(Topic ID: 167575)

Batman 66 by Stern new info


5 years ago

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  • 604 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Bamatami
  • Topic is favorited by 58 Pinsiders


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Topic index (key posts)

26 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #1 Flyer announcing Batman 66 Posted by GAP (5 years ago)

Post #4163 Photo of the Batman 66 playfield via Stern Posted by dmbjunky (5 years ago)

Post #4193 Photos of the SLE Cab Posted by cavalier88z24 (5 years ago)

Post #4194 Photo of LE Cab Posted by cavalier88z24 (5 years ago)

Post #4264 Clear photo of the entire SLE Posted by DCFAN (5 years ago)

Post #4449 Video from the Stern tour at Expo 2016 Posted by KingBW (5 years ago)

Post #4974 Batman 66 Product and Feature Matrix Posted by KLR2014 (5 years ago)

Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#486 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

I will admit I'm a Stern fan boy but I keep it real.

That's actually a completely contradictory statement.

Remove the word "boy" from your statement and it's fine. The term "fan boy" applies to someone who is such a fanatic of a company that, in their eyes, they can never do any wrong and they will constantly deny any possible shortcomings of the company, make excuses for them, and generally bash anyone who criticizes said company. I.e., they are completely blinded by their allegiance to the company and can't be remotely objective. They never "keep it real."

#995 5 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

The problem is your historical patterns start two years before the investors came in.
Things have changed.
LTG : )

Things may have changed, but as the saying goes, the proof is in the pudding.

No doubt that Hobbit's are rolling off the line at a pretty good clip these days, but couldn't the same have been said for WOZ prior to Hobbit?

All we have to go on is history. Based on JJP's history, guessing that JJP's pin #3 won't be shipped for 18 months from now is actually a bit optimistic, if anything.

Having said that, nobody would be more happy to be proven completely wrong than me. I love my Hobbit LE and am really looking forward to seeing Lawlor's pin.

#997 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

If that's true Rob, then that's F ed and they better sell a whole bunch more of TH's.
I'm guessing shipping by 1st quarter of 2017.

I hope you are right!

.........but I doubt it.

#1164 5 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

Honestly is there any other hobby where your toys retain at least 90% of their value and often go up in price, basically PAYING YOU to have them?
Make no mistake - this is a MAJOR reason the pin market is strong, and were it to change, sales would drop.

Funny you mention this. It is so true, and it is a very large part of the reason that my plan to sell off nearly my entire collection in order to finance another hobby (off road vehicle) is pretty much on hold. I can usually recoup 90% of what I pay for a pin, whereas the substantial money paid for the large number of modifications that are required in the off road hobby are the complete opposite: nearly a 90% loss.

We all bitch and complain of the high prices that we pay for pins (and rightfully so) but this hobby is actually one of the least expensive hobbies that I have ever been involved in in terms of retaining value/getting your money back.

#1195 5 years ago
Quoted from rotordave:

......................................Except Xmen is now a very good game.


#1236 5 years ago
Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

The gun hobby always has & always will trump pinball in terms of sustained value...Most guns in Ca. hold 90% or better resale and often double or triple quick (sometimes in months) due to our political bs roster system....Im about to spend B-title game money on a python that was about $250 when brand new

Good point. But you do have the non recoverable costs such as all the ammo, shooting range fees, gun cleaning supplies, etc.

#1277 5 years ago
Quoted from someoneelse:

...karma points for producing demand to bring even more deadly weapons into the world to make it a more peaceful place.
Sorry, I'm European.

Sorry you are.

1 week later
#2077 5 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I'm dying to know how Stern plans on enforcing the "You can't sell your game to anybody but us for 18 months" thing on the mega super LEs.
It's ridiculous...even considering the spiraling standards of this entire bizarre promotion.

I have not looked at the specific language being proposed by Stern (whatever it says it's ridiculous) but if it is phrased as you have stated above I don't think it is enforceable. You either own the property and can do with it as you please or you don't.

A Right of First Refusal can be an enforceable provision in a contract, but it does not mean that "you can't sell your game to anybody but us for 18 months." The way a Right of First Refusal normally works (and it usually applies to real estate transactions) is having someone who owns real estate that they want to sell to someone. However, someone else (STERN) has a right of first refusal to purchase the real estate. Before the owner can sell the real estate to the person who wants to buy it, they must first offer it to STERN under the same terms and conditions offered by the person trying to buy it. If STERN exercises the right of first refusal and follows through with the purchase, the other person who made the offer will have no right to acquire the real estate (pin).

It should be pretty obvious to anyone how you can get around this when it comes to a pinball machine. Hint: there is no requirement that an offer to buy a pin be in writing like there is in Real Estate.

