that would work but i would still need something to mount it in or to something like the original fuse holder housing.
maybe this would work? i don't see why it would not work and i could mount it with the other fuses .

https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/FHSM

Yes, you could - but then you would have uncovered line voltage with no fuse in your machine.
The wire going "into" the fuse will always have 115/220 volt in (depending on your country).
I would deem this extremely unsafe - I always add a cover over such voltage points in old machines where they are exposed, i.e. power switches etc.

If you mount it near the other fuses you run the risk of sending 115/220 volt straight into your circuit boards as well.

So technically, yes, you could - but from a safety viewpoint I would not do it.

okay , i will get a replacement fuse holder like the original one then find something to use to cover it.

Use something like this. It's like a fuse condom.

https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwj-tMr52t_5AhUCEOcKHdIjBrYYABAzGgJwdg&ae=2&ohost=www.google.com&cid=CAESa-D29x0uK2TouXwg5_tKnBh09PLd3vvAcGVqIBxvZhIaQYWGyTMi2ENwO7U0hrLwNov-JeBF_pTAoQ3CTCEV6rrPAGOSU_E5DqIhRJaGqKE_GI37tyg_pWi7o-k2JKQkkHdKpoxaiwOLPMs6&sig=AOD64_0ftUH0blDB17myuyafiGeYlFx90w&ctype=5&q=&ved=2ahUKEwjwgsL52t_5AhW4LzQIHQfpDeMQ9aACKAB6BQgBEJsC&adurl=

Anybody have any luck repairing the disc motor? Mine just stopped working.

I found it pretty simple to just install a new one. Pretty cheap, too. Pinwiki covers it.

Fixed my motor! Drive gear was off but the motor wasnt spinning at all as it was filthy filthy dirty inside.

What can be done about the blue tint on the backglass here?

20220825_151306.jpg

I had one bad window so I scraped the remaining blue off with a razor (carefully) and put in one of those Gottlieb blue windows that attaches over the display tube itself. But I'm sure others know how you could attach a blue cello film over that somehow.

Any solution is going to involve scrapping the window clear and applying a new blue film. I don't know which film or where to get it.

Contact Pinsider 80spit in PA. He’s got the film. Easy to scrape the window and install the film.

I have window film. Here is how they look on black hole, $15.00 shipped

d315cc57383b66570363f9a7ca298a6fac81f3c5 (resized).jpg

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Finally got the project Black Hole Ive been working on mostly operational. I have only found one flaw. The re-entry gate is always open. So the ball always comes into the inlane. Guess I shouldnt complain much!

I'll have to figure out why that small relay coil never energizes.

received_3530849377143372 (resized).jpeg

Any chance the gate (or gate mechanism) is physically stuck?
Or maybe just a little resistant to moving?
Just an idea….I had mine that was sometimes NEVER open, and just needed a little adjustment.

Jeff

Nah, it moves very easily. The coil just never pulls the back plate in. I think I seen a wiring hack in the backbox so that could be it. Ill have to pull the manual and trace wires.

Come to think of it, the disc motor is super noisy too. Probably should replace it. I've heard the replacement is super quiet.

In attract mode, does that gate / light switch? I have the Pascal board, but I seem to remember this should be the normal attract behavior?

It does if it hasn't been modified per pinwiki

The light clickson and off. But the gate just stays in the open position.

Wiring to the coil must be broken. Or the coil is bad.

It’s been a while on mine, but I thought the light was triggered by the gate. On mine if the gate didn’t move, the light didn’t change, as I recall…

Correct. If you do the trick to disable the gate opening and closing in attract, the light will just stay on solid in attract.

Is there evidence that this wasn't done on purpose to illustrate the fact that you need to open the gate during attract mode?

Working towards getting mine set to route and I'm not sure if I want to disable this or not. At face value it's like yeah, maybe the mech will get wear but on the other hand unless there was a service bulletin or something 99% of these games sat on location with that thing clicking on and off all day without issue. And it does help show that the gate is there.

Not sure. Pascal's all-in-one board has it set off by default (just a great board, by the way). I don't miss it, but you have a point.

USA-Version Black Hole for sale in Germany...

https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/ad/141832

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On Pinwiki it only says something about how they forgot that the gate was powered by a lamp driver. I dunno, that seems a little far-fetched. I mean if they didn't intend it to click on and off, that noise would have stuck out like a sore thumb. I disabled it anyway just because it gets to be annoying after 20 years.

As mentioned, if you get the Pascal board (and I HIGHLY recommend it), you get that option for free (along with possible 7 digit displays, massive troubleshooting menus, ball save, and so much more).

The 7th digit has not been missed thus far in my black hole experience.

Mechanically it's so simple it's hard to see it wearing out, just a regular old relay armature moving the gate. Maybe clean the nylon bushing once every 50 years.

Congratulations on your new machine. I am presently looking for a project Black Hole myself.

Do you have to turn it off? Have you tried starting a new game or hitting the slam switch?

I had a random tone get stuck on power up and power down on my Gottlieb Volcano, which has same sound & speech board as yours. I finally tracked it down and fixed it. Follow the saga here:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/gottlieb-80-sometimes-a-random-continuous-sound-on-boot

You do not have to replace these headers, nor do you have to use the punch-down style connections. All of the single-sided KK-0.156 Molex headers in a Gottlieb System 80 can be re-pinned with crimp-on pins pushed into the original header body.

