(Topic ID: 167469)

Blackout Club... (Fans Welcome)

By mof

7 years ago


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#188 6 years ago

Is there a back story about the Blackout theme? It is a cool looking machine but I haven't found much about a story that goes along with it. Has anyone found any write up on it?

#194 6 years ago

Did you get any pictures while you were making the adjustments? Nice to know some techniques to adjust it. Will keep that in mind once I get mine going.

1 week later
#210 6 years ago

I almost have all the pieces I need to start getting my game together. This gem just showed up today! I think the image on the new backglass is amazing. First time I have seen it in person. Going to look awesome in the game. There was no trim on this. Do these normally just have the lift rail at the bottom or are they also supposed to have side trim? Some pictures I've seen seem to indicate that this only used a stainless lift rail on the bottom. Can someone confirm that and also if that rail is supposed to be 3/16" so I can order the proper lift rail? For the moment I'm just going to keep this in the package until I get the lift rail and put it in the game.

Robert

BlackOut_BG (resized).jpgBlackOut_BG (resized).jpg

#211 6 years ago

I thought these machines originally came with yellow flipper bats but I've looked at a lot of different pictures for reference and it looks like a lot have white flipper bats. Does anyone know if they used both from the factory? I have white on mine and think they look fine and wondered if they could be original or not.

#222 6 years ago

Lookin for recommendations and options for instruction cards and inserts for the apron. I'm missing the pricing card and plastic window covering it.

#230 6 years ago

Are you replacing an existing one? If not you'll also need a trim kit. I just ordered a set and once that comes in will be able to install the new Blackglass. Should look amazing once installed.

I still haven't ever had a chance to play Blackout and am looking forward to it. Should be able to go over my boards this weekend and can try to power it up. Befor I do I'm adding the fuses for the bridges and adding the extra fuse board for the special solenoids.

http://nvram.weebly.com/repair--conversion-kits.html

Better to start out with the extra protection in case the machine has other unknown issues.

2 weeks later
#237 6 years ago

When I bought my Blackout it was missing the Backglass so I ordered a reproduction. Since I'm concerned about heat from normal bulbs behind it I would like to go all led behind the backglass. I was thinking about all frosted warm white bulbs but would like to hear what worked for you.

#240 6 years ago

Has anyone tried any of these balls in Blackout? I think they may fit in well with the theme:

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/PB116-BKP

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/PB116-BCK

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/PB116-SWL

What one would you try?

#241 6 years ago

I'm going to give the Black Pearl a try once I get my game going. Will let everyone know how it looks and works out.

#242 6 years ago

When I got my machine it was missing the backglass and most of the bulbs were missing in the head. This may be a simple question but are the lamps the same or were some of them different? I plan on putting in LED's (Not Unicorn Puke) and am going to see how the warm and/or cool white frosted LED's end up looking through the backglass.

If all goes well I may start re-assembly this week.

Robert

#244 6 years ago

I finished rebuilding my sound and power supply boards and should have my driver and CPU boards done this evening. Since some of the wiring was moved around before I bought the machine I wanted to ask if anyone has pictures of how the harnesses are routed and connect to each of the boards. It would help to have reference photos as I assemble it. I could also use good images of the way the brackets are screwed in place for both flippers. If all goes well I may be able to power it up and finally play it this weekend.

#249 6 years ago
Quoted from Gnatty:

A normal, silver ball. Why use a black ball on a predominately black playfield? Are you trying to not see the ball?

I use fresh new shiny silver balls in all my machines. When I saw those custom ones I just thought they fit the theme well and may look cool. Blackout black ball. Might be awesome or not. That is why I asked. I'm going to give one a try to see how it works out. If not then I have a game with a mostly light field it should work in.

#250 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

Guess I can't say for sure, but my original Blackout backglass had a 3/16" lift trim as well as black plastic side and top trim. It all fit perfectly on the repro.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/gatecrashers-hardware-vids-review
Last page has current catalogue...my repro backglass measures 28.5 inches wide, same as his stainless lift channel and it comes with the 3 plastic trim pieces for free to finish it off.

I just tried to install the new lift kit and it seems too tight to fit on the glass. I had ordered the 3/16" kit but I am beginning to think they sent the 1/8" kit by mistake. I've e-mailed to ask but thought I would also ask here. I've read that it is common to put a piece of cloth friction tape along the bottom edge of the glass before putting on the stainless lift rail. At the moment it is too tight to put on the glass. Do those rails normally go on tight or should it be loose until that tape is added? I hope that they just sent the wrong kit and I can get the right one before new years. I do not want to take any chances and damage a new backglass.

#253 6 years ago

Thanks for notes about how the rail is supposed to fit. I'm pretty sure that I was sent the 1/8" version by mistake even though I ordered the 3/16" version.

#254 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

This would be great! Is there somewhere I can purchase them? I do not have the capability to burn them myself.

Did you get a set? I am going to make a set for mine and could probably make an extra while I'm at it if you haven't already ordered a set.

#257 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

No I did not! If you are able to do this I will cover the costs, that would be awesome. I do wonder if that rom will work with the real game, or only in pinmame.

I have to make up some other ROMs this weekend and will make a couple sets. If all goes well I should be able to test in my machine to confirm they work. I don't see any reason they wouldn't.

I just finished rebuilding my sound board and power supply. Going to work on the CPU and driver over the weekend. The entire 40 pin interconnect is going to be replaced but the others can just be resoldered. I designed a tool to help me quickly fix the .156 connectors so they come through the PCB a bit more so they can be properly soldered. Made a huge difference on the sound board connectors.

