Restored a machine for a customer and it worked fantastic.

Shipped it to him. He called me after set up saying that it keeps dying and that he never played a game.

Here is what happens the machine powers up into attract mode but doesnt cycle the wall motor before doing so and the test report flashes test motor. Everything in attract mode works as it should lights sounds etc.

Upon depressing the start button the machine begins to start a game as normal for about 3 seconds then locks up. Display is dark, No controlled lighting, no sound. To get out of the lock up the machine must be powered down.

If during attract mode the coindoor test buttons are tried sometimes Test mode can be reached but then it cannot be exited. Again only sometimes You can get into test mode.
Basically the coin door buttons dont function.

The machine is not in a slam tilt mode

At one point it was noticed that the Magna save button switch blades were making contact. Must have been done during shipping. The switch gap was corrected and the game came up normally, the motor worked as it should and two balls were just shot around.

During the working game mode he tried to use the coin door buttons to see if they were now functioning and they still did not. He powered down the game to get out of test mode and the game was back to the same lock up sequence.

Depressing SW2 on the CPU does not change anything with the board diagnostic LED

Upon power up the 5v LEd comes on quickly followed by the Led on the far right. The diagnostic center Led comes up right after in the fast blinking mode.

No board corrosion I reflowed all of the pins on all boards, New fuses all voltages read as perfect.

The game played spectacularly before it was packed and shipped.

Any ideas?

Bump

Had him do all of that and nothing.

When he presses the start button the machine starts up until the point the word black Kni is heard. It doesn't get through the word Knight. Sometimes it reaches the point where the ball just gets into the shooter then it Locks up.

Owner just called. When locked up he pressed SW2 on the board and it did not come out of lockup only with power down/up cycle did it do so.

Ill forward him your suggestions and will post his reply thx

The owner just sent this response to your suggestions.

"Disconnected the center knight head flasher cable. Since I don't remember ever seeing it flash. Thought I'd try that suggestion you sent.

Game started! Played it for a while, target bank motor still doesn't work but otherwise it was almost normal. Except the display was totally freaked out. See pictures.

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Can sometimes get it in test mode if I hold down both buttons at startup. Or press the right button a lot. Not always.

Anyway unfortunately after that game with the freaked out display I couldn't start another. Same as always. It's like when you changed one thing, that stuck magna save button contact and the game started up once. So weird.

So basically it's got to be there's some board problem. I will probably just order the Rottendog system 11b and interconnect boards and hopefully that fixes everything including the mysteriously not working target bank motor."

Still can't figure this out any other suggestions that I can have him look for?

Bump

Rob, I passed the info on to the owner.

When I restored the machine I tested everything with the upper playfield still out and the machine did not crash it just went through the usual alert messages.

However the input you gave may still be the reason that the machine is now crashing which I feel is a more apt description by the way.

If indeed there is an issue with the switches not registering that yet raises another question and that question is why would this happen after shipping?

I installed a new drop target motor and new switches during the restoration and the machine played perfectly before it was wrapped and shipped.

Thx so much for the heads up I will keep the progress posted and maybe we can solve this issue without having hands on the machine.

Yes I had him do that from his first email the Ribbon connectors and all of the connectors.

Got an email last night saying that he unplugged a flasher as per Kbliznicks suggestion and that the game actually started and he played three games only the drop target assembly did not work so there may be something to the drop target assembly that is the issue as per Rob_g's suggestion.

He went on to say then the machine returned to crashing

The original flasher and its associated transistor were fried before I restored the machine and replaced both.

He now has all LEDs in the machine.

This problem only happened after it was shipped to him.

As for my Jokerz Not in a billion years would I take any of my machines apart! LOL you have no idea how anal I am about my machines.

In the interim I believe he has ordered a brand new Rottendog board.

This is all very strange as I reworked all of the boards for the restoration and they were in great almost new shape.

I just cant figure this one out especially so without having the machine in the shop.

Have to thank all who have been trying to help I think we will crack the mystery soon.

I did not sell the game it was sent to me for a complete restoration. I did not change out that cap as I wanted to. I have suggested to him to return the board for a full cap and bridge replacement.

Yes I do care about any machine I work on for a client.

If he could send the machine back to me I would repair this issue with no cost even if it has nothing to do with my restoration as it left my shop working 100%.

It really bothers me that he has not had the opportunity to play it.

I have never encountered this situation before of one of my restorations having an issue upon arrival to a client. Its not good to say the least.

The client commented to me that it seems to bother me more than him that maybe the case but either way its just not acceptable.

Here is the latest response.

"All the drops register -- I was able to get it back in test mode. After that I was able to start a game but the game immediately dropped back into attract mode -- this was right after it kicked the ball to the plunger. Once again it seems like any minor change, getting into test mode, testing the drops -- doing that lets you play one game or at least start to play one game. Meanwhile during the game both the R and the M in RANSOM were both blinking which is not supposed to be something that can happen. First ball played OK.

