(Topic ID: 72381)

BOP 2.0 Owners Club (Members Only)

By awarner

10 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 3,142 posts
  • 209 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 days ago by Pete_HH
  • Topic is favorited by 88 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

20240121_230154 (resized).jpg
814F4830-D9A6-40D7-94F5-5CA0214A771D (resized).jpeg
IMG_6793 (resized).png
IMG_2418 (resized).jpeg
IMG_2417 (resized).jpeg
IMG_2416 (resized).jpeg
IMG_2415 (resized).jpeg
IMG_9887 (resized).jpeg
IMG_1682 (resized).jpeg
IMG_1681 (resized).jpeg
IMG_1705 (resized).jpeg
IMG_1599 (resized).jpeg
IMG_4224 (resized).jpeg
2023-09-28 12_53_59-Amazon.com_ Alinan 5pcs Button Battery Holder Coin Cell Battery Holder with Swit (resized).png
EFDACD6A-A27D-49B1-99F1-A94B7086313E (resized).jpeg
bop_2_rules (resized).png

Topic index (key posts)

7 key posts have been marked in this topic (Show topic index)

There are 3,142 posts in this topic. You are on page 42 of 63.
#2051 6 years ago

I tried electrical tape, packaging tape, felt, nothing worked very well and often these tapes would cause too much friction inserting the glass.

However, when I tried Pinball Pro's tape, it was thin enough to allows the glass to move yet the surface of the tape created a better contact to reduce rattle.

https://pinballpro.net/shop/anti-rattle-tape-ar-1/

#2052 6 years ago
Quoted from jsa:

I tried electrical tape, packaging tape, felt, nothing worked very well and often these tapes would cause too much friction inserting the glass.
However, when I tried Pinball Pro's tape, it was thin enough to allows the glass to move yet the surface of the tape created a better contact to reduce rattle.
https://pinballpro.net/shop/anti-rattle-tape-ar-1/

I use it on my tron le, I had to put 2 strips on each side because of the bass

#2053 6 years ago

1.19 just became available today!

#2054 6 years ago
Quoted from mollyspub:

1.19 just became available today!

You have to be at 1.16 or above to install it. This IS the one to have folks!

#2055 6 years ago
Quoted from awarner:

You have to be at 1.16 or above to install it. This IS the one to have folks!

Well, this is a nice surprise in an otherwise bad year for Dutch.

#2056 6 years ago

So, you're saying I have to have a 1.16 on before I can install 1.19?

#2057 6 years ago
Quoted from ToucanF16:

So, you're saying I have to have a 1.16 on before I can install 1.19?

Yes. 1.16 has to be installed first. This is a Delta (just the changes) update.

#2058 6 years ago

This is my current BOP 2.0 project add-on. Original design by "The Korn". Used with permission (and help). I just got the new hinge cut and attached to the frame, the door attaches tonight.

IMG_9754 (resized).JPGIMG_9754 (resized).JPG

#2059 6 years ago

Curious - does the new code happen to fix some of the audio bugs when playing the original BoP mode?

#2060 6 years ago
Quoted from AudioHaven:

Curious - does the new code happen to fix some of the audio bugs when playing the original BoP mode?

I haven't tried, but I don't think so.

#2061 6 years ago
Quoted from AudioHaven:

Curious - does the new code happen to fix some of the audio bugs when playing the original BoP mode?

Bugs? You mean to poor job pinmame does upsampling the ROM audio samples? Not really DPs fault.

#2062 6 years ago
Quoted from mavantix:

Bugs? You mean to poor job pinmame does upsampling the ROM audio samples? Not really DPs fault.

Samples aren't an issue - but there's a sound delay. Instead of the sound playing right when a switch is hit, there's about a second delay.

#2063 6 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Samples aren't an issue - but there's a sound delay. Instead of the sound playing right when a switch is hit, there's about a second delay.

I did notice that the sample playback improved from 1.16 to 1.18, though that might be a coincidence of timing on the pinmame side of the equation. Now there are really only two problems, the delay and some over-modulating with the samples. It crossed a threshold for me which I consider playable... So it's really not a huge problem.

#2064 6 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Samples aren't an issue - but there's a sound delay. Instead of the sound playing right when a switch is hit, there's about a second delay.

I haven't noticed the delay, can you give me a specific example I can test? Nothing near 1 second delay, I'm pretty sure I'd have noticed that.

