Boston, MA
Yup.
(Topic ID: 167575)
Linked Games
Batman (The Dark Knight)
Stern, 2008-
Batman 66 (LE)
Stern, 2016
-
Batman 66 (Premium)
Stern, 2016
-
Batman 66 (Super LE)
Stern, 2016
-
Star Trek: The Mirror Universe
Pinball-Mods.com, 2014
Topic Gallery
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Quoted from Air_Pinball:His avatar is a dog. The quote is from a television production company's tag line we've all watched growing up after many shows.
Learn.
I got it.
I know you're a Stern lover Kirk and that's okay. I like their products too. The issue is they have really dropped the ball lately, to epic proportions. We as consumers should hold manufacturers to a standard. When we follow companies blindly and don't question when quality has become an issue we become sheep. We deserve more from Stern. Period.
Quoted from Air_Pinball:They dropped the ball on the ghosting issue.
The did NOT drop the ball on their pricing and model decisions on Batman '66. It is simply a case of over-privileged Pinsiders bitching about a pin they finally can't afford. Oh, the horror!
First world problems.
I never said anything about Batman '66.
It's way more than the ghosting issue. It's a PF issue. An overall quality issue. A lack of QC issue. A communication issue. Prices went up, quality went down. There's no debating that.
Yeah we're very lucky individuals that we can complain about multi-thousand dollar toys. I'm very thankful for that. I know the vast majority here work damn hard and have for years to be able to afford these. It has nothing whatsoever to do with privelage. It's about getting a quality product. That is not happening right now. End of discussion.
Quoted from Air_Pinball:This whole thread is about Batman '66.
The post that I was originally replying to was not yours. You jumped in. So you can't say "I wasn't talking about Batman '66".
Yeah actually I can. Because I wasn't talking about Batman '66. You said you weren't losing interest in Stern (laughable by the way) and I responded to that. A lot of people are. Another fact that I'm sure you'll debate.
Go back and think of the next username you want to switch to. You are wearing this one out fast too.
Quoted from iceman44:Some of you guys are living in total denial and will have to eat a mile of sh*t when it gets released. Just sayin
Where have I heard this before?? ***cough*JPOP*cough***
Quoted from Air_Pinball:I don't care what you were talking about. You replied to my post, so you should stick with the subject.
You wore out your welcome a long time ago.
Your post was in regards to Stern, not Batman '66. Jeebus keep up with your own argument.
Quoted from Rarehero:Let's be honest - the people that post here that buy NIB games: They CAN afford it. But they also can make the choice not to buy something when it hits the "This is Fucking Stupid" zone. At some point a toy is a toy and just not worth it. Asking a ton for a game without pics is arrogant, and people who can afford it are responding with "not interested" on principal.
Boom!
Quoted from Air_Pinball:Where's that ignore button.....oh there it is.
Bye!
Bye, Felicia!
Quoted from 82Trooper:So...help me understand.....how hard (do we anticipate) will it be for an interested party to buy a game...once they are released? Not one of the LE or alleged SLE games...but the lower level, "Premium" model? Forget the price discussion for now...simply inquiring about availability.
I onoy bought one other NIB...Avengers Pro. I price shopped, located on from the Gameroom Guys on E-bay....ent them some money, and got my game.
Will a search for a BM66 be very different?
The Premium? No I don't think so. And I don't expect even the LE to be all that hard to get either on the secondary market. Maybe I'll be wrong. Maybe not.
To Greg's point, yeah I actually could grab an LE right now. It's been offered to me. I have the cash to do it. I like the theme. I'm not doing it. I have my reasons.
And to Doug's point, price point aside, it would take a dream theme, major innovation and dream team for me to spend $9500 on an unproven pin. I concede we all have our pricing thresholds but we are getting into ludicrous territory. At least I am.
Quoted from Mojosan:If you're implying that Stern is coming up with a "Ron Hubbard style personality test" I think you're a little fevered.
Actually watch/auto companies make sure that long time enthusiasts and collectors of their brand get the true special editions. Exactly what Stern is doing.
But Rolex, Panerai, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Aston Martin, Ford, (and all of their top collectors/enthusiasts) are idiots. You're the marketing genius....
You forgot Koenigsegg. Probably the baddest hypercar manufacturer on the planet
Quoted from iceman44:
I'm so glad the preachers on here have determined what price is acceptable for EVERYBODY!!
What a F Ing joke!!!
Hate away
Did you even read my post?
Quoted from iceman44:Not talking about you. Just in general and Rare of course
Is the price "ludicrous"? Sure it is. To what degree of stupidity. I'm not sure
When I bought my first pin, a Lotr LE I thought I lost my mind then when I paid $5200!
