Well, the upside of lackluster code is more money in your pocket I guess...nobody is forcing us to buy it. I love the rules/code in Stern's KISS (led by Lonnie), but it took the team 1 year to finish it (and it was VERY incomplete).

JJP recently put more money in my pocket when they designed Toy Story with no kinetically satisfying toys (one of the most anticipated pinball licenses in years). Instead, large LCD's and very annoying audio to drive you nuts

I have to sell a pin in the winter to make space. . I'm ok with that wait actually.

Such a great point. A game like STTNG has more going on than any new game and is still fairly affordable when compared with NIB Premiums/LEs. True for WH20 as well, both games have been in my collection for a decade. Great playing games.

Counter argument for what's included in this Pro:

What has passed for a "basic" Pro BoM in the past is 2 flippers, 2 ramps, typically a main toy (interactive), often a secondary toy (static)... then a few from the grab bag of drops, spinners, up posts, captive balls, scoops/saucers, powered gates, and magnets. This is more or less the case for SW, GOTG, DP, BKSoR, STH, Munsters, AS, Kiss, ACDC, IM, Mustang, TAV, TF, Avatar, and GoT.

Somewhere in between are the games w/ 2-3 flippers, 2-3 ramps and some other goodies to make a very solid Pro - ST, GB, TWD, GZ, LZ.

The more "fully featured" Pro's as of late share a lot in common. Some Pros get more in them: 3-4 flippers, 2-3 ramps, the main interactive toy + more static toys to fill up the empty space, and even more from the aforementioned "grab bag". This would be the case for AIQ, TMNT, MET, XM, Rush, IMDN, Mando, JP, and IMDN. Focusing on Pro BoM only, this group is very appealing at the Pro level because it looks fully featured and not empty.

Having said that, I'd argue that Bond Pro is in the "fully featured Pro" group. 3 flippers, 2-3 ramps (semantics due to the split entry ramp), Main Interactive Toy (Bird One Rocket) w/ a static building behind it, A SECOND INTERACTIVE TOY (DB5), an upwards scoop from an under flipper shot, a 3-bank of drops, an up post, and a spinner.

What makes it look "barren" to some is probably that the ramps are either low or close. Ramps don't touch or go through the backpanel, so there's some empty space back there. Similar to how DP and BM66 sort of look empty in the way back (also Gomez games). But I'd argue this has more to it than the commonly adored GZ Pro, and much more than other popular Pros like GoT, Kiss, or SW.

Obviously code execution and theme integration can move the popularity of all these up and down (DP goes up in value, TMNT leaves something to be desired)... and with Lonnie rumored as the main programmer, we can certainly hope to be pleasantly surprised to avoid saying the obvious. But as far as features are concerned, Bond Pro is up there with the best for BoM on a Pro level title.

Edit: Also, what Bond Pro lacks over the Prem (jetpack, dragon tank, underwater scene, Bird One physical lock) can be cut in half easily w/ cheap mods. The underwater scene looks like it can be easily modded for the Pro, same with the dragon tank. Both look like short money mods too. So you can have that hated word "Promium" pretty easily and only be out the jetpack and Bird One lock.

Was it true Lyman added the finishing touches to the KISS code?

That is what I heard a while back.

I had a STTNG and it's loaded for sure but I found the wide body makes it slow. Great game but I still prefer newer machines.

Great summary - I think the Jetpack is very cool but it will also slow the game down. I LOVE physical locks but for $2700, I can live without.

Sometimes I feel like I'm taking crazy pills because James Bond clearly has 3 ramps. What is this nonsense about not counting the "split" ramp as two? Because it returns on the same habitrail? So the fuck what...

I agree that Bond has 3 ramps, but some are calling it 2.

I think it all goes back to the debate on games like Mustang and GB Pro having "one or two" ramps.

With the ball saves at the beginning of multiballs common since the mid 90s, physical ball locks have lost their meaning a bit. Although from one of the Stern Bond videos it looks like the balls are released from the rocket on the premium in a bunch - kind of like on CV highwire MB, or GZ, I think - this is kind of cool, but…

I heard that as well, however the 5 programmers listed are Lonnie, Tanio, Waison, Jack, & Mike.

The turnaround from a "meh" ruleset to pretty awesome is rare, but they did it. Was worth the year wait...so glad I was patient.

Just too bad the dots suck so bad. Stern should port it to Spike 2 and add some kick arse concert footage. Would be a strong seller...

Mustang is at least a little debatable because it's a lift ramp on a lift ramp. GB Pro though? Some people...

Surprised there are no photos of these in the wild at the event today.

I’m just going to remind everybody that this exact Pinside meltdown happens whenever stern raises prices.

It’s insulting, it’s greedy, it’s a slap in the face, etc etc.

And yet, the planet continues to spin, the sun continues to rise, birds chirp, babies cry…

Please try not to take this stuff so personally. They are just trying to sell pinball machines. If it’s not for you, don’t buy them.

