(Topic ID: 54503)

Black Knight Club...Members Only!


By mof

7 years ago



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  • Latest reply 8 days ago by PSchmitz
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There are 2276 posts in this topic. You are on page 33 of 46.
#1601 1 year ago

Price check.
I have a lead on a non-working Black Knight project.
...cosmetically "pretty good"...
...untested...
...the guy wants $1600 which seems pretty steep...

What are Black Knight projects going for these days?

#1602 1 year ago

Seems steep to me for a project
I passed on one several months ago that was a BK project for 700, because I didn't have the space.

#1603 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

Huh.... what is a good replacement, nail or otherwise? I’m not sure on size/length, but I can swing by the HW store tomorrow.
Excited to play! I took apart the drop target mechs on the upper pf, and man were those dirty.

As @Travish says it is a small nail. I installed a metal post to support the plastic better on my rebuild. I also installed some nice supports behind the upper right drop targets instead of the nails.

20180925_160501 (resized).jpg20180925_160505 (resized).jpg
#1604 1 year ago

Where are you guys getting those trough protectors for the lock trough on the upper playfield?

#1605 1 year ago
Quoted from frunch:

Where are you guys getting those trough protectors for the lock trough on the upper playfield?

Those are cliffy's. He has a set for the whole machine including the shooter trough.

http://www.passionforpinball.com/blknight.htm

#1606 1 year ago

Awesome, thanks for the link!!! It's been a while since I've shopped out my BK, this is a very good reason to finally get to it.

#1607 1 year ago
Quoted from ss-pinball:

Price check.
I have a lead on a non-working Black Knight project.
...cosmetically "pretty good"...
...untested...
...the guy wants $1600 which seems pretty steep...
What are Black Knight projects going for these days?

$1600?! That should be a “good” working game. A big project should be 700-800 ish.... unless it is mint with cpr playfield a and plastics etc?

#1608 1 year ago
Quoted from epeabs:

As @Travish says it is a small nail. I installed a metal post to support the plastic better on my rebuild. I also installed some nice supports behind the upper right drop targets instead of the nails.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Mmmm now I see those nails you’re talking about. Ya I like the screw post better. Dang I have a bag of them at home but already went to work. I’ll snipe one from a post and replace it tomorrow. Thanks!

#1609 1 year ago

Any replacement “holder” for the spinner and gate? My game had two spinners and this gate was mangled to make fit....

077BFE54-1930-4A29-B0DF-8E4C90433F2C (resized).jpeg
#1610 1 year ago

You could always bend a new wire. It's pretty easy actually.

#1611 1 year ago
Quoted from Travish:

You could always bend a new wire. It's pretty easy actually.

For the wireform gate? I ordered a new gate, just need the holder thing. Looks like thin steel which wouldn’t be too hard to rebrand a flat piece but that requires my time to source and screw around.

#1612 1 year ago

Damn that's a lot of work to change the eff'n turn-around cave bulb....

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#1613 1 year ago
Quoted from chaskett:

Damn that's a lot of work to change the eff'n turn-around cave bulb....

I just had a look at mine. It would be much easier to unscrew the socket from the bottom of the playfield and swap the bulb. It might be a bit tight but that would be a much better option.

#1614 1 year ago

I would second that option. Probably a bit easier to desolder and pull the socket out for bulb replacement.

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#1615 1 year ago
Quoted from epeabs:

I would second that option. Probably a bit easier to desolder and pull the socket out for bulb replacement.

If you desolder the ground braid, when you put the socket back in, just put the braid underneath the tab, no need to resolder. It's not going anywhere and the contact with the socket should be more than sufficient.

#1616 1 year ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

If you desolder the ground braid, when you put the socket back in, just put the braid underneath the tab, no need to resolder. It's not going anywhere and the contact with the socket should be more than sufficient.

A lot of times the solder will stay stuck to the tab but not the screw since the screw did not get hot enough for it to stick. As long as you can get your little socket on the screw head you won't even need to desolder it at all.

#1617 1 year ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

I just had a look at mine. It would be much easier to unscrew the socket from the bottom of the playfield and swap the bulb. It might be a bit tight but that would be a much better option.

I had thought of that, but mine has a giant glob of solder covering the screw. I needed a rubber change and wax anyway

1 week later
#1618 1 year ago

Hello everyone. Just joined pinside.com after I acquired a non-working Black Knight at an auction. I brought it home to start some investigation on what was wrong, and turned it on. Unfortunately, it turns out that who ever assembled the Black Knight mixed the black/white connectors in the backbox. I'm sure I don't have to say the damage that caused when I turned it on. One of the chips burned (see attached picture) and smoked and who knows what else was fried.

