(Topic ID: 119471)

BEWARE OF SELLER - Indiana - Sega Twister Pinball Machine


By mikelaka

4 years ago



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  • 210 posts
  • 101 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Norm
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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There are 210 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 5.
#51 4 years ago

If I went to pick up or make arrangements to pick up and the seller said I couldn't play it, Id tell him to pound sand too. That is just stupid.

I just wasted 6 hours of travel time, $400 in hotels/gas/food etc to look at a game. Thankfully he let me play it and it was riddled with problems.

Better safe than sorry, OP you are 100% correct in this situation. Thanks for the heads up.

11
#52 4 years ago

High maintenance or not, the buyer should have the ability to turn the game on and check it out before he leaves..

Also, If the seller claims that was not possible, why in the description did it say to come play test it before you bid if that was not possible.

Personally, the buyer dodged a bullet on this one.. and the seller lost out on TOP DOLLAR for a Twister, even with the fees!

#53 4 years ago
Quoted from balboarules:

If the seller claims that was not possible, why in the description did it say to come play test it before you bid if that was not possible.

Bahahahahahahahahahahaha...........

#54 4 years ago

I have done business with the OP.
I bought my Black Hole from him.
He was easy to deal with and a straight up nice guy.
The seller on his ebay deal was clearly hiding something.
( Welcome to Pinside, Mike!)

#55 4 years ago

Must be a slow night on Pinside, pretty clear the op was right and seller was shady to me.

#56 4 years ago

People make false statements on eBay all the time. Not saying the seller was, but his action of not letting you turn on the game, spoke louder than words.

#57 4 years ago

I've bought several games from Tony. I've never had any issues with him. Tony was nice enough to help me troubleshoot and fix issues I've had with games that weren't even purchased from him. When I was just getting i to this hobby I contacted him on a HUO game he was selling, I was looking for my very first game. I was bit too late though , somebody beat me to it. But when I located a Monster Bash I thought I was interested in, Tony offered to check it out with me and thanks to him I did not purchase it. I held out and spent the same amount on Matt Mckee's much nicer MB.

Chris

#58 4 years ago

If anyone ever purchases a game, I have it powered on for them, show them all the features and how they work. If anything doesn't work I fix it prior to them coming. It is utterly ridiculous that someone would not let you play the game when your picking it up.

#59 4 years ago

Wow, that's an absolute mess. Thanks for the warning, OP. Unless a game is being sold as a project, it's foolish to pay anything remotely close to full price for a pin you can't test.

#60 4 years ago

The only thing worse than a Twister is a $2000 Twister

The only thing worse than that is a $2000 Twister that doesn't work

If I were you I'd thank the seller for backing out & I'd focus on making a deal here on Pinside

#61 4 years ago
Quoted from s2k4ary:

People make false statements on eBay all the time.

Say it ain't so!!

#62 4 years ago
Quoted from floyd1977:

I have sold only one machine on eBay. The guy came down from Madison, so obviously it would've been impractical to test the game before bidding. He won the auction, but I insisted that he check out the game and play it as much as he wanted before taking it. I even told him he was not obligated to buy the game if he thought I had misrepresented it in my ad. I'd rather not sell a game to someone than have that person feel that I ripped them off.

If someone gives you a hard time about wanting to test a game before buying it, you are better off not doing business with him, in my opinion.

I'd buy a game from you anyday, I like the way you do business. That's the way I sell games too.

#63 4 years ago
Quoted from Jetzxi:

I've bought several games from Tony. I've never had any issues with him. Tony was nice enough to help me troubleshoot and fix issues I've had with games that weren't even purchased from him. When I was just getting i to this hobby I contacted him on a HUO game he was selling, I was looking for my very first game. I was bit too late though , somebody beat me to it. But when I located a Monster Bash I thought I was interested in, Tony offered to check it out with me and thanks to him I did not purchase it. I held out and spent the same amount on Matt Mckee's much nicer MB.
Chris

Nice to hear a good story about the seller.