I think the pro version of this game is fine. Unlike a lot of other pro's, all the features are still in the game. You miss out on the jetpack bond, which admittedly is a cool mech, but does it really do a whole lot and does it get old after a while just slowing down the game? You also miss out on the underwater fight, which again is kind of cool but it doesn't seem like it actually does anything like interact with the ball. Then theres the physical ball lock. Those aren't huge losses and little to no impact on the gameplay. All the shots and modes and everything are still in the game and theres a lot of features on every version of the game. Yeah I would prefer a premium probably but getting the pro I don't think would impact the game play experience at all. To say the pro is stripped or barren is just flat out wrong.

So you still bought? Showed them!

Scariest thing about DLC is if they tie it to your insider connected account, then you basically can't resell the DLC when you sell the game (still own the DLC if you get that game again though?). At least with the DLC as a topper you can sell the topper with the extra mode on it.

Is Pinside selling the flipper a special ad actually assisting the flipper or just taking a bite.And so far only 1 repetitive ad.
I am Buying from a Distro but would not buy from a scalper.This machine will fit in as a good change of themes in my Row and I look forward to that day.Too bad the pricing is the dominant subject here,its been said now lets talk about the Machines.

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The Pinball Show Episode 113: The Big James Bond 007 Episode

Hosts: Dennis Kriesel & Zach Meny

- NEW Info On James Bond 007 Pinball
- NEW Stern Pinball Production Updates
- NEW Pricing Changes For Stern Pinball Machines
- NEW Info On The Unreleased 60th Anniversary Elwin Edition Of James Bond
- A Possible Goldfinger Bond Game In The Future?
- NEW Info On Steve Ritchie's Upcoming Game With Jersey Jack Pinball
- NEW Production Updates For Chicago Gaming's Cactus Canyon Remake LE
- This Is Spinal Tap?
- Strong Takes By The Kriesel On 2022 Game Catalog & Introducing A New Sound Effect
- Shoot The Wamps...I Guess...
- Pinball Market Trends

https://www.podbean.com/media/share/pb-h6n2b-12d1d1f

I do want to play this, but my first reactions are

#Interesting layout, playfield seems pretty wide open (gives me some Dredd vibes with the upper left flipper and MB with the under playfield characters)
#Mechs aren't that exciting, always good to see some drops though
#Art looks good to me, I like the color options and the layout - well done for sure

I'm sure this game will be fun, but my main takeaway is that this price increase really may be the proverbial last straw. I'm not a fan of any price increases and understand they have to happen sometimes for various reasons. Much like Toy Story, this should not have been the game to usher it in.

Will listen on the elliptical tonite!

I'm trying to figure out why they went with the wibbily wobbily 'Soviet dildo' rocket when in the movie, the spaceship opens up and swallows other spaceships (see photo), which is very cool.

In a pinball game, this mechanic would be very appealing; the rocket could open up and swallow balls, either as a hazard or to lock balls. Then spit them out for multiball.

Seems like a missed opportunity to me.

GobbleGobble (resized).jpg

I think the issue is that with the hyper-realistic special effects from You Only Live Twice, they knew that there was no hope to compete in a relatively low-budget pinball machine, so best to go another direction.

I mean, we had people who were upset that the Dino in Elwin's JP didn't look real enough, so what other choice did they have? Just make it flop around and call it a day!

The impending rocket launch is so typical bond/spy flick though. Still an easy hit.

They also could have used something like the opening swimming pool mech. in the Thunderbirds game to mimic the fake crater lake in the YOLT movie. Crater lake opens, spaceship rises and opens, spitting the balls out for multiball.
There may even be leftover mechs from the TBAG game.

The wobble rocket isn't a great visual, although I guess maybe it helps knock the ball into the targets you need?

Visually it going straight up and down, without the wobble, would look good. Have it start low and build up to full height to visually demonstrate how close to the multiball you are. Having a working gobble hole for a subway entrance would have been pretty sweet.

Regardless, I hope the countdown/lightshow/sound/shaker are all on point for when the missile multiball launches.

Yes, you can see all the targets around it... it's a mix master, potc tortogua, etc kind of setup. You put the ball up there and try to get action.

First eveyone complains there aren't enough dildos in their games, now there are too many?! It's lose lose with these people.

At least they finally called the "well for 13K it better have sex with me!" crowd's bluff! Careful what you wish for!

I expect that you’re incorrect and that so long as any player is logged in using insider connect, they can access the missions on any pinball machine. The owner isn’t locked in and exclusive.
When you sell a game with insider connect, the original owner does have to transfer the pin ownership to the new buyer.
Been there, done that. No biggie.

I knew they were bluffing, the whole time.

If this game came with the lube they've been demanding, they wouldn't even know what to do with it!

I knew I should have introduced myself at CLE Pin. There's always 2023!

In the past I would have been much more worried about who is the programmer on a given game. Having owned most of the recent games including Gz and Rush, it's apparent that Stern has really done a lot to upgrade its software group and processes. They definitely have a long history of incomplete software at release along with highs and lows from one game to the next depending on the lead programmer. These newer games in the last few years are proof to me that they have come a long way in both areas.

