Beat Time refurbishing

Just acquired a pretty beat up and dirty Beat Time. Huge Beatles fan, walls are full of only Beatles or Pinball, perfect fit! Calling this a refurb as I just want to get running and protected from additional damage. Backglass has some flaking but if I'm looking right, according to IPDB this is an early production blue one, right?

It's got some quirks I want to fix... when you power up the game with the toggle under the cab nothing happens. Then, when you hit start it lights up and starts a game (no credit required). You can hit it again for 2 player but the game is stuck in P1 ball 1 forever. Is this some home use hack that anyone here is familiar with and can help me reverse? My repair skills are limited and em experience is very little. Thanks

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#2 4 years ago

edednedy

Pinside member

Most likely, you have a gummed up ball count unit.

#3 4 years ago

edednedy

Pinside member

This is what your looking for. One coil plunger should step up one at a time and the other should cause the unit to spring back to the beginning. Thoroughly clean the cams levers and pivot points, as well as the fingers and rivets on the other side. You may want to put a thin layer of super lube on the rivet side. Also make sure all springs are present. After cleaning, advance coil plungers by hand until they move freely.

Ball Count (resized).png

#4 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

Great, thanks! Would that be under the playfield or in the backbox? Would that affect the strange start up too?

#5 4 years ago

edednedy

Pinside member

It's usually in the back box on a Williams but it could be anywhere. You'll find several similar looking units. Credit unit, coin unit, bonus unit (if it has one) all look similar. There should be a 'Ball Count" sticker on it, if it hasn't fallen off. If you're not sure, press and release the plungers of all the units and see if one is stuck.

Does the machine light up when you hit the left flipper button?

#6 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

Ok, thx. Away from machine, I'll check left flipper later

#7 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

Yes, left flipper will turn on gi, and start button still starts a game (em on freeplay??).
Stepper was very stiff, cleaned and lubed, switches wouldn't spin back before but they do now! Sadly, game is still stuck on ball 1. After seeing that, I moved the back coil twice and I was on ball 2! Progress!
It still won't advance on it's own, would that mean bad coil?
Thanks

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#8 4 years ago

HOW

HowardR

Pinside member

Boulder, CO

7y 78,050 6,251

If the unit's advance solenoid tries to advance but doesn't, you probably have a mechanical problem

If you suspect a bad coil, you can probably swap a coil that works with the same part number. Or use a bulb tester:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/reading-gottlieb-schematics#post-2634425
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/em-pinball-circuits-basics-to-not-so-basic/page/2#post-3184715

If the coil isn't receiving the signal to advance, you probably have an electrical problem. This is the most likely but harder to diagnose.
In that case, I'll need to see a high quality scan of the schematic from (for example) Staples ($2) or Kinkos ($6)

#9 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=213&picno=72930

I like the bulb tester, good trick! So, if I understand correctly I clip that to the lugs on the suspect coil and it should light when the coil is supposed to fire, right?

This is unfortunately one of the machines that IPDB doesn't have a manual for. Does anyone have a scan they'd be willing to share?

#10 4 years ago

JAY

I_P_D_B

Pinside member

10y 45,550 316

OP
Quoted from Vader77:
Backglass has some flaking but if I'm looking right, according to IPDB this is an early production blue one, right?

Coincidence that I just updated the Beat Time listing on IPDB to evidence two more "blue version" games to the discussion there, one of which I had a serial number that casts doubt on calling any of them Early Production which was my early supposition. One is in the USA, one in the Netherlands. What is your cabinet serial number and what country is your located, please? Curious to know if the backbox tag, the playfield certificate, and the lower cabinet stamping all show the same serial number as is normal. Are both your backglass and playfield the blue version, or just the backglass?

Still, they are uncommon in our travels, aren't they, amd a mystery why they are different. Please register your serial number on the IPSND.net and identify it there as the "blue version".

Here's a recently added picture showing the green and blue backglasses side-by-side:

I'll run out to the garage today where I think I have a Beat Time manual and I'll add it to the IPDB then come back here and tell you when that is done. I'll reply back here today either way, okay?

Jay

#11 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

I can't find a serial # stamped in the cabinet and the playfield sticker is pretty faded but seems to match the 91486 in the backbox.
My playfield is green.
I will register sn...
Fingers crossed on the manual, thanks!
❤IPDB!