#2079 5 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

To me the real risk of not honoring Stern's SLE request is quite simply you will never be in their "circle of trust" again. What is that worth to you.
Most SLE buyers I'm guessing would like to be involved in whatever comes down the pipe later.

How is Stern going to know if you sold your Super Duper Excellent Triple Ultimate LE to someone?

Are they going to require the owners to open their home to a Stern employee to confirm that they haven't sold their SDETULE?

#2197 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

I'm losing interest in Stern.
Anyone else?
I'm actually starting to dig into another hobby because of it.


#2415 5 years ago
Quoted from Pimp77:

I have no problem with the pricing.


Quoted from Pimp77:

Sadly, I think I'm priced out of their NIB offerings on principle alone..

#2435 5 years ago
Quoted from Pimp77:

Just because I'm personally priced out on principle (my principle) doesn't mean I have a problem with it. I'm out, but if enough are still in then it's the right move for Stern. So be it. I'll buy second-hand.

Just pointing out the obvious contradiction. I know what you were trying to say. But if you are "out based on principle" because of the price, you obviously *do* have a "problem with the pricing." What you are saying is that Stern can charge whatever they want, which is simply stating the obvious.

#2747 5 years ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

Who could ever forget the "animatronic band" in AC/DC or the "star field projector" in ST? Oh the dreams we had before the actual reveal.

It really is funny how completely different our imagination and expectations are compared to reality.

The star field projector on ST was hyped in a huge way. There was no way that it was ever going to come close to matching the hype. So when it's revealed, it is mocked as a Disco Ball etc. But looking back on it, if you take away the hype, it is actually a fairly cool little feature that fits the theme well. Is it some great new ground breaking tech the likes of which we have never seen before? Not even close...but those were the unrealistic expectations.

#2765 5 years ago
Quoted from Mr68:

I was just now told my deposit goes non-refundable immediately without seeing anything of the game. My distributor is a good guy and he said this was a directive from Stern. I told him I understand but I was insulted and I just dropped out.


You did the right thing.

#2976 5 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

The bar for "celebrity" is apparently incredibly low in pinball when it comes to special privileges afforded.

Ed is a fellow Pinsider who posts fairly regularly, and by what I can tell is a good dude, "celebrity" or not.

#3042 5 years ago
Quoted from MinusWorlds:

I'm loving that you can't let this go!

Why should he, or anyone else for that matter, just let this go?

It's freaking insanity and should be (perhaps repeatedly) called out as such (in my opinion).

#3051 5 years ago
Quoted from dzoomer:

The world is not black or white. You'd think the Houdini thread alone would have blown that mindset out of the water, but I guess not.

I agree that this is not a black and white situation.

Believe me, I now have very conflicting feelings about this whole thing. On the one hand it really pisses me off to see that JPop had the balls to try and sell yet another pin when he had already screwed more than a hundred people out of tens of thousands of dollars, and to see some people indicating that they would be willing to preorder a pin from this guy is just plain insanity. There is a big part of me that just doesn't want to see JPop involved in designing another pin, regardless of whether it is technically for a new company.

OTOH, my friends who have been screwed out of a lot of money by JPop probably have little chance of recovering all of their money. So if by some small chance (and don't get me wrong, I definitely think the chance is *very* small) this American Pinball can actually make the buyers who JPop screwed whole again (or even mostly so), then I am obviously all for that.

But the devil is in the details, and how this will actually work. AP saying that MG will be delivered to all of their rightful owners by the end of 2016 sounds....well.....too good to be true, which means that it probably is.

#3119 5 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

See Nissan GTR - its price increase has been steady and quite significant while mostly being the same car. They realized the intro price point was under priced.

This is true, but it is also the reason that you can get huge discounts from sticker price on a GT-R now compared to the first few years after it was released. I don't see that happening with the new Stern pricing structure, especially in light of the strict minimum selling price that Stern is putting on their distributors.

#3125 5 years ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

Stern is constantly playing with their pricing and release structures. If the current ones aren't working to their satisfaction you can bet they'll change things up.

It would just be nice to see them "change things up" by actually *lowering* prices for a change.

#3156 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

Stern definitely opened the door for a highly tolerable price increase from JJP

I have to disagree with the idea that Stern opened the door for a "highly tolerable price increase from JJP."

This implies that people wouldn't have a problem with a JJP price increase just because Stern is increasing their prices. I think it's getting to the point where a lot of us are pretty much sick and tired of these price increases, and if JJP just follows Stern and raises the price of JJP #3 by more than $500.00 compared to Hobbit, it ain't going to go over well.

