progressed into.
Quoted from TheRingMaster:My biggest concern is if the epoxy glue will be able to hold the inserts in place.
scuff the sides up before glue give it some tooth as Vid would say.
Yes especially the green one looks good in the pic since it's got alcohol on it for a preview. I've sanded the sides with 80-100 grit and it will give a little tooth to it. I've tried the Loctite plastic primer too but I am doubtful cause it's made for CA glues and not epoxies. Loctite says, I've mailed them, they don't have one for epoxies and did not know if it will make any difference or not.
Looking good.
I can't recall if you have restored your coin door yet but if not I wanted to share that I found a good way to get the texture. The previous owner of my game sanded the coin door smooth and painted the door with flat black. The back was full of rust from what it looks like bar drinks being spilled on the game.
I sanded it down and stripped the old paint off. Then used Krylon textured paint to get the texture. I didn't care about the color so I bought what the store had (gray) as I knew I would paint over it. Looks like it is meant for outdoor furniture. Let that dry and then painted with black paint and put a couple layers of clear over it once the base dried. Cleaned up the mechs, harness, clear inserts, etc and reassembled. It's not an exact match of the original style but I like it. Looks a lot like my Stern doors.
Anyways, figured I'd share to help you out if you haven't done this part yet. I was going to start a thread of my own with my restore but figured there is no need for 2 of them and yours is documenting things real well.
Here's a couple of pics of how it looks now.
I second that! Really nice door! I did mine way back and skipped the texture all together. Like it without it too. Looks brand new like yours. I may try that tip on future doors. The one on my HS is kicked inwards so I don't know what I will do with it. Maybe it's possible to straighten it or I'll try to find that type of door that was also used on arcade cabinets back in the day. Or the easiest is to get a WPC style door. Have not decided yet but as close to original without the hassle of straighten it would be best =)
Here is a picture of the progress with the PF so far. Its getting closer...
Whats left is not that much but time consuming. Sand all inserts that are left, fix a few wood spots, sand the insides of all holes, reglue all inserts, a bit more ME over everything, cleanup with naphtha. Then the first layer of clear will finally go down. I think it would take me one more day if I could work on it continiously but.. Ive got plenty of other projects so lets say one week
I hope too but I think it will be a pain! But gone this far I just need to finish this at all costs =) masking will also be a hard one. Easy in theory but difficult when you're gonna start. The project is starting to feel like a "not wanna go through it again" thing but, if it ends up good I will probably sit there sanding and prepping again in the future.
Hey Andy I just added Comets pop cap rings, red on top white on bottom and boy do they ever light up the pf around the pops and the upper mini pf above them. I actually see the ball in the space now. It looks GREAT. Thought you'd like to see how it looks if you want to do it. They are at max brightness right now, gonna play it for a while and see if I have to turn the brightness down a little.
IMGA0537.JPG IMGA0538.JPG IMGA0539.JPG IMGA0543.JPG IMGA0544.JPG@MustangPaul, that looks really nice! I like the star feeling that it gives me, like twinkling stars in the night sky. Goes well with the theme and I must admit I'm tempted to try it! =)
@Curbfeeler, good to hear! Will check your F14 and send you scans for a test! It would be a huge advantage to have stencils for the inserts. Otherwise I will sit here masking by hand forever...
https://img-f.pinside.com/201412/2089388/328452.jpg
mustang paul those caps look good and i like the red lights around her crown.
Thanks but the more I look at it the more I think the red jewel caps with red/white rings would look better, I might give that a try and I like they way I can see the stars on the pf by the pops. I left the red incandesents in the helmet to match the pop color and because I like the way they fade, with leds that would not happen.
Very red spotted. That's why I've been thinking of getting the jewel caps to help break-up that hot spotting. I have red jewel caps with red/white rings on other games and it really does help spread out the light.
Ok, more stuff to learn which will delay this project but make it better in the end
Just had to try out the method of masking the inserts and paint them instead of using water slide decals. Feels like a better method if you have the oppurtunity. I think, even if you are using water slides youll have to go through the pain of making vectorized pics of the scans to make it look decent. Thats why I happened to order a plotter the other day. Worth it just for this project? No.. but Ive got a HS waiting for restoration too and that PF is in need of a restoration.. no joke..
Also, thanks to Curbfeeler and his F14 restoration thread for convincing me to try this. (Paul, he beat you to it but im sure you can find something else for me to buy.. ^^)
Whats seen in the picture below is gonna put even my patience to a test. If you don't hear anything more from me in this thread you know its because it killed me.
scape.jpg
Great Cheddar! Im curious too! Though it feels a bit like ... "sigh..." that I need to learn all of this too. Im lucky im an experienced photoshop user though even though the vector stuff is new to me.
Quoted from TheRingMaster:(Paul, he beat you to it but im sure you can find something else for me to buy.. ^^)
Not that expensive that's for sure. If you can handle PS I'm sure you can get a handle on this. I've never done any vectoring but I know you get great results. Have fun with it.
Here is an issue I ran into when sanding the inserts. I noticed that on the back of them (though most visible on the clear ones) there is some kind of sticky film that makes them look faded from the front. I had theories about what this was.. either clear coat from when they cleared the back of the PF. Or glue. I think most likely it is glue residues.
The small inserts, like the 3/4" squares, are full of this but the larger ones like in this picture have it on the edges where the glue has been.