So now I'm in search for replacement boards. I'd actually like to replace all the boards to start clean and avoid any other issues. I tried to figure out what are the boards, but I see that Rottendog no longer supports a replacement board. Then I found another company (I believe they are called Kohout Enterprise), but no one seems to have those either.

So I'm hoping someone here can offer a suggestion of where I can go to get replacement boards for Black Knight.

I appreciate any assistance.

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#1619 1 year ago

You may want to consider having the boards checked out before replacing them. Replacement boards have been produced, but they aren't always that easy to find. Your original boards may have years of life left in them after getting refurbished by a good tech. I had my boards repaired nearly 15 years ago and have had surprisingly few problems since. If you consider going the repair route, a couple well-known repair guys:

Chris Hibler https://pinside.com/pinball/community/pinsiders/chrishibler/contact

Clive/Coin-Op Cauldron: http://www.coinopcauldron.com/

If you're interested, Clay's Williams system 3-7 guide had written this specifically about reversing those connectors on a Black Knight pinball machine:

Oops! I Mis-Connected the Plugs and Turned the Game On!

If the plugs were cross-connected, and the game turned on, there are some likely things that could happen (this example is Black Knight; what blows exactly can be game specific, and may also depend on how long the game was powered on). First the obviously broken stuff was:
General Illumination lights.
Score displays unlit.
Flippers permanently energized and stuck on.
Drop target reset coil energized and stuck on.
Sound board wouldn't even do self test.
Blows fuses.
In this Black Knight example, here's what fried, and what survived:

Power supply board was OK.
Sound board Amp IC blown (flipper was being energized through this IC).
CPU board needed IC7 (7404) and IC5 (7402) replaced, as these were shorting +5V and ground through them (these are connected to the memory protect circuit and diagnostic switches). It also needed IC12 (7408) replaced to get the CMOS RAM working again (until this was replaced, the game always came up in test mode).
Driver board needed IC17 (7406) replaced to fix a bunch of switches that wouldn't read. Also needed IC11 (6821 PIA) replaced to fix some row inputs that were stuck "on" (surprisingly, the 4049's CMOS chips survived)

#1620 1 year ago

Thank you Frunch. I’ll see what it costs to repair the boards.

#1621 1 year ago
Quoted from dmgambone:

Thank you Frunch. I’ll see what it costs to repair the boards.

Welcome! I recently sent all my BL boards out for check/repair. I always send mine out on a used game just to make sure they’re ok. It costs less or about what 1 board costs to buy. Totally worth it.

#1622 1 year ago

Allan at Ardvark Pinball in Mass does great work. http://www.ardvarkpr.com/

#1623 1 year ago

How can I tell if the backglass on my Black Knight is an original or a reproduction? Do the reproductions have any indicators/differences on them? The backglass on mine is in near perfect condition, which I find unusual for an almost 40 year old pinball machine.

Given that it is in such great shape, should I do anything to help preserve it or leave it alone? What I've read is that many people feel that if it's in good shape and not flaking, don't mess with it.

#1624 1 year ago
Quoted from dmgambone:

How can I tell if the backglass on my Black Knight is an original or a reproduction? Do the reproductions have any indicators/differences on them? The backglass on mine is in near perfect condition, which I find unusual for an almost 40 year old pinball machine.
Given that it is in such great shape, should I do anything to help preserve it or leave it alone? What I've read is that many people feel that if it's in good shape and not flaking, don't mess with it.

If it is in great shape, convert to LEDs and be done with it as long as it is in a space without great temperature fluctuation. If you want to use incandescents, google "triple thick pinball backglass" to find out how to seal it.

#1625 1 year ago
Quoted from dmgambone:

Thank you Frunch. I’ll see what it costs to repair the boards.

Just got a Black Knight myself and about to send them off to Eugene Mosh to be refurbed. I couldn't find any new PCBs

#1626 1 year ago

Put my game back together, powered it up before putting all my plastics etc back on. Right flippers worked barely, then stopped working (both). Left work no issue. They worked before tear down.

I tried by passing the weebly fuse board and still nothing. Flipper switch looks ok, I am going to look into the transistor but....any ideas?

