ADDED POLL INFORMATION:

The following "Old School" SS Pins that have a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball have had at least 2 responses in this thread. They have been chosen as the top candidates as the Best "Old School" Solid State Pin of all time! Please vote for your favorite!

Blackout

Eight Ball Deluxe

Seawitch

Paragon

Flash

Gorgar

ORIGINAL POST:

We all know that with the advent of Solid State technology pinball was raised to another level. The early SS pins had the great "Old School" feel of their EM predecessors but could also take advantage of more in depth scoring schemes. But around 1985 things changed in that we saw a change in the playfield design with the addition of ramps and toys. We also saw multi-ball become part of almost every game. These things changed the way pinball was played and ushered in what I consider the "New School" era.

What I would like to discuss here are opinions on what SS Pins, most likely pre 1985, without toys, ramps, or multi-ball are considered the best. What would be considered the best of the "Old School" style flat playfield SS Pins that could be considered the crowning achievement of this style of Pinball Play?

Please be specific in your reasons why you chose a specific pin or pins. What makes its' layout and play the best representative of "Old School" Pin mastery? Does its' solid state technology bring it past others in the field while still maintaining the "Old School" charm? Does its' artwork stand way ahead of others? Or does it have an unsurpassed theme?

Remember we are looking to discuss SS Pins with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball.

Which ones do you consider the best and why?!!!

I just woke up and was greeted by all these great Pins of the early 80s!!! Thanks for the wonderful descriptions you all are offering!

The reason I restricted it to no multi-ball is that, even though there are a few "Old School" EM games that did have multi-ball, it was pretty unusual and mostly just a new fangled gimmick. Also I feel that multi-ball really takes away from the true game play. Multi-ball just creates a mess in my opinion!

So from what I've seen so far the top contenders are:

Blackout
Eight Ball Deluxe
Seawitch
Paragon
Meteor
Flash

Let's keep them coming as I'm sure there are some more great ones out there!!

Thanks!

Well I'm going to chime in with one of my favorites. I do own it, I love the theme, and I really think the ball play has been underrated. My 1978 Bally Star Trek!

I always wonder why this pin is so underrated as far as the game play is concerned. The layout is different compared to anything else I've seen out there. But the rule set is still very easy to understand. There are numerous great shots and a good simple strategy with this pin.

The plunger shot brings you to the top of the play field with 2 rollover lanes and a saucer that will build your "BALLY" Bonus. This drops down into the Poppers which can direct the ball right back up to the lanes or saucer. Three stand ups on the right also help score the "BALLY" Bonus. The "Bally" Bonus is carried over for each ball. The four drop targets on the left are crucial as each time you complete the bank your bonus multiplier is increased up to a free ball. You also have an upper left lane shot that brings you back to the top of the play field but more important this shot scores increasing points that leads to a free ball. There are two roll over lanes on the left middle that also score extra points. And the best shot of all is the right side "Time Warp" shot that brings the ball back to the plunger. Making this shot scores your accumulated bonus points but does not reset them. If you can continue making this shot you can really rack up the points!!

The best strategy is to work the four drop targets to get your multiplier up to 3X and free ball. Then work the "Time Warp" shot to repeatedly collect the bonus. Along the way you can work the "BALLY" bonus and the upper left lane for extra points and a free ball. Fun, easy, and effective strategy to rack up the points. My best score turned over the pin with a final score of 1,456,270!!!

I really like the play of this pin and of course you can't beat the classic Star Trek theme!!

Just love those Classic Game Room reviews!! Didn't realize that Supersonic is actually quite similar to Star Trek. Same color scheme, same sounds, and a very similar play field layout. Looks like a fun pin!

WOW!! It's exactly the same game! Interesting how Star Ship, which is really the first Star Trek pin made, ended up being Supersonic. Also the fact that Star Ship was an EM and Supersonic ended up being a SS pin. Too bad Star Ship never went into production as it would have been really great to have a Star Trek themed EM out there.

Mike,

Can you please spell out the abbreviated pin names. Without the full names I really don't know the pins by just the abbreviations.

Thanks!

Posters above please explain why you consider these the best.

Posters above please follow the guidelines for your suggestions:

Based on the pins that have been mentioned more than once so far, the top contenders are:

Blackout
Eight Ball Deluxe
Seawitch
Paragon
Meteor
Flash
Gorgar
Joker Poker

Some of these have been mentioned a few times but no one has given any reasons why they think they are the best of the SS "Old School" pins based on the criteria I set forth. I am planning to add a poll to this thread tomorrow so that we can get some numbers behind these selections. But to make the poll the pin will need more than just one description why it's the best.