Will post again when I get the ROMs made.

Robert

#258 6 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Thanks for notes about how the rail is supposed to fit. I'm pretty sure that I was sent the 1/8" version by mistake even though I ordered the 3/16" version.

Just got a message that they are mailing me a 3/16" kit which should work since I probably got the 1/8" by mistake....

#261 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

No I did not! If you are able to do this I will cover the costs, that would be awesome. I do wonder if that rom will work with the real game, or only in pinmame.

I made up a couple of the divide by 10 ROM's. The change is all to GREEN 2 FLIPPERS ROM. Just pull that one chip out and install the replacement with patched code and it should work. Just send me a PM and we'll figure out how to get it to you.

#262 6 years ago

Well, it's alive! As far as I can tell the CPU, driver, sound/speech, and power boards all work as they should. It has an NVRAM module installed so no more batteries to worry about. Now all the real work starts. Have some lamp socket connection issues, drop targets don't always register so need to tear those down, also have to rebuild the flippers, polish/wax the PF, new target stickers, rerubber, and lots of lamps.

It looks like two 6 digit displays are out. Tomorrow I'll confirm if those displays are bad or just a connection issue. If they are bad I'll just move the two good ones to the player one and two spots until I can find some. Does anyone have one or two good 6 digit displays? I'm sure someone out there has gone the LED route and may have an original display or two kicking around.

Even with everything left to do the game is playing well and I can tell it is going to be fun when done.

Once the replacement lift rail for my backglass arrives I will be able to get that installed.

Robert

#264 6 years ago

I confirmed that two of my player displays are dead. For now I just moved the two good ones to player one and two. If anyone has converted to LED displays and have one or two original working displays let me know.

Robert

#266 6 years ago

I finally have all my playfield lights going. Even after cleaning all the sockets there were two that would not light. Ended up being bad diodes at the lamp sockets.

Cleaned the horseshoe contacts and the PCB for the upper set of drop targets and now those register as they should.

Game is definitely playable now!

#268 6 years ago
Quoted from nicknack66:

What diodes did you use to replace those. I have one light that doesn't work (despite cleaning) and based on your post will replace the diode and see if that solves the problem.

The diodes on all the lamps are 1N4001 but you can use any of the more robust versions with a higher PIV like the 1N4004 or 1N4007. I used a 1N4004 as my replacements. Replacing a diode with a higher rating works but you never want to substitute one with a lower rating.

Hope that fixes your machine!

#269 6 years ago

I wanted to mention that it is a good idea to inspect all the wiring at the lamp sockets and the machine overall. There were several connections that were almost touching on my machine. I've also seen were the fiber insulators in the sockets can shrink and allow the tabs to turn easily if bumped. I put a small pice of electrical tape on the tab coming out of the center plate for the ring of lights to protect it from shorting against the ring.

#272 6 years ago
Quoted from Brijam:

Where can I buy a couple of those divide by 10 roms? I'd love one for my blackout and firepower!

I could probably make up some more since I have the proper chips on hand. I made one for another member and am going to put one in my Blackout as well.

Robert

#273 6 years ago

I finally made the time to install the two extra fuses for the AC into the bridges on my Blackout. This is the same mod I performed on my Pinbot. These are there in case one of the bridge rectifiers dies in a shorted state. It has happened to others in the past and can burn up the wiring from the transformer to bridges if that happens without the 8A slow blow fuse inline with them. If you install them in your game make sure to add labels to make it easy to maintain down the road. When installing the fuse holders I lined up the center with the head bolt and left room between for the labels. Each one has a thin piece of double faced tape underneath to keep them from moving and a screw to hold them down.

Sys7_Fix5 (resized).jpgSys7_Fix5 (resized).jpg

#276 6 years ago

I'm aware of that bridge board but I'm not fond of cutting of the .250" ends and the screwing the wires to the terminals. I would have rather seen it use different terminals so the wires could just plug in.

It is a good board, just not for me.

1 week later
#277 6 years ago

Does anyone have a good picture of the backbox with the glass off and door closed? I haven't seen any in this thread. The only pictures I've found show a small wood block on the upper left on the front of the door. Is there supposed to be one on the upper right as well? It would be good to get some more reference photos of games posted here.

#280 6 years ago

Thank you for posting the pictures! I also have that one wood block with the rubber pad. I wasn't sure if there was supposed to be an extra one on the right to keep that door away from the back glass. Makes sense that it was just on the one side to keep the door from opening too far.

My door is a bit different with square bezels around the player lights instead of the round ones pictured. I'll get pictures of mine and get them posted too for reference.

Made a lot of progress this weekend with rebuilt flippers, switches cleaned/adjusted, new rubber rings, and a lot of cleaning of the playfield. It is amazing how much a magic eraser can help remove swirl marks. Just need to finish going over it with Novis and wax then it will be ready to play. It is cleaning up nice and looks so much better than when I started.

Tonight I have one wire to resolder on the playfield and one socket to repair behind the 1000 stand up target. Getting close to wrapping this one up.

On the coin door I was able to get all those switches adjusted and working well. The only issue left on that is the coin mech for $1 coins doesn't always work. Most of the time the coin just hangs up in the coin mech. Haven't found the problem yet. Even though I don't expect to use it much I'd like to have everything working as it should.

#283 6 years ago

Here is a picture of the back panel on my machine. I think this is one of the earlier ones. It has plastic bezels to shield the lamps. Thanks to another Pinsider I was able to obtain two working player displays and now have them all working on my machine!