#3167 5 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

But let's look at the available paths for the potential buyers...
- Cheaper, yet very comparable (proven) products have been available all along.. in the resale market. Yet, the 'gotta have the next Stern' crowd continue to line up to buy at the contested, soon to be unbearable NIB prices.
- Don't buy new games at all? Maybe..
- Buy the 'other' NIB games available on the market that may be lower priced or at least a greater percieved value per $$?
The market of 'I don't buy old games.. NIB is where it at' is the new money in the industry over the last decade and they've proven turning to just buying resale games isn't their outlet. So I think the tolerance for NIB prices is very much about what NIB alternatives you have.. vs not buying at all.

I really have no idea what your point is?

#3181 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Speaking as a buyer of pinballs, Hobbit is already at least $500 more than I'm willing to spend on a game. Any game, from any manufacturer. If they tack another $500 it won't change anything for me, but I wonder where other people's personal lines are. At some point it's just too much right?

Bingo! The funny thing is that THLE's price was actually $500.00 above my limit as well. I was weak and went ahead anyway (part of my weak ass justification was that at least I didn't have to wait 3 years for it like others did, so it was worth paying a little more). I really do enjoy the pin, and do feel like I was getting more for my money vs a Stern LE...but either way, since I already broke my price limit by $500.00 on that one, any additional price increase just makes it that much further away from what I'm willing to pay.

If Stern Premiums are going to be $7500.00 (street price) that is going to be a hard pill to swallow too. I am resigning myself to no more than one NIB purchase every year and half or so.

Quoted from Aurich:

hat makes perfect sense to me, I get where you're coming from. But for me the key word is "game". I buy pins to play them. And after a certain price point it's just too much money for a game. I can spend it on other things to have fun with instead. Like cheaper pins!


I think people like Odin and NimblePin have this figured out.

#3234 5 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

well... the new normal
Anyone who still clings to the idea there won't be a price increase after Stern goes LCD is mental.

Yep. I think we are looking at $7500.00 as the new normal on Premiums.

#3255 5 years ago
Quoted from docquest:

Yeah its not for everyone. This artist loves the outlines, he does it on most of his stuff. I like it.

Being a bit of a videophile, I can tell you that I *hate* those outlines. It reminds me of the DVD days when edge enhancement was so prevalent.


#3286 5 years ago
Quoted from TomGWI:

Me too. Especially when they want a deposit up front. Kinda tells me something.

You forgot the non-refundable part.

#3302 5 years ago

lol at Big Hurt being linked to this thread.

1 week later
#3625 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Man, this relentless drip is punishing, I'm already tired of the theme and I haven't even seen it. I can only imagine how Alien pre-order people have felt, like 20x worse. Dropping games as pure surprises is definitely the way to go.

Couldn't agree more.

#3725 5 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Shouldn't there be only 30 people in the world who care... if that's really what's happening?
It never ceases to amaze me how much energy people have to invest in *saving* other people... who may not even care.

#3812 5 years ago
Quoted from Air_Pinball:

All right.....all right....I admit it.
I'm Steve Ritchie.

I know Steve Ritchie. Steve Ritchie is a friend of mine. Kirk, you're no Steve Ritchie.

-Lloyd Bentsen

#4343 5 years ago

Funny how different opinions can be when it comes to art. Lots of love for this one, but it's definitely not for me. Tomdotcom's picture that he posted earlier sums it up nicely.

Messages Image(3836515410) (resized).png

#4366 5 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

No, we all blame JJP for current prices.

No, we used to. Now we blame Stern because they have leapfrogged JJP.

The question now is whether JJP #3 (Lawlor's) will leapfrog Stern.

Seems we have a battle for who can charge the most and get away with it.

#4471 5 years ago

I just saw the FB video of the BM66 SLE and it looks twenty times better than the static photos. I like it a lot!

Wouldn't even consider paying $15k for it, but it does look pretty damn sweet.

#4473 5 years ago
Quoted from goren1818:

Have you guys seen this survey posted to Stern's Facebook page? Thoughts? Wonka would be cool!

Easy. Yellow Submarine!!!

#4618 5 years ago
Quoted from rotordave:

I know some people have a love affair with shares, and fair enough, it's your money and you can do with it as you please. But lots of people said the same about these companies ...
Lehman Brothers
Merrill Lynch
Freddie Mac
Fannie Mae
Royal Bank of Scotland
Bradford & Bingley
Alliance & Leicester
And 1000s of other companies around the world that disappeared after 2008.
You can bet your life that Coke and Apple will cease to exist within our lifetimes. Maybe 10 years, maybe 50 years. Who knows. May as well go play the roulette wheel.
Anyway, back to Batman!!!

AIG is still around and they are one of our biggest clients.

#4658 5 years ago
Quoted from PinB:

11 minute video of Gomez showing Batman 66 @ Expo:
» YouTube video

This is how you do a presentation!

I could listen to Gomez speak longer than pretty much anyone else in pinball.