#64 4 years ago
Quoted from RCA1:

I have done business with the OP.
I bought my Black Hole from him.
He was easy to deal with and a straight up nice guy.
The seller on his ebay deal was clearly hiding something.
( Welcome to Pinside, Mike!)

Also nice to hear a good story about the buyer.

#65 4 years ago

This thread is about the OP trying to help by sharing an experience they had. Who cares what he spent on Twister and how one thinks he's lucky the deal went south and it "saved" the OP. I bet there's pins I'd spend more than others here would. It's so annoying when people get on here to bash others choices. Stick to the topic. Also, I agree with Pinfidel, with high ticket items I prefer that the buyer tests it out first before any money is exchanged. That's what honest sellers do.

#66 4 years ago
Quoted from FightNightFZ:

This thread is about the OP trying to help by sharing an experience they had. Who cares what he spent on Twister and how one thinks he's lucky the deal went south and it "saved" the OP. I bet there's pins I'd spend more than others here would. It's so annoying when people get on here to bash others choices. Stick to the topic. Also, I agree with Pinfidel, with high ticket items I prefer that the buyer tests it out first before any money is exchanged. That's what honest sellers do.

I was speaking in half jest to the OP & its likely the others were as well.

$2K for a broken Twister sucks. If price & title are irrelevant then why is it mentioned?

I don't get all butthurt when folks make fun of Baywatch. Wonder what makes us different in that regard?

#67 4 years ago

I for one thinks thinks Twister is actually a great playing game and would be worth 2k for a nice one as parts are almost impossible to come by. But if I was the OP and the seller had said he would cancel the auction because they couldn't come to terms, I would have thanked him and moved on. Then look for another.

-2
#68 4 years ago

The fact that you dropped 2k on Twister is more insane then this entire fiasco IMHO.

#69 4 years ago

I find it hard to believe that some of you guys think you should not be able to test a pin before completing the sale.

I've been buying videogames and pins, and reading internet videogame and pin forums for 10 years now and I've never once heard of a seller refusing to allow a buyer to plug in a machine and test it.

Whenever I've bought anything, the seller would plug it in and show that it worked without even being asked.

There's only one reason why a seller would forbid you to test out a game - because he's a scumbag and the game doesn't work as advertised.

-3
#70 4 years ago

The whole saying you'll bring a technician by to check it out to make sure it works 100% is what strikes me as weird and would bring up red flags as a seller. What's wrong with your own ability to evaluate a pinball machine? I doubt you would've had a problem if you showed up and plugged it in to make sure it was in the condition described in the auction (which you don't link to or say what the *auction itself* describes as the working condition). Talking about bringing your guy in to go over every nook and facet just makes it sound like you're going to try to get a discount because a bulb is out.

#71 4 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

I was speaking in half jest to the OP & its likely the others were as well.
$2K for a broken Twister sucks. If price & title are irrelevant then why is it mentioned?
I don't get all butthurt when folks make fun of Baywatch. Wonder what makes us different in that regard?

Lol, I actually didn't even make it to the 2nd page of comments so I didn't see yours. In the Baywatch regard, I think it is underrated and I like it, just like my MSF.

#72 4 years ago
Quoted from Code_Blue:

The whole saying you'll bring a technician by to check it out to make sure it works 100% is what strikes me as weird and would bring up red flags as a seller. What's wrong with your own ability to evaluate a pinball machine? I doubt you would've had a problem if you showed up and plugged it in to make sure it was in the condition described in the auction (which you don't link to or say what the *auction itself* describes as the working condition). Talking about bringing your guy in to go over every nook and facet just makes it sound like you're going to try to get a discount because a bulb is out.

He wants to bring a tech because he is smart. Unless I was a tech myself, I will always bring a friend that knows more than me to help me evaluate the game.

#73 4 years ago
Quoted from mikelaka:

Tony informed me that he had to move the machine to cold storage and that there isn't any power to test the machine.

ive heard a few good cover up stories, but that one takes the cake.

seems he didnt want him to plug it in at all ?... yes the OP bought it .. fair enough, but shit, just let the man fire it up ?? ... cold storage ... ROFL

#74 4 years ago

I always find the bad seller reports interesting reads.
I can see both sides here, as I think others have said..