Blackout_BackPanel (resized).jpgBlackout_BackPanel (resized).jpg

#284 6 years ago

I just finished replacing 10 sockets on the back board and have all the lamps working now. Actually all LED's since that is what I'm using to reduce heat and preserve the new back glass. Most are frosted warm white with the exception of one blue for the high score, a few red for game over and tilt, and a few fire LED's right in the upper middle. Looks fantastic when all lit up. I wanted to avoid the rainbow puke that I've seen on other Pinball machines and not have a purple machine.

For the playfield the visible lamps are new #47 bulbs with the exception of a few more fire LED's near the top under plastics and some LED's under most of the inserts below the playfield.

I still need to finish polishing the playfield with Novis and then wax it. I'm amazed at what the magic eraser cleaned up on the playfield and removed most swirl marks. After installing new target labels and installing fresh rings it plays really fast and is just about dialed in. I can see why people really get attached to this machine. It may lack a lot of the toys of newer machines but it is just a fun machine to play.

Blackout_LampTest (resized).jpgBlackout_LampTest (resized).jpg

Blackout_Backglass (resized).jpgBlackout_Backglass (resized).jpg

#285 6 years ago

My machine was missing the label for the coin door switches. I think attention to details can make or break a machine. While browsing ebay I came across this:

ebay.com link: itm

It came quickly and I am happy with the results. I unscrewed the switches, cleaned the metal bracket, and installed the label with the center hole. The outer two holes were smaller but I used a fresh exacto knife around the inside of the outer holes using the metal as a guide and cleaned those up. Also used the exacto to trim the slots where the screws go.

After that carefully installed the screws snugging them up and done. If you over tighten them you could mess up the label.

I thought I would share the link in case anyone else needs one too.

Robert

Blackout_DiagLabel (resized).jpgBlackout_DiagLabel (resized).jpg

#286 6 years ago

Here are pictures of my rebuilt CPU and Driver boards. New 40-pin connectors and I removed and fixed all the other .156" connectors and resoldered them. The CPU needed one chip replaced by the battery and I took the opportunity to install an NVRAM module so I never have to worry about batteries leaking again. I think NVRAM is the way to go with these since there isn't a clock and calendar to worry about.

Those 3 Watt resistors on the left side of the driver didn't look so good so I went for newer 5 Watt replacements mounted neatly above the board. I use the lead forming tools to make sure they are uniform and line up. Doen't take much extra time and I think it is worth the effort.

Blackout_Driver (resized).jpgBlackout_Driver (resized).jpg

Blackout_CPU (resized).jpgBlackout_CPU (resized).jpg

#287 6 years ago

I need to get a better camera since it really doesn't do the machine justice. With all the proper lighting it is a fantastic looking machine. The attached picture I took was before fixing all the bad sockets and it looks so much better with it all lit up. I think this game will be around for a while!

Blackout (resized).jpgBlackout (resized).jpg

#290 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

Your game looks really nice! Definitely doing more than I did with mine. Where did you get the 'fire' LEDs...are they red and flicker? I like that idea and would like to add something like that behing my backglass.

Thank you! I still have some more detailing to do but it is coming along. These are the fire effect LEDs I used:

http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/fire.htm?1=1&CartID=0

I used three in the upper center of the backglass and 5 on the upper part of the playfield. The effect is really cool. I also picked up one UV LED and may try that as the "Blackout" light under the playfield.

#291 6 years ago

I also installed a Comet Pinball slow color changer in the 20 spot in the very center of the playfield. I tried a fire LED in there first but it didn't look good there. The color changer looks much better.

http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/1smdrgb.htm

1 month later
#293 6 years ago

All the lane change notes about Blackout talk about the entrance lanes at the top. It also appears that the lane change moves what light is lit for the red targets. I don't recall reading that in any of the documentation unless I missed it. Anyone else notice that?

I have to say that this game has really grown on me. I always thought the artwork was cool but this is just a fun game to play and it ends up getting a lot more use than I expected.

Robert

#295 6 years ago
Quoted from Inkochnito:

The spinners move the red lights at the drop targets afaik....

They definitely move with the spinners but when those aren't moving at all it seems that the lane change makes them move too. If that isn't the case on other games them maybe I have a switch misadjusted that registers when hitting the flipper.

The lights also seem to change when the jet bumpers are hit.

Robert

#297 6 years ago
Quoted from gutz:

You just answered your own question. One of your spinner switches is gapped too close.

Without asking how other machines are working it wasn't obvious if that was normal operation or a switch too close. Sounds like I need to go back and check the three spinner switches...

#299 6 years ago
Quoted from gutz:

You just answered your own question. One of your spinner switches is gapped too close.

That was it! Switch #18 for the spinner on the left side. It was gapped too close. I readjusted that and made sure all the spinners spin freely and register correctly. Now the red lights in front of the red targets only move with the spinners spin. All fixed.

1 week later
#308 6 years ago
Quoted from grandy:

The cliffy's are a must. Made an enormous difference on mine.

What are the cliffy return frames and where do they go?

1 week later
#318 6 years ago
Quoted from OwenKhan:

Anyone on here sell reliable Blackout ROMs? Interested in the divided by 10 score one if its around...

I should have an extra divide by 10 ROM and can check. Also those ROM's don't normally get hot. Is the one getting hot the one that was installed backwards? I usually pull all he ROMS, carefully clean off any oxidation on the leads, and verify the images. I'll replace any that have failed.

I've rebuilt quite a few of these boards now and would start with replacing the 40 pin connector on both the MPU and driver boards. Also, is there any battery damage? That can wipe out traces on the board and other parts.

