(Topic ID: 248216)

Bally old chicago - score relay stuck energized when hitting target

By Danisa

4 years ago



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10pt-relay (resized).png
Old Chicago 10 point relay (resized).jpg
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#1 4 years ago

Hello,
this is my first post
I have an issue with a Bally Old Chicago that I am restoring. This is my first endeavour.
The Pinball does proceed with the reset OK. My issue is with the 10-point relay that gets stuck on when hitting any of the 10-pt targets.
When doing so, the relay stays ON and I hear a buzzing sound. The score wheel does not register the point.
This happens on any of the 4 players.
I don't have this issue with the 100pt or 1000pt targets.

I have ruled out any PF switch being stuck since the resets completes OK.
I am kind of ruling out the score reels switches since it happens on all 4 players reels. Also the 10 pt reel does goes back to 0 during reset if I manually change it. But then again, I think the 2 reset relays are used for this and not the points relays.

There may have been an issue with the 10 pt relay before. I don't know. The thing I noticed when doing the check-up is that one of the wire going to the 10 pt relay was disconnected. Maybe the previous owner disconnected it. I did solder it back fine.

My research has taken me to verify the EOS switch but I am not figuring out where to look for that. All I find is related to the EOS for the flippers.

I know that something is keeping the relay energized so the score wheel can register the points and energize the chime and all. Then when the sequence is complete it is suppose to de-energize the relay.
So my questions are what is keeping the relay energized? Why is the relay not activating the 10-pt score wheel? Where is that EOS switch I should be checking?
Is the 10-90 unit from the back box involved in this?

Thanks for your help.

#2 4 years ago

If the 1st Player score reel solenoid doesn't activate when the 10 Point relay is activated, Inspect and diagnose this circuit with Alligator clip jumper wires
http://www.planetimming.com/Pinball/troubleshooting/EM%20Troubleshooting.pdf
http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index3.htm#features

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#3 4 years ago
Quoted from Danisa:

My issue is with the 10-point relay that gets stuck on when hitting any of the 10-pt targets.
When doing so, the relay stays ON and I hear a buzzing sound.

Quoted from Danisa:

My research has taken me to verify the EOS switch but I am not figuring out where to look for that.

Good sleuthing. The EOS switch on this Score Reel hangs down from the frame:
Old Chicago 10 point relay (resized).jpgOld Chicago 10 point relay (resized).jpg
Once triggered, the 10 point relay should stay on until any one of the four 10 point Score Reel EOS switches opens. It seems unlikely that all four would fail to open though. You could try to put a folded piece of paper between the contacts on the 10 point relay switch in the schematic above that connects the white-green (54) wire to the white-blue (52) wire. If the problem goes away at least we know that that is the part of the circuit that is holding the relay in. If it changes nothing we need to look elsewhere.

/Mark

#4 4 years ago

Thank you HowardR and MarkG.

Since I don't have alligator clips, I have tried what I could easily do. I do have a multimeter though.
I tried the paper test on the relay suggested by MarkG.
As seen on the picture, I put a paper between the contacts of the first switch on the left. When I do this, the relay does not become stuck when I hit a 10-pt target. That is a good thing I guess. However it does not activate the score wheel.
I did check the EOS switch on all 10 point wheels to see if they were not stuck. They open when I manually advance the score. Did a minor filing of the contacts with 400grit sandpaper. They seem OK.

So now I am guessing that the part that is not working is what is suppose to make the score wheel turn and open that EOS switch to notify the relay to let go.

On the 10-pt relay there are 6 switches (2 in front and 4 in the back) that I am assuming will cause an action. So one of those actions is not working.
I also noticed that one of the chimes is disconnected. There are 3 chimes (metal plates) in the front of the bottom cabinet of the pinball near the right side. One of those metal chimes bar has been removed and the plunger/knocker has been disconnected. My thinking was that was done to reduce the noise the pinball was causing when scoring points. Would that be an issue?

Thanks,

10pt-relay (resized).png10pt-relay (resized).png
#5 4 years ago

Hi Danisa
in post-1 You write "... the score wheel does not register the point ..." - question: Does the plunger on the score wheel moves, at least moves a bit ? If Your answer is "NO, no movement": You must investigate in the path (JPG) that HowardR shows in his post-2. Greetings Rolf

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