Edit: ah, I did just install the correct flipper coil on the right lower as the right had a 50v Coil in it

#1627 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

I tried by passing the weebly fuse board and still nothing. Flipper switch looks ok, I am going to look into the transistor but....any ideas?

There isn't a transistor. Just the relay on the driver board and the connectors.

#1628 1 year ago
Quoted from zacaj:

There isn't a transistor. Just the relay on the driver board and the connectors.

Ah ok.

Just found an old thread
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/system-7-black-knight-flipper-problem

Tested my magnasave on the right, not working. Left is. My multimeter isn’t at work

#1629 1 year ago

I'm starting a topside tear down of my BK today to put in a new playfield protector. How to I remove the upper playfield, or at least move it high enough to get at the turnaround? I've removed what looks to be the screws holding it in, but it still doesn't budge. Thanx in advance...

#1630 1 year ago
Quoted from Mathazar:

I'm starting a topside tear down of my BK today to put in a new playfield protector. How to I remove the upper playfield, or at least move it high enough to get at the turnaround? I've removed what looks to be the screws holding it in, but it still doesn't budge. Thanx in advance...

Check for more screws under plastics, etc.

#1631 1 year ago
Quoted from Mathazar:

I'm starting a topside tear down of my BK today to put in a new playfield protector. How to I remove the upper playfield, or at least move it high enough to get at the turnaround? I've removed what looks to be the screws holding it in, but it still doesn't budge. Thanx in advance...

There are four screws. One on each side (machine philips) and two between those red posts at the back. Once those are free, look underneath, there are harnesses you have to unhook. If you want to really get it out of the way.

#1632 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

There are four screws. One on each side (machine philips) and two between those red posts at the back. Once those are free, look underneath, there are harnesses you have to unhook. If you want to really get it out of the way.

Mine had 5 screws. The fifth is in a deep hole along the top right rail.

#1633 1 year ago
Quoted from chaskett:

Mine had 5 screws. The fifth is in a deep hole along the top right rail.

I believe that's accurate. I think mine had five as well and one of them is in that upper right corner and the hole is deep.

#1634 1 year ago
Quoted from chaskett:

Mine had 5 screws. The fifth is in a deep hole along the top right rail.

Quoted from epeabs:

I believe that's accurate. I think mine had five as well and one of them is in that upper right corner and the hole is deep.

I can check when I go back to troubleshoot my flippers. I remember deep hole screws but they only held on the side rails to the pf. Either I forgot or multiple versions?

#1635 1 year ago

I am in the middle of a teardown. Here are the 5 screws with the deep one circled in red.

2019-01-18 19.38.37 (resized).jpg
#1636 1 year ago

Thanx, guys. Very helpful and I was able to get the upper playfield up enough to get at the turnaround. Playfield protector is in, and I'm quite pleased. I put it mainly to overcome the multitude of cupped inserts and it sure did...balls roll much truer now, no bizarre change of directions. I needed to make a few mods/shims to keep the balls from hopping when hitting the ramps, but all in all this is a great improvement. I can post some before and after pictures if anyone is interested....it looks like my semi-decent playfield has been clear coated.

I'm encouraged enough now that I'll probably do my Eight Ball Deluxe tonight as well. That should be much easier/simpler than BK.

#1637 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

Ah ok.
Just found an old thread
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/system-7-black-knight-flipper-problem
Tested my magnasave on the right, not working. Left is. My multimeter isn’t at work

Ok, so to start, I'll check fuse F4 on the PS board (however 1 fuse blown would mean all flippers/magnets would stop, yes?)
I also see a fuse under the pf on each side near/connected to the magnasave magnet. I will check those as well.

Where does the power separate from ps board to each side? In another thread they mentioned the ground as well. Is there a ground strap for each side? I reinstalled the white/red ground when I put the pf's back in. But was wondering if I missed one.

#1638 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

Is there a ground strap for each side?

There's just one white/red wire for ground that gets screwed down with the ground strap in the backbox.

DC voltage for the magnets and flippers (what the schematic is calling (flipper B+) runs from the power supply board at connector 3J3 at pin 4 and 5. The female connector has a blue wire for pin 4 that provides 28VDC to the left flippers and magnet. Next to it at pin 5, there's a grey wire carrying the same DC voltage for the right magnet and flippers. Even if it doesn't fix the problem, i highly recommend replacing the header pins and female connector at 3J3. On both Black Knights I've worked on, replacing those header pins made a notable gain to flipper strength. In one case the flippers weren't working at all and it was just worn out header pins on that connector. I remember the pins had a sort of dull appearance compared to others. Seeing how much more work the flippers perform than the other coils, i suppose it shouldn't have come as a surprise.