The Molex pins are part number 08-52-0072 (18-24 AWG) and are readily available at most places including Amazon. Just have to borrow, buy, or make a pin release tool. Also get a good crimper tool that will make the proper double-crimp.

can someone confirm if the red dot on the top this capacitor is the positive? .
someone changed the wires on these at one point so they don't match the colors listed in the schematics.
i am about to change the capacitor .

IMG_4228 (resized).JPG

You have the same green and yellow wires mine does. Green wire coming from the bridge rectifier (the lug with another green wire attached) goes to cap negative.

Yes, the red dot on the capacitor lug indicates it's the positive lug.
BTW you want to remove that coil spring washer away from the smaller blue capacitor lugs before it shorts it.

i found a fuse cover and a new fuse holder but i don't think the old fuse is wired correctly.
i would assume that the two yellow/purple wires go on one end and the purple/blue wire goes on the other end .
not wired together with a different colored wire on the same side . is this the way to do it.?

IMG_4209 (resized).JPG

The way to do it is how the schematic shows. What is this fuse wired into? Why do you say you don't think it was wired correctly?

There was an old Gottlieb service bulletin that talked about adding fuses to slingshot circuits; is this for that?

its the primary fuse , where the power goes though after the filter capacitor. the schematics show one wire on each side of a different color.
there's a wire going from the fuse to the service outlet but no color code for that one.
wiring (resized).png

The schematic shows one wire with color 766 on one side and TWO wires on the other: color 744 and the one going to the service outlet hot side.

If you have two wires on each side, then you'll have to physically trace the extra one.

i think i understand the layout now , i traced the wires and the 2 purple /yellow (744) wires has one that go's to the on/off switch and the other to the service outlet and the single purple/blue wire (766) go's to the Line Filter. so it seems it would be best to wire both wires of the same color on the same side.

Yes, otherwise, the fuse would be bypassed. After complete, I would pull the fuse out to verify that it kills power to the machine as intended.

On my machine the BLACK drop targets won't reset until the HOLE targets are all down also. It's this correct operation? Or should they each reset individually after the bank is complete?

Thanks
Flash

The 2 banks should reset independently of the other. Each bank resets after completion.

When you score it with the glass off, if you hit each BLACK target one by one, does each one score? And if so they still don't reset?

Correct. They each score, they each have a sound effect, and the arrows each light up. But they don't reset regardless of the order they were knocked down.

However, they will reset after HOLE is all knocked down.

Here's a video of it in action.

Those are controlled by solenoids 1 and 2, if I am reading the manual correctly. They both fire together but not independently, if I understand your description correctly.

I would conclude:

• the Driver board is working since the two solenoids fire at all
• the inputs and matrix are working since each target is scoring properly

We can pretty much rule out the game logic, right? What are the chances the PROM is corrupted but the game still plays?

So I'm thinking it's something screwy in the logic of the Z28 decoder (74LS139).

It's a guess, but it's a cheap guess. If you don't want to randomly swap chips, use your logic probe to examine the inputs and outputs of Z28 when the solenoid is supposed to fire.

Screen Shot 2022-09-01 at 10.05.45 PM (resized).png

https://www.futurlec.com/74LS/74LS139.shtml

As another test - with some or all of the BLACK & HOLE targets already down, start up a game. The HOLE bank should reset about a half second before BLACK does. Are yours doing that, or firing at exactly the same time?

Check the wiring to make sure the signal side of the coil hasn't been bridged from the hole targets?

After rebuilding my motor it spins way too fast. Like around 10RPM and looks ridiculous. It's the factory setup. I was testing it with a 9v battery when I was putting it back together I thought maybe it was just fast because it was 9v vs 6 that the game feeds it. Even under load with the disc on it, it's probably around 10rpm.

My first thought was that I geared it wrong as the drive gear was loose in the gearbox. Can anyone confirm that the motor has the small metal gear and the drive shaft / part that connects to the spinning disc has the large metal gear? Any other ideas why this thing is spinning fast as hell? It looks like this is the only way it could go together.

Edit: there are disc capacitors grounded to the lid of the case. Is it possible the motor contacts, one or both are supposed to be soldered to it as well for some reason? I remember taking it apart and thinking wow those things were awfully close to being in contact with the metal casing. Probably nothing?

Also on the inside of the motor there was a good deal of soot I had to clean up, but no indication of what might have burned.
20220902_111700.jpg20220902_112006.jpg20220902_112116.jpg

troubleshooting why my lower level display just stopped working. The display glass and pins look good, is there anything like a separate fuse or anything? I've got the schematics here, but I'm not seeing anything. Trying for the easy first.

I'd power it down and unplug it the connector.

Check for continuity of the ground pin back to ground buss.

Then power up the machine and measure voltages at the connector.

Pin 19 - Ground
Pin 18 - +5 VDC
Pin 17 - +42 VDC
Pin 16 - 3 VAC
Pin 15 - 3 VAC

Screen Shot 2022-09-02 at 8.44.20 PM (resized).png

Almost finished resurrecting my game. Thought this was interesting. The lower level bonus display would have some garbage digits. I swapped it with player 1 and the problem followed. So it looked like segment e and f were shorting from the display test. Upon close examination of the board I found this situation on the driver Chip. Just thought I'd share.

PXL_20220906_015817807.jpg

Nice catch!