I was there probably the same time you were for the Python Angelo charity event and tournament. The pizza from his giant wood burning brick oven was the highlight for me.

He had Loch Ness monster and I played it as well. I think his pinside handle was something like pinsane or pinsanity. Really cool guy to open his house up to so many strangers. His house was pretty incredible too.

That would be Steve Tsubota. His handle was Pinsane but looks like thst account has been deleted or gone inactive so not sure what goes but I know he has a Krull pinball as I know the guy he bought it from years ago!

Weren't some of the pins donated to the museum? But John benefited from the sale in the end? So were they donated to John? No clue regarding the agreement, and not making any judgement, just curious.

Based on the 990s, that appears to be the case.

John is scheduled to speak at Expo, maybe he will say or someone can ask him.

Steve hosted several Orange County Pinball League events, and Krull was one of the games we got to play there. I enjoyed the game, including the larger-than-it-looks through the playfield surface lens lower playfield. My friend Basil in CO had one, too, don't know if he still does or not.

Here's the score sheet from the month we used it when the scores were archived, just for a baseline reference. AFIAK, there are no other statistics anywhere online for Krull scores; this is probably it's only tournament usage ever! Unfortunately for them, Jim Belsito missed that month and Karl DeAngelo was assigned to other games that day, but Johnny Modica and I both got to play it. Don't know if Karl played a casual game on it that day or not. I'm sure that with practice we could all do better, but if you don't own one, you're not getting practice on it! We were all winging it.

February 3rd, 2013 Tournament Scoresheet
Krull

Player Rank Division Score Place Game Place Points Awarded
Round 1 Pam Kay 79 B 325,730 2nd 14th 9
Mona Shah 47 B 316,350 3rd 15th 7
Gene Lewin 8 A 832,340 1st 4th 10
Matt Topper 6 A 287,860 4th 16th 4

Round 2 Kevin Glass 81 B 266,830 3rd 20th 6
Megan Waters 39 B 210,720 4th 23rd 4
Bill Ung 29 B 355,870 1st 12th 10
Richard Donaldson 16 B 336,430 2nd 13th 8

Round 3
Molly Atkinson 80 B 1,200,970 1st 2nd 10
MJ Kusel 59 B 176,750 4th 24th 4
Kenny Hardy 42 B 270,910 3rd 19th 6
Tim Moyers 14 B 671,840 2nd 5th 8

Round 4
Breanne Fletcher 52 B 283,430 3rd 17th 6
Angi Burkard 22 B 594,430 1st 6th 11
Mike Levitt 17 B 243,110 4th 21st 4
Ron Burkard 9 A 383,890 2nd 11th 8

Round 5
Kasey Kang 49 B 213,030 4th 22nd 4
Bob Matthews 44 B 1,571,520 1st 1st 11
Mimi Buck 19 B 276,130 3rd 18th 6
Bob Tucker 10 A 415,950 2nd 9th 8

Round 6
Chris Enright 4 A 415,590 4th 10th 4
Chris Lammi 3 A 1,037,450 1st 3rd 10
Johnny Modica 2 A 421,790 3rd 8th 6
Ron Rezendes 1 A 563,170 2nd 7th 8

Average score for the tournament: 486,337

I always love reading these posts about super rare pins, their history, and where they may be now. Thanks guys!

Oh boy that's gonna be a shitshow

If I understand this, the MOP was a standalone charity and the assets there were the building etc and that was accounted for by the charity. His machines were on loan and he has to declare income on everything that was sold. If anything the higher prices for the sales means that he has more to pay taxes on for his personal income. I am not his tax guy and if he is going to speak publicly someone can ask him - and probably will - these questions.

By the way - none of this stuff about his personal finances is anybody's business but his - just saying.

Who else will be there? Robert Mueller or J.Pop ??????

Sorry, I must have been thinking of Loch Ness monster, which was also there.

https://pinside.com/pinball/machine/loch-ness-monster

Well, along with Krull that makes 3 rare ones that I never saw -- at all. The way I tried to cover all the aisles there (even taking note of games that were turned OFF / Out of Service), that is really disappointing.

This question has been raised a number of times in this thread, and the consensus from local people that actually know the museum seems to be that no pins were donate to the museum (or to John), but that the museum was instead a display of his personal collection which he purchased and owned outright. Like you I don't know anything about this situation beyond what I've read in this thread, but I would think that if John were auctioning off games that were donated to him or to the museum, we'd have heard from some unhappy donors by now.

To me "business is business" and other peoples business is something I really don't need to know about. How much money someone makes on what they do - why they do what they do - etc. really isn't anyone else's business.

