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(Topic ID: 77057)

Black Hole Club... Members Only!

By mof

10 years ago

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3,291 posts
297 Pinsiders participating
Latest reply 8 days ago by EntityClay
Topic is favorited by 139 Pinsiders

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Black Hole Gottlieb, 1981

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6 key posts have been marked in this topic

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Post #1614 How to light up the tube Posted by Mudflaps (5 years ago)

Post #1618 Example photo for a lit tube Posted by Mudflaps (5 years ago)

Post #1628 Example photo for a lit tube Posted by gweempose (5 years ago)

Post #3035 Example for using Ice blue LEDs Posted by Crimcyan (10 months ago)

Post #3157 Adding a potentiometer to the aux lamp driver board for chase lights Posted by Redfive05 (7 months ago)

Post #3162 Photo of a potentiometer installed on the aux lamp driver board for chase lights Posted by GRUMPY (7 months ago)

Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#1977 3 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from Snowtrooper:
2.) Up Kicker Not Strong Enough: The infamous up kicker strikes again. There was a A-1496 coil installed which was working great. Again I was going to upgrade and continue my bulletproofing (Bulletproofing = upgrading the power transistor and adding the pull up resistor, installed and wired a pop bumper driver board to prevent burn out/ meltdown / overheating, and upgraded the coil to the A-4893 coil). The pop bumper driver board was a suggestion found on Pin Lizards Black Hole / Haunted House Club manual. I am stumped why the up kicker lost the strength / power to shoot the ball up the ramp. Defective power transistor? Suggestions?

I highly recommend replacing the upkicker with a flipper coil and EOS switch. You can contact Cliffy to have the bracket made up. I reached out to him a few months ago and he was able to get one out to me in about a week. The EOS switch will help prevent the coil from getting fried if the transistor fails and it can be adjusted to get the kicker strength more consistent. You should then run a smaller 2A fuse in F17 for additional protection.

https://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Black_Hole#Black_Hole_Ball_Lift_Kicker_Mod

2 months later

#2015 3 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

This might be totally unrelated, but if you aren't against going non-original I suggest a modern replacement of the power supply. It will reduce energy consumption and heat. It can also improve the grounding situation.

I would get intermittent coil chatter, triggering of the bottom playfield and random sounds after several minutes of play (with ground mods done). I went with a modern replacement, even removed the ground mods (except for the beefed up connector), and have had no issues since.

1 month later

#2056 3 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from frunch:
I realize there's numerous solutions to the tube-kicker problem...in my case i bought an end of stroke switch bracket from Cliffy that's designed for this application. It allows you to install a flipper coil instead of a regular coil there, and you can adjust the strength of the coil using the end of stroke switch (open sooner for weaker, open later for stronger). It took a bit of tinkering to get it just right, but it's been good ever since. Might be worth considering if the other suggestions don't pan out.

This is truly a great solution and may very well help extend the life of the drive transistors... or at the very least prevent lasting damage in a dangerous coil locked-on scenario. And no way should you be running a 6A fuse as the manual states. With a flipper coil you can run 2A.

https://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Black_Hole#Black_Hole_Ball_Lift_Kicker_Mod

#2065 3 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from majorrager:
I meant the upper playfield. Maybe the one referred to as "outhole"? I replaced the remote transistor in the front of upper playfield with a new MJ2955, and checked the other remote transistor located near the back. I also reseated all the connectors and lightly cleaned card edge contacts hoping I had a bad connection.

I believe you are referring to what is listed in the schematics as "Ball Gate (Cardholder)", which is pre-driven by a lamp (L15) transistor and boosted by the under playfield 2N5875 (or MJ2955 replacement). The next transistor to check is Q16 on the driver board which drives lamp L15.

ballgate (resized).png

3 weeks later

#2115 3 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from goingincirclez:
My question is: HOW could that coil have had any current with the MPU / Driver disconnected AND the remote transistor boards removed?!

The coils will all have positive voltage from the bridge rectifier going to one lug. The transistors ground the circuit when activated thus firing the coil. The ball lift kicker piggy-backs off a lamp drive transistor and is amplified by the under playfield transistor. The transistor under the playfield may be lacking a pull up resistor and/or partially activating the coil since it is not connected to the lamp drive transistor. Basically it ends up in some psudo-state. At least that's my guess.