#2065 6 years ago
Quoted from mavantix:

I haven't noticed the delay, can you give me a specific example I can test? Nothing near 1 second delay, I'm pretty sure I'd have noticed that.

Just hit the heartbeat ramp or an inlane switch. On the real BOP, the second you hit that ramp switch, you hear the heartbeat...on the emulated version, the ball's way past the switch when you hear that sound. At the end of the day, it's still awesome that it's 2 games in one, and I think 1.0 sounds great thru the 2.0 sound system...but if you're used to the original hardware, the sound delay is really obvious. There are no sound delays on 2.0, though...just 1.0.

#2066 6 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Just hit the heartbeat ramp or an inlane switch. On the real BOP, the second you hit that ramp switch, you hear the heartbeat...on the emulated version, the ball's way past the switch when you hear that sound. At the end of the day, it's still awesome that it's 2 games in one, and I think 1.0 sounds great thru the 2.0 sound system...but if you're used to the original hardware, the sound delay is really obvious. There are no sound delays on 2.0, though...just 1.0.

Seems like there would be a no input lag version of pinmame that could be used

#2067 6 years ago

Does anyone here know what is needed to get a LED ticker working? The machines Dutch bring to shows often have it (http://www.pinballnews.com/shows/expo2015/153.jpg) so I am assuming supporting code to be present in the software.

I think it would make an awesome topper! Has anyone else done this?

#2068 6 years ago

Where do you find the latest download? We just bought 2.0 and I love it. Thanks to Al & Flake for bringing their's to Southern Fried Gameroom Expo for us to play!!

#2069 6 years ago
Quoted from loriradford:

Where do you find the latest download? We just bought 2.0 and I love it. Thanks to Al & Flake for bringing their's to Southern Fried Gameroom Expo for us to play!!

http://www.dutchpinball.com/bride_of_pinbot_2.0_software

Also, if you get your machine on the internet, you can update that way as well.

#2070 6 years ago

Thanks Al.

#2071 6 years ago

How many people are online? What does it add to the game. I need you read all these pages but thought maybe you could give me the cliff note version. Thanks, Lori

#2072 6 years ago

Yes, I'm happy with it! Thanks to Vince G. and Paul K. for helping me with it.

IMG_9792 (resized).JPGIMG_9792 (resized).JPGIMG_9793 (resized).JPGIMG_9793 (resized).JPG

#2073 6 years ago

Any feedback on 1.19 before I download and install? Curious and cautious.

#2074 6 years ago
Quoted from badbilly27:

Any feedback on 1.19 before I download and install? Curious and cautious.

Don't waste anymore time! It's the ritz!!!

#2075 6 years ago
Quoted from awarner:

Yes, I'm happy with it! Thanks to Vince G. and Paul K. for helping me with it.

This must sound really good in your balls.

#2076 6 years ago
Quoted from badbilly27:

Any feedback on 1.19 before I download and install? Curious and cautious.

Eetsa gooood! I like the modes continuing after multiball ends.

#2077 6 years ago

Has anyone figured out a way to run both sets of hardware ? I know that BOP 2.0 plays the original, but I still want to run off of the original hardware if possible

Edit: I guess that would be impossible changing the complete speaker panel and display

#2078 6 years ago
Quoted from Chosen_S:

Has anyone figured out a way to run both sets of hardware ? I know that BOP 2.0 plays the original, but I still want to run off of the original hardware if possible
Edit: I guess that would be impossible changing the complete speaker panel and display

You could have it output to a separate AND display, mounted wherever you wanted, externally.

#2079 6 years ago

I noticed when running the Williams game (BoP 1) thru pinmame, no settings are stored. I set it to free play, and the next time, it was back on 6 credits. I suppose it will also not store high scores that way. Why is this?

#2080 6 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Samples aren't an issue - but there's a sound delay. Instead of the sound playing right when a switch is hit, there's about a second delay.

I was referring to samples - like when he says "My God, she's alive!" - it isn't very clear. Or when you hit 200K skill shot and he says "Yahoo!" same thing. There are quite a few examples, actually.

#2081 6 years ago

As an FYI to anyone doing an update to V1.19, I ran into a problem that caused the boot sequence to get stuck in a loop. I had added a custom ROM for BoP1 (bop_l8) to the ROM directory in pinmame while running V1.16. During the update, this ROM didn't get copied to V1.19 while the configuration file for for the system did. This cause the boot sequence to check for the bop_l8 rom, not find it, fail, and restart the boot sequence. After the update, I manually copied the rom over, which fixed the problem. Thanks to Koen at DP for pointing me to the log file that helped me find and fix the problem.