With that said I fully understand why some people are thinking selling off this collection is a "shady deal" if machines were donated. But in my eyes that is something between the people who donated machines & John and really has no place being talked about here. As posted above - if John was selling off donated machines I am sure something would have been said by now from people who donated machines.

In any event to me it is more sad to see a collection that could be played by the public broken up than it is about all the other BS. This is why everyone should try to support VFW PHoF and other venues that share their machines with the public. It is only with everyone's support these places will survive & thrive. Banning is gone, PAPA (Pinburgh) is gone so both coast have lost two HUGE collections this past year or so. Before that it was the National Pinball Museum in Washington DC a few years ago and likely others I don't know about. VERY SAD to see this happen!

I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop. Instead of CNN and NY Times reporting about the massive pinball/arcade auction, they will be reporting about the shocked and disappointed buyers who overpaid and received routed or non working games. Cut to footage of kids pouty faces looking at their family's non functioning item.

I know it has been stated over and over that you should expect routed condition in a pinball museum but I doubt most think that way. I have visited vintage car, motorcycle, sports car and Nascar museums all over the east coast, and as expected the cars/bikes are all in pristine 'museum' condition so it is easy to see how rookies could misunderstand. With a museum auction with high prices, I wonder if some buyers will claim fraud.

I doubt it. The news has too short an attention span to care about something that has passed.

LTG : )

You guessed it.

Frank Stallone.

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When attending a Public Auction things are always sold "AS-IS" where they sit. I have attended auctions for years and I remember one "great line" one of our local auctioneers would use. "It worked fine last time they used it" - this was basically saying "it is a broken heap of shit" because he didn't say "it works". He said "it worked last time they used it" and everything works until it breaks - then once it is broken "they no longer use it since it is broken". The guy was a character for sure!

I doubt buyers would have any recourse for "buyers remorse".

"Local Man Regrets Overbidding at Auction" doesn't have the ring of "World's Largest Pinball Collection Hits the Auction Block."

Hahaha yes...I don't believe there will be any follow up press on this.

I also suspect auction part 2 doesn't attract as much attention, although strangely enough the CNN story seems to have a new life. I've been sent messages / linked to the FB story on it about 5 times this past week.

I thought it was: 'It was working until it broke'.

Talked to a bunch of SoCal pinballers at Pinball At The Lab over the weekend. Many had hoped to bid but figured they'd be priced out, and we were right. Nobody I spoke to said they'd bought any of the games; so much for the early-on "the locals will clean up" theory; I'd bet most of the games are heading far out of town. We're barely less pessimistic about weekend #2. I'd like to get some of Saturday's games, and may be there in person, but I'm expecting to come home empty handed again. Going to mingle more than to bid.

What's the favorite for highest-priced game still remaining?

I think the general consensus was in favor of the POTC from JJP (?) If there were two of them, then the topline model of it.

I hardly ever ventured into the arcade section -- if that was where they were -- but I never checked out those apparently upright (hybrid ?) pinball games, like Varkon, of which there were a few. So I don't really know how they worked. One hybrid game I basically liked was Hyperball . . . but it was seldom working. I think I got to play it at some early MOP event, but it just wasn't happening after that.

I am wondering what the story is with Lot #1224. Are they talking about that whole wall as a single unit, take it or leave it, or might it get broken down into separate items ?

Magic Girl or JJP Pirates with the three discs.

LTG : )

What can you do with Magic Girl, unless you are able and willing to write (some entire ?) new code for it ?
Then again, given what we have witnessed so far, I don't think we can rule out some of these tables being purchased strictly as large, expensive objets d'art -- no pinball playing interest or intent required, just a gigantic wallet ! Brancusi sculpture, anyone ?

I predict the magic girl will be a flop.

I think the word is out on this by now. Who wants that heap of shit?

Maybe it’s time for a poll on this thread predicting the highest sold game at Banning. Got some heavy hitters like POTC CE, BBB, Magic Girl, GNR CE, etc coming up

What can you do with a Red Line Fever white wood ? A Zingy Bingy without the backbox. A Williams BBB white wood ?

Not everything has to be playable or complete to attract $$$$

Now since the general public got into this auction, they may not know what is scarce or common. Time will tell.

LTG : )

After further review, I'd guess BBB goes #1, GNR CE #2. Can Pinside software do a football-style poll where you rank your top 5 and they get 5-4-3-2-1 points, then we see what games get the most points overall?

I say

#1 BBB
#2 POTC CE
#3 GNR CE
#4 Magic Girl
#5 TAF LE (already sold $22k?)

Lloyd. That's a JJP CE. The pirate's prototype is long gone. It left 3 years ago. Went to a few shows. Then back to New Jersey.

