Bride of Pinbot 2.0
Dutch Pinball, 2014
Machine: Bride of Pinbot, The
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Just joined the club, but have not installed the kit yet, I have a couple of questions:
is the code up to a good place?
is the game still worth upgrading the 2.0 kit to?
replayability... is it there?
I ask these because I still love the original and have no problem keeping it stock, however... it's 2.0... should I go for it?
Quoted from Rarehero:You can still play original code with 2.0, so it's 2 games in one.
Yes sir, I'm aware, just want to make sure it's worth while, unless there's someone out there desperately needing it
Quoted from Rarehero:As much as I hate Dutch Pinball right now - I'll still say that bop 2.0 is an incredible mod/upgrade/modernization of BOP. Whether it's right for you - that's up to you! Maybe check out some YouTube videos of it if you haven't already?
I've played the game a few times at tpf , but there were glitches, it looked cool , and there was only one kit left, I couldn't resist after turning down the pin I went to tpf to buy
Quoted from jsa:I tried electrical tape, packaging tape, felt, nothing worked very well and often these tapes would cause too much friction inserting the glass.
However, when I tried Pinball Pro's tape, it was thin enough to allows the glass to move yet the surface of the tape created a better contact to reduce rattle.
https://pinballpro.net/shop/anti-rattle-tape-ar-1/
I use it on my tron le, I had to put 2 strips on each side because of the bass
Quoted from Rarehero:Just hit the heartbeat ramp or an inlane switch. On the real BOP, the second you hit that ramp switch, you hear the heartbeat...on the emulated version, the ball's way past the switch when you hear that sound. At the end of the day, it's still awesome that it's 2 games in one, and I think 1.0 sounds great thru the 2.0 sound system...but if you're used to the original hardware, the sound delay is really obvious. There are no sound delays on 2.0, though...just 1.0.
Seems like there would be a no input lag version of pinmame that could be used
Quoted from lyonsden:As an FYI to anyone doing an update to V1.19, I ran into a problem that caused the boot sequence to get stuck in a loop. I had added a custom ROM for BoP1 (bop_l8) to the ROM directory in pinmame while running V1.16. During the update, this ROM didn't get copied to V1.19 while the configuration file for for the system did. This cause the boot sequence to check for the bop_l8 rom, not find it, fail, and restart the boot sequence. After the update, I manually copied the rom over, which fixed the problem. Thanks to Koen at DP for pointing me to the log file that helped me find and fix the problem.
what did the custom rom do different for bop1?
Quoted from lyonsden:L8 has the billion point bug fixed and the ghosting patch applied to l7
Right on, I guess I'll be looking for the L8 for the bop1 ... unless anyone here has a link to the L8?
Curious if anyone wants to or has tried to change the music yet? I have some ideas of what I'd like the music to be changed to.
I'd like a nudge to know what needs to be done before I dive in 
Quoted from mgpasman:As I understand, they are .wav files that are looped. The files are all accessable via the file system so very easy to change. So create a simple .wav file to see what the effect is, and take it from there. Probably MUCH more easy to experiment if you make the PC accessible via remote/network shares
.
Is the machine running windows, or Linux ?
Quoted from lyonsden:Metamorphosis. Haven't made the big wheel billion (yet).
When you go back to the original Bop, do you notice any switch lag? If you do notice it, does it bother you?? I've been hesitant to install bop 2.0
Quoted from lyonsden:From your ad:
$2000-base game
$2000-Bop 2.0 package with color dmd.
$500-new Bop 2.0 decals and translite
$100-new rails
$300-new ramps
$1000-brand new playfield
(included with 2.0 kit) -flipper fidelity speakers and amp
$15-new shooter rod assembly
-lit flipper button
-comet leds throughout
-the good pop bumper led rings from pinball life
-new legs
-new colored posts and purple silicone rubbers
-custom bop apron magnet
$50 -new upper playfield
-helmet super nice original
$100-new faces
I'm guessing around $6k in parts. Labor costs really depends. Some people like doing it, some people don't. Not sure how to charge for it unless it was done by one of the big names in restorations, but let's say $1k. You are the second owner, it has been enjoyed, etc. Say it has 500 plays since being redone. At $1 per game, take $500 off.
$7k seems high, $6500 seems more reasonable.