This time after the first ball drained the game counted up bonus, kept playing the sound loop (that plays while waiting for the ball plunge) but was otherwise locked up with just with the G.I. working and that's it.

Motor not working in test or any other time.

So if say the game is terminally confused and let's see what happens with the new board".

He will be installing the new board tomorrow.

I am thinking along the same lines. We will see when the new board is installed.

The owner just installed the new board and this is what he wrote!

"Unfortunately for BK2K, the replacement board didn't change anything, and in fact the game has all the same symptoms as before but in addition it also no longer has speech. Which may mean I did something wrong when transferring the sound ROMs. Good grief. Was being really careful too.

At this point I don't know what else to do really other than ship the game back up to you and just chalk this up to I don't know what but experience. But clearly this isn't something I'm going to be able to fix on my own and it's also pretty clear that it's not the board. Now I'm thinking could it be one of the CPUs? Who knows.

So disappointing!"

Im so confused by all of this as the machine was perfect, much better than new after my restore and this happened upon arrival at his home??????????

Has any other System 11 owners had a machine crash? If so what was the cause?

Bump

The owner just sent me this clip

LED sequence from power up until lockup

The rotten dog board was just installed by him a few days ago thinking that it may solve this issue and as you can see it has not.

He lives in Long Island I referred him to a tech out there but he doesnt seem to trust anyone else with the machine and is thinking of sending it back to me.

I am trying to avoid that scenario as I wouldn't want the machine damaged in shipping I don't think he will prep it sufficiently and it would be ashamed to have it damaged after the restoration that was done.

Too bad the issue didn't arrive in the shop before I sent it out.

Sending me just the boards won't really help as I don't have text fixtures.

I find it odd that the same issue has carried over to the new rotten dog board too something is corrupting the logic somehow. Power issue, Playfield board, ribbon cable ?

Will do

Just got the response back from the suggestion of removing the sound board from the equation.

"Sound board completely disconnected. Just removed all the cables from it.

Still have the same problem. At power on left and middle lights are steady, right light is blinking steadily. Once I start a game, The game locks up just as before, and looking at the three lights on the CPU board, the left is out, middle light is steady, and right most light is sometimes out but more often steady lit. I don't actually think this is any change from before. I think there were times before when the rightmost light but steady lit once the game locked up, and other times when it is out."

Cant fix a target bank without a machine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

From my home he is about 60 mi but with Long Island Traffic it can take up to 3+ hrs 1 way

He is sending me the machine tonight and it will have to wait until my FT restoration is done.

The owner understands this and is ok with it.

Im really looking forward to finding out why he had this problem.

The machine arrived at my shop about 1hr ago! I won't be able to get to it for a few weeks but if anyone is interested I will post a follow up as to what was causing the troubles.

Yes he was aware that I was restoring a machine for another client so he has no problems waiting.

I do all machine restorations on weekends so the schedule is really tight as I take easily close to 200 hrs for a restore.

I have restored 4 of his machines and have two more on queue.

He understands that the machine left my shop working perfectly and this just happened.

He is not in a rush for the machine I have been in contact with him since the machine arrived at his home.

If he wanted me to stop my restoration and work on this machine I would have done it as the client always comes first no matter what. Of course I would have had to have run it by the other client as well.

I will be finished with the FT restoration soon. I ail then be able to get back to the BK2000 and see what is going on. Of course I will post the results.

Just finished the FT restoration so now I have had about an hour to try to figure out the cause of the lock up and it appears I have but not the remedy yet.

The cause of the lockup and odd behavior is due to either of the motor up or down switches not being depressed by the motor cam. In other words at least one must be activated or the machine goes bonkers and locks up.

By manually turning the motor until a cam depresses a switch the game can be played perfectly without having access to the castle shot as the up down targets remain up. There is no compensation in the software for a failed motor.

Why didn't the cam activate either switch? Its because the motor is not working.

This is a new motor that was installed when I restored the machine as the other was giving all sorts of odd behavior and Pinsiders said it was a motor issue and the solution was replacement.

The replacement did the trick as all issues had gone.

However something must have happened during shipping that caused this motor to fail and that is where I am at now trying to determine why it failed.

I have taken a voltage reading at the motor connector and am getting 30+ volts during motor test.

Does anyone know if this is correct?

I have the IPDB PDF of the manual but no schematics. Manual says Q6 is the motor transistor but there are two Q6 transistors one tip 36 on the AUX pb and a tip 102 on the PDB which is a new Rotten dog replacement that the owner installed trying to fix the issue.

I am assuming that the tip 102 is driving a larger Tip on the APDB and that they are both working as I am getting voltage in motor test.

The tip 36 tested fine at least on the board as did the tip 102.

Can anyone chime in? Thanks

Yes and I just took it off the machine and its 24v 60 hz. Model -E 24 11RPM CCW

Im getting 48 ohms in ohms test