The other problem with the boards is that the leads were trimmed too short from the factory. You get broken solder connections and cold solder joints. Some people just say reheat and add a little fresh solder. While that may have worked when the machine was newer and a fresh break that isn't good enough. Many of these have had bad connections for years and it has oxidized the length of the pin in the board. I remove all those connectors, made a tool to push the pins through their sheel so the stick out about 1/16" out the bottom so after soldering there is a nice strong filet so it won't break again. That step is something that isn't mentioned in the bulletproof in guide but needs to be added. Also changing some of the switch matrix resistors to 0 ohm jumpers.

Don't forget to add two fuses on the inputs to the bridges. That will protect your game (and maybe your house) if one shorts.

Blackout is a great game and is solid once you go through it.

Robert

#320 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

Finally lit my blackout kicker with a slow fader from Comet Pinball. Used nearby extraball socket screw to mount and alligator clips to the gi wires. Very simple mod and looks really cool.

Have you tried any of the fire LED's? I used 8 of them on the machine. 5 on the playfield GI inder the meteors, 3 in the upper center of the backglass. Looks awesome. I also picked up a couple UV LED's and was going to try one in the blackout light.

#322 6 years ago
Quoted from swillie:

Where did you get the fire LEDs? I want those, sounds perfect. Also I tried the UV blacklight LED bulb for the cup also, but just didn't 'pop' enough. I think the deep purple shade of the color changer looks more like what I thought the blacklight bulb would be like, so I would suggest a purple instead. Buy both, they are so inexpensive anyway.

I have a blue bulb in the blackout now that looks bood but may still try the UV light. I haven't tried lighting the kickout hole yet.

Those Flame LED's are shown here:

http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/fire.htm

1 week later
#325 6 years ago

I would look to get the correct system 6 board. There have been several inexpensive ones on eBay. One even had a Blackout ROM set on it.

I'd also replace the 40 pin connector. As I recall the CPU and driver work as a set and the CPU won't go through the boot up without it.

1 month later
#341 5 years ago

I just finished rebuilding a Blackout boardset for someone local. All new 40-pin connectors, removed, cleaned, fixed and reinstalled all the rest of the connectors. New 5watt resistors, new DIP sockets, and 8 zero ohm resistors for the switch matrix. 5101 was pulled and NVRAM installed.

Someone had messed with the reset circuit which I had to go back over. Odd thing was on the MPU the 6808 was bad. I rarely see those go bad.

1 month later
#352 5 years ago

If the machine doesn't have the extra fuses installed before the bridges in the back box you should look into adding those asap. If needed I do have a good picture on where those should go.

#357 5 years ago

This is the way I installed the fuse upgrade in my Blackout.

FuseUpgrade (resized).jpgFuseUpgrade (resized).jpg
2 months later
#370 5 years ago
Quoted from dfester007:

Well, I pick up my Blackout mid next week... should be sweet!

It is a fun game and mine gets a lot of use. Check to see if it has the extra fuses added to the bridges. If not they are easy to add.

3 weeks later
#379 5 years ago

Also check all the solder connections around the board for the .156" connectors. They were often cut too close to the board and the solder connections break.

#381 5 years ago
Quoted from llevine5:

Thanks, will do. Just curious (being new to pinball); let's say the connection was somehow broken between the connector and the board. Why would plugging and unplugging then cause the series to reset? Is it because you are breaking the column/row matrix processing cycle, then reinstating it, so something in the ROM says "Hey, reset everything"??? I would have thought if the connection was broken, it wouldn't reset at all, but that's not the case.

If you have bad connections you will be chasing all sorts of gremlins in the machine. I usually pull the whole set of boards and go over them all. Is there any battery damage? That is also a wildcard.

That long 40 pin connector between the CPU and driver is a weak spot. My game had about 5 of the sping clips on the driver board connector just gone. When the solder joints crack they can start getting oxidation in the crack and on the pin creating an insulator. As the machine gets bumped it can make and break connections. Wreaks havok. Also if some of the caps have dried up they may not be in spec and can cause issues.

Another thing is that some of the original DIP sockets were very poor. They often have to be replaced to make a reliable game.

If you're not comfortable with board repairs then have someone go through them.

#385 5 years ago

Unless the original boards are missing or completely hacked up there is no reason to change them with an after market replacement. Once the original boards have been gone through properly they can run rock solid.

Even if you swapped out the CPU and drivers you'd still have to go over the sound speech board and power board.

#388 5 years ago
Quoted from alveolus:

My biggest gripe with the rule set is that there is no reason to ever shoot the right lower spinner lane. This is a shame as it is a cool shot and adds to the pleasing flow of the game.
Does anyone know how difficult it would be to modify the ROM to add a simple rule to incentivize this shot?
One idea:
Completing the center target bank twice lights the lower right spinner.
Completing the upper target bank lights only the top right spinner.
Completing both of the above lights both but flashes one of the spinners for 2000/spin which alternates with each spinner hit.
Thoughts?

That is an interesting thought. I've rewritten the code to alter the rules on an older Bally machine but haven't looked at the Williams code. A lot would depend if there are any free bytes in RAM to keep track of that and also if there is any unused space in the game ROM.

Robert

#390 5 years ago
Quoted from mcuzz:

I never shoot for that shot anyways because if you miss its straight down the middle

Then that would be a good reason to make that shot something special..if you make it you get lots of points. If not you may loose the ball.....

#398 5 years ago

On my machine I probably replaced close to 20 lamp sockets on the backboard and some on the playfield. How are the sockets on your game? Any shorted?

I put white LEDs in the backbox since I wanted to reduce the heat and prolong the backglass art. Just changing the bulbs to LEDs shouldn't have caused a lot of trouble.