#4699 5 years ago
Quoted from PinB:

In this other video, George said that there are over 10 iterations of the Batman theme in the game (including the original theme).
He also said that, yes, the Batusi is in there as a feature as well.
» YouTube video

Thanks for posting that. Very cool.

One thing that I really agree with Gary on is when he said "I want you to think about this beautiful game without that backglass in it. That is pinball, and it is absolutely stunning artwork."

While I do love the big LCD in my Hobbit, I also really like the size of the LCD that Stern is using because it still gives you a very nice sized backglass (well, translite) vs the small narrow one you get with the JJP pins. It's a tradeoff obviously, but there are definitely pros and cons to each approach. The size of the LCD screen on Hobbit can be a bit overwhelming while playing, whereas the smaller LCD on the BM66 will be easier for the player to see.

The more I see (and hear!) of BM66, the more impressed I am, and the more I want one, even though it would be the premium version due to pricing.

#4706 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

BM66 theme kinda sucks nuts IMO


#4709 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

Dogh. I forgot to put "with all due respect" in front of my post
Answer me this tho Rob. If it's such a great theme why such a low run? Great themes & great games sell right? Stern likes money right? They're not in it for us.
Stern said from the get go they weren't making many of even the premiums.
Fake demand for a low demand game.
High prices to make it seem like an affluent artifact for only the most elite pinball collector.
High prices to offset the cost of a low number of units being sold.
I dont think the Kapow partnership is why its expensive either. I think whatever extra price was paid for their shit was washed out by the cash savings of rehashing a game & using pre-made animations from another project.
Either I'm paranoid or I'm the only fucker here with a brain lol

Hey, that was just a lazy post on my part, as I didn't specify what I thought you were wrong about. Obviously it's all personal opinion based on various factors including being, as you put it, "old AF"

But for me personally, hearing that Batman theme music, and seeing those characters on the LCD screen had a far larger impact on me from a pure nostalgia standpoint than pretty much any pinball theme released since I've been in the hobby. It immediately took me back to when I was a kid, and my younger brother and I would watch BM when we'd get home from school (they were already re-runs by then...so I'm not quite as old AF as you might think).

Yes, nostalgia can be a powerful thing, and despite my earlier criticism of the overly colorful artwork, I am more excited about this theme and this pin than anything else currently being released, including Alien (even though I think Alien is the better overall theme for a pin).

My reaction to this pin has changed a lot over the last few days. In other words, I too feel like I've been "bi-polar" on this title.

#4713 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

I was a young man my whole life. When did that change? Lol dont answer!
I hear ya Rob. I just think BM66 is some top secret CIA & Stern partnership. There's prolly an image on the LCD that "activates" a certain cell of buyers.
BM66 SLE owners are the got dayum Jason Bournes of pinside

Well I ain't no SLE buyer, I can tell you that!

#4718 5 years ago
Quoted from underlord:

Wake me when Jaws gets here. *yawn*

Hey Rick, Jaws *is* yawn!

#4723 5 years ago
Quoted from taz:

The BM66 theme can't really be explained to younger folk. It's pure nostalgia. I can hear the theme music and it'll stop me in my tracks. I love the campy villains and who doesn't like Catwoman and Batgirl? I didn't blink twice about buying the LE. The SLE now and all that drama, is a whole other affair.


Nostalgia as pure as any I've experienced in pinball yet.

#4725 5 years ago
Quoted from MK6PIN:

Completely agree!!! Went for Alien as a grail theme, but I have major nostalgia ties to BM66....suspect I will enjoy both of these for quite some time!!!

You in on both Mark?! You lucky SOB!

#4854 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

That's the price just for the decals!

#4873 5 years ago
Quoted from Mojosan:

The next release is Aerosmith and the pro pricing is supposed to be $200 over GB pro.

I would be surprised if that turns out to be accurate, but I hope that it is (obviously).

$200.00 more for Sterns first LCD pin would be more than we could hope for (and I'm afraid that it is).

#4875 5 years ago
Quoted from NeilMcRae:

» YouTube video

Doesn't look "blah" to me!

#4880 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I hadn't seen it even rotate, so thanks for the video. But I'd prefer to see gameplay.

Capt._Obvious (resized).jpg

#5002 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Wait, the B66 Premium is $1000 more than what I paid for my NIB Stark Trek Premium and doesn't even come with a shaker? These prices are ridiculous.
Does it come with lube or do you have to buy your own for that too?

How much more did you think Stern was going to charge once they implemented the LCD screen?

I figured it would be somewhere between $800-$1200, and it looks like they came in right in the middle.

And most Stern Premiums have not included a shaker.

#5038 5 years ago

#5047 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Wow, nope, definitely not. Why would you pay that much more for a part that's cheaper than a DMD?

You are smarter than this, so I'm not going to waste my time spelling it out for you since you are obviously being deliberately obtuse.