I tried to clean this up. A cotton stick with different things on it. Tried water, very hot water, alcohol, naphtha and acetone. None of them worked that good. And a word of warning to anyone digging this deep into their pinball machines, do NOT use acetone on it because it will make it worse, like crystallize the glue and make it opaque white instead of hazy. Ive tried to scrape it off with a razor blade too but its really hard to get off.
The best method seem to be hot water, then let it dry and then use a cotton stick (whats the word for those? plastic sticks with cotton on the ends..) and try to scrape the glue off. Works like 60% good but always something. I will have to test if it comes off easier if you heat it up with a heat gun.
Anyway, cleaning inserts like this is something I would do if they were impossible to find. Doing it if new ones are available I cant justify it. So, guess what... more delay before the first layer of clear! Will get some new and snap them in there.
Quoted from MustangPaul:...Have fun with it.
Definitely will! =)
Gonna try to cut some frisket as a test though ive heard its a bit too flimsy for this. But would be nice to do a test before I get the better vinyl masking material and a decent transfer tape.
Quoted from TheRingMaster:(whats the word for those? plastic sticks with cotton on the ends..)
Cotton swab. They also make foam ones too. That stuff is most likely glue, I hope it wasn't the kind of glue that melts plastic.
Thanks! =)
Its the epoxy glue (or whatever they used) they used for glueing the inserts in. But I think it reacts to alcohol and gets worse. I wet sanded the inserts in denaturated alcohol, not sure why but guess because I had it next to me. And some of it got on the back of them. Will sand in water next time as long as it's not on the PF. Live and learn as you said before Paul.
just thought I'd mention that if you guys ever need a hand vectoring some artwork and have the scanned art send it on over. I have illustrator and a Cintiq and I'd be happy to help out. (please note it would be helpful if the artwork scanned and sent over are actual sized, which shouldn;t have to be said but you wouldn't believe what is sent out at times lol...)
at any rate I'm happy to lend a hand guys
great thread btw
Quoted from anubis2night:just thought I'd mention that if you guys ever need a hand vectoring some artwork and have the scanned art send it on over. I have illustrator and a Cintiq and I'd be happy to help out. (please note it would be helpful if the artwork scanned and sent over are actual sized, which shouldn;t have to be said but you wouldn't believe what is sent out at times lol...)
at any rate I'm happy to lend a hand guys
great thread btw
GREAT offer.
Indeed, thanks anubis2night!
I think what I've scanned is actual size or bigger, not low res and too small at least. If I send something I will measure it to make sure. Very nice offer of you! =)
Quoted from TheRingMaster:Still learning... =)
Each color will get its own layer in inkscape.. then I can export each one into the cameo software and cut stencils for each one of them. At least it wont need to hurry to get it finished for christmas.
heart.jpg 104 KB
Is that InkScape? Are you using the colour separation function as your starting point? It works really well.
I have just completed the full redrawn artwork of Eight Ball, I am planning to do a full reprint onto the playfield. The most reliable container I found for my vector drawings is a plain old PDF. My commercial printing place can read it reliably. The only thing is InkScape will not export the layers in the PDF, all the entities are stacked in order but all in one massive layer.
Hi BJM-Maxx!
Yep its inkscape. I am not using the colour separation function, not that I am aware of anyways.. still very new to it. But I changed the stroke color to the pink one since it stands out very well. Thanks to Curbfeeler for the inspiration =)
Sounds like a massive task you just went through.. but the result will get very nice i guess! I have not really thought of the pdf and stuff yet, just to get it into the cameo software safe and sound since im gonna do stencils and airbrush. But someday I will have things printed too and then the pdf might work.. thanks for pointing out!
Hey Andy, okay back after a trip across the country and returning from that to find myself buried in work. I've got the scans you sent and dig through them tonight and set out some pointers. We'll get this going for you!
Dan
Okay Andy, here we go. So we're going to get to know the Cameo, okay? All your first cuts and first layers of paint we'll plan to wipe off with alcohol. They are practice, okay? For fun, if you will.
So we won't start out with lettering yet (too complex). Let's start with solid fields. I think light blue will be a nice place to start out.
So the way I do vectors in Inkscape is I draw the anchors (odd number pics) and I drag the curves (even number pics). Sometimes it's trial and error to get the right location and number of anchors, and sometimes you have to move the anchors (select them without the others and move them with the keyboard). Then re-try dragging curves. It does take practice.
I found a very low res copy of the playfield off vpforums but here are some low-res demos attached. When I trace for real I use this bright pink but I also use no fill and a stroke of 1px. A very, very thin line.
So find a place on your playfield you want to try this, and let's practice tracing the shape of the mask. Set your anchor points, bend the curves. Set the anchor points, bend the curves. It's time consuming, but it's simple steps.
1.png 2.png 3.png 4.png 5.png 6.pngHere's something else you can do to start out. Do the pop rings by making a circle in inkscape. My circle in these pics is perfect, but my scan from vpforums is warped. It's fine for a demo.
Select this circle then right click it to duplicate. Then Path...Outset to perfectly expand the duplicated circle into a bigger and perfectly expanded version of that circle with just the right offset from the first circle. Repeat and repeat to make the whole set. From these masks you can paint perfect circles.
I actually used the freeware version of the cameo software for this on my F14. A circle is a circle, no? I was able to "outset" and "inset" my chevrons, also to make perfect keylines. Very handy as you can see from my F14 thread.
Good Luck, Sir! Keep us posted.
Dan
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