(Topic ID: 66878)

Bally Vector: Why No Love?


By smileymatthew

6 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 109 posts
  • 52 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by xTheBlackKnightx
  • Topic is favorited by 9 Pinsiders

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There are 109 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 3.
#51 4 years ago

Agreed... it is a flawed (but pretty) game and thus needs to be dialed in carefully or else it won't be any fun. I'm also going to swap the top flipper for a 2" per the original designer's intent.

Did adjusting the EOS switches also cure the problem of smacking the glass? I just got a Vector and am starting to tune everything up. Get about 10-15 loud THWACKS every game going up that short middle ramp... way too much!

#52 4 years ago

Yes, adjusting the EOS switches made a huge difference to this issue.

Once I had cleaned the flipper mechs and rebuilt with new parts, the lower left, upper left and upper right were all far too powerful. The lower left flipper in particular smashed balls against the hype targets, giving uncontrollable bounces with no time to react. It also caused air balls on the right ramp. Now I have tuned it, the whole game is so much more playable as you can, with control, pick off the hype targets in order and safely shoot it up to the upper playfield too. It has given the left flipper real meaning. This lower left flipper improvement transformed the game.

You adjust the EOS so that it switches from the power coil to the holding coil earlier in the movement of the solenoid to slow the flipper down. It is crude, but effective. Marco sells a leaf spring adjustment tool that makes this really easy

I also tuned the lower right flipper too to give sensible vector scan speeds (780 is my highest now), as this shot smacks into the posts at the mouth of the ramp when you miss. Most vectors are damaged here, mine isn't yet, and I want to minimise the risks.

some fool had actually put a more powerful coil in the upper right flipper mech !!! It was stupidly powerful with the big flipper and broke a drop target and a bulb behind it too. I needed to buy a new coil and rather than buying the stock coil, I bought a slightly weaker one.

If you were to keep the original factory coil in the top right, I think that you will be ok providing you stick with the smaller flipper and adjust the eos

Having got my game so playable, I am actually considering putting the bigger flipper back in the mini playfield. It is frustrating to get the ball up there on the right ramp to then lose it down the middle ramp so quickly. I think the designers had so change of heart here. The game is designed to look right with the smaller flipper. But I think it might play better with the larger one (with weaker coil). With the small flipper the ball can often drain down the middle ramp without you being able to even reach it with the small one.

The upper playfield is very badly designed. This might sound crazy, but I am also wondering about putting a one way gate on the entrance to the mini playfield from the left ramp as it is mad that there are three ways of draining out of this tiny playfield. And it is quite difficult to get the ball up there in the first place. Just drilling two holes in the metal ramp just above the popper and making a wire gate would do the job. And to return to stock, it would just leave two small holes that no one would really notice

#53 4 years ago

I was thinking the same thing... is the small left ramp to the mini-playfield even necessary? The left-side 2" flipper can rarely scoot it up there, and the main left flipper always smacks it hard against the glass. Instead of a gate, I was thinking about redesigning the area entirely with black trim to match the rest of the playfield and using a ball drain hole as an escape. Certainly much more work involved with doing that, but it would be an elegant solution.

#54 4 years ago
Quoted from Aeolus7:

Just picked up a very nice Vector. Super unique, interesting game. I really like it. I have big plans for it once I have some time: flipper rebuild and shop job, among other things. It's fantastic otherwise. The drop targets look brand new.
Does anyone have LEDs & Alltek lamp boards in their Vector? I'm considering putting in the retro LEDs, color matching inserts, and playing around with some backglass colors. I would be interested in any examples...

Did you grab the Vector that Big Toys was selling at MPE? That thing was awesome and the price was right. I played the first couple games on it when he brought it up. Kind of regret not picking it up myself.

#55 4 years ago
Quoted from dfsays:

Did you grab the Vector that Big Toys was selling at MPE? That thing was awesome and the price was right. I played the first couple games on it when he brought it up. Kind of regret not picking it up myself.

That was Steves game (HemiOrange09), if it was Big Toys it would have been twice the price.

