(Topic ID: 185852)

BM66...Let's be honest.

By Cheese_WizardPQ

2 years ago

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  • 605 posts
  • 141 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by Cheese_WizardPQ
  • Topic is favorited by 6 Pinsiders


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#61 2 years ago

Not sure what the point of this thread is or why the OP thought we needed another one on BM66. Every point made in the original post has been covered (and in some cases absolutely beaten to death) in other threads.

Issues with the build quality, including playfield issues, I understand. It is incumbent on Stern to address those. It is rediculous to have those issues on what is supposed to be a flagship game (or frankly any game they sell at current price levels).


Don't like the price? Don't buy the game.
Don't like the design? Don't buy the game.
Don't like the code status? Don't buy the game.
Bought the game and bothered by any of the above? Sell the game.

#74 2 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

LE owner here...I have no regrets purchasing the game.
If the code stays the way it is a year from now, then I'll regret it.


#75 2 years ago

By the way, even though I wanted and bought an LE, I agree 100% this was a cash grab by Stern and see nothing that justifies the extra cost of Batman over other recent games.

I fully expect that if I were to sell the game I would have to take a decent hit financially. But I like the theme so much that's unlikely to happen anytime soon, if ever. I don't see the game as a BDK retheme and don't think the turntable deserves the hate it seems to have. Love the art, the ramp flow, the video assets, music and LCD integration. I think Lyman will make this a great game over time. But even if he doesn't, I'm not sure I'd give the game up.

#165 2 years ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

I think Batman 66 looks pretty cool, there's no doubt about that. The issue a lot of people have with the game is why did Stern charge so much more for Batman 66 versus other titles? As others have said it does seem like Stern wanted to make a pin where they could make the biggest profit ever per game and Batman 66 is it. The playfield itself is mostly a re-theme from Dark Knight which represents at least some cost savings versus starting from scratch.
Also, Stern basically removed from the pro from the equation and made the pro the premium and the premium the LE (just added some powder coated armor to it and charged $10k) just to create a new Super LE model. The entire Super LE concept leaves a bad taste in many people's mouths. The top end game should be an LE and that's it, the Super LE crap for $5k more is ridiculous.

If there is anything to hate about the game, it is the pricing and the Premium/LE/Super LE structure which is simply Pro/Premium/LE renamed to pull extra cash out of wallets. I was torn because Batman 66 is a dream theme for me. I absolutely love the art package (and topper) on the LE, but $10k was insulting because it was essentially a $7500/$8000 game. I wasn't real happy about that, but went ahead with it primarily for one reason - Lyman was coding the game. If it were anyone else I wouldn't have bought the game when I did, but would have played the waiting game.

No matter how you look at it, Batman 66 will go down as the Stern cash grab experiment. Yes, their first LCD, but I suspect the game will really be remembered more for the "Happy Anniversary, Thanks for the Support, Screw You" pricing.

Did it work? Since the LEs and SLEs sold out, maybe. But if few "Premiums" get sold over the next three years (or whatever the production run is) then it's almost certainly a bust.

I don't know about others, but I can't think of any other theme I'd be interested in where I would buy into this pricing model. I want Elvira 3 and probably Star Wars, but won't consider either NIB at the BM66 pricing structure. (I'm probably a day one LE buyer otherwise, assuming everything else looks good).

How is the Batman 66 Premium not a Pro?

What was Stern trying to accomplish with the pricing structure? Did they really think there would be more than 500 buyers on theme alone where price wouldn't be an issue?

Those are the questions that interest me about BM66.

#191 2 years ago
Quoted from PiperPinball:

Ill modify my pin with some interactive mods to enhance the game and enjoy it with my friends and family.

piperpinball - do you have a small video screen at the end of your crane?

#192 2 years ago
Quoted from ronaldvg:

All the talk about the structure of the game is moot in my opinion. I mean the Pre=Pro, LE=Pre, SLE=LE discussion. To be able to make it a Pro-Pre-Le they must have something to take off the game to make it cheaper. With BM, what can they take off ??? There is so little there already.
Take off the LCD: not possible because they had to make dots for it, take off the spinning toy: it will just be a Batman Dark Knight, take off the crane: that's the only fun thing in there. They just could not make a pro out of this one
I own an LE but sadly the value just is not there, besides the fact if it is a fun game or not.

They don't have to take anything off. The Premium is a Pro, just priced like a Premium. The Premium they call an LE has the topper and the armor (and autographs). I don't know what to make of the SLE ...