Could you please help me find a $2000 base bop!?? I’d really appreciate it
Quoted from lyonsden:That is the kind of game you want if you are swapping playfields, putting in a 2.0 kit, and redecaling the cabinet.
Which Is exactly what I’m looking for
Quoted from lyonsden:Wish I had one -- it would be yours.
Nice bro, I appreciate that!
I need to be clear... I’ll be on the hunt again soon, or something... all my efforts at the moment are here...
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/backyard-gameroom-in-the-desert/page/3#post-4033184
I personally have never seen a bop at that grade or price, I want another I can convert badly, I have the 2.0 kit and Playfield. But damnit, I’m so invested in expanding space I can’t yet... yet. Stay tuned
Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:I just finished this up for a buddy of mine. I would have put chrome trim on it if it was mine.
Beautiful!
Quoted from lyonsden:That looks really good.
Thank you!
Quoted from lyonsden:Finished installed the helmet back in my BoP and have updated the code. I think it came out really well (and kicks the snot out of the stock lighting).
» YouTube video
Code, as always, is open source: https://github.com/elyons/professor_pinball_pinduino_sketches/tree/master/BOP-ramp-head
If anyone is interested in a plug and play kit, just PM me (and I'll get this listed in my Pinside store). I think the cost will be $125 (or you can DIY for around $40-$50).
Dood, that is amazeballs, I’m down for a diy method... looking forward to the guide, mind posting the diy guide here?
Quoted from Snux:Oh, I do. My machine sounds awesome. Discussions ongoing about if/how it can be released. If we do push an update, I'll post here first listing what else I've fixed and seek any other things people have issues with on the 1.0 side, be good to fix those (if possible) at the same time.
This will take some time, even if there is an update bear in mind that BOP2 isn't real high on DPs list of priorities.
Im watching with great anticipation... I have yet to install my 2.0 kit, kind of a shame really, but my family and I love 1.0 so much that The possible lag was keeping me from installing it .... have I said all this before?, forgive me if I have, just really excited to see this fix implemented!
Thank you Snux! If there’s any lobbying I can do to push things along, let me know. You can even send this post to DP if it helps
Quoted from ToucanF16:Not sure how many of us still have an uninstalled BoP 2.0 kit. I purchased from DP’s first batch. I live overseas and pinball is on hold until I return to the states in a couple years.
With all that’s going on with DP, I want to make sure the latest code is installed. I assume all I need is the P-ROC and mini PC from the kit? Maybe a mouse, keyboard and monitor too?
Can someone give me the BoP 2.0 ‘upgrade for dummy’s’ version to get the newest code in my uninstalled kit?
Same here guys
I have not installed mine yet, waiting on the next code drop and to finish my gameroom, but being prepared is where I’d like to be... any help is appreciated
Quoted from Marvin:good luck on that wait.
Thanks! I’ll take good luck
...
I have 2 problems... one, I’m building a gameroom by myself, its taken all of my time and focus, I don’t have space to pull my bop and install the kit, I also have a new playfield, so I need to wait to do it all.
Two; I love 1.0, it’s got lag in the switches on the 2.0 software, going to get real annoying pretty fast
Some day soon I’ll get on the project
Quoted from Marvin:have you considered the original excellent art and stainless so that the game stands out in a lineup rather than being a boring black base cab?
Looks like the 2.0 art package is already on...
what about pink, or white for the trim, or a really great blue, blue would be great, none's done it yet that I know of, maybe that electric blue thats on the art under the brides feet?
Quoted from Marvin:have you considered the original excellent art and stainless so that the game stands out in a lineup rather than being a boring black base cab?
Quoted from MustangPaul:How about chrome with Candy purple pc on top? Expensive but damn it's purdy.
[quoted image]
tell me THAT won't stand out in a crowd!!
Isn't this the BOP 2.0 Club?... I would think anything BOP 2.0 goes and is allowed.
Quoted from MustangPaul:Sure it is, my picture was just to show what the color looked like.
super gorgeous, I think it would look great on bop 1,or 2
Quoted from Snux:There are improvements to the 1.0 sound, I've made the changes to the version of Pinmame BOP is using so that it will run with the Pinsound Studio software instead of emulated sound. Using the original WMS sounds for BOP. Sounds a lot better. But it needs DP and Pinsound to come to some agreement, and it's hardly very far up DPs list of things at the moment.