Basically the complexity of the hardware drives the need to have a standing army of programmers and coders now to accomplish all of the game rules along with HD graphics and sound. It seems that the old days of a small group creating the game and also coding it themselves have changed. Hiring in people like Ray Davidson has really helped too. I can just picture prototype games being played by Ray, Keith, TS and others who all collaborate on great ideas.

Yes, I will still have my fingers crossed any time I am down for a new game without playing it, but I do feel good based on recent first hand experiences.

The reason physical locks went away was to save the cost. Added to this, physical locks can be tricky to program. So savings on programming and testing as well.

The reason you could still make a "moden game" with 3-4-5 ball multiball was thanks to the auto-plunger.

The role of the ball saver is to adjust the reward in the players eyes for achieving multiball.

And it is a pity, as physical lock rocks. And no wonder it is the deluxe-edition bait/sacrifice. As rules wise it is essentially transparent.

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Physical locks are a relic of the past.

In reality, they create additional opportunities for stuck balls and other malfunctions, and also screw up 4 player games. There’s a reason physical locks are almost always disabled whenever possible in a tournament game.

I think we can all agree that pros tend to have fewer issues than premiums.

In my opinion, the game is loaded regarding mechs & toys, couldn’t be happier with in that regard. Theres something going on in every corner and in the middle, multiple ramps, crazy cool ball looks, sleek wireforms. I’m looking forward to seeing how they manage to incorporate the music into the game because the Connery film soundtracks tend to have an orchestrated thought provoking 60’s kinda vibe with many motion picture instrumental compositions. How many will be original, any created for the game to fill it out? I thought they did a great job with Batman ‘66 incorporating a little bit of jazz, we will see!

Less stuff to break will do wonders for reliability

So back on the thread topic, I'm actually getting kind of hyped for the Bond pro(I'm just pretending the other models don't even exist anymore at these prices). A great theme with lots of shots and modes (seemingly), and I like the idea of controlling the multiplier with the action button. Plus, by selling my ST to help fund this I'll only have to kick in 3k or so. Of course I don't really know how the game plays yet and the rumors that it might take until freaken next April to get the pin is kind of dampening the urge to purchase. If I could get the pro in a couple of months I think I'd have pulled the trigger. I'm just worried that even if I get on the list now I won't get in the first run and will have to wait until Christmas 2023 to get the game . . . maybe GZ pro??

Damn I remember when Crazy Levi would brag after every new pinball announcement about Stern's ability to get Pros in people's hands almost right away (and I do mean after every new pin announcement, not just Stern's). Those were the days . . . hopefully they'll come back.

Exactly!

I associate premiums with stuck balls and stuff not working.

One thing for sure is that Stern is making awesome Pro’s and this one will be no different. I see some collector’s who try and stay with one version or the other of everything but I like having different versions of games as they play differently. Absolutely love my Ghostbusters Pro and Stranger Things Pro in particular.

If the rocket started thrusting up and down like a shake weight, all of the horny pinsider boomers would go crazy.

Someone saw the building in Godzilla going up and down and complained "I can't put a square in a round hole!"

This virtual tour of the gallery at Christies 007 sixty year is cool. I found myself going down the hallways looking for a bathroom.
https://www.christies.com/features/virtual-tour-sixty-years-of-james-bond-12444-1.aspx?sc_lang=en&lid=1

Looks like $15-$16k is what the flippers are asking. Where do you see LE prices after Christmas?

I feels like asking 20% over msrp was “normal” on the recent releases until the machines actual land and people start playing them… then I’d guess it depends on how good it is, how many are for sale, and what else gets released

I'm counting on my British bros, to release some recordings of Bond game play from the 60 Anniversary special events this week

Only premium I have is LZ. I put in for the Bond Pro today.

GB Pro is fantastic.

"open up and swallow balls"

I don't think that's getting away from the innuendos....

I like the physical lock on my bm66 until it screws up. I still think it's a positive overall but it does have lots of cons for sure.

Exactly. That’s what Gomez said in the interview.

Mnaaa. Still an awesome feature. Only made obsolete by redundency due the evil auto plunger and savings (or priorities, to be nice).

The physical locks and ball release(s) at multiball start is a different dynamic and interaction with the player than the feed from the trough. Plus it makes various multiballs in a game feel different and having their own style. Not all being the mindless chaos and spray until the saver is on the last leg. Think White Water where the feed offers a pre-multiball play task.

Games with no auto plunger cannot offer ball saver in multiball. So back in the day they used a different trick to tweek the reward of starting a multiball: The multiball restart (and occationally the last chance jackpot). Again a different dynamic to the multiball ball saver of now-a-days. And something I will argue is a great great lost feature.

I do miss the compensation multiball for relocking one ball after a failed multiball. I love the skillshot ramp on Maverick; how you can add 1 extra ball to the base multiball or 1 extra ball into the compensation multiball with a skillful plunge

Sometimes I'm surprised the dual launcher hasn't been cost cut out of existence. But I guess Stern knows people really love pulling the plunger. And Keith Elwin has been pretty amazing at giving a lot of interesting skill plunge options. Some other games hardly use the plunger or provide interesting skill shots that make it worth the cost. (Skillshot should be a major design priority considering it's how you start every ball, and people of all skill levels can try to do them)