It'll also be interesting to see what the remaining whitewoods go for - - Avengers (the earlier Stern version) and POTC (Stern). Any guesses?

There is only one pin I was considering bidding on in this auction and it’s coming up this weekend. But I’m guessing it’s going to be out of my price range. I have played it several times at the museum and it is rare, unique, and fun. Nico Volta probably will outbid me. Pop pop pop.

PTC ?

LTG : )

The Real question is....

Does Bugs Bunney go for more than Rocky?????

Whoever these buyers are, I would not be surprised.

Might as well. Just like a printing press for money. Interesting to see what happens.

How about Tron LE? It’s supposed to be worth $21k on the “normal” open market. It should go for 40k or more in this auction.

#1 BBB
#2 POTC CE
#3 GNR CE
#4 Magic Girl
#5 TRON LE
#6 TAF LE (already sold $22k?)

All the whales have had plenty of time to scope the lots in this auction and know what’s coming up. Hard to say if prices will dip on some of the less desirable games but it is possible. I expect the desirable games will still get top dollar. These are targeted for some buyers and not likely they blew their wad on something else.

I have seen numerous people who think the auction is over. I wonder if they don't heavily promote the second weekend if that will keep bids a bit lower.

If LAH goes for 6500 dollar then a BBB must be worth like, 80K or something?

That's the same wishful thinking that kept us all watching the shit show for the first weekend. I don't think we'll see any difference this time around. I'll be glad when it's over.

It will be interesting to see how this week fares.

My single game that I purchased during round one is almost at my door.

which one?

LAH is a better player

I'll upload a pic when it is in its new home.

So, what's the report from Gamelab ? Wasn't that the first sizable tourney in this area since the pandemic shutdown ?

Event was good, nice to see a lot of the regulars again, especially the ones who came from out of town - - the Lefkoffs, Raymond <winner!>, Dave S., Louise, Sal, Cayle & Jasmijn, Sanjay, Sunshine, Ben C., Leslie R., etc. (I'm sure I've omitted some). Games were in good shape as always, good settings, decent mix, things ran pretty smoothly with Jim as TD and Karl's software. The main negative was the lighting - - too dark! I couldn't see to get the timing precise on my shots on games in the main room, lost on those (average 0.7 points). Did better in the less-dark back room (average 2.0 points). Some of my opponents wore headlamps, which clearly helped them over the course of the event. If I had to choose between GameLab or another SoCal location event on the same day, I'd go with the other one due to the lighting. Yes, I could use a headlamp next time, but it's still inferior to decent lighting. I'd rather not go back to GameLab unless that changes. I'd rather practice elsewhere, too, for the same reason.

The food court next door proved very convenient. Parking was no problem (adjacent and free on weekends). The schedule could be improved - - the timing of the meal breaks is bad. Instead of going 10:30 (practice) and 11 (live start) to 9 pm (planned hard stop) with a meal break at 4 (what happened to Lunch?), go from 9 (practice), 9:30 (live start) to 1:30 lunch break, take the hour then, finish by 7:30 in time for dinner. That way all 3 meals can be at more or less normal times. I always hated the stupid Pinburgh schedule for the same reason. What, pinball people can't get up in the morning or something?

Speaking of hours, their tiebreaker plans backfired on them. At 9 p.m. when round 14 ended, they considered stopping there as planned and setting up the A and B playoffs ... but there was a several-way tie for the spots in B division. Since they had to at least run a tiebreaker, they decided why not run another whole round, it wouldn't take that much longer. But when they did so, the result was an even larger_ tiebreaker needed: 7 people for the last spot in B. That meant playing both a 3-player and a 4-player game on a machine to break the tie, lasting even longer than a normal round game would. I'd already left, but I think it was around 10:30 by the time it was over.

We had a lot of no-shows, the waitlist people who came all got in. A few games played too long and dragged out the finals. Had a few weird malfunctions, too, but hey, those make good stories and don't seriously impact the event. Yes, I would recommend the event to people, just bring and use a headlamp.

Thanks a lot of that report, Bob. (I'll have to make a note about a headlamp, as optional gear to bring along in future. The lighting is an issue I've noticed at certain other past venues, not limited to Calif.) Is Lake Alice still used for any events, or is this to be the complete replacement ?

A friend of my dad's who has a couple games but isn't a very big collector, doesn't really know how to work on his own stuff, told me he bought the Barb Wire from the Museum auction. He's gonna hire me to work on it for him, he says it's working aside from a sluggish flipper and sling but I bet it needs a shop job. He also said he wanted to put a few color LEDs in it.