Hey snux, any news on this front?
Quoted from floyd1977:Thanks for doing this. Will this work?
amazon.com link »
Also, is the software you used freeware?
I copied the image of the drive a while back, but I would really like to do what you did and ensure I have a working backup drive.
Be careful with that device when the drive is in it, if you power it off with the drive running in windows, it will mess up the boot Sector
Quoted from Snux:A few people have been in contact asking if they can "beta-test" the BOP 1.0 Pinsound/Pinmame changes or have copies if they promise not to tell anyone.
Sorry, but no can do. The folks at both DP and Pinsound have put a lot of work into their respective products and I promised both parties that I wouldn't distribute this until they're in agreement. The change would then be available as a new update (1.20?) from the DP site like the others.
I hope DP manage to work through their current issues and get TBL sorted out, then maybe they'll have time to revisit BOP 2.0 again.
Ok guys , sounds like we need to start knocking on DP’s and pinsounds door per say. Maybe enough of us can convince them to allow this to follow through and get bop 1.0 with more polish on it. Anybody with me?
Quoted from awarner:I have secretly gone one step further with my “backup” and I bought another computer to have as a spare. I figure that all of the boards are replaceable since it’s just a WPC compatible P-ROC. The same(ish) computer might be hard to find in 10 years though. But no matter what method you take to get there, please get some sort of backup of your drive.
I still have not opened and installed mine, due to the sound lag in 1.0
Can I update my bop 2.0 computer independent of installing the kit and then back up the hard drive?
Quoted from nwpinball:My helmet light has never worked right with the 2.0 kit, it seems kinda random. I was assuming it was an LED problem too. Anyone else have thoughts on this? How did you get the helmet lighting dialed in on your Bride 2.0?
Quoted from adamross:My helmet lights seem to be all over the place... a lot of ghosting too. So wondering if it was the kind of LEDs?
Anyone have a fix for this?
I’m planning on installing my kit soon, hope to have a solution soon
Quoted from jsa:I'm talking about the emulator fixes you are describing. DP is back in business, I'm happy to ask next time I speak with them if you like.
Please do this, we all want a perfect 1.0 experience, this fix Snux has is the ticket
Quoted from Snux:Yup, in the version of pinmame that shipped with BOP 2.0 the helmet lamps followed a set (fairly long) repeating pattern, not linked to gameplay at all. The patched version I'm still sitting on (with the other fixes) I spent a long time sorting out so it actually caught the lamp effects that should be displayed
Yes! Snux
231E1676-14F3-40FE-9F90-3403AC7C986F (resized).pngQuoted from mollyspub:This is in regards to the sound emulation?
Yes, and a few other fixes
Quoted from adamross:I have tons of insert bleeding from my LEDs. Not sure if this is considered "ghosting"? Any tips on how to rectify greatly appreciated!
Is it the actual led under the insert that’s coming on or is it that the light from the particular insert is bleeding over to the other insert?
If it’s the actual led coming on that is not supposed to be turning on, then yes... it’s ghosting
Quoted from Snux:OK, email sent to Barry. Let's see if this goes anywhere!
Snux , hey bud any news ?
Quoted from Snux:Radio silence, I'm afraid.
I'm due to go into hospital for heart surgery in the next week or two, so BOP isn't exactly top of my mind at the moment. I'll chase it when I get back up to speed again. In case I'm not able to pick it up again for whatever reason, there is one other install of the updates with a beta tester who does contribute to this thread, so it won't get lost.
Oh no! Forget bop, I hope all goes well with your surgery, I’ll pray that things go well and the recovery is very quick!!
Quoted from Snux:So, still no reply from Barry (guess he's busy building TBL machines) but I sent him a follow up email today. Will post here again once I have some news.
Sounds good, I’ll email him again as well
Thank you
Quoted from Adams_Tales:Hi guys
Nest week I pick up a BOP. It hasn't been playing for years meaning the condition is very nice. I got caught by the thought upgrading to 2.0.
It seems the conversion kits are not sold anymore, so I guess the road ahead is to scrape the parts together myself. I have a PRoc board and LCD screen at hand, but especially the software seems to be tough to obtain, since I understand it it connected to a serial number?