#56 4 years ago

I didn't think $1200 was too insane, considering the condition it was in.

#57 4 years ago

At MGC, I finally got a long enough barrel lock for the backbox. Just need to construct a latch for it. A bit of a challenge, since the turning mech isn't square, but a circle. The latches it came with had dimples. Hmm..

#58 4 years ago

Because there is no LCD in it man. I want a Vector.

#59 4 years ago

You see folk saying that Vector is hard, they do not get multi-balls, games over too quickly etc. To give folk a flavour of what a difference tuning this game makes ........

I am an above average player, but nothing special. On my Vector I used to struggle to make a million. But having tuned it as I described above I now regularly score over 2 million, and 3 million is a good weekly score for me on a 5 ball game. All I have done is set this game up right, I have not changed anything from stock other than use super bands flipper rubbers and reduced flipper powers to sensible levels to reduce air balls and risk of damage to plastics and the game.

I always get a multiball on this game, usually a few multi balls. I have had bonuses of many hundreds of thousands

Some folk say vector is a one shot game - the timed ramp. This is complete rubbish, they do not understand the game. To get a big score you need

1. Nudging skills to save the ball in the outlane saucers
2. Accuracy to shoot the hype target in order h-y-p-e. I would say this is the most important target bank in the game. These can be picked off with the lower left and lower right flippers. Also with the upper left - but that is a very risky Hail Mary type shot. I do not even shoot the timed ramp until I have shot hype in order. This gives you a special 2x then 3x bonus on the timed ramp that lasts for the duration that ball. This is how you get big points. But if you shoot in the wrong order, you must reset it by hitting all 4 targets to relight them. Then shoot in the correct order to build this massive bonus. This disciplines you to play this game properly - get control of the ball, shoot accurately, not just thrash about
3. Accuracy on the right ramp to get the ball into the mini playfield, then upper playfield nudging skills to keep it there to knock down x-y-z to build the end of ball bonus multiplier. It does not really matter whether you knock these down in order. You need the 3" flipper that most games were supplied with for this, and a properly set end of stroke switch to limit coil power. Otherwise you have no chance and will break the drop targets with the absurdly powerful flipper and solenoid most games have now
4. Accuracy to pick of the defenders, in order, with the main two flippers and the upper left flipper. Shooting them in order means you gave to shoot three down and not all six
5. To hit the timed ramp with the main right flipper

The combination of vector scan multiplier and bonus multiplier gives this game a "bases are loaded" feel and when you set it up like this, you rack up huge points. But that is the whole story here, you just build your foundation before going into timed ramp shots.

#60 4 years ago

Just played this for the first time at the Ohio show. Actually kinda like this game, it was one of the better players with some decent ball times. Go Vector!

#61 4 years ago

Bally Vector is soon to go up in value, mark my words.....

#62 4 years ago

There is a Vector local to me. The thing is seriously beautiful. Looks like it just came out of the box. I was actually at the sellers place looking at another machine and he showed me Vector. This is really the first time I've played this machine. At first glance it looks cool. I love the retro sci-fi theme and the early 80s robotic voice. I played a couple rounds and it didn't grab me. It seemed like there was a lot of wasted space on the playfield and the few shots it has weren't that interesting - and this is coming from a guy who likes the 80's era machines.

I'm all for paying a bit more for something so beautiful and in good shape, but I walked away from this machine. I don't think I'd ever play it. Whatever it is with pinball gameplay that grabs people, this machine just didn't have it for me.

That said, if I found one for $400 or less I'd probably buy it just so I can look at it.

#63 4 years ago
Quoted from seven:

That said, if I found one for $400 or less I'd probably buy it just so I can look at it.

Hell, if I found one for less than $1000 I'd buy it.

Great shooter's game.

#64 4 years ago
Quoted from Stu:

Bally Vector is soon to go up in value, mark my words.....

Hmm, I better do more work mine, so I can trade it for a different game. Hell, I'd trade it for a similar condition Firepower II.

#65 4 years ago

Don't trade it...Keep it...Trust Me!