Also I'll continue to pitch to folks that I highly recommend getting the bracket from Cliffy and using a flipper coil for the lift kicker. Save yourself some future heartache!

https://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Black_Hole#Black_Hole_Ball_Lift_Kicker_Mod

3 weeks later

#2172 3 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from goingincirclez:
When the lower PF is activated, at some point it might suddenly cut out (flippers go dead, lights off) which of course causes the ball to drain. The game announces the appropriate re-entry callout and otherwise proceeds as normal. You can continue playing as if nothing had happened. You might go right back down to the lower pf and not experience this again, for a few more games... or it might happen again immediately.
There doesn't seem to be a specific triggering cause or event. And since it's random (within 20 seconds, or 5 minutes, or never at all?) it doesn't seem to be a hard-fault state either.

I would start investigating around the Lower (L) Relay. The relay will control everything down below, the lower GI (both low and high voltage), pop bumpers, kickers, and flippers. It's possible the relay is malfunctioning and can't hold anymore. It's also possible the drive transistor is getting flaky. It is driven by lamp #17. The transistor is Q18 on the schematics.

1 month later

#2236 2 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from REGNE:
I'm more frustrated when I've earned that gate open (& when coming back up from the lower field) I get a gate jumper that drains.
I also get some that jump when the gate is closed...so...I guess I can't complain.

Sounds like your getting too much of a kick. The flipper coil + EOS kicker modification solves that issue nicely.

(Or your tube might be sitting a tad low and the ball jumps up on the lip of the playfield.)

10 months later

#2465 2 years ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from radial_head:
About to start a full "re-shop" of my Black Hole after shopping it lightly when I first got it 3 years ago now. I've got new posts, a new plastic set, new rubbers, and new pop bumper rebuilds on hand.
What's something you didn't do when you shopped your game that you wished you had done?

I would highly recommend the ball lift upgrade to a flipper coil and EOS switch. Cliffy sells the custom bracket. Then you can adjust the strength, use a reasonable fuse, and never have to worry about a burned out coil (and potentially save your transistors).

3 months later

#2571 1 year ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from Matthew2015:
does anybody have a extra "L" drop target ? . mine was replaced with some white drop target at some point that does not match . Unfortunately no one sells these lettered drop targets Individually.

I do, I'll PM you.

5 months later

#2873 1 year ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from jasonbar:
Does anybody have recommendations for 28V LED bulbs to replace the incandescent 313 bulbs that illuminate the lower PF?
My first searches reveal LEDs costing $4-5 each. Eeek!
Thanks,
-Jason

Keep the 313s, it's one of the things that make Black Hole unique and quirky. I do run LEDs in the GI strings, but run traditional 313s on that high voltage string. That's my two cents.

1 month later

#2913 1 year ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

In my opinion, the best solution is to replace the tube kicker with a flipper coil/end of stroke switch. You kill two birds with one mod. Easy to adjust the kicking strength and you will not need to worry about frying your fuses and transistors.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/black-hole-club-members-only/page/40#post-5916606

5 months later

#3128 8 months ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from pin-ball1958:
It's alot easier just to get the 28v LED's (which they are, not 24v) from Comet Pinball, then you don't have to do any mods.

I use regular incandescents for the high voltage rail which I think look great and bright. Plus they are on for short periods of time. So, I'm in the camp to leave the game original here - it's the quirkiness of the engineers at the time!

4 months later

#3227 3 months ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from kinggroucho:
2. I fashioned a one-way gate on the right "outlane" using some old lamp sockets and some wire. The most frustrating thing about this game was having the ball bounce over to the right side of the playfield (via the pop usually), past the flippers, and pushing the gate open. If I was lucky, all it would do is disqualify the lower playfield ball save, but if I was unlucky, the ball would push the gate open, then the gate would close behind it, losing the ball. Both scenarios filled me with rage that only a one-way gate could dispel. I also don't feel bad about this because it's also easily removable.
Was kinda just curious if others felt the same about this game? It's so highly reviewed that I felt like I've been missing something.

The gate is by-design. You are supposed to lose the ball to the outlane if you try and trap a ball that is moving too fast.

1 month later

#3254 73 days ago

Lithium

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 37,050 76

Quoted from Ollulanus:
Anyone have a spare L drop, or know somewhere with them in stock? Snapped one, looks like Marco is out.

PBR should have the entire set in stock here: https://www.pbresource.com/Blackhole.html

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