If you listed a pin without telling us why please do so. And if any of these pins are your favorites please tell us why they are the best.

Keep them coming!!

Yes you are correct in that they are all fun. But I think you are missing the point of this thread. I'm trying to determine what would be the KING of the "Old School" SS Pins. The Best of the Best when it comes to SS Pins with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball. The crowning achievement in Old School Pinology.

Sorry but Black Hole doesn't fit the criteria set forth. No multi-ball allowed.

Please explain why you voted for these pins being the best.

Can you be more specific?

Thanks crassmage!

Tell us why you like Galaxy and why you consider it the best "Old School" SS pin.

BoP,

Did you read the original post? It says:

Flash Gordon has ramps thus it's not considered as an "Old School" SS pin. It does not fit the criteria for this discussion. Sorry.

Please remember we are looking to discuss SS Pins with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball. Also I would like to read what your opinion regarding the pin is. Why would you consider it the best?

Sorry these games have ramps and or multi-ball thus they not considered as an "Old School" SS pin. It does not fit the criteria for this discussion. Sorry

Not sure what to do with Medusa. Yes it fits the stated criteria but it is far from an "Old School" design.

I chose 1985 because I simply did not know exactly what year a non-ramp and non-multiball may have still been made. 1985 was my best educated guess. With the facts that have been gathered so far it does seem that 1980-81 would be a more accurate cut-off date. Plus it really doesn't matter if you read the original post and the detailed criteria that is stipulated there.

Yes I agree that limited to this "Old School" group of SS Pins with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball, they are not going to be better than pins that did have those features during that time period. But again that is not the point. We are trying to determine which pin that IS limited to those criteria would be considered the best.

What I consider "Old School" pin design are those pins that have a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball. These types of pins still were being produced at the beginning of the solid state era. I just want to determine which solid state pin with an Old School design would be considered the best.

Hope that clarifies things for those of you that don't seem to get it.

Medusa and Spectrum look like great pins and yes they do fit the criteria. So why don't you give us some detailed reasons why you would consider these to be the best? Perhaps their advanced use of the technology available to them at that time will put them on the top.

The problem is NOT my topic, the concept, or the stipulations I attached. My original post is VERY CLEAR in it's description and explanation of what I wanted to achieve with this thread.

The BIG problem here is that some of you simply DID NOT READ the original post!! You could at least read the original post before making your own post based on incorrect assumptions. You can't put everything in a title. And to reply to a thread simply based on the title without reading the original post is the easiest way to make yourself look foolish.

Remember the old saying: When you ASSUME You make an ASS out of U and ME!!!

Snyper2099,

Thanks for the great post with all that info. It really helps narrow down some of the top pins that would fit the "Old School" criteria I have set forth. I just wish that we could get some more input from fellow pinsiders on why these pins were great.

Fellow Pinsiders! Please look through the pins mentioned below and give us your opinions on which ones you think are the best! And if you have any other great "Old School" SS Pins that you think should be added to the list please let us know and tell us why.

Blackout
Eight Ball Deluxe
Seawitch
Paragon
Meteor
Flash
Gorgar
Joker Poker
Evel Knievel
Medusa

PinKeeper,

Great response!! Thanks!

Thanks TheShameGovernor and kennywawa for both of your great discourses!

swf127, can you please elaborate why you chose Eight Ball Deluxe and Paragon?

Hey zarco, did you read the criteria set forth in the original post? Black hole does not qualify for this discussion because it DOES have multi levels and multi ball!!

These 2 pins do qualify. Can you share with us why you think they are so great?

Please elaborate if you can. Thanks!

Here is an update on the list. Each of these pins has been mentioned at least twice. But some of them have not had any discussion presented why they should be chosen as the best. Without any discussion they will not be included in the upcoming poll.

Blackout
Eight Ball Deluxe
Seawitch
Paragon
Meteor
Flash
Gorgar
Joker Poker
Evel Knievel
Medusa
Sinbad
Big Game
Skateball
Genie

Please look through the pins mentioned above and give us your opinions on which ones you think are the best! And if you have any other great "Old School" SS Pins that you think should be added to the list please let us know and tell us why.