#2082 6 years ago
Quoted from lyonsden:

As an FYI to anyone doing an update to V1.19, I ran into a problem that caused the boot sequence to get stuck in a loop. I had added a custom ROM for BoP1 (bop_l8) to the ROM directory in pinmame while running V1.16. During the update, this ROM didn't get copied to V1.19 while the configuration file for for the system did. This cause the boot sequence to check for the bop_l8 rom, not find it, fail, and restart the boot sequence. After the update, I manually copied the rom over, which fixed the problem. Thanks to Koen at DP for pointing me to the log file that helped me find and fix the problem.

what did the custom rom do different for bop1?

#2083 6 years ago

I'm the guy who took the P-ROC version of pinmame and made a few tweaks for DP to use for the "1.0 Experience". We have very little room to manoeuvre in the depths of the chipset emulation, so I don't think much will change.

That said, Koen did suggest something that might considerably improve the sound and I'll give that a try as time allows, it could be some time from and might not even work. Bear in mind that this is just a hobby for me and I also don't have a BOP to try it in, so it's a bit of to and fro with Koen to try things beyond a simple test that I can do.

So no promises, chances are it won't change, but I am looking at it.

#2084 6 years ago
Quoted from Chosen_S:

what did the custom rom do different for bop1?

L-8 fixes the billionaire club bug. http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=1502

#2085 6 years ago
Quoted from AudioHaven:

I was referring to samples - like when he says "My God, she's alive!" - it isn't very clear. Or when you hit 200K skill shot and he says "Yahoo!" same thing. There are quite a few examples, actually.

That's how it sounds in the original. WPC games didn't have clear sound samples. It sounds a little "different" I think due to their beefed up sound system - the shittiness of the original is now even more obvious.

#2086 6 years ago

The original CPU sound was much more clear but it is low sample rate audio, probably 4 or 8khz... I suspect the issue is pinmame does a poor job resampling that audio for the higher quality audio hardware in the PC. It's more noticeable on the speech, but the music is equally effected by the distortion. Maybe there's settings to adjust pinmame, but I suspect it would just need better underlying audio sampling code to make it sound like the original. Unfortunately, pinmame doesn't look like it's been maintained by developers in a long time, so Snux is probably our best hope for a fix. Anything we can do to help you Snux ?

#2087 6 years ago
Quoted from Snux:

I'm the guy who took the P-ROC version of pinmame and made a few tweaks for DP to use for the "1.0 Experience". We have very little room to manoeuvre in the depths of the chipset emulation, so I don't think much will change.
That said, Koen did suggest something that might considerably improve the sound and I'll give that a try as time allows, it could be some time from and might not even work. Bear in mind that this is just a hobby for me and I also don't have a BOP to try it in, so it's a bit of to and fro with Koen to try things beyond a simple test that I can do.
So no promises, chances are it won't change, but I am looking at it.

Will this also address the sound lag?

#2088 6 years ago

The problem is the original low sample rate sound was designed to be run through the DAC in the WPC sound board.

There's no DAC, physical or virtual, that the sound is run through before being output to the speakers. It's possible they could introduce a virtual DAC running in Windows, but that would introduce additional latency.

Better would be batch processing the original files with DAC filters and playing those resulting files through PINMAME.

Better still would be if PinSound / PPS, in their search for original files, manage to get the original masters from WMS.

#2089 6 years ago

Pinmame is still being developed, but the P-ROC branch is kind of stale. Nothing anyone else can much do, but if I have any luck you'll hear eventually. Whether it will help with lag I don't know, that seems to be something only a few people have issues with.

#2090 6 years ago
Quoted from Snux:

Whether it will help with lag I don't know, that seems to be something only a few people have issues with.

Are you saying some people don't have it? What technical reason would there be for some people to have lag and others do not? I think some people just don't notice it.

#2091 6 years ago

I thought I'd seen some people post they didn't have lag. As mentioned, no experience myself as I don't have an actual BOP to try it in. As you say maybe they just don't notice

#2092 6 years ago

I don't have a lag - just checked. I'm sort of #2 ever sent out. So, very first batch, European version, old mini pc.

Sound quality is kinda crappy - i.e. 100% the samples that were used originally other than that, only the display emulation is slow. I didn't experience any 'memory' loss either - all settings are kept. I'm also running the billionaire patched ROMs.