#5053 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I don't think I'm being deliberately obtuse, no. You're the one saying you'd expect to pay up to $1200 more just to switch to an LCD. That's ridiculous.
If anyone here thinks they have more experience developing content for a high rez LCD display on a pinball then I do I'll say "Hi JP, you're doing great work!"
I understand the costs to develop, I understand the costs to buy, and none of it justifies the kind of price increase you're talking about. If you think "it's new and shiny so they can just upcharage whatever they want" then okay, but I don't think that accounts for the realities of the market. More than $1000 price increase on a Pro? Not gonna fly.
Luckily what I'm hearing doesn't match your numbers, so we'll see how it all comes out in the wash on Aerosmith.

Sorry for the confusion, I was talking about the LE/Premium price point, not the pro.

And yes, part of it most certainly is the "new and shiny" and "new fangled" LCD screen that many people on this site have been *begging* Stern for for years, so obviously there is going to be increased desire/demand.

Your original post didn't say a single word about "developing content for a high rez LCD display" and you only referenced the actual cost of the LCD screen, which is precisely why I said you were being obtuse. But you already know that.

#5057 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I just want to use that experience to tell people "don't get fooled", meaning great, everyone is on LCD now, I think that's a good thing, but don't just open your wallet for it. Make them earn it.

Oh, don't get me wrong my friend, I don't intend to freely open my wallet for it, and despite how much I expected Stern to increase the price I am certainly not happy about it. In fact I'm pretty happy to see just how pissed off people finally seem to be getting about these ridiculous price increases.. I just read that thread about high pinball prices being bad for pinball, and it seems that perhaps we will have more people keeping their word about not buying at these ridiculous prices.

#5110 5 years ago
Quoted from Pimp77:

People are very rich...$5k is a drop in the bucket for some. Why not if you're that loaded I guess?

The vast majority of people who "are very rich" didn't get that way by dropping an extra $5k for for a whole lot of nothing in return.

#5134 5 years ago

Edit: not worth it

#5145 5 years ago
Quoted from fnosm:

Lots of people work hard all their life and die broke. All hard work guarantees is a tired and broken body.
The stories that are endlessly repeated are those of the few that end up at the top of the heap because no one wants to hear the stories of the billions that struggled all their lives and didn't finish first.

Life isn't fair.

I just came up with that one on my own.

#5186 5 years ago
Quoted from kvan99:

The kind of magic he was talking about was games that were made in the 80's-90's. Remember the first time you saw Rudy talking in FH? Or the Mist ball on BSD? Stern games are simply missing that magic..at least it's severely watered down. Maybe that's why we're less enthused about the price increases. IT NEEDS MORE MAGIC!

But now we have LCD's!!! Pure MAGIC!

#5197 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

The days of sub $5k games are over. When do you bail? Is $5500 too much?

I think a big part of the problem, or reason for these continuing non stop price increases is due to the fact that we all keep making excuses to ourselves: Well, if I was in at $5k and that was my limit, is it really worth not having a pin that I want for $500 more? So now your new limit is $500 more than it was.

Then the next new and shiny pin comes out and it's a theme that you love, but it's another $500 more than your last (increased) limit. Same excuse/logic applies: if I were in at $5500.00 does it really make sense to deprive myself of a pin that I really want over $500? So your limit has now been increased by $1k.

So yeah, where does it stop?

#5201 5 years ago

The thing is, I can buy these pins at the asking prices and still not be spending more than we earn. But that doesn't mean that I feel that the prices are worth it to me, or that I will be willing to pay it.

#5250 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

BM66 isnt even out yet & the game has run it course.
That's why this thread is now about pizza, politics, philosophy & Stern's 2017 lineup.

5,250 posts about a pin that hasn't even been release yet. That's called HYPE and you are still posting in the thread!

#5272 5 years ago
Quoted from PW79:

I'm not here out of excitement for the game. I'm here as a spectator for the impending shit show.
Stern, or clearly its just us pinballers, are good at hype followed by... well you know.

Well you can say that about any thread on Pinside about a newly revealed pin.

You might want to head over to one of the many Dialed In threads for an example.

#5280 5 years ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Just ordered the complete Batman 66 dvd set for $41.99 with shipping. Going to rewatch every episode and get my fix of Adam West / Robin / Cat Woman / Bat Girl / & Villians. Figure this just save me $15.5k so I plan to buy two or three A-list pins with my new found spoils. Turns out, I didn't need to buy every pinball machine with an appealing theme - gameplay trumps both theme and design team, every time.

Why are so many people in this thread acting like a premium version doesn't exist?

#5297 5 years ago
Quoted from rotordave:

Personally, a visit to Lucielles BBQ in your neighbourhood is my cup of tea!

Hey rd, I don't remember you having a cup of tea when we were there last time?