Can I justify it today? Yes, because I want it and don't care if I lost a couple of grand later selling it.
If I had to sell it for $7500 with all the bells and whistles, how far has Tron Le and everything else dropped? It's all relative
At least this time I know I'm getting a pin in a couple of months. Yes, Jpop was beyond stupid, but I've been fortunate otherwise
It's a hobby and I'm having a blast!!!
Me too.
I thought you sold your LOTRLE? If not, I'm glad you kept it. GB Premium is my first NIB, well should be, unless the deal goes through for a Bally I'm working on 
Really hoping it does
Quoted from iceman44:I did sell my LotrLE a few months ago, trying to make room for the new stuff! I'd think about getting it back when they do the VE with LCD and great sound
I'd stick with that GB premium, its really good
GB Premium is coming either way. Just a matter of which gets here first. I've alread spent way too much in mods and custom work not to go through with it. No way I'm not losing money on my GB. Don't care, bought it to play.
Yeah put me in the Mary Ann camp too. For me it was the will she, or won't she, do (content edited by staff). You couldn't tell with Mary Ann. With Ginger it was a given. I like the intrigue.
Quoted from erak:So the art is exact copies of the model kits. Maybe cleaned up a bit. or colors corrected.
Not to rain on your parade but that's Photoshop.
It's still awesome. But it's still photoshop.
Yeah I didn't want to say anything. I'm glad the people interested are happy. Personally I expected brand new hand drawn art.
Quoted from docquest:Why does everyone keep crapping on Photoshop?
Don't they realize its just a tool to manipulate existing artwork which could be hand drawn or photographic?
Do people realize that the Ghotbusters art on the pinball machine was probably composited and edited using photoshop (or equivalent digital editing software).
Photoshop is a tool and like any tool it can be used with amazing results or horrible results depending on the skills of the user.
$10k-$15k
Oh here we go. Tell me with a straight face that those of you who are in on BM66 that you didn't expect brand new assets for this? Seriously, go ahead.
Be honest with yourselves.
Not jealous either. Like I said I was offered one for a very fair price. I passed. But for you guys who are in I was hoping for a better jump out of the gate for you. That's all.
Quoted from RDReynolds:So the artwork looks great, but people on here are upset that it was previously used on a model kit or whatever that .00000000000000000000001% of planet earth would even know existed.
Just want to make sure I am following along.
The issue isn't the artwork per se. It's people are paying $10-$15k for these and are getting previously used assets. At least part of the art is apparently. For that kind of money I would expect original work.
Do we know for sure the art is for the games and not just promotional material?
Quoted from RDReynolds:What if it was original, yet inferior, art?
Even worse. For that price range I expect original, exceptional work.
GB has a lot of manufacturing issues. The artwork? Original and amazing. And before anyone says it...yes I realize the cost difference in the artists.
Quoted from vid1900:Since most of the actors are dead, and the rest are 70+ years old, all we have are used assets.
Unless someone discovers a previously unknown, 50 year old picture of one of the actors, dressed in character, in an interesting pose.....you are looking at the best of the best.
So I guess that begs the question...how did Zombie Yeti get the ghosts to stand still so he could do the artwork on GB?
Quoted from iceman44:It's how art is done today, including how Yeti drew GB, MG, RAZA and everything else he does.
You don't "reinvent" Batman characters, take the best rendering out there and turn it into shit.
Chris Franchi is good enough for me as far as Batman goes.
Dude I like you but that's just flat out incorrect. He may have used photoshop during the process but the assets themselves were original.
If you're happy that is all that matters.
Quoted from vid1900:He put a lemon in each of their mouths so all their faces would be frozen and puckered.
Is there anything you don't know?
Quoted from iceman44:Sure, the assets are original yeti. So are these assets from the "original" artist hired by Stern to integrate into the game. You don't get to just paste these in like clip art.
It's based on Batman 66 series, see pics above, they are awesome! I'm not sure what more you can ask for.
You got real dollars at stake. As long as you're happy it doesn't matter what I think. I hope it's all you want and more. Someday a dream theme pin will come up for me and I know it will be criticized. All good.
Quoted from iceman44:I appreciate that, not everybody is going to love everything.
My last two pins are a TWDLE and GBLE which are fantastic for me. The BM66LE is going way above and beyond those two, I'll take it and be very happy with it from what i know so far.
Agreed. I prob would have been in on GBLE if it weren't for all the green. Just not my color. So instead I'm dropping stupid money into a premium to make it my own. Including some one off stuff that should blow people's minds. Others will laugh. To each their own.
The fact that you have pages of back and forth on whether it's a photoshop or original is quite telling. The point is if someone is paying $10k-$15k for BM66 we shouldn't be arguing whether or not this is original artwork.