#2093 6 years ago
Quoted from mayuh:

I don't have a lag - just checked. I'm sort of #2 ever sent out. So, very first batch, European version, old mini pc.
Sound quality is kinda crappy - i.e. 100% the samples that were used originally other than that, only the display emulation is slow. I didn't experience any 'memory' loss either - all settings are kept. I'm also running the billionaire patched ROMs.

So if you hit the heartbeat switch, you hear the heartbeat sound absolutely instantly?

I'm finding it hard to believe that some kits would have lag and some wouldn't.

#2094 6 years ago

I'm guessing we all have the lag, it's just not really noticeable to some of us and some of us it bugs the crap out of I don't think I hear the heartbeat sound instantly, but soon after, I never realized it was a lag problem.

#2095 6 years ago
Quoted from nwpinball:

I'm guessing we all have the lag, it's just not really noticeable to some of us and some of us it bugs the crap out of I don't think I hear the heartbeat sound instantly, but soon after, I never realized it was a lag problem.

Yeah, look...it's not a deal breaker. I notice it...but I wouldn't rip the kit out because of it. I'd appreciate if it could be fixed...but if it's not, it's still cool that you can play either version of the game.

#2096 6 years ago
Quoted from Chosen_S:

what did the custom rom do different for bop1?

L8 has the billion point bug fixed and the ghosting patch applied to l7

#2097 6 years ago
Quoted from lyonsden:

L8 has the billion point bug fixed and the ghosting patch applied to l7

Right on, I guess I'll be looking for the L8 for the bop1 ... unless anyone here has a link to the L8?

#2098 6 years ago
Quoted from Chosen_S:

Right on, I guess I'll be looking for the L8 for the bop1 ... unless anyone here has a link to the L8?

Here you go: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hxoy10el4e9asa1/bop_l8.zip?dl=0

#2099 6 years ago

For what it's worth, I posted the STL files for the leg bracket adapters and BoP face plate brackets on my github repo.

Just a refresher, we created the leg adapter plates to fill the gap between the "new style" Williams leg brackets and the corner gussets. When you remove the smaller plate and add the new style, the adapter sits between the gusset and the new bracket.

The face plate brackets are designed to be used with the new, CPR replacement face plates for the Bride's head. The old face plates had metal brackets screwed to the back to keep the pinballs from falling through the holes. The new face plates not only do not have mounting screw holes for the metal brackets, but also the holes are bigger and not beveled. This leads to balls falling right through, and if you try to use the old metal plates, the balls wobble or roll to the center. The new plates are meant to be two-sided taped or glued to the back of the new plates, and they hold the balls perfectly.

https://github.com/jayadelson/pinball

#2100 6 years ago
Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 1.00
Lighting - Led
Mitchell Lighting
Led
$ 95.00
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
Pinball Mod Co.
Sound/Speakers
$ 49.99
$ 44.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Pinball Shark
Shooter rods
$ 20.00
Playfield - Decals
DevilsMuse Arcade
Decals
$ 250.00
Lighting - Interactive
Professor Pinball
Interactive
£ 58.00
Lighting - Led
PinballToys
Led
$ 9.99
Eproms
Matt's Basement Arcade
Eproms
$ 285.99
Cabinet - Other
PinSound
Other
From: $ 35.00
Cabinet - Other
Rocket City Pinball
Other
$ 44.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Pinball Shark
Shooter rods
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
$ 1.25
Lighting - Led
Mitchell Lighting
Led
$ 12.00
Tools
Nezzy's Pinball Prints
Tools
$ 30.00
Electronics
Yorktown Arcade Supply
Electronics
$ 69.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Pimp
Decorations
$ 98.00
Lighting - Interactive
ArcadeMade
Interactive
$ 40.00
Electronics
Yorktown Arcade Supply
Electronics
$ 399.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
From: $ 12.00
Flipper Parts
Precision Pinball prod.
Flipper parts
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
From: $ 159.95
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
PinSound
Sound/Speakers
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
From: $ 8.99
Cabinet - Other
NO GOUGE PINBALL™
Other
$ 150.00
Displays
Digipinball Shop
Displays
From: $ 1.25
Playfield - Other
Rocket City Pinball
Other
$ 200.00
Lighting - Interactive
Professor Pinball
Interactive
From: $ 64.95
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
PinSound
Sound/Speakers
From: $ 399.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
Hey modders!
Your shop name here
There are 3,142 posts in this topic. You are on page 42 of 63.

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bop-20-owners-club-members-only/page/42 and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.