From the buyer's side, he wanted to test the machine and wasn't permitted and seems he got a bit of a runaround from the seller. He's leery because of that. Fair enough.

From the seller's side...he already sold the machine and the buyer then wants to show up and inspect it with a tech. That raises concerns in a big way that the guy is just going to nitpick it to death.

Honestly I gotta say that I side with the seller here. The big sticking point is that you already bought the machine. If you had made arrangements with the seller to inspect the machine prior to purchase that would be a different story. I understand that's not always workable with auctions, but as a seller I would probably do the same thing.

If someone bought a game from me and then, after purchasing it, wanted to show up to do a deep inspection, I would back the heck away from that. It's asking for trouble and, at least to me, immediately tells me that the deal can be riddled with problems down the road.

I always encourage people to look at a machine before they pay.

#75 4 years ago
Quoted from FightNightFZ:

Lol, I actually didn't even make it to the 2nd page of comments so I didn't see yours. In the Baywatch regard, I think it is underrated and I like it, just like my MSF.

MSF sucks

#76 4 years ago

This is one of the most ridiculous threads I have read. As if you can't turn on something, such as a pinball machine, which can form issues by just looking at them wrong...

When I sell now, it's sold as is. Could be HUO, but it is as is. I make this clear in the email/pm with the buyer, and I tell people it's working now (or whatever the state is), play it as much as you want, take out the eye piece and look it over, but when it leaves, it and any possible issues are now yours.

The consensus of dodged a bullet is correct.

#77 4 years ago
Quoted from herbertbsharp:

He hasn't ripped you off.

I agree, if it was that important to you, you should have made that clear prior to bidding.
Honestly I would have probably canceled the auction on you too. As LTG says, "No deal is better than a bad deal"

You're probably bias though due to the fact that you've sold POS games on ebay with great pics and description. Well I know of one game for sure anyway. Thanks for the lesson though

Post edited by moderator: If you have had any bad dealings with the poster, you should post a clear description elsewhere, but a vague post like this can be viewed as a personal attack.

#78 4 years ago

I think the seller should have listed the machine as being sold "AS IS," if he didn't intend for a buyer to be able to kick the tires. Bidding would have been adjusted accordingly, of course.

But to advertise as "100% working" and not allow confirmation afterwards (which is in both parties' interests if they're both honest) is wrong.

Once again, if the seller felt that strongly about it, s/he should have advertised it as "100% working" but also "sold as is."

#79 4 years ago
Quoted from NJGecko:

I always find the bad seller reports interesting reads.
I can see both sides here, as I think others have said..
...
I always encourage people to look at a machine before they pay.

Quoted from Rick432:

I think the seller should have listed the machine as being sold "AS IS," if he didn't intend for a buyer to be able to kick the tires. Bidding would have been adjusted accordingly, of course.
But to advertise as "100% working" and not allow confirmation afterwards (which is in both parties' interests if they're both honest) is wrong.
Once again, if the seller felt that strongly about it, s/he should have advertised it as "100% working" but also "sold as is."

+1

I just want to add that I am not against anyone testing my machines when I sell. Mine have always been in my gameroom with power applied...so by all means. If you are a 1000 miles away, by all means send a friend/tech if you want. I've never had a problem except for a glass that was damaged by NAVL. (I had pictures of it in good shape as they were wrapping and loading it, which I provided to the buyer for his claim)

It's just the situation here. The seller was presumed guilty without proof - Nobody proved that it wasn't 100% working. After buying you now you want to monkey around with moving it into a truck? The second you move it - technically it's your responsibility. If it's stated to be 100% working where it sits it should be able to be proven by testing where it sits.

Both parties made this situation a no win for each other.

#80 4 years ago
Quoted from NJGecko:

From the seller's side...he already sold the machine and the buyer then wants to show up and inspect it with a tech. That raises concerns in a big way that the guy is just going to nitpick it to death.