I emailed dutch Pinball, but rumour is that they are very hard to reach.
Any suggestions where to go from here? And other key elements, hard to get, I need to focus on?
I am sorry if my questions are obvious for some of you, but I am a mechanics man - electronics is not my field.
I don't believe its possible to put together a kit for bop 2.0, I think its a signed software issue
Quoted from Snux:Radio silence, I'm afraid.
I'm due to go into hospital for heart surgery in the next week or two, so BOP isn't exactly top of my mind at the moment. I'll chase it when I get back up to speed again. In case I'm not able to pick it up again for whatever reason, there is one other install of the updates with a beta tester who does contribute to this thread, so it won't get lost.
Hi Snux checking in to see how you’re doing? I hope the heart surgery has had good recovery.
I hope you’re well, and strong!
Can we try to make some new progress on the bop sound emulation updates for 1.0 if you’re up to it ?
I’d love to get this perfect soon if possible, I know you hold only 1 of 2 keys, but you’re our best hope I think.
Quoted from Marco1973:fossmin
nwpinball
Thank you for the answers. I think it's stupid creating a pinball arcade and then stopping it if there is still demand.
They gain anyway money. If I prpduce 1 kit or 20 kits the gain is the same pro kit.
I know they are producing the big lebowsky.
But you have to think: if people know they will have a "customer care" for a short time, do you think they will sell more or less ?
Anyway a respectable businness man will answer everyone, even if it takes time.
The Dutch pinball guys don’t think about business the same as traditional business , plus i think they were tied up in lawsuits for a few years.
The kit had parts (circuit boards) that are no longer available.
The kits were $2000, not a whole ton of demand for that price tag, plus if they build more kits I would expect an increase on price... also, the sound emulation in 1.0 is not correct, there’s a fix, but DP is not focused on helping the fix get to the customer.
Quoted from Snux:It's been radio silence for some time now. The improved 1.0 version requires a new build of pinmame, a copy of Pinsound Studio, the sound files and a couple of other bits and pieces.
The Pinsound folks understandably don't want to have their software running on a commercial product without some kind of recompense and proposed that DP let them have the sound assets from BOP 2.0 (so they can make a remix for 1.0 using 2.0 sounds). DP weren't interested in that and to be honest are not really interested in the 1.0 upgrade at all as they have bigger fish to fry with TBL etc.
So that's where things have remained. I'm likely to sell my BOP at some point soon as it's not being played, but there is one more person with a copy of the update; he did a lot of beta testing and lots of tweaks to the sound files. He's willing to host the update on his website along with the install instructions (it's not automated, you need to hook a keyboard and mouse up to the PC in the machine) but only once DP / Pinsound are happy. He has posted in this thread before but I'll let him decide if he wants to make himself known or not.Yup, all good thanks, caught it in time so no lasting effects
Great news on your health!!
I’m always waiting eagerly on the update! Long live Bop 1.0!
Quoted from mollyspub:What can you tell us?
Good news for everyone that is looking for a kit, DP is creating a new batch of kits., Barry said that now would be the time to implement any fixes to the software that need to be done. He just needs those that have the fix to get in touch with him to start moving forward.
Quoted from mollyspub:When you say the fix, do you mean the sound on 1.0?
That and some lighting issues on 2.0 is what we are trying for
Quoted from Jesder:I may as well out myself. I really hope we get to see this update roll out at some point to all 2.0 owners. I don't plan to sell my 2.0 anytime soon, so if snux does move on, I'm still keen to see it through.
Thank you, that’s amazing!!!
we certainly appreciate any help to get this pushed forward
Quoted from Snux:Cross your fingers and watch this space some more, there is some movement in the 1.0 sound improvements / bug fixes being made available........ Hopefully more news soon.
Super excited about this, crossing my fingers!
Quoted from Snux:I just heard that DP and Pinsound have come to an agreement which permits the improved sound package for 1.0 (and a few other 1.0 fixes) to be released. DP are going to be building another batch of 2.0 kits, so this is great timing! I'm not sure yet about timing for updates on existing machines as that will need some testing, but we'll be working with DP to get that sorted out.
@Snux, thank you!... thank you for not giving up, right when we thought there was no hope, we tried one more time!
@ Barry with Dutch Pinball, many thanks, this is very exciting, seriously, you’re awesome!
