My flippers are set up just like yours Chris. I can often get into multiball and get over a million each game. The key for me is to hit the four yellow stationary targets as quick as possible using backflips and the upper left flipper, then set up the G-forces. I then go downstairs and aim for the three drop target bank and clear a set to open the upstairs gate. If I don't get the second set of targets while down there, I send it back down to finish the job. Knocking down the lower playfield right drop targets twice lights up the extra ball near the top of the main playfield. A backflip from the lowest left flipper on the main playfield usually nails the extra ball. I sometimes can get extra balls up to seven times in a row that way.

Steve

My transition from the left kick out metal guide to the flippers isnt smooth enough for me to pop it from left to the right stationary targets. It sounds like I may need to figure something out if you can hit it from there.

Agree with Steve's game play strategy. I only wish like a ton of the early games that extra balls earned were banked. As I seem to get an extra ball with score during the same extra ball via pf rollunder. Win two extra balls only counting as one then quickly drain. I still can't constantly score that great. Lots of near million games but still plenty of 200k or less. I just took out my super cap and put in NVram. So my 2.2mil is gone from the memory. So time to get something descent on there again. Oh and if I remember correctly I had about 1400 games on it since putting in memory cap a couple years back. I am getting my money's worth out of this title for sure!!

Does anyone have a spare BH spinning disk they would be willing to part with? Mine has some imperfections, wear & tear, etc.

Feel free to PM if you do.

Thank you!

I have a nice one for you. PM sent.

Brian

Thank you Brian! This problem is officially solved thanks to you.

This is just another example of how awesome the pin community is and truly looks out for each other.

I am very thankful.

Hey guys, so I'm curious about what BH's were like originally coming off the assembly line. Just so when I see a game out there for sale saying it's an all original, which I happen to personally like, I know what to look for.

I've seen some games out there with chrome legs and some with black legs. I've also seen games with the chrome acorn speed nuts holding down plastics and some with the white rubber tops (I believe the bottom PF always had the whites and tops had chrome).

I know we said the spinning disks originally had flush black flat-head screws holding it on, and others with a single rod.

What did a factory BH look like? The official flyers only show so much and usually the legs are below the frame.

Any insight is much appreciated here.

That stuff imo means nothing. And a lot of flyers not correct as proto machine picture in flyer. Like flash flyer shows red drops i believe and never seen a machine with red. Always blue. My BH machine has chrome legs with all chrome speed nuts. All boards original with matching serial numbers as well. Which is what some may look for but I don't think it matters much. A circuit is a circuit. Now aftermarket board that is a different story.

I hope we can see a CPR Black Hole in their playfield preorder page. I think Stu mentioned it was a possibility.

For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure it came with stainless steel acorn nuts and legs. Black legs would probably look awesome though -- they'd match the trim on the head.

I think you're right about the flyers and it being proto machines featured. I just personally like it and when pursuing a game, I would want a machine for sale that much more if it were all original parts, matching serial numbers, etc. I can't really explain the reason other than the fascination that the game was able to stay together for it's life. With how much abuse these games go through over the years, especially older titles released before it was common to own your own machine and have it be HUO, seeing a game in a preserved state is almost like it's frozen in time untouched.

Now, having a game be all together with original parts doesn't always mean no wear and tear. The HH I found in '15, it was literally stored in a basement since '87, and so it was like a time capsule, but it did have the usual wear on the drop points. And with that comes the catch that none of the bulletproofing was done to it and the battery leaked a little, but overall I would buy it all over again and now that I have the guts of it updated, the playfield parts are literally the ones put on from the factory, except for rubbers and the clear window. Those needed replacing of course.

But for the record, I wouldn't expect someone to pay more for my game because it was all original. Just personal preference.

Here is a photo of what I believe is the factory legs for system 80s, or at least BH/HH. Not sure but I believe a long time pinhead once told me these legs have these extra support indents to make them beefier to handle the weight of these monsterous games, but I could be wrong on what he meant.

IMG_0374_(resized).JPG

i deleted do to mistake, thank you blondetall for the help.

my black hole and panthera both have smooth legs. BH2 (big house) has ribbed and so does my Big Guns. So in my mind a later improved style leg?? Leg bolts are always acorn heads. Stronger with ribbed sounds logically correct to me. Correct for BH i don't know either but mine are smooth.

Does anyone have a spare BH spinning backglass disc they would be willing to part with? Mine has some imperfections, wear & tear, etc.

Feel free to PM if you do.

Thank you!

Gottlieb_1981_Black_Hole_Scan_of_Spinning_Disc_200dpi__(resized).jpg

Mine had some wear too so I got Cliffy to protect it for me.

Steve

Spoof_Cliffy_(resized).JPG

All of my System 80/80A/80B games have smooth legs, if a System 80/80A/80B game shows up here with the wrong legs, I toss them in the can and get the correct one's. Actually, I don't even mess with old legs anymore, I just buy new one's now with new bolts. IIRC, the rib style legs were on System 3 games.

Steve

Awesome! Glad to finally know what style the original legs are. Doesn't matter to some, but to me I like to get these as original as possible. Will look for some smooth system 80 legs at my next show (Allentown) or see what shipping from PBR will run me. I have to place an order with them anyways.