You should look at it and say "Dayyyyuuuummm I ain't never seen that befo in ma life, dat shit is tiiiiight yo!!!"
Not
"Yeah I saw that before on a model kit on Amazon for $31.99"
And yes that's the actual price.
Quoted from flynnibus:You mean like paying 2-3 grand more than the going price of a new pinball machine to buy a pinball machine that was made 20 years ago?
Maybe some people see value in things besides 'unique'... like value in things they just consider GOOD.
I'm not even sure what you are saying but I think it's something to the point of "it's not broke, don't fix it" ? Maybe...
Sure that artwork is good. Not what I would expect from a five figure machine but let's leave it at that for now. I hope they will have some mind-blowing toys then not some reworked already been done crap. Oh wait...that's right. Nevermind that point too.
Good is a relative term, but typically includes the quality of build. In that sense Stern hasn't built a "good" product all year. No argument there. They have major issues.
You see where I'm going here?
Everyone enjoy your $10k-$15k BDKVE.
<mic drop>
Quoted from flynnibus:People paid a premium for MMR not because it was unique... but because they thought it was a good product.
You on the other hand are already discounting a product purely because you think they should have been more unique... instead of deciding if the actual product is any good or not. And by that logic, people shouldn't have been paying top dollar for MMR... considering it's just a copy of existing stuff.
You have this predisposition that because it's expensive, it needs to be more one off, unique, different. How about you actually see the game and the sum of its parts before you think you are gonna drop the mic.
It's already been dropped, sorry. I can't just go back and pick it up now. I'll look silly.
Quoted from iceman44:Whatch you talkin bout Minus! They have built a GREAT product in GB. The PF issues are way overblown and being handled as they say "on a case by case basis"
Getting ready to pull the tarp off, grab a beer and flip me some awesome GBLE.
I hate you.
I factor in build quality when I talk about whether I believe a product is good. I disagree it's blown out of proportion. I think it is a major short-term issue (as do many others) and the potential long-term issues are scary.
The first ghosted insert or cracked clear on a BM66 better result in someone's head exploding.
I know I've been pretty aggressive toward Stern lately but I'm a consumer. I believe in being critical in any product I'm spending money on. Let's just say this isn't their year. Even tho they had the audacity to let everyone know August has been their busiest month ever or whatever. Between the quality control, pricing, Hilton's Stern Army BS, lack of communication, KISS code, Facebook Nazism, etc. they've lost a lot of customers.
But Gary keeps giving us the finger...I hate him for making GB. It kills me giving him money. It's like every time I buy a Kanye song. I just want to hurt myself after. I disgust me sometimes. I need to go take a shower with a Brillo pad now excuse me.
Quoted from vid1900:You don't think that all the bad things that happen to you are karma for buying Kayne songs?
I can't help it Vid. He sounds so great with that autotune...
It's amazing, so amazing, it's amazing, I'm amazing, I'm amazing, I'm amazing...
Quoted from Banker:Wow all of the complaints, and how many sterns do you own?
Me? I own one. TRON. And a GB Premium on order. I've owned STLE and METLE as well. STLE was fantastic but didn't get played much and had some issues. METLE I never got into and the clear cracked. It was a pain in the ass getting that taken care of BTW. Never fixed, I think they sent me a promotional item or some BS after like 2 months.
Like I said, as a consumer I have every right to question a product. As much as Stern might not like it. How many of those products I currently own is irrelevant. I have enough experience with pins to know when there is an issue.
I've owned a bunch of Bally/Williams pins too. Out of all the pins I've had you want to guess which was the most trouble free? TRON. I love my TRON machine and besides normal shopping it's been completely maintenance free. So I know that Stern is capable of making a quality product. That's not where they are at right now. Turn a blind eye all you want.
Also most of the people here know me well enough by now to know I'm like 30% serious with my posts and criticism. Maybe 40% if its about BM66.
Quoted from iceman44:Well well, that really disappoints me, you actually buy Kanye's crap! The wardrobe, shoes, everything.
It's good to be critical, no problem, but my last two Stern pins TWDLE and GBLE are kick ass. I hate that others have some PF issues but my GB is excellent quality.
I have a Woz sitting on the other side of the room that looks great, oozes quality and I still like it but its running a bit behind the other two in fun factor.
Quit screwing around and get that GB pin you want!
And F Kanye that POS.
Just his music and admittedly did watch his wife's porn tape 
And I did order a GB Premium, I'm weak Doug, I'm weak!
Quoted from iceman44:You are only weak because of Kanye! Please tell me you don't watch the Kardashians. The GB premium was a great move, you will love it, might have a code update by the time you get yours too.