#403 5 years ago

Did you disconnect or knock a wire off the relay in the backbox that turns on and off the GI?

#406 5 years ago
Quoted from dfester007:

Turns out the credit button works better in free play. However, I have found 2 works off on my coin door diagnostic buttons. Anyone have a wiring diagram or can take a photo of which colors go to which switch?

Do you have the manual? You can download it from here:

https://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=317

I think the schematics show the switch wiring.

#409 5 years ago
Quoted from pb456:

Oh... By the by - I have had to replace several diodes in mine, as there were game reset problems, and all boiled down to damaged diodes, one of which you see on the high score reset switch, above. I have been using 1N4004.

I had to replace some for the lamps too.

7 months later
#449 4 years ago

Hope these will help...

IMG_1359 (resized).JPGIMG_1359 (resized).JPGIMG_1362 (resized).JPGIMG_1362 (resized).JPGIMG_1364 (resized).JPGIMG_1364 (resized).JPG
1 week later
#454 4 years ago
Quoted from Spacemanratso09:

I am joining the club tonight quite possibly
Pumped looks like a fun game never played it
Anything I should look for ?
Thanks
The game is coming from non pinball people

If the boards have never been gone through then the 40 pin connection between the MPU and driver boards. Also look for signs of leaking batteries.

3 months later
#477 4 years ago

I've ordered speakers on Amazon and you should be able to find some that use the exact same bolt pattern so no mods required. The one in my Blackout was fine but replaced one in my Meteor.

One thing I've noticed is that some speakers are intended for a cutout opening and you also need to order the additional spacer (often 1/2") so the cone doesn't hit the bottom of the cabinet. An easy upgrade for a worn out or torn original speaker.

If the sound doesn't improve then it may be time to install fresh caps on the sound board and reflow and bad solder connections.

#481 4 years ago
Quoted from Impzilla:

Its compatible electronically, nothing to change on the sound board.
The bigger physical size requires the bottom board to be cut out a bit.

I'm sure the larger speaker works fine. Unless the bottom of the game is trashed I wouldn't recommend altering it since you can't go back and undo it and there are plenty of drop in replacements.

This is the speaker I used:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0765CWG64/

Some speakers should also use one of these:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ITN4IR6/

1 month later
#511 4 years ago

Any pictures? May need your power board checked and the sound/speech board. The sound cards often need new IC sockets.

There is also an update to add fuses for the bridges. It prevents the wiring from melting if a bridge shorts.

Did you get the combo MPU and driver board? I seem to recall reading that some of the pins near the edge of the board can short against the metal mounting bracket. That could cause a coil to lock on.

Quoted from Hench4Life:

Joined the club a couple months ago, but my wedding and honeymoon planning prevented me from putting any work in. This machine is in pretty rough condition, looks like it spent a lot of time in a garage; mouse droppings and leaves included.
No backglass, major acid damage on the board, beat up cabinent and all the rubbers are destroyed. However, the playfield is in pretty decent shape, and the plastics are all in good shape (couple have some warping).
This is my first project (I have a players condition Time Machine), but I'm excited to bring this bad boy back to life. I didn't want to attempt a board refurb, so I got a Rottendog board. The biggest issues, other that a deep clean, is a locked up slingshot coil. I noticed the coil had a burt wrap, but the diode wasn't hooked up, so i thought that may have been the cause. I got a replacement coil (with diode). When I power up, it engages and stays that way. I found one of the activation switches (the scoring switch) was twisted and stuck closed, but that didn't resolve the issue. I've read through several threads on pinside on the issues, and they are usually a transistor or IC issues, but I wouldn't think that's the issue with a brand new board.
If anyone has any ideas on what might be the issue, I would really appreciate the help.
I know the relay for blackout isn't working, but I'll worry about that later...

#513 4 years ago
Quoted from Da-Shaker:

Did the coil lock up with the old board in it? Is the coil diode faced the right direction? Check for a short near the coil.
I didn't know those new boards could short against the holding frame. That would really suck. I've used a system 3 rotten dog and it worked great.

The shorting issue is mentioned in this thread. It may not be the issue here but it is something to check.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/warning-to-rottendog-327-owners-check-it-now

I try to use original boards and update those. If an MPU has severe damage then I'd probably look for a used board without acid damage to rebuild.

#516 4 years ago

That connector that is hanging goes to the relay to Blackout the GI.

IMG_1502 (resized).JPGIMG_1502 (resized).JPG
#517 4 years ago

Here are some reference photos I just took of my Blackout. It had mainly board issues and was missing parts but was mostly in original state without too many hacks. I added the two extra fuse on the bridges in the head.

It is definitely worth the effort to fix. Blackout is a great game and plays fast.

IMG_1494 (resized).JPGIMG_1494 (resized).JPGIMG_1495 (resized).JPGIMG_1495 (resized).JPGIMG_1499 (resized).JPGIMG_1499 (resized).JPGIMG_1500 (resized).JPGIMG_1500 (resized).JPGIMG_1501 (resized).JPGIMG_1501 (resized).JPGIMG_1504 (resized).JPGIMG_1504 (resized).JPGIMG_1508 (resized).JPGIMG_1508 (resized).JPGIMG_1509 (resized).JPGIMG_1509 (resized).JPG
2 months later
#561 4 years ago

Does anyone have a spare nice lockdown bar that fits Blackout? It is the last piece that I need to really make my game nice.

