(Topic ID: 334913)

Black Knight 1980 - MPU locking at 0

By USAsquint

1 year ago


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  • 19 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 months ago by USAsquint
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Diagnostic 9 when ic19 removed-faulty or mem protect circuit (resized).jpg
Diagnostic Pass BK ROMS flashing off to zero  zero or 8 (resized).jpg
IMG_20230422_132904214 (resized).jpg
Diagnostic 7 when IC26 removed-faulty (resized).jpg
Diagnostic 6 when IC 14 is removed-faulty (resized).jpg
Diagnostic 5 when IC 20 is removed-faulty (resized).jpg
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#1 1 year ago

First post. Recently bought a Black Knight machine off of FB marketplace here in Virginia from a single machine owner. Was listed as non-working due to blowing the solenoid fuse. With further troubleshooting I am finding the MPU to be an issue as it usually locks at "0". Hoping someone can help me step thru this a bit. Have not done any soldering to printed boards with chips etc. but have soldered other things and generally know how it works. I have no supplies on hand of component parts. Just a meter, schematics, very basic soldering gear, a new fuse set for BK from Marco. I have the PDFs of the schematics but I am not a guru on using them for tracing down circuit paths.

Current state:
Driver board removed, MPU with 1J2 cable connected only. IJ2 cable while connected to board read proper voltages per schematic.

Observations:
Normally goes to 0 on the display and stays but sometime will randomly boot with a "t" or another number from the trouble code list. Nothing regular or consistent but stays on 0 90% of the time.

Voltage tested at the 1J2 cable and shows normal per schematic.
Voltage tested at the Test Points:
Expected reading per schematic - see attached image.
1 - 12.5v
2 - 1.1v
3 - 118mv
4 - 13.5mv
5 - 4.86v
6 - 2.46v
7 - 4.59v
8 - 4.95v
9 - 5v
10 - good continuity with ground

Previous owner first started having the solenoid fuse issue late last year. He send main and driver boards to a guy that repaired boards. Got boards back with some new chips and stated that boards worked when final tested after work. Previous owner reinstalled into machine and it still would blow fuse and also would not boot as it is now. I got the machine end of March. May reach out to tech that did the work unless I get some promising leads here. thanks.

Pics below are before anything was disconnected obviously.

IMG_0994 (resized).jpgIMG_0994 (resized).jpgIMG_0995 (resized).jpgIMG_0995 (resized).jpgIMG_0996 (resized).jpgIMG_0996 (resized).jpgIMG_0997 (resized).jpgIMG_0997 (resized).jpg
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#2 1 year ago

Thread reposted in correct topic, my bad, corrected

#3 1 year ago

Reposted in this forum since I mistakenly posted in the EM section Yesterday.

#4 1 year ago

Check the two large connectors are not reversed.

Check the 2 remote logic fuses are good game will not boot if one is blown

Rebuild power supply

Check for a shorted diode on locked coil

Pinside_forum_7524885_3341210 (1) (resized).jpgPinside_forum_7524885_3341210 (1) (resized).jpg
#5 1 year ago

Cable connections are good and not mismatched.
Change out all fuses for new ones.
What goes into rebuilding a power supply? Isn't it possible to take some readings to determine if power supply needs to be rebuilt? I am getting proper voltage at the input connector on the main board. Readings take at test points on the main board show differences on some points from what schematic shows for expected voltages.

#6 1 year ago

Voltages for Logic must be clean the capacitors are 40+ years old time to rebuild the power supply.
The caps need replacing on the sound board also.

#7 1 year ago

A System 7 board displaying a 0 for more than a few seconds indicates the CPU is not running. Typically this is caused by:

1) Bad ROM sockets - you can try reseating the ROM chips to see if that changes this symptom - you can also try cleaning the oxidation off the legs of the ROM chips with a fiberfgalss sanding pen or similar - long-term fix is replacing the ROM sockets.
2) Bad CPU socket or CPU itself - again, you can try reseating the CPU chip or swapping the CPU from the sound board as a test - or replacing the CPU socket.
3) Bad ROM chips - rare but the only way to test is to get new ROMS - can be masked by dirty legs on good ROM chips.

#8 1 year ago

You can't boot the board without the driver board connected.