#5333 5 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

"the Bat Signal, which lights up to project the iconic winged Batman symbol onto nearby walls"
amazon.com link »

Wonder how much would be involved in hooking that light up to the pin. Shouldn't be too hard, similar to the Tron Lightcycles.

#5482 5 years ago
Quoted from labnip:

1 le << for sale
1 sle >> mine mine mine

That's bad ass!


#5541 5 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

I agree. I always found it odd when people would say that Stern should drop the Pros because they don't want a stripped game on the market. All you've done is removed that price tier completely. The Premium will not be offered at a Pro price.

Exactly. I've said this many times myself, it just doesn't make sense that people actually want *fewer* choices instead of more.

Apparently the assumption is that if one of the versions is cut, that will mean that one of the other versions will either be cheaper, or have more features on it.

Neither assumption has any merit. As far as I'm concerned, having more options (3 game tiers) is a good thing, not something to be criticized.

If an LE is too much for what you get, but you want all the PF features, get the premium. If the premium is too much money, get the pro. If the pro is missing too much compared to the premium, take a pass.

The entitlement mentality has been strong here lately.

#5543 5 years ago
Quoted from pauloz:

None of what you have said is any reason why I should justify to you how I spend MY money.


Can we stop with the bashing of those Pinsider's who have made the decision to buy a BM66 SLE (or LE even)? I mean seriously, just because the price might be too high for you doesn't justify telling another Pinsider that they are "dumb" for taking the plunge on a pin that they are obviously as excited as hell about buying.

Nothing like public shaming of fellow Pinsider's who are excited about buying a new pin just because it costs more than you (or even the majority of Pinsiders) think it is worth.

#5550 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

There's room in the market for 3 levels of machines per release, but the gameplay features should be the same.

And which version should they all be the same as?

The pro? The LE?

Which is the "correct" version?

There are pros that play better than the LE, and there are LE's that play better than the pro.

One advantage to having different game play features is that Stern is able to sell the pro for quite a bit less money than an LE. JJP basically has the model that you are talking about (all gameplay features are the same) but their "standard" version isn't as cheap as Stern's standard (pro) version.

#5553 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

And yes, JJP has it figured out. I mean, actually, Batman '66 basically does this as well. No difference in gameplay between versions. The starting price is just out of whack.

You actually just made my point for me.

Stern BM66 has no pro version, and the prices are too high for many people. Great argument for keeping Stern's current 3 tier structure.

And to say that "JJP has it figured out" seems to miss the boat, as their cheapest (standard) model doesn't come close to being as inexpensive as Stern pro models.

Quoted from jar155:

Whichever the game the designer designs. They get to make one design, their best design.

To be honest, the designers opinion of which is their best design isn't going to always be what you or I think their best design is. How many LE's are going to be the designers choice for their "best design" even though many of us think that the pro version plays better? (take a look at GOT for a recent example)

Give me the choice to decide for myself. Stern is doing it right.

#5559 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

This doesn't make your point.

It absolutely clearly makes my point.

Just because you refuse to see it does not mean that it doesn't.

#5573 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

The sole purpose of the LE or SLE purchase is to have something limited. They're making that less so at the expense of the consumer on the SLE. They're devaluing the product. It degrades my confidence in them going forward.

I'm pretty sure that anyone who bought a BM66 SLE would have had the chance to cancel when it was determined that there were going to be 80 of them. Not that big of a deal really.

It's not like Stern sold 30 BM66 SLE's to 30 people and a year later sold another 50 of them.

#5580 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

They still lied though.

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

#5601 5 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

Is it really that difficult for people to understand? Stern said that there would only be 30. They priced it and presented it as the very special reward for the customer. Once they realized that more profit was to be had, all that went out the window. Customer appreciation be damned, it's about money now. Furthermore, that $15k price was meant to reinforce rarity, which was diluted by more than half.
It's selfish and greedy.

#5629 5 years ago

This thread reminds me a lot of the original GOT thread. 90% of the posts in that thread were nothing more than repeatedly bashing the artwork.

Fast forward to BM66, and 90% of the posts are bashing the prices.

#5636 5 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

Ummm, no, this thread is nothing like the GOT thread.

Of course it is. Just because the source of the complaining is different doesn't mean it's nothing like the GOT thread.

90% of the posts are complaining about the same thing over and over again. You know....just like the GOT thread.

1 week later
#5715 5 years ago
Quoted from kermit24:

Lyman is outstanding, but he doesn't have a reputation for pumping out code quickly. Met and TWD both took some time before they were "complete". Lets hope the wait isn't that long....

Correct. AC/DC wasn't done quickly either. But it sure as hell was worth the wait!

#5723 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I know a guy that has two Super LEs coming and he doesn't beg or apply or kiss anybody's ass. He's just rich.