#286 2 years ago
Quoted from KirboTurbo:

I rode up on the elevator with George Gomez late Saturday night at TPF ... I asked him if I had a chance to buy an LE, should I do it. He said without hesitation, "absolutely". His exact words were, "this is Lyman's baby". "He won't quit till it's complete".
... It might not be for everyone, but looks like a keeper for me.

These two statements pretty much sum up the LE for me. And the only opinion on the game that matters is mine, so the haters can hate all they want...

Congrats on your new game!

#325 2 years ago
Quoted from PinballNewb:

People's pin equity is at stake here. Large amounts in this case. Not a surprise.

Pin equity only matters if the owners are looking to sell. I don't see a lot of owners looking to sell.

#354 2 years ago
Quoted from yuriijos:

I don't get it, this game is a remake of BDK, so shouldn't the code be complete other than different sounds and animations?The toy crane is the same, the layout is the same, therefore the rules should be done. I've never played it but have played a lot of BDK, just seems silly of why the code is so far behind when the game is a remake. SMVE was a re theme and it did not suffer code issues, it was a SM with new graphics, sounds, and animations. Wow, just wow.

The game is not a remake. It shares the crane and right side layout. Big deal.

It's absolutely absurd that some want to write this off as TDKVE. As you say, "Wow, just wow."

1 week later
#388 2 years ago
Quoted from Cheese_WizardPQ:

And what about the batphone rotation? I have to hit it to start a mode but it takes forever to rotate in place. Doesn't feel "live"
Is it something I have to tune?

Nothing to tune. It's all software.

#390 2 years ago
Quoted from rai:

some might think for $10-$15K BM66 is more of a money grab than an Elite pin.

Whatever they think of the game, I think pretty much everyone agrees that BM66 pricing is a money grab.

#395 2 years ago
Quoted from rai:

To me, BM66 is a regular (good bad or average) pin masquerading as something special.

Not quite. It's a regular pin MARKETED as something special.

2 weeks later
#494 2 years ago
Quoted from Rody:

The dilemma...what to do when your wife wants an expensive game that you don't care for, hmmmm.

That's a no-brainer. You get the game. It becomes "her game". If she shows interest in your hobby, encourage it. And, if you don't get tbe game, you may never hear the end of it ...

3 weeks later
#544 2 years ago
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:

BM66 scores a whopping 4 out of 10 in Buffalo Pinball's latest review:
LOTS of room for improvement apparently - yikes!

Two more people who did not bother to understand why the game was released with alpha code.

#553 2 years ago
Quoted from purplemunkydishw:

I guess I am three?
Yes it was supposed to be a anniversary celebration, but it makes not sense to me to ship what was their most expensive flagship game ever, and release it with half-assed code.
I can't imagine how bad it must have been when Lyman wouldn't let anyone play it.

The code did almost nothing at Expo. Why do you think no one was allowed to play?

I happen to think Stern made a big mistake releasing the game as they did, primarily because of all the inevitable code complaints, and because the masses wouldn't pay attention to why. In order to market the 50th Anniversary of the show and the 30th Anniversary of Stern (the marketing behind the SLE), the game had to be "released" in 2016. The game clearly wasn't ready on schedule and certainly could have used some additional hardware tweaking in addition to more robust software. Clearly there were some issues that caused the initial release schedule to be impacted, but Stern was kind of stuck because of the anniversary year.

Also, the Expo reveal had to be planned long in advance, and the Adam West party was a big part of that. He's not getting any younger and is cutting back appearances. I'm sure that made the release date less flexible than had it been almost any other game. Stern didn't effectively communicate any of this EXCEPT at Expo.

1 week later
#565 2 years ago
Quoted from vireland:

Since there is still inventory out there, and probably will be for some time, I don't think this is a risk through 2017 probably into 2018, at least in the US market. Lyman may well make a classic, but that's an IF, not a when, and we have no idea when that endpoint is, except that it's definitely not this year. Why tie up $8k with a very unfinished machine when you can have a complete, playable and fun machine for those 6-10 months and then decide on Batman'66 when there's at least a base of code at 1.00 to evaluate? Makes no sense.

"Except that it's definitely not this year" - you don't know that.

If the question is "Do I buy a Premium now or wait?" then waiting may be reasonable since BM66 will be in production for a while and games should be readily available. But the game is already fun and playable as it is. Not deep or polished, but fun and playable (running .75).

If you wanted an LE or SLE, buying early made sense if you believed Stern would allow Lyman to complete the code as he saw fit since getting an LE/SLE down the line was likely to be difficult. If you bought a game after ignoring all the comments about releasing the game with Alpha level code and not understanding the consequences of that decision, that's on you - not a reason for others to not decide for themselves.

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