#9 1 year ago

What's This? I don't remember that in my BK, but mine had the transformer in the lower cabinet

Pinside_forum_7524885_1 (resized).jpgPinside_forum_7524885_1 (resized).jpg
#10 1 year ago
Quoted from BobLangelius:

What's This? I don't remember that in my BK, but mine had the transformer in the lower cabinet[quoted image]

That is the GI relay. Enables flashing the GI.

#11 1 year ago
Quoted from BobLangelius:

What's This? I don't remember that in my BK, but mine had the transformer in the lower cabinet[quoted image]

In the beginning of Black Knight production run, the transformer was located in the backbox, and the game used power supply board part# D-7999, with a stand-alone General Illumination Relay mounted to the backbox floor. During production, the transformer was moved to the lower cabinet and the G.I. Relay was then mounted on a new power supply board, part# D-8345.

#12 1 year ago

Thank you all for the input. So the main board will not boot without the driver board attached?

#13 1 year ago

Not with stock roms test roms only.

#14 1 year ago
Quoted from slochar:

Not with stock roms test roms only.

Roger that. Will reinstall driver board. I did swap the main cpu with sound cpu.

#15 1 year ago
Quoted from USAsquint:

Roger that. Will reinstall driver board. I did swap the main cpu with sound cpu.

With the driverboard un attached:

The cpu will show a Zero then flash off then back to 0 with Black Knight software pressing the diagnostic button will flash zeroff and back on if the Ram 5101 is faulty it will show a 9

#16 1 year ago

I ordered a new power system 6 supply board from pinballpcb.com. Anyone using one of those? Figured I just want to have a known good board to eliminate that as a possibility.

With everything plugged in.... Still goes direct to 0. Occasionally will here a random click that sounds like a relay from the cabinet area. Might display a different number from time to time or immediate go blank. Only getting general lights at power up. On a few power ups it would immediately kick out a ball. Did that maybe 3 times.

1 week later
#17 1 year ago

Bench test cpu with driver board removed diagnostic using Black Knight Software:

Cpu boots to Diagnostic flashing zero -off then back on either an 8 or a 0 depending on software revision = game software and 5101 and Mempory protect circuitry ok pressing the diagnostic again will repeat the test: zero off then on.

Pressing the diagnostic button with IC 26 removed = 7
Pressing diagnostic with ic 20 removed = 5
Pressing diagnostic with ic 14 removed = 6

Cmos RAM Memory test:

Pressing diagnostic with 19 removed = 9
Note: a faulty 5101 or memory protect fault 9 will not be seen unless game software is ok

With Roms 26,20,14, removed =5
Diagnostic 5 when IC 20 is removed-faulty (resized).jpgDiagnostic 5 when IC 20 is removed-faulty (resized).jpgDiagnostic 6 when IC 14 is removed-faulty (resized).jpgDiagnostic 6 when IC 14 is removed-faulty (resized).jpgDiagnostic 7 when IC26 removed-faulty (resized).jpgDiagnostic 7 when IC26 removed-faulty (resized).jpgDiagnostic 9 when ic19 removed-faulty or mem protect circuit (resized).jpgDiagnostic 9 when ic19 removed-faulty or mem protect circuit (resized).jpgDiagnostic Pass BK ROMS flashing off to zero  zero or 8 (resized).jpgDiagnostic Pass BK ROMS flashing off to zero zero or 8 (resized).jpgIMG_20230422_132904214 (resized).jpgIMG_20230422_132904214 (resized).jpg

#18 12 months ago

Received the new power supply board today. Installed. It looks real nice in there but... no change in behavior. Main board goes to "0" and stays. I may get a rogue click or a 2 showing but this is only on the first couple of attempts to power up after days untouched.

Pintec, I have not tried your latest diag steps yet.

1 month later
#19 10 months ago

Just to close this one out... I gave the main and driver board to a local guy in the area that supports/repairs for other local arcades. He also has a BK 1980. Got the boards back this past week and installed them in my machine. He put them in his BK machine to further test them out so whatever else is wrong will be with my machine.
Installed and machine boots and plays so now I'm able to start a todo list for other issues.

No sound
Lower ball lock - does not recognize that a ball is in there. No new ball is ejected for play.
#4 player display is blank
Adds points in 5,000 intervals randomly sometimes with a flipper or even static with no movement.
Bulbs etc

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