1 month later
#612 4 years ago
Quoted from thegarse:

Joined the club with a project pin that should keep me occupied (first system 6). It hadn't been turned on for about a year. Has intermittent sound, one slave display issue, bunch of burnt resistors and some drop targets that need love. Cabinet is decent. Playfield needs a hug or two. I can't wait to get it up and running.[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

You got lucky on the boards since there doesn’t look to be any battery damage. Those original boards are solid once done. I’d do the following:

- Replace the 40 pin connectors between the MPU and driver
- Replace the resistors that are burned up for the lamp matrix
- Update to the 0 ohm jumpers for the switch matrix
- Resolder any cracked solder connections at the headers.
- Replace those DIP sockets on the MPU and sound boards
- Install NVRAM so no need for batteries again.
- Check/replace any bad caps on the power supply and sound cards.

1 week later
#620 4 years ago

You could also install sound ROMs from another game like flash.

1 month later
#647 4 years ago
Quoted from ss-pinball:

Does anyone have any additional information about this?
ebay.com link » Williams Blackout Pinball Machine Playfield Overlay

Don’t do it. Either touch it up the original Playfield or check on a hardtop. I have yet to hear anything good about those large stickers. If you had no other option and had to use one I’d probably get one of the thin clear Playfield protectors to go over it.

#650 4 years ago
Quoted from ss-pinball:

I messaged the seller two days ago. No response.
How would this differ from a hardtop?
What's the deal with Outside Edge anyway?
I get that we're shut down now...they said 4th quarter 2019 a year ago...we're pushing 6 months late AND they are releasing product for titles with lower numbers of machines out there? How smart is that?
And, of course, like some others in the replacement part pinball world, they never respond to questions, rarely give updates and are generally pretty vague about commitments.

First I’ve heard the hard tops are awesome. They have the graphics printed on the underside of thicker clear plastic sheet. It is like the overlay and Playfield protector all on one.

The overlay is like a giant vinyl sticker. You can run into bubbling issues. Some people have clear coated the stickers but I really question how those would wear.

#656 4 years ago

Any pictures of the current Playfield? Is it savable?

3 weeks later
#673 3 years ago

Just wrapping an original Blackout board set and noticed something odd about the speech board. Mine has 3 ROM's on it for the speech. This one which I think is from a slightly earlier game has 4 speech ROM's installed. So far it all sounds the same.

How many speech ROM's does your game have?

#675 3 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

Blackout ROM file I have has 1 sound ROM and 3 Voice ROMs

That's what I have in my game. This has 1 sound ROM and 4 voice ROM's on the other board. Maybe a couple ROM's were smaller so it takes up an extra ROM to hold all the speech on earlier games. So far I can't hear any difference.

3 weeks later
#717 3 years ago
Quoted from Da-Shaker:

Looking for a third game, that'll fit nicely next to them. Any suggestions? I'm thinking Barracora or Space Station. Not interested in Black Knight

Meteor goes along with the theme and has 15 drop targets. Fun game.

#721 3 years ago

I can’t recall where I read it but it is a known issue. If you clean the switch contacts for the start button it may help.

1 week later
#745 3 years ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Not sure the reference. What is wrong with System 6?

Not sure either. Same board set as Firepower and both great machines. Once the original boards have been properly gone through they are solid and work well. Just have to make sure not to cut corners and be aware of all the known issues and updates.

#747 3 years ago
Quoted from KnockerPTSD:

Fire power is also a sub 2k (cdn) game all day. System 6 are too unreliable for most people is all.

Probably because those machines hadn't had the appropriate board work done and game properly maintained. You can't cut corners on them. On those boards I prefer to do it once and do it right. Replace both halves of the 40-pin. Replace the old unreliable DIP sockets, clean any oxidation off the tarnished chip leads, REMOVE the rest of the .156" headers to clean off the oxidation on their pins instead of just reflowing. This is important since most of those leads were trimmed too close and have cracked solder joints. With the age it oxidizes down into the hole and on the pin. Just reflowing without cleaning isn't enough. I made a jig that I use for those that pushes about a 1/32" of the pins into the shell of needed to correct ones that were cut too short. Other things like replacing AMI PIA chips or at least keep an eye on them. I've rebuilt many of these sets and specifically 5-6 Blackout sets. Haven't run into reliability issues on any of those.

#760 3 years ago
Quoted from KnockerPTSD:

^^this is why^^
I love how you make it seem like no big deal though.
An entry level pin requireing that much work to bullet proof only supports my original response of "system 6"
The AVERAGE system 6 buyer/owner doesnt necessarily have the skill set to do all that work. Get a system 7^ and you are more likely to just need a flipper rebuild. I love me some system 6 but dont explain away all you have to do to make it reliable as if its a cake walk.

I'm not saying the average person will have all those skills or tools. If not they can send them out to be done. Usually costs far less than replacement boards. After that they shouldn't have to worry about it. If someone had done it already they should be good. Just commenting that the System 6 can be reliable as the others. I've had to do the same list for system 7 boards and everything I said applies to those too. Same issues.

1 year later
#867 1 year ago
Quoted from SteelNation:

I just picked up a Blackout last night so I'm happy to join the group. My first old game. I'm not sure how active this thread still is but I hope I can learn some tips on working on one of these old Williams machines. A lot to learn. Time to start catching up on the 800 posts.
First task is getting the cigarette smell out. It does bring back some nostalgia of 80's bars though.

Ozone generator in the cabinet can help. I’ve heard it can damage rubber rings so do it before replacing all the rings. The cheap awesome cleaner from dollar tree works well to get ride of tar and smoke smell from the outside.