I buy all my legs from PBR now, I never have rust or stripped bolt issues again. IIRC shipping is cheaper if you spend $100 or more so I usually add legs & bolts to my restocking orders when I do them. Remember that they are 27" for most of the games and use 31" on the backs of MGoW, HH, Spirit & Caveman. The exception to the 27" rule for the front legs is MGoW, the 28 1/2" legs work better there because of the leg position error.

Steve

Yeah, I think my order will be over $100, especially tacking on these legs. You get 10% off too with orders over $100. I'll ask if the shipping discounts are available too.

I can look at the manual, but just to confirm while we're here and on the topic, all four legs on the BH are 27", right?

Correct. Forgot to mention, get four new 3" leg levelers too.

Steve

Most Gottlieb's, at least the older Sys 80/80A, etc., all had smooth non-ribbed legs. As do the GTB EM games from the late 60's and up...as far as I know. Some later games went to the ribbed legs for reinforcement and better support. Blownfuse stated the correct sizes to utilize...and I'd like to snatch up his Spirit!!! LOL.

With this exception...to give BH a good pitch (as well as most of my other pins to be honest), I always use 3" levelers on the back legs, and 2" on the front legs. For me, there is no real reason to put 3" levelers on the front legs, because most of the time the levelers are screwed pretty much all the way in, so it's just wasting bolt. And makes them more difficult to remove if they ever freeze up. If you jack Sys 80 games up on tall legs and levelers on the front, you might as well buy a step stool to play the game, as it sits at the level of your friggin sternum.

I just picked up a machine and this is my first non Williams game. I'm about to swap out the bulbs foe LEDs and curious of two things. Do the bumpers take 44 or 555s? Also how do you get ge bumpers off to replace the bulbs?

Yours should take bayonet style...44...unless somebody converted them. But don't use 44's...they melt everything (although it looks like you're throwing LED's in). If you're going to keep it original looking, use one or two LED warm clear bulbs. There is a clip on each side of the pop bumper cap. Just squeeze the sides together (lightly), and just the center cap should come off. If your game is original, they could be brittle, so be careful. If not and you snap one, I know PBR carries new ones, and I believe Marco.

Mthank you for the help. I have all the LED lights ordered from Cointaker and did all 44s besides the nine 313s for underneath. They also said I needed four 455 blinkers but didn't know where they would go, any idea? Thank you!!!

What is the correct coil for the lower playfield kicker at the return tube? Is it GTB-A4893 or GTB-A1496? I've seen MOF's BH thread, and he appears to be using a GTB-A1496. Steve Young shows GTB-A4893 is meant for the Ball Lift Kicker. Is that the same thing? I don't have a manual for BH. What should be used? My coil recently burned up. Anyone know the transistor location as well?

There are usually 455's behind the spinning disc in the backbox.

how can I distinguish which bulbs are standard 44s and 455s blinkers behind the disk? If I recall there's a total of 12 bulbs behind the disk and I believe only 4 are 455s

The one I had they put all 455s behind the disk. You can just put the four spread out how you like

Agreed, just do it to taste. I think I have 8 back there on my game. The bulbs run off the same voltage so it doesn't matter which bulb you put in which socket.

Does anyone know the size of the set screw used in the hub of the spinning disk mount?

Any of those screws look right?

http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_80#Replacing_the_Black_Hole_.22Spinning_Disk.22_Motor

My disc is there, but no motor so I am not sure on the set screws.

Well it says the set screws require a 3/32" Allen key. I wonder if that is a standard thread size.

i'm in. just got a lotr too. i think I still like black hole better. great contrast in gameplay. I think one of these manufacturers needs to make a classic style ramp-free game like black hole or flight 2000

Awesome...welcome to the club. BH is definitely a tough friggin game...especially to get multiball!! Compared to some of the newer pins I have and/or play, I keep hitting the start button ten times more often every time I stand in front of my BH. I would also love to see a new ramp-free game, but don't see that happening.

3/32" is the size of the Allen wrench used, actual thread size is probably 4-40 or something similar

awesome...

put the new motor in from servo city. this has to be near the top of the list for best backglass of all time. I bought space invaders because that was super cool but this is better and the game is wayyyyyyyyyy better

20160211_225143_resized_(resized).jpg

Definitely one of the coolest backglasses...just an attractive game all around. Looks like you picked up a nice example also! Some people don't like the "wide-open" upper PF on BH, but I can get the ball flying around on mine no problem.

And for those who really want this game to pop...pick up the Boston Pinball LED displays. Mine make the game ridiculously blue and bangin!

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I'm still hoping Xpin makes their 7 Digit displays for gottlieb.

I hope Dave from wolfpac makes them. He is way more reasonable on price. I did request. He made the Bally display at over half of what other crooks charge.

I have been finding the 7 digit displays not super easy to find and then when you do pretty price for used parts.

I've been waiting to see if they send all the displays or only the ones in the back box. Looks like all of them, for the lower pf and apron too? Damn those look good.

Yup...the kit from Boston Pinball has all 6 displays, including the sub PF and apron credit/BIP. They are bright and crisp as hell. I actually have a jumper board mod that powers them separately, and has it's own brightness control.

F ya sweet. thanks!

Hey guys,

Could one of you do me a favor and grab the measurements of the apron cards for this game?

I made a set for my site, but I keep seeing photos of Gottliebs from this era and I feel like the cards look bigger than the original measurements I made them for.

If no one has by 6pm when I get home I can.

Sounds great, thanks!

6"x4.25" and 6"x2.25"

Thanks, greatly appreciated!