Quoted from s1500:

Hell, I'd trade it for a similar condition Firepower II.

#66 4 years ago

One of the forgotten aspects of this game is how similar it is to TRON. The "I AM A P.A.C..." voice might as well be the MCP, and the "game grid" on the backglass has players scooting around on light cycle wheels. Also, you must knock down the drop target guards to enter the i/o tower... yes? Do you also see this geekery?

I think it would be pretty cool to re-theme this one as TRON (as long as it didn't involve destroying an original in decent shape...).

#67 4 years ago

Vector is an amzing pinball machine, hoping to add one to my collection some day.

#68 4 years ago
Quoted from Stu:

Bally Vector is soon to go up in value, mark my words.....

Hopefully not before I find one

Everyone, please continue to post critical comments about how bad Vector is and convince people to stay away from it.

#69 4 years ago
Quoted from Stu:

Don't trade it...Keep it...Trust Me!

It's a nice looking, nostalgic game, but I'm not feeling it with the playfield & gameplay. Lookin' for moreso fun than collectability. Heck, if you were closer, I would have sold you mine.

#70 4 years ago

I will be selling one at TPF 2016 w/clear coated PF and fully renewed mechs/boards/etc.

1 month later
#71 4 years ago

New CPR Bally Vector Conversion Kit:
http://www.classicplayfields.com/hammer.html

#72 4 years ago

here is a video of vector at our local meet last week.very tight tilt

1 month later
#73 4 years ago

I've had Vector for a while now and it's in beautiful shape. It's been great reading all this and watching the video to see how it plays for other people, it'll help me fine tune mine. I didn't know if I loved it or hated it but I do have a better appreciation for it now, it is hard to master for sure. A strong right flipper is a must to make the left ramp and lock a ball, and my best speed that I can remember is about 800 but it wasn't from a trapped ball on the flipper, it was "on the fly".

I'm going to try different flipper rubber too, because when I trap a ball and let the flipper down to make my shot, the ball bounces down the flipper making it damn near impossible to shoot accurately. I have new yellow rubber on them now, thinking of trying the black or red... It doesn't seem to be a flipper alignment problem that I can tell. Not sure what else to try there.

#74 4 years ago
Quoted from CanadianGamer:

I'm going to try different flipper rubber too, because when I trap a ball and let the flipper down to make my shot, the ball bounces down the flipper making it damn near impossible to shoot accurately. I have new yellow rubber on them now, thinking of trying the black or red... It doesn't seem to be a flipper alignment problem that I can tell. Not sure what else to try there.

Is the ball bouncing from the transition between the ball guide to the flipper?

#75 4 years ago

My latest Vector issue: Resetting the rearmost drop-target bank pops out a ball into the shooter lane. Heh.

#76 4 years ago
Quoted from s1500:

My latest Vector issue: Resetting the rearmost drop-target bank pops out a ball into the shooter lane. Heh.

I am having this exact same problem as of a few days ago.

#77 4 years ago

Go into SWITCH TEST and make sure each switch is registering the correct # on the display.

#78 4 years ago

I wouldn't mind owning one. I think it would fit nicely in my Classic Bally collection.

Rob Bell
Robsgameroom.com

image.jpg

#79 4 years ago

holy crap mr bellman! Nice collection!

#80 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Is the ball bouncing from the transition between the ball guide to the flipper?

Yes, sort of, when I let go of a trapped ball on the flipper, and I can't see any way of adjusting the guide. Is it ok to bend that wire a little? Seems hard to do, but tried a little and thought I might ruin it if I tried harder. The ball travels fine when going straight across from guide to flipper though with the flipper down.

I did put some red flipper rubber on that wasn't new but was in good shape and it seems to have helped quite a bit. It's still not perfect but much better.

And I have to agree, NICE collection MrBellman!

#81 4 years ago

Be super careful bending the wire guides if the playfield has been clearcoated.

Duckbill pliers are a good tool for precision bending.

#82 4 years ago

Thanks guys. It's been fun hunting these classic games down , restoring and playing them. Sadly every time I get a new one something else has to go do to space. I try and find sitters, but have to sell most of the time.