#869 1 year ago
Quoted from wildwillys:

Hi All I just joined the Blackout club, this will be a long restoration it's probably not worth it but....
I'm looking for a head I think most williams 3-7 will work but not sure and also looking for a playfield it can be trashed I plan on using a hard top.
The lower cabinet is ok except for the bottom panel so i will replace that. It sat in a building for the past 10 plus years and the roof started leaking. the side of the playfield is rotted through and most of the top. the bottom of the playfield is 90% useable. The backglass is pretty decent and the boards don't look too bad.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

I saw that post on Facebook about this game. While some of that looks bad the boards look good and will clean up well. Once properly refreshed those should be solid. I've done a bunch of those sets. Will need new DIP sockets, electrolytic caps, new 40pin interconnect and normal clean up but you'll have good boards.

Blackout is a great game and worth saving.

Too bad you aren't closer. I think I still have a spare Blackout playfield as a spare (in case I wanted to do a hard top) and I have a Gorgar head I was going to use as a test fixture. I could probably just take out the internals and use something else for the wood part if needed.

See if anyone closer comes through but if not i'll see what I have.

#880 1 year ago
Quoted from wildwillys:

I'm looking for a set of the wood playfield rails for my Blackout if anyone has a used set or I remember a while ago someone was making new ones for a bunch of different machines but can't remember who.
Thanks, Jeff

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/oak-replacement-playfield-rails-wh2o-and-taf-ready-to-ship-or-york

#886 1 year ago
Quoted from Hench4Life:

Robert, I’d be interested in the gogar head if your looking to part with it. My blackout head is rough!

I was going to use it to build a test fixture but could probably come up with something else. This one isn't rough and would probably be better on a game.

1 week later
#892 1 year ago
Quoted from SteelNation:

I'm starting to work through the issues I have with this machine and taking them one at a time. I need some help with this one. I'm still learning about the boards so this one may be over my head.
The player 1 & 2 displays are missing the bottom left segment and the player 3 & 4 displays are missing the bottom segment.
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
After looking at the schematics, I narrowed this down that it might be the capacitors controlling those specific segments.
[quoted image]
On the Master Display board, those capacitors looked a little toasty so I replaced them and one other that looked bad. When I turned on the game I got white smoke from the two bad segment capacitors and they are burnt again. The other one I replaced is fine.
Original board photo:[quoted image]
Repaired Board:[quoted image]
After start up: [quoted image]
[quoted image]
I assume now that there is something 'upstream' causing this. Where should I check from here? Possibly one of the chips on the board?
Thanks for the help.

Looks like someone installed some 1/4 watt resistors instead of 1/2 watt. If the larger ones burn up you may have bad glass.

#897 1 year ago
Quoted from Rampton:

Check out this ad: https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/ad/112329
Out of the master displays listed, nearly half have the same resistor burn-out issue. Mine did too, so I replaced it. I'm guessing there's a common problem upstream, as noted, causing this? Is this common for all System 6 or just Blackout?

I’ve seen it on system 3-6 when the glass goes bad on a slave display.

#900 1 year ago
Quoted from Rampton:

As in there's a crack/leak or something? I don't know what's meant. Sorry.

If it is cracked or leaked then nothing display and they are toast. Some seemed to work but would drag down other displays and burn up resistors on the Master display. Some displays seem to draw more current as they age and just can't be used reliably.

#904 1 year ago
Quoted from SteelNation:

I replaced the resistors with the correct 1/2W and the player 3/4 ‘d’ segment resistor immediately smoked. The other player 1/2 ‘e’ segment worked… for a few minutes, and then also smoked.
I checked the voltage at pin 3 and it was -104 and pin 4 was +100. I checked them a second time and I think I may have shorted something because they now both read 0 and displays are dark. Uggh. I’m making this worse. Noob problems.

If there are issues it can help to disconnect all of the slave displays except one. Power on to test. If ok turn off then plug in the next one and continue to test each one. It can help isolate the bad panel.

2 weeks later
#908 1 year ago
Quoted from SteelNation:

My next issue is no speech. Is it worth messing around to try and fix the speech board or buy a replacement from PinPCB?

Totally worth repairing. I’ve rebuilt a bunch and am finishing up one for Firepower now. Usually end up replacing all the DIP sockets on the boards and all new caps.

1 month later
#917 1 year ago
Quoted from SteelNation:

Thanks Robotworkshop. I probably should have said “if you’re not sure how to diagnosis the problem”. I’m comfortable soldering components on the board but I’m pretty lost on how to diagnosis which components are faulty. I could do a shotgun approach and order a bunch of things and replace half of the board, but at that rate I’d be most of the way into the cost of a new board. I’d really like to fix the board, for the sense of accomplishment and cost, but I need someone to show me how to figure this out. I really want to learn but I’m pretty new and just need some direction.
mof I can open a new thread for the speech issue. I never really know if it’s better to ask in the owner’s thread or a separate one.

Totally understand about troubleshooting and typically recommend that first. However there are many well documented must do updates if you want the boards to be reliable. A good 40 pin interconnect set is number 1. DIP sockets are high on the list. If any are scanbe brand then just stop and replace them. Otherwise you’ll be chasing issues that are connection related. If the driver board has AMI brand PIA chips those have a high failure rate. If I see those I’ll pull them out to check and put in sockets so if any fail they can easily be replaced.

5 months later
#928 1 year ago

Also at the hardware store you can get the glue called GOOP. It works really well for these. I've spread a thin coat between the board and glass just below the top edge. Clamp with the spring loaded plastic clamps. I haven't had any break free again.