Thinking in a different direction, have you verified the magnet button works in switch test?

#1639 1 year ago
Quoted from frunch:

There's just one white/red wire for ground that gets screwed down with the ground strap in the backbox.
DC voltage for the magnets and flippers (what the schematic is calling (flipper B+) runs from the power supply board at connector 3J3 at pin 4 and 5. The female connector has a blue wire for pin 4 that provides 28VDC to the left flippers and magnet. Next to it at pin 5, there's a grey wire carrying the same DC voltage for the right magnet and flippers. Even if it doesn't fix the problem, i highly recommend replacing the header pins and female connector at 3J3. On both Black Knights I've worked on, replacing those header pins made a notable gain to flipper strength. In one case the flippers weren't working at all and it was just worn out header pins on that connector. I remember the pins had a sort of dull appearance compared to others. Seeing how much more work the flippers perform than the other coils, i suppose it shouldn't have come as a surprise.
Thinking in a different direction, have you verified the magnet button works in switch test?

Thanks.

When I get back to work. I can verify more and also bring my DMM. I have not done any switch test(s) yet. I'll add that to my list!

#1640 1 year ago

Found my flipper issue.

The pin on the molex at the power supply board (blue wire for right flippers) wasn’t making good contact with the pin. I found this by doing continuity tests at the flippers and working back through plugs etc to the power board. I have ordered a new molex connector and I’ll repin.

Also I found a band clamp to make my right gate bracket

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#1641 1 year ago

Hey, just realized I never followed up on my flipper power issue back a while ago...the game I was working on had tons of corrosion at the IDC connectors, so I replaced them all, which eliminated some of the problem. But, the *lower* flippers still felt sluggish. The problem area turned out to be on the pins of the block connector between the upper and lower play fields.

There's no good way to replace both the male and female pins, short of replacing the whole connector plug and every pin. The guy I was doing the work for didn't want to get into all that unless it was really necessary, so we took a small file to the pins and wiped them clean with alcohol, rinse, repeat, like that. It worked! Game plays solidly now.

So, if you have any issues with your BK, don't make the mistake I did and fail to consider those playfield connectors! Major potential failure point!

#1642 1 year ago

Quick question
I got my game up and running. Played a game. Had a ball in the upper lock, and my game ended (ball drain). The locked ball stayed, I waited to see if it would eject but it just stayed there. I started a new game, ball still stayed. I locked a ball up top or hit that shot and it ejected the old ball and kept playing.

I haven’t tested the switch yet but is this normal? Or should it eject locked balls after a game ends?

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#1643 1 year ago

Yup, normal behavior. Nothing to worry about!

#1644 1 year ago
Quoted from frunch:

Yup, normal behavior. Nothing to worry about!

Oh good! I was kind of scared some logic on the board wasn’t right.

I did fix my right magnet issue, it wasn’t working. I fixed the power so it had power and ground, flippers were working.

I checked the wires and they looked good, then I pulled the fuse and checked it with my dmm. It was super spotty. The metal had corroded/oxidized enough to not work. I cleaned that up. Tested and it’s working!

Almost done fixing the game up! Pretty excited. What color shooter rod spring should I uSe? I have a red? But it is waaaaay to strong and launches the ball up and flies to the drain.

#1645 1 year ago

Please confirm... in the default settings, two or three captured balls intended to start multiball do NOT carry over each turn if multiball is not achieved before round is over, right? Meaning you need lock two/ three balls AND achieve multiball on the same round or else the locked balls don't count and the locked multiball counter resets, correct?

#1646 1 year ago
Quoted from MoSeS_1592:

Please confirm... in the default settings, two or three captured balls intended to start multiball do NOT carry over each turn if multiball is not achieved before round is over, right? Meaning you need lock two/ three balls AND achieve multiball on the same round or else the locked balls don't count and the locked multiball counter resets, correct?

Confirmed, Thats how mine is set up. It might be adjustable in the menus.

#1647 1 year ago
Quoted from gutz:

Confirmed, Thats how mine is set up. It might be adjustable in the menus.

It is

#1649 1 year ago

Cleaning up nice

28041 (resized).jpeg
#1650 1 year ago
Quoted from pinaholic:

Cleaning up nice

Wrong club, lol! Nice looking High Speed though!

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