Jeebus no! I can't stand any of them. I watched the vid years ago. Now I wish it was a knife stabbing her and not Ray J.
Quoted from pinmister:Bad business practice
Well that's one thing Stern has mastered as of late. Playfields? Not so much...
Oh and good morning everyone 
Quoted from Pinstein:I predict that on Oct. 14th it will be Batman 66 top.
Sorry but JJP and Pat are going to steal the show.
You are right tho, Batman and Alien will be fighting for 2nd place.
Quoted from kpg:Those aren't THAT great deals man.. let's be honest.
What is an awesome deal, but not many will have the chance - is to be one of the lucky and fortunate few to be to spend only $15,000 for a one of a kind, once of a lifetime machine.. a Batman 66 SLE machine! Now that would be a deal if you were approved and accepted to buy it from Stern.
I'm loving that you can't let this go!
People are calling it a cash grab because it is a cash grab. No ifs, ands, or buts. Period.
It's a damn BDK retheme. With photoshopped "artwork". And it's 2.5x to 4x what BDK cost originally and a LOT of the work is done. And you have to apply for the right to buy it!
Stern is taughting this 30 anni and they give the pinheads this? They could have went 100% original build but they didn't. Ask yourself why. And if you have to, go rub one out before answering. I really don't get the reason why people have such a boner for this game.
They should have went all out but instead give us a slap in the face.
Quoted from flynnibus:See Nissan GTR - its price increase has been steady and quite significant while mostly being the same car. They realized the intro price point was under priced.
Prices are increased when a company realizes they missed the mark. But customers are very sensitive to price increases, so typically you use tricks to get the same effect without people seeing a 1 to 1 price increase. Introduce a new model at a higher price point and slowly or coyly remove that prior model. Etc
When the company seems the market is EAGER to overpay for your product or a competitors product.. you will evaluate your own price points.
They aren't going to look just at the corner cases, but this kind of comparative analysis and evaluation of price strategies happens all the time.
Please don't compare the GT-R to a Stern pinball ever again.
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:Wow, I wish I was able to see the complete machine like you did.
Last time I checked, we are still a have a market economy. Companies are free to charge what they want. Call it a cash grab if you like. If they sell well, they may repeat the sales model, if they don't sell well - they learned what the market will bear.
I've seen more than enough to make that assumption.
Same left side of the playfield, same crane toy, photoshopped artwork. What else do I need to see to be disappointed with a $16k BDKVE, BDK66, BDK 2.0???
Quoted from flynnibus:Certainly not every pricing strategy choice is successful or well received But these 'rules' people keep coming up in these threads about market dynamics and pricing are so wrong and generally are trying to replay outcomes verse seeing the actual pieces that matter. Pinball is not an oddball at all.
You mean like comparing a car that has gone up in features and price vs. a pinball that has gone up in price and down in features?
Quoted from BoJo:Don't forget about cell phones
Of course!
Quoted from jar155:Cars have gone WAY up in regards to reliability and build quality too. Stern's newest games have dropped off in build quality noticeably.
Fine point sir!
Quoted from flynnibus:Please check in again when you keep up with the actual discussion vs getting distracted by blinky lights. Nothing about this was comparing Stern products to GTR - but about marketing, pricing and business. Something that apparently a large part of Pinside doesn't grasp at all.
Just another nonsensical argument on your long list of them. You make valid points here and there but jeebus man. I simply stated how your argument was incorrect. There was a reason for the GT-R going up in price. What's the reason for Stern, other than cash grab of course.
There's a reason I waited for the 2012 GT-R before I bought it, and it wasn't because the price went up. You want to take a guess why?
Quoted from flynnibus:Features that really didn't increase the price of the car to Nissan.. but instead were simply things that improve the car to the customer? The engine tweaks and refinements and restyling are things every car goes through. You waited for the mid-cycle refresh. Good on you.. that's smart. That didn't really make the price point jump valid because of increased costs... it was Nissan continuing to capitalize on the VALUE RELATIVE TO THE MARKET.
I see what you're saying but I disagree to an extent. The changes did increase the cost to Nissan. R&D isn't free. My point was/is quality and performance were going up while the price increased. Was is it complete correlation? Prob not. Stern quality and features have gone down while prices increased. That's all I'm saying. Now is a great time for some sexy GT-R action.
Quoted from iceman44:I just went to lunch today at my favorite spot Willies and they raised the price on my Chili dogs with cheese by a buck
Cash grabbing m fers
Now THAT'S some BS!
Quoted from Manimal:Artwork teasers on Stern's FB page. Let me be the first to throw up just a little. They are failing on all levels on this one........
Isn't that Locke from Lost?
That's a teaser?? Consider me 100% flaccid...
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