I wish you were talking about me!

#5801 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Without seeing even a second of gameplay? That's effing ridiculous. Man, we're just a dumb wallet now to these companies, open up.

I don't think that the majority of people who are in the market for this $15k pin really care all that much about seeing a game play video.

They are buying it as a collectors item, top of the line, 80 of a kind, with a theme that truly appeals to them. They know exactly what it looks like, and we know that the layout is based on BDK. Combine that with the fact that Lyman is doing code, I don't think seeing a game play video is going to make or break many sales on the SLE.

I'm going to get a Premium and definitely want to see game play videos first, but even then, I really doubt that it is going to have a huge impact on whether I proceed with an order.

#5872 5 years ago
Quoted from docquest:

It special because in addition to the premium and LE versions it also has: limited to 80 machines worldwide, special embossed metallic "Hyper-Chrome" side art, 4 translites, red cerise pinstripping, unique front panel with back lit bat emblems, upgraded speaker package, bat signal projector mounted to topper, extra toys on playfield, headphone jack and volume control on front of coindoor, and some type of personalized voice message/call from adam west.
I agree with you that for me this is overpriced for what you get. However it appears there are somewhere between 80 to 400 people who think its worth it to them and are really looking forward to getting it since they love the theme and want the version that has all of the bells and whistles. I think its cool to see people so excited about this theme and can't wait to see some unboxing footage for the lucky buyers.
Value is in the eye of the beholder. Most pin heads think a Ghostbusters, AC/DC, Metallica, or Tron at about 5K is a good value but 99.8% of the rest of the population would think you would be nuts to spend anywhere near that much on a box of blinking lights and switches.
I thought you said in your last podcast you were going to stay more positive?

#5894 5 years ago
Quoted from kermit24:

Jeff (jar155),
I think it's time to stop beating the dead horse with this. It's really getting old.

He's lost any ounce of credibility he (may have) had.

He titled one of his recent podcasts "Stuck Fern." Someone posted that he said in a recent podcast that he promised to be "more positive?" What a joke!

Beating a dead horse indeed.

Dead Horse.gif

#5927 5 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

I agree Taz. People shouldn't be bitching about Stern lying about the quantity of "Super Limited" games... They should be bitching about the sub-par playfields, or the incredulous pricing.

As if nobody is.

Dead Horse.gif

#6021 5 years ago
Quoted from J85M:

Ironman has an echo effect all over it's playfield, but it's one of Stern's best games!

You can say that again.

No, seriously.......YOU CAN SAY THAT AGAIN!

#6053 4 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Lyman on code is a great thing...but there is a physical game there to play, and as we've seen with GB - game that looks cool can end up being a physical nightmare.

What are the chances of this being a "physical nightmare" though? It's a BDK with a few tweaks, and I don't see those tweaks having much of an impact on how the pin is going to shoot.

And while GB definitely has it's issues, I think calling it a "physical nightmare" is a bit hyperbolic.

#6062 4 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

It's really not BDK aside from the crane. That's like saying Iron Man is just Austin Powers with a few tweaks.

No, it's not.

But you already know that.

#6093 4 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

He has a business relationship with Stern and gets obvious perks from Stern as a pinhead. There are motivations to not talk even remotely bad or share an opinion that may be percieved as negative. Sorry but that causes one to help hype; so hard to take Ed's singular opinion as 100%. Keep in mind that Stern just banned Martin from the factory for saying he thought BM66 was expensive...
Say something bad and they may ban you, remove perks, and not hire you for their next self promoting anniversary event paid for by customers. That is just the reality about Stern and hard to blame anyone for wanting those perks as a pinhead.

Obviously you didn't hear some of the things that he said at the Stern party.

#6171 4 years ago

Any chance our first video could be from Dead Flip/Jack Danger from the Stern factory like we saw with GOT and GB?

1 week later
#6347 4 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

and yet you keep buying...

Quoted from jar155:

I do? No, not me.


Yes you do. You bought the very last pin that they released, according to your own post!

Quoted from jar155:

Stern put out essentially one new game this year. We got Ghostbusters.

#6373 4 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

If you're spending $15,000 on something that is arbitrarily far more expensive than it should be, then I think that you have a right to complain about every bit of sloppiness.

Funny, I don't see the guys who actually spent the $15k on this pin that you make reference to complaining much at all.

#6380 4 years ago
Quoted from blimpey:

While we wait for video here are some photos of the SLE I took at Expo. I really liked embossed foil cabinet and head decals.

Looks amazing!!

#6386 4 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

Are any of them them saying anything at all? I'd be quiet about that decision too...

With people like you posting the types of things you do in this thread, many of which are nothing more than trying to shame people who bought the SLE, would you really expect many of them to post in this thread? So you can point out how foolish they are? And tell them how to spend their money?