The machine is not "sold" until the transaction is completed. Just because the auction is over and you're the winning bidder doesn't mean it is a done deal unless it is clearly and solely stated "as is, where is, no guarantees written or implied" with no other conditions. If the seller states anything such as "good working condition" in addition to this, it now adds terms that the buyer is within his rights to verify before completing the transaction.

A good seller should welcome a thorough inspection by a qualified person.

#81 4 years ago

Been told wayyy too many times the game is fully working. Worst instance was a nascar where I got there and nothing worked. Game had GI only. The seller hadn't even bothered to test it since his kid's bday party a few months prior. Luckily for me he finally negotiated down, but it bites to be 5 hours out and looking at going home empty handed.

Would never buy a game if the seller said I couldn't turn it on.

11
#82 4 years ago

Exactly what helicopter said. It's ebay. Nothing is sold until cash exchanges hands and the machine is loaded up.

As for having a tech come with, I wouldn't care if he brought a van full of people to check it out. Why in the world does it matter if the buyer does not have the ability to check the game out himself? If he said the game is working then he has nothing to worry about. If he is concerned the buyer will want to renegotiate the price after he inspects all the seller has to say is no. It is very irritating that there is anyone out there that sides with the seller in this instance.

There really is not a debate to be had here. A buyer has the right to try something before he purchase it, if not then just as in this situation, it's not going to be sold.

Also the price of the machine is irrelevant, why is it that every thread turns into a pricing discussion? It doesn't matter if this twister was 10k or 100.

#83 4 years ago
Quoted from Code_Blue:

The whole saying you'll bring a technician by to check it out to make sure it works 100% is what strikes me as weird and would bring up red flags as a seller. What's wrong with your own ability to evaluate a pinball machine? I doubt you would've had a problem if you showed up and plugged it in to make sure it was in the condition described in the auction (which you don't link to or say what the *auction itself* describes as the working condition). Talking about bringing your guy in to go over every nook and facet just makes it sound like you're going to try to get a discount because a bulb is out.

I don't get your statement, in the description the seller does state it works 100%, that means EVERYTHING works not a bulb out or a switch not working. 100% means EVERYTHING doesn't it? So if a tech came and looked at it he would find NOTHING wrong with it to try and get a discount right. No try before the money exchanges hands means no sale in my book.

#84 4 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

Exactly what helicopter said. It's ebay. Nothing is sold until cash exchanges hands and the machine is loaded up.
As for having a tech come with, I wouldn't care if he brought a van full of people to check it out. Why in the world does it matter if the buyer does not have the ability to check the game out himself? If he said the game is working then he has nothing to worry about. If he is concerned the buyer will want to renegotiate the price after he inspects all the seller has to say is no. It is very irritating that there is anyone out there that sides with the seller in this instance.
There really is not a debate to be had here. A buyer has the right to try something before he purchase it, if not then just as in this situation, it's not going to be sold.
Also the price of the machine is irrelevant, why is it that every thread turns into a pricing discussion? It doesn't matter if this Twister was 10k or 100.

In certain cases at least for me the money would matter. If I have a deal pending where the price of a 'working' machine is priced below the price of a project version of the pin I actually avoid trying to test it. Just check for completeness and for absence of abuse. I then haul and go. Never can tell if the seller would change their mind if you turn it on and it happened to start working better than they thought

Mike V

#85 4 years ago
Quoted from RacingPin:

In certain cases at least for me the money would matter. If I have a deal pending where the price of a 'working' machine is priced below the price of a project version of the pin I actually avoid trying to test it. Just check for completeness and for absence of abuse. I then haul and go. Never can tell if the seller would change their mind if you turn it on and it happened to start working better than they thought
Mike V

That's for sure. That's how ya get the deals.

22
#86 4 years ago

Are we REALLY arguing about whether or not it's good practice to deny buyers of a supposedly 100 percent working machine an opportunity to turn it on and play it before buying it?

Anybody who is saying it is is either arguing for the fun of it or an idiot. Any machine sold as fully working needs to be plugged in, turned on, and tested at the request of the buyer. Any seller who refuses to do this is obviously acting in bad faith and shouldn't be trusted, ever, with anything.