Alpha testers get in there!!
I’ll send a message to alpha test this weekend, I don’t want to jump in until I actually have time in
Thank you KoenHeltzel !!!
Quoted from KoenHeltzel:We need alpha testers for this update somewhere in the coming weeks.
Please apply if you have some time and are comfortable to hook up mouse and keyboard in the case the update needs to be reverted. Send me a PM with your email address to apply, thank you.
Pm sent
Come on guys, this is momentous, let’s get it done
Quoted from KoenHeltzel:Hi,
First go into the 2.0 software (right flipper button, then start button, then maybe you might need to select the current face).
Then try adjusting the scaling value of the display in the service menu: Adjustment Menu -> Display -> Scale. Set it to value 10.
Now that you can see the full dmd frame, you can adjust the horizontal/vertical position with the other settings in the "Display" subcategory.
Also please check if you are running the latest software (1.19) under "Software Menu > Current version".
If not please update because the 1.0 software display will not scale correctly on the 1366x768 display.
https://www.dutchpinball.com/bride_of_pinbot_2.0_software
- Koen
Ok, got that ironed out ! Thank you
A
Quoted from Shredso:I signed up to test the new software over a month ago and never heard back.
Same here
Quoted from Wharhed:I’m fine with the install, I just see that the soon to be released 2.0 vs my original 2.0 kit has a difference in wiring and amplifiers. I’m just wondering what the actual difference is.
I’m sure the differences are very minimal
Quoted from alveolus:Me too. Any chance we could purchase one as a backup?
You can just copy the hdd and buy a similar pc and configure it, I’m sure it will be much much cheaper
Not only the call outs , but all of the sound is near what the original was,
Before, the sounds were all lagging behind switch presses, everything was compressed and distorted. Massive improvement with 1.21 or beyond if there are more updates
Way to go, Koen, DP, Snux, and everyone else... here’s to hoping for a public release soon!!
Quoted from Snux:Jesder you got closer to all the sound files than I did, maybe one landed in a wrong folder or maybe a sound command we didn't see before? I already removed my BOP2 kit and sold the machine so tricky for me to check.
Be worth switching back to the old sounds and see if you can still recreate there, in which case it's an issue with the ROM itself and probably all BOPs do it
I’ve not seen this on an original bop.
I’ll test my 1.0 on 2.0 this week
Quoted from KoenHeltzel:Another bugfix update v0.59 is now live.
Download / changelog here:
https://www.dutchpinball.com/the_big_lebowski_pinball_software
In the meantime v1.0 is still in development, but we are wrapping things up! Thanks for your patience!
That’s great news! Thank you!
I’m sure TBL owners are rejoicing
Looks like my gigabyte pc is having trouble...
Will not power up when I flip the cabinet power switch on.
I open the back box and Press the power button on the gigabyte PC and it goes into a boot loop, it gets to a screen that says “ starting Bride of Pinbot 2.0“ and then resets
Anyone know what I need to do from here?
Quoted from nwpinball:Yay, tonight I got my Bride running again after about a year of it being down! Big ups to Barry and Dutch Pinball for still doing product support for a batch 2 kit I bought way back in 2015. Barry's instructions were perfect, I had to replace the CMOS battery, then redo the BIOS settings according to Koen's photos and instructions on the Dutch forum and boom, I was up and running again. Now to update my software!
https://forums.dutchpinball.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=187&p=1018&hilit=Bios#p1018
This was my issue; needed a new cmos battery
Quoted from alveolus:What type of battery?
Cr2032, )pretty much standard for all computer cmos batteries). The number is stamped on the casing positive side for convenience
Quoted from dscapo:I was disappointed in the lag on the sound for the original.
I’m not sure how recent the new code is.
The lag is fixed with the updated code, it incorporates pinsound software. We worked for a few years to get all the gentlemen involved to get the fix implemented
It’s not perfect, but it is very well implemented now
Quoted from dethfactor:I pulled my hdd and it worked luckily. I was able to pull an image and mirrored it and put it on a cheap new 128gb ssd drive. I also managed to find a lot of stripped machines on fleabay. I’m probably going to try to cobble together 2 working machines and then test and offer the rest up here if anyone wants spares for a backup machine. Should get them by the end of the week.
I might be in on that, wouldn’t hurt to build a backup
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