#6408 4 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

Tell us more about how back in July Stern definitely fixed all the playfield issues. You certainly repeated that enough in other threads.
If Stern wants to change the narrative around this game, they need to get out there with new info, new pictures, and new video to stir up excitement. As it stands now, it still hasn't been played by anybody outside of a very small handful of people, the existing pictures are supposedly only of non-production prototypes, and we know very little about what the game is going to do in regards to code and integration with features. If these things are supposed to be shipping real soon, there's no reason why they can't share a few things to control the message around the product a bit more.
And it's not just a Batman '66 thing. Stern does a pretty bad job at controlling the narrative around their products, especially around game launches. Ghostbusters was launched amid tons of rumors of "something must be wrong" or "Stern is hiding something with this one." They go silent for such long stretches that it shows that they either have a lack of confidence in their product or they lack a basic awareness of how product launching and marketing works. Based on George's enthusiasm, I assume it's the latter, because Jody is a dolt.

I love how you resort to personal attacks on specific people at Stern. Well done.

You know a lot of us here are really pretty tired of your crap, right?

Seriously, why are you continuing to post ad nauseam in this thread? You have 88 posts (edit...90 posts) in a thread discussing a pin that you have zero interesting in purchasing with nothing but non-stop bashing.

It is beyond ridiculous, and has got to the point of childish trolling. Sad, especially considering how you said in a recent podcast that you were going to start being "more positive."

#6409 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

It's a f—ing forum, we're here to talk about shit. Everyone who's all worried about the "noise" or whatever is the one that needs to get over it. When there's a video or something there will be like 4 new threads in an hour, chill out.
I swear the whining about the whining is almost the worst, only thing more stupid is this post, that's whining about the whining about the whining.

Not when you have a single person virtually taking over the entire thread with his incessant bashing, repeating the same thing over and over and over and over again. 90 posts by someone who has zero interest in ever buying the pin that is the subject of the thread. Do people have a right to give their opinions even if they aren't a buyer? Of course! I am the first one to defend that. But 90 posts? Ridiculous.

But I guess we shouldn't be surprised that you would defend that kind of behavior given what you did with the artwork in the GOT thread.

#6412 4 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Any chance our first video could be from Dead Flip/Jack Danger from the Stern factory like we saw with GOT and GB?

Quoted from jar155:

I expected that, but Jack's lack of an announcement of it coming makes me think that owners get first crack at this. That's kind of cool in a different way, I guess. Pay that much and maybe your first impression should be your own.
That said...I WANT VIDEO!!!

#6420 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

So use the ignore button you big baby.


I prefer to call out the trolls, but thanks for the suggestion!

#6476 4 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

Thanks. Ramp flap doesn't cover catwoman anymore. I can finally sleep at night!!

That's impossible! Everyone knows that Stern sucks and doesn't listen to feedback!

Quoted from zucot:

No catwoman flap overlap? Games on the line? The factory isn't closed for 3 weeks?
What are people here going to pull out of their ass and complain about now?

I'm sure we will find out shortly!

#6557 4 years ago

I wish the video quality was better, but I like what I see except:

Quoted from DCFAN:

It looks interesting. The middle of the playfield seems a little dark in the video. Some spotlights could be added if that is an issue.

Yep. They probably should have put spotlights on the slingshot plastics.

#6579 4 years ago
Quoted from kvan99:

Lol..oh man, that music..oof. Sorry folks the game play is not there yet. Now seriously how many of you are going to cancel?

I'm more convinced that I will be buying a premium, not less.

#6695 4 years ago


#6754 4 years ago

That's freaking cool!

#6779 4 years ago
Quoted from xfassa:

Some Joker action. » YouTube video

Nice. Not floaty at all compared to that first video that was posted yesterday.

#6924 4 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

You pinheads need to make up your mind jar155 called me Kaneda the other day

Actually I think he called you Jody.

#6969 4 years ago
Quoted from kpg:

Interesting thing to note with the BM66 release... seems all (or mostly) everyone posting their machines are home customers. When GB released, their last major release, seemed operators were the first people showing off their machines.
Could it mean that most BM66's were purchased by home collectors vs ops this time due to the price raises?


Similarly, you will see more ops buying Aerosmith pins vs BM66 as well.

Remember, there is no lower priced (pro) version of BM66. That alone will keep a lot of ops from buying it.

#6975 4 years ago
Quoted from taz:

I understand why they don't get it, because I grew up watching the television show and it's one of the best of it's era in my estimation, so I'm hooked for nostalgia purposes. I love the theme a lot and appreciate the music, videos, and cheesiness of the show.


Same boat here.

1 week later
#7093 4 years ago

Thanks for doing this.

What do you have the pitch set at? Game looks fast, especially compared to other videos I've seen.

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