#87 4 years ago

Do you bid on something and win at your local auction, then come back to pick it up with a tech to make sure it's in exactly the condition the auctioneer described? Of course not. You'd be laughed out of every auction house in the country.

#88 4 years ago

This is a direct quote from the listing "Pinball machine that works 100% with no errors."

100% means 100%.. not 99.5%. Listing something as 100% means it is fair game to bring a tech.

#89 4 years ago
Quoted from Code_Blue:

Do you bid on something and win at your local auction, then come back to pick it up with a tech to make sure it's in exactly the condition the auctioneer described? Of course not. You'd be laughed out of every auction house in the country

This is an absurd argument. No auction house would list something at working 100%

#90 4 years ago
Quoted from Code_Blue:

Do you bid on something and win at your local auction, then come back to pick it up with a tech to make sure it's in exactly the condition the auctioneer described? Of course not. You'd be laughed out of every auction house in the country.

Do you bid on a supposedly 100% working pinball machine on ebay, and then go to pick it up, have the seller refuse any attempts you make to test it, and then just hand over the cash and take it?

Of course not. You'd laugh the ebay seller out of his house and come here and post about it.

Not sure why you are confusing eBay with an auction house. They are different things.

#91 4 years ago

Why didn't you just pay his advertised Priority shipping! HA!

Based on what the OP is saying there's too much emphasis of the seller saying testing afterwards is NOT allowed, as if they are hiding something. Would make me feel uncomfortable too. So one is welcome to play it before a bid, but it's instantly moved to a place with no heat and power after the auction so no testing? Sounds fishy. If I'm selling a game, a working game, I don't bother moving it and making it unavailable while the bidding is going on, and on this listing bids started on the 16th and were made throughout the auction. Yes, some buyers can be nit picky, and no one should use the phrase "100%" or "Perfect" on used items. I've had nit picky buyers want to get things for less and I just say No, they wasted a trip. Always depends on the situation though. My favorite is when I have something worth what it's worth and lots of interest and someone says "I'll take it" then comes back later and wants to know if I'll know off X amount of money cause they have to drive so far. That's your problem buddy

#92 4 years ago
Quoted from RacingPin:

In certain cases at least for me the money would matter. If I have a deal pending where the price of a 'working' machine is priced below the price of a project version of the pin I actually avoid trying to test it. Just check for completeness and for absence of abuse. I then haul and go. Never can tell if the seller would change their mind if you turn it on and it happened to start working better than they thought
Mike V

There are many times I do not turn a game on myself before loading as well. Almost every single game has something wrong with it and I know that and can fix it so I am okay with that. However you better believe that if I want to turn it on and I was told no, I would keep the cash and leave. I recently bought a title that was above market on price because I was told it was an excellent example. I got it shipped and it was very far from it. It pissed me off I paid a premium for the game, but at the end of the day it's my own fault for not being more like the op and inspecting it further.

-8
#93 4 years ago

As the seller, the issue I would have with the request to come and inspect is now my time is being wasted. How long is this inspection going to take? If it's in storage without power, then am I expected to move it somewhere with power?

Courtesy as a bidder/buyer is to ask those questions and make those arrangements prior to placing a winning big/agreeing to purchase.

I was selling a Nissan speedometer on eBay recently, someone did a Buy It Now and THEN asked if it was for an automatic or manual tranny. I replied, no response back and I had to waste my time on filing the non paying bidder report and relist it.

Seller stated it could be played before the auction was over, so there you go if it was that important.

#94 4 years ago
Quoted from Code_Blue:

Do you bid on something and win at your local auction, then come back to pick it up with a tech to make sure it's in exactly the condition the auctioneer described? Of course not. You'd be laughed out of every auction house in the country.

What an irrelevant statement. All auctions are clearly started with the same old speech. Sold as is where they sit, no guarantees. I don't think I have ever heard anything other than that.