FYI: I checked the IPDB and there were over 300 SS pins made before 1981 that did not have ramps or multi-ball!!

I've been through that quest many many times!!

WOW!! What a cool pin! Knew that there must have been something out there that was made past 1981 and fit the criteria. Very interesting and unique. Thanks for sharing!

I addressed this matter earlier in the thread but I will elaborate some more here. Checking the IPDB website there were over 3,545 EM machines made. Only 17 of them had multiball. That is less than 1/2 percent!! Multiball was just a "gimmick" added to a very few EM machines and thus I do not consider it as a part of what makes a pin "Old School". To me "Old School" is based on working ONE ball through a simple flat playfield with no ramps or toys.

mof,

I did some more research and there are SS pins that fit the parameters I stipulated going all the way up to 1988. So limiting it to 1981 would have left out a lot of pins. My cut off was "around 1985" and that was just a guess and I was off also. I did change the title to hopefully alleviate any more confusion and my parameters were always stated crystal clear since my first post.

I don't understand why something so simple is so hard for some of you to understand. All I'm trying to do here is discuss SS Pins with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball and then try to determine which ones are considered the best and why. Any sort of date doesn't even mater. We are not looking to discuss the best pin in a certain time frame, we are looking to discuss the best pin with a certain criteria. I originally put the 1985 date in because I already knew that people wouldn't read the original post and suggest pins like MM and STTNG. And, as we continue to see, a lot of people are not reading the original post and are putting up all kinds of suggestions that don't fit the criteria. The problem is not what I posted. The problem is the fact that people JUST DON"T READ what I did originally post.

Simple answer YES!! As the original poster I have a reason for this thread. I outlined the criteria for the discussion. It is my responsibility to maintain control of the thread and not let it go off in a direction not intended. If you or others don't like or agree with the criteria I set forth, you can always go start your own thread that may better reflect what you have in your mind as the discussion point.

As we continue to see with Pinballgeek's post just before this one, people obviously are not reading the original post. Pinballgeek named a pin with multiball and didn't provide any reasons why he chose that pin. From here on out I will simply ignore any posts that don't follow what I asked to be discussed in the original post.

I see this so often in many of the threads on this and other forums. People post a response to a thread that is often totally off base showing that they never even read the original post or they post a one word answer that doesn't add anything to the overall discussion. It's truly amazing how LAZY some people are. Can't even take the time to read the thread or write something constructive!

Thank you for that suggestion. I did not realize that I could go there and remove any thing from that list. I will do that shortly. EDIT: I just tried to remove the incorrect pins but I cannot remove a pin that someone else put up there. Only the moderators can do that.

I'm sorry but that title makes absolutely no sense to me and is way too long. It also does not clearly relate to the criteria I am looking for. I know that there are pins that fit my criteria that were made after Flash. And also what does "slightly off being Electro Mechanicals" really mean? The title as it now reads is very accurate and nice and short. If someone doesn't know what "Old School" means they can read the original post as it is described there very clearly. Everyone should be reading the original post anyways before posting something themselves, and if they don't, they will show their foolishness with posting something that doesn't relate correctly to the discussion.

OK, Here is the compiled list with descriptive posts for all the pins that were mentioned at least twice. As you can see there are some pins that were mentioned at least twice but still do not have at least 2 reasons why posted. They will be eliminated from the upcoming poll if no one gives a description why they should be considered as the best SS Pin with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball.

Also, if you have any other pins that fit the criteria and you would like to see included, please tell us which pin and provide a reason why you think it's the Best "Old School" SS Pin with a standard flat playfield, no ramps, no toys, and no multi-ball.

Thanks!

Blackout

Eight Ball Deluxe

Seawitch

Paragon

Meteor

Flash

Gorgar

Joker Poker

Evel Knievel

Medusa

Sinbad

Big Game

Skateball

Genie

Good idea. Thanks!

I'll give another 24 hours for any more additions and comments. I'll then put up a poll so that we can get some numbers.

Thanks!

Poll will go up soon. Last chance!

The Poll has been added! Please see poll information now posted in the first post of the thread. Please vote!!

Please take the time to read the thread. It's all there.

First of all you can only put 10 items in a poll. There were more than that mentioned so all cannot be put in the poll. I had to make a determination on what pins would make the cut and the best was to give those with at least two descriptions be in the poll. Second it is my thread and I can set the criteria as I please. If you would like some other criteria you can start your own thread.