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#12 4 years ago

JAY

I_P_D_B

Pinside member

10y 45,550 316

Ok, I have just added seven PDFs to the Beat Time listing. It's useful to know that the manufacturer's manila game envelope contained not just a multi-page manual but several loose sheets, letter size and legal size. It's good to know there are both manual and loose sheets for some games, as sometimes certain games (Bally 70s games come to mind) where only loose sheets are provided by the manufacturer and they may get labeled as a "manual" when no actual manual exists in the sense that we think of one. If we get used to such mislabeling, any of us might not realize that Williams 60s games can have both, to then look for both. I seek to avoid labeling loose sheets as a "manual" on the IPDB (although I'm sure we have many mislabels on this) and instead use the title found on the first page, like for Bally: Installation and General Game Operating Instructions. It might be a trivial distinction on the surface but once in a while these trivial distinctions pay off when searching for documentation.

On the IPSND.net, today it occurred to me to add to the Game Trait for instances where a game may have a blue backglass and a green playfield, and vice versa. Turns out that is what you have, a mixed blue and green game. Vader77, I think you and I are on a roll. So, when you add your 91486 to their list, be sure you select "blue backglass and green playfield". Oh, and what country your game resides.

#13 4 years ago

JAY

I_P_D_B

Pinside member

10y 45,550 316

duplicate

#14 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

That is great, thanks. And a good story/mystery brewing. I signed up at IPSND and tried to register but for some reason my email was filled in but name and a couple others were greyed out and I couldn't fill out or finish registering. I'll try again tomorrow

#15 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

On the repair side... I don't see a diode on that coil. Does this mean I'm safe to connect the lightbulb tester straight to both sides of the coil?

#16 4 years ago

edednedy

Pinside member

Vadar77, You're fine.

EM's don't need no stinking diodes.

#17 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

Thx, I was gunshy from previous expensive repairs stemming from me "repairing" something. Unfortunately, lightbulb test failed, no light. I think I might be out of my depth and need to call a pro...

#18 4 years ago

DNH

Knxwledge

Pinside member

Ramona, CA

5y 81,300 1,875 11 8

OP
Quoted from Vader77:
Thx, I was gunshy from previous expensive repairs stemming from me "repairing" something. Unfortunately, lightbulb test failed, no light. I think I might be out of my depth and need to call a pro...

"The Bootles" lol. Cool find, looks like a fun table. I'd personally say just send it and try to fix it yourself if you've got the time. I'm in a similar boat, I dove head first into EM with no prior EM or pinball experience and I'm just learning as I go. An unwise move by some but I'm enjoying my time spent in the garage. Very fun but slow process. I'm indebted to the people on Pinside for their help, really. Whatever you decide to do, best of luck.

#19 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

I might try but I fear I'll do more harm than good! Is there an em for serious dummies thread I should read?

#20 4 years ago

edednedy

Pinside member

http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index.htm

#21 4 years ago

DNH

Knxwledge

Pinside member

Ramona, CA

5y 81,300 1,875 11 8

OP
Quoted from Vader77:
I might try but I fear I'll do more harm than good! Is there an em for serious dummies thread I should read?

As already posted, pinrepair is a great resource. As long as you take detailed pictures when disassembling any parts, and don't cross any wires or short any wires/switch stacks together when soldering, you should be good honestly (anybody more experienced feel free to disagree). Common sense will keep you afloat. And once an EM is repaired it's very unlikely to stop working again (assuming it's not left sitting and unused for a long period of time).

#22 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

I guess I was really looking for a magic wand...
Been reading the pinrepair and the other recommended info. I am a little less intimidated, mixed feelings atm...
The recent IPDB updates did not include the schematics, anyone have that to share?

#23 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

I purchased original schematics, en route. What should I do about the busted 9 & 12?

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#24 4 years ago

edednedy

Pinside member

Steve Young at Pinball Resource sells literally 100's of different stand-up targets so there's a chance.

If not, you may just need to buy some blank yellow targets and make decals for the numbers.

#25 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

Thanks, they don't have the full 4 target piece but I read Vid's guide to replacing stand up target faces so, I think I'll go that route

#26 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

I've been doing some Mr Clean Naptha cleaning. Should I keep going or start living with what is there? I fear pulling off paint but I feel like I can go a little farther too... please advise

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1 week later

#27 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member

So, I read up, nutted up and did some more playfield cleaning (pictures to follow).

What about the backglass? Some flaking and some big bubbled up spots and a shot of spray paint. Just mask reels and then a light and then a couple of heavier coats of triple thick or is there something else..?

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#28 4 years ago

MRM

mrm_4

Pinside+ Frequent

6y 126K 6,204 11

Just in case you want to treat yourself. Steve made a sweet Beatles version.
http://bgresto.com/?p=140

#29 4 years ago

VAD

Vader77

Inactive member