#95 4 years ago
Quoted from PoMC:

As the seller, the issue I would have with the request to come and inspect is now my time is being wasted. How long is this inspection going to take? If it's in storage without power, then am I expected to move it somewhere with power?
Courtesy as a bidder/buyer is to ask those questions and make those arrangements prior to placing a winning big/agreeing to purchase.
I was selling a Nissan speedometer on eBay recently, someone did a Buy It Now and THEN asked if it was for an automatic or manual tranny. I replied, no response back and I had to waste my time on filing the non paying bidder report and relist it.
Seller stated it could be played before the auction was over, so there you go if it was that important.

Did you not read the part where the buyer offered to remedy the situation of no heat for the game and supply power on site?

Also on your speedo, it's ebay, it's just the way it goes. A waste of time to click on resolve item issue, then click non paying bidder is much easier than not having ebay to sell a random part on. If that is the worst thing that happens to you on eBay consider yourself lucky.

#96 4 years ago

My list of do not buy from has grown since yesterday. This thread as brought to light lots of bad or potentially bad sellers. Keep it going.

-2
#97 4 years ago
Quoted from mikelaka:

So, there was recently a Sega Twister Pinball machine on ebay. I won the auction for $2,026.
I asked for location and I let Tony Pinto from Classiccoin-Op know that I'll bring a tech and go through the machine to be sure that everything works. Tony informed me that he had to move the machine to cold storage and that there isn't any power to test the machine. He guaranteed me that the game works 100%. I told him I would bring a heated box truck, let the machine sit for an hour inside the heated box truck, go have breakfast, and come back to test the game after the game adequately heated up. Tony insisted that he wouldn't allow the game to be tested at all and claimed that the machine should have been tested prior to bidding.
I see both sides here. I've sold Pin's on ebay. But telling someone that a machine works 100% and then telling them that they are not allowed to plug it in or test it, just doesn't make sense. He told me that if I sent payment through PayPal that he would immediately return the payment because he wouldn't guarantee the game. He also informed me that he had no where else to take the machine where it would be heated so the machine could be tested. I told him that I could wait a week or two and pick up the machine when it would be warmer. I even offered to pay for the machine and to wait until it was warmer to test. He openly refused any and all and told me that he would just cancel the auction and relist it.
Tony said the best I could do would be to visually inspect the game. Tony claims that my intent to test the game should have been done prior to bidding and that he has never had this ever come up before and that I am being unreasonable. He then cancelled the ebay auction.
My reason for posting this is so that no one else runs into the same situation. I can only assume that Tony Pinto from Classiccoin-op was hoping someone would purchase the machine and have it shipped. And when it arrived not working, Tony could state that the machine worked prior to being shipped.
Tony Pinto is also known as Droopydogy.

You should have asked to test the game BEFORE you bid. You had that opportunity and you actually added that contingency AFTER the seller took it off the market thinking he was just going to ship what he believed to be a 100 percent working game.

If you are going to add your inspection contingency, then you have to allow the seller to sell the game to a local person on your way to pick it up. Essentially, you are saying the game is not SOLD because you are inspecting it and YOU added that to the deal.

This is why I would never sell on EBAY. Every pin I sold I insisted on inspection first before settling on price.

-1
#98 4 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

Did you not read the part where the buyer offered to remedy the situation of no heat for the game and supply power on site?

Still a hassle for the seller and should have been discussed prior to bidding. Most people are quick to jump on a seller/retailer, but the customer is not always right. The seller doesn't have to submit to a buyer's demands after a sale agreement. A seller can walk away from a sale the same as a buyer can, and this seller chose to do that.

#99 4 years ago

The seller and the buyer have the right to do whatever they want true. Ultimately the seller is hiding something because if he was not, he would have allowed the game to be played, because now he has to relist the game, wait for it to sell and in the mean time allow others to come play/test the game. The seller is acting shady to say the least.

-2
#100 4 years ago

Call me shady, but if I sell something and then have to wait an hour, in the cold, in my vehicle, at my storage unit for the buyer to conclude his testing, I'm not agreeing to it. In this case testing occurs prior to agreeing to purchase and that was opportunity was made available.

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