#83 4 years ago

Just played it for the first time in cax tournament. Never seen one before.

Seemed like a pretty cool game with a nice ruleset and advanced strategy for its time.

I was able to get 1.7m after 3 tries.

#84 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Go into SWITCH TEST and make sure each switch is registering the correct # on the display.

I did the switch test. It says 01. The manual says:
01 = #2 Left of outhole
#1 Right of outhole

This switch to the right of the outhole seems to be the problem.
switch.JPG

While trying to adjust the switch, my leaf switch tool touched the metal arm/bracket on the playfield, and that fixed it temporarily.

As soon as I take the leaf switch tool off that bracket, the 01 code comes back.

Does this mean the switch is not grounded? Is the diode bad?

#85 4 years ago

Did you take the balls out?

#86 4 years ago

That is with the balls in. With the balls out it gives the 03 code which is outhole.

#87 4 years ago

The test usually shows the last button pressed.

So when all the balls are out, the start button is registering outhole when pressed?

#88 4 years ago

Ahhh, ok.
I took the balls out, and the test reads 0. So it tests fine. When the start button is pressed it registers 06, which is its corresponding switch

#89 4 years ago

I don't know what is is about this pin but back in the late'80's I used to buy pinballs in lots of 5 from a local distributor near me. I'd pick up about 15 a month (I was a teenager back then-not a lot of money) and in EVERY lot there'd be a Vector. Technically I've owned maybe 30 or so of this title. You could not GIVE them away, but I always managed to either part them out of sell them to college guys for their dorms. I hated that pin!

#90 4 years ago

For switchie tests, I always reset the drop target banks, otherwise they get annnoying.

#91 4 years ago

Yes, I was clueless, but now I understand!

#92 4 years ago
Quoted from MrBellMan:

I wouldn't mind owning one. I think it would fit nicely in my Classic Bally collection.
Rob Bell
Robsgameroom.com
image.jpg

Nice lineup!

I'm building my own. I'll be at three soon.

4 weeks later
#93 4 years ago

I have immense love for this console.

I grew up with a Vector machine in my house and played it to death. I have immense love and enormous respect for this machine. Even after all this time, I can't get one specific line out of my head from this machine.

Does anyone else know when this plays on the machine (because I do. If you can figure it out I'll.... um... I'll give you a cookie).

"Ow! Bell! Bit! Bang! Zap! Ow! Bell! Bit! Bang! Zap! Ow... Bell... *vwwaaaahhaa vwahha vwhaaa vvwha!* Hit the showers!"

2 weeks later
#94 4 years ago

So my Vector is still occasionally, and randomly, spitting a ball into the shooter lane upon completion of any of the sets of drop targets.
The switch test still shows everything is in order.
On multiplayer games it does Not occur 100% of the time.
I'm not sure what this means. Maybe the game rom is slowly failing?

On a side note, pinsider DRD on the last post of page 1 of this thread provides some good thoughts on Vector. This game is challenging in a similar way to Flash Gordon. It's a total ass-kicker, and when it is set up nicely, it is a joy to play!

#95 4 years ago
Quoted from iron00monkey:

So my Vector is still occasionally, and randomly, spitting a ball into the shooter lane upon completion of any of the sets of drop targets.
The switch test still shows everything is in order.

That's happened on mine too. But only on rare occasions.

#96 4 years ago

Often when there are the wrong coils popping, its the male AND female connects on J4 of the MPU

#97 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Often when there are the wrong coils popping, its the male AND female connects on J4 of the MPU

A friend of mine wants to re-pin some things on Vector with all the fun supplies he got recently. Hmmm..

#98 4 years ago

There's one for $700 around here but I'm already one pin over my limit.

#99 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

There's one for $700 around here but I'm already one pin over my limit.

I told ya man, cash up some of those DMDs (for the space!) and go grab it!!

rd

#100 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

There's one for $700 around here but I'm already one pin over my limit.

I'd grab any Vector for 7 bills.

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