1 week later
#934 1 year ago
Quoted from damadczar:

I don't wanna take my back glass off to double check, but I think you'd need:
MPU
Driver
Power Supply
Sound
Speech
I'm pretty sure they sell a combo MPU + Driver board, and I think there's also a combo Sound + Speech board (I think).
I've not done an exhaustive search, but that's mainly what you'd need.
Is the display driver board also missing? If so, you'd need that too.

I would second getting a set of teh Wolfpack displays. The kit has the master display and the 4 slave displays.

For the others you have a few options. Get original boards for the game. Those when properly serviced and rebuilt run well and are trouble free. I run all original boards in my Blackout and Firepower and they have been solid for years.

For the MPU/Driver if you want an aftermarket the latest version of the Rottendog Combo board works well. The early version wasn't as robust in regards to the switch matrix and if there were shorts in the matrix could blow an odd chip in that board. It also had a mounting tab you needed to watch out for. The current version doesn't have those issues. I know several people running them and are very happy with them. So either a combo board like this or a rebuilt original MPU and rebuilt driver board.

For the Power Supply I prefer the original one. They are really simple. As long as the main 5V capacitor is replaced and any questionable solder joints reflowed you are usually good to go. I rarely have issues with the HV section for the displays but if you run the Wolfpack LED displays it isn't an issue as those don't need HV at all.

I've heard there was an aftermarket sound/speech but never tried one of know if they are available. Again, I go original here. It uses the smaller square sounf board with the optional 40-pin ribbon connector. That is needed so the optional plug in speech board can be used. It holds up to 4 speech ROM's and some circuitry for the speech. Either find a good used one or a used set that can be rebuilt.

1 month later
#945 1 year ago
Quoted from Pulptoxic:

Hello to all BLACKOUT lovers
Hope one of you could help me with my issue.
I bought my BLACKOUT some weeks ago, in good condition and a very nice PF.
Checking the mechanics under the PF i recognized, that the upper 3 bank target assembly is broken. Could anybody give me a hint which assembly is the right one? Should I need a new drop target board too?
I couldn't find a parts list at any place. If there is one with part numbers, i would a appreciate the help with this.
THX & Greetings
Bert
[quoted image]

Looks like just a broken coil stop. That and a new plastic coil sleeve should do it.

#947 1 year ago
Quoted from Pulptoxic:

Thank you for answering so fast! Yes this one and you're absolutely right the coil stop is broken.
What do you think about the plunger, looks very used an oxidized, replace too?
best regrads

Hard to tell from the picture but where it is used you should be fine just cleaning and maybe polishing a little. With a new coil sleeve and stop it will work fine,

7 months later
#985 5 months ago
Quoted from PantherCityPins:

Hey all,
I’m working on a Blackout for a friend. It keeps popping the 2.5 amp SB fuse with pop actuation. If you replace the fuse the game will power up fine and everything works until you actuate a pop bumper. So I checked the pops and I don’t see any obvious shorts, all the coils seem ok, plungers move freely.
The weird thing is it can happen with any of the three pops and it takes 3-5 actuations to blow the fuse. All the boards are new except for the power supply board. I’m wondering if there is an issue with the board itself and it’s sending too much amperage through the circuit over time??
Thoughts?[quoted image]

Are the correct coils installed?

1 month later
#991 4 months ago

There is a divide by 10 ROM you can use if you are rolling over the score. If a display is bad you can look for a good used display or get a whole fresh set of LED displays. The Wolffpac are excellent. If you go that route you can sell your original working displays to offset the cost.

#993 3 months ago
Quoted from PantherCityPins:

I have a new power supply board incoming. Going to throw that in there and see if it fixes the problem. Something that blows a fuse over repeated actuations but not every time seems like an issue of increasing amperage from the board that is building up slowly until the fuse pops.
I’ll let everyone know how it comes out.

I doubt the power board is at fault. It will not increase amperage. Any of the power boards can supply more current (up to the fuse size) but that all depends on the load connected to it.

Something else is wrong in the game.

#996 3 months ago

The divide by 10 was done for Firepower but works in most System 6 games including Blackout. You should be able to get it from this page:

https://www.pinball4you.ch/okaegi/pro_soft.html

#998 3 months ago
Quoted from zeldarioid:

It’s hard to tell what all that person did/had to do…if it’s just fitting/mounting new 7-digit displays, maybe swapping in a Sys 7 MPU, that doesn’t seem like it’d be so bad? If it requires altering game code or something, though, that’s not something I’ve ever done and wouldn’t know where to start :/
Not that I’ve done a display or MPU swap, either, hah

If someone is rolling over the score then that is what the divide by 10 patch handles. You keep your 6 digit displays but all of the scores are a tenth of what they normally are so it acts like a 7 digit game. Just imagine there is an extra invisible zero on the right of each player display.

There are instructions in this ZIP file on how to patch the ROM. As I recall you only need to patch one chip and burn a fresh one with the new image:

https://www.pinball4you.ch/okaegi/p-fpall.zip

The patched ROM used to be online but it looks like many alternative versions of code have been pulled.

#1000 3 months ago
Quoted from zeldarioid:

Yeah the divide by 10 ROM makes sense, and def seems simple enough to implement, but it has the same bummer: You have to mentally manage your score in some fashion. If it’s not something crazy to make the game report and record 7 digit scores, that’d be the ideal, *but* I’m guessing since there isn’t readily available, easy to follow steps on doing it (at least that I’ve been able to find thus far), there probably isn’t a particularly straight forward way to go about it?

I'm sure there are several on here that have the images. I think I have a spare one ready to go. Would just need to look through my parts. I have a couple games that can use it.

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