(Topic ID: 210644)

Bally Minizag AAB

By beadwindow

3 years ago

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  • 21 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by gilles89
  • Topic is favorited by 6 Pinsiders


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#1 3 years ago

just picked this machine up and while the flyer says there's an aab and replay model, i think it's a kit that is added to achieve the aab function. i know it's not true aab but does anyone have one of these kits and also is it something that can be replicated fairly easily using parts?

#2 3 years ago

Hi beadwindow
thanks for bringing up "Minizag AAB". So by now we know about TWO Bally pins with an "available on request AAB-Extraball-Relay kit". Many years we only knew that Williams had this "on request kit" - here http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=989 read "Notes ... The schematic diagram makes dotted line reference ...". A picture of the ultra-rare Williams relay: http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=989&picno=53310 . The "Shangri La" http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=2110 also has the text "... kit ..." --- a while ago we had an topic here in pinside - and the result of the topic / discussion is: http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/2110/Williams_1967_Shangri_La_Wiring_Diagram_for_Homemade_Extra_Ball_Relay_Assembly.pdf

"Bally Kit" - astyy started this https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bally-rocket-iii-apron-credit-lamp-wiring#post-3912650 - then from post-4 on the discussion focused on "... Kit ...". See post-7 "paperwork" - aahgo showed in post-11 the relay - well, the whole topic is interesting - post-35 shows the DIY AAB-Relay.

"Minizag AAB" - in the ipdb-schematics I also see "dotted lines for the kit to be plugged in" --- so chances are "You can make Yourself such an AAB Relay".
beadwindow - You said in post-1: "I know it's not true AAB" ---Yes, we simply get an Extraball instead of an replay (thats all) - so the question is "Do You really want to make such an relay" ? Greetings Rolf

#3 3 years ago

thanks for the links and all that info. i've wondered about the nature of aab kits for a long time-ever since my first bally. always seemed that it was an obscure item and little info available.

#4 3 years ago

Hi beadwindow
see here http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=438&picno=23470&zoom=1 --- the Capt. Fantastic has an "Shoot again" function - an Extraball can be made (playing an Replay-Game). Here http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=438&picno=3985 we are informed "can be set to Add-A-Ball-MODE" --- we can clue "... kit ..." is mounted in every Capt. Fantastic leaving the factory.

The "... kit ..." the operators only had to buy when the pin did NOT have an "Extraball-feature on Replay-Mode". Greetings Rolf

#5 3 years ago

Hi beadwindow, my AAB journey started as I thought the Credit Lamp in the apron was not working and ended in my wiring a DIY "Added Ball Kit". My Rocket III is now switchable between Replay and "Shoot Again" (- which is what it says on the backglass). Yours will be very similar but I don't see a a lamp in the apron.

I have since found information in the 1969 Parts catalog that this conversion kit approach started with Rocket III
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The chronological games list then highlights clearly those earlier than Rocket III had an AAB model * and later that were convertible using AAB Kit **. (All machines until Cosmos apart from The Wiggler for some reason)
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I worked out the wiring for the Relay from the Schematic, I'm happy to help with this if needed.

#6 3 years ago

Taking the above research further (being a Saturday!), I cross referenced the later Bally Parts Catalogs, in 1976 the games are still listed but with no reference to being AAB Convertible, as such this list from the earlier 1973 catalog could be the definitive list of 13 Convertible games. Thereafter only one true AAB listed 1969 King Rex.

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#7 3 years ago

thanks for the offer to help and i'll take you up on that a bit later. i'm currently getting the bugs worked out of a wms suspense and then on to the minizag. i'm thinking for machines without the lamp in the apron that it would be ideal to install a "correct" apron and wire in a light.

#8 3 years ago

Your apron is likely correct for the game, the schematic only shows a Shoot Again light on the Insert. I guess you can see the translucent text on the backglass, on my game it had flaked off which was another piece of the puzzle.

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#9 3 years ago

the game's on the way and it'll be interesting to see if there is a shoot again light or not. i found a supposedly complete set of paperwork for this game so it may provide additional info.

1 week later
#10 3 years ago

shipper just dropped off the Minizag and the cabinet is rough with paint flaking everywhere but I’ve restored cabs before and this one has easy stenciling. the cab and head interiors are very clean which is a nice change compared to the Suspense i just got thru with. the backglass looks decent but when lit there are cracks everywhere so I put the call in to bgresto. The playfield is in very good shape with some light planking in a couple areas and the plastics are very nice minus a partial crack in one that I’m pretty sure happened during shipping. frustrating because I told the dude to remove the ball. anyway, here’s a few pics of the aab adjustments and the backglass “shoot again lite”, and a score card that was just stuck in there.
the aab conversion kit is listed as k-313-6 in my paperwork. speaking of paperwork I have the game adjustments, “effective adjustments on moveable flipper assembly”, coils list and part numbers, feature instructions (game rules), and sequence of operation. the only thing I’m missing is the playfield post difficulty settings card which was originally inside the game. pm me if anyone wants a scan of this stuff.

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#11 3 years ago

Hi beadwindow, below is the wiring for MINI-ZAG DIY Added Ball Kit. This differs to my ROCKET III (yours has MB switch on relay and 10 pins populated) but according to the documentation is the same as DIXIELAND, I suspect there are just a few versions of this relay plug that cover the 13 AAB convertible games that I listed above.

Enjoy added ball - well - Shoot Again

DIY Added Ball Kit - MINI-ZAG (resized).jpg

#12 3 years ago

Excellent and thank you very much!

2 months later
#13 3 years ago

Got the well-packed bg in from bgresto.

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#14 3 years ago

Sweet.............how long did it take to get it?

#15 3 years ago

If you are ever interested in selling this MiniZag, restored or unrestored, I continue to buy duplicates of Ted Zale titles at competitive dealer prices. This particular title fully restored is worth about $2K to me. Unrestored up to around $1K.

#16 3 years ago

i placed the order for this on 12MAR this year but it was a rush order so that it would be done to ship with my Capersville and Suspense back glasses (to save on shipping fees). the rush order was bgresto’s idea, I didn’t request it.
thanks for reaching out and I’ll keep that in mind-I just noticed I’m across the river from you. do you buy duplicates to have spare parts on hand or ?

#17 3 years ago
Quoted from beadwindow:

thanks for reaching out and I’ll keep that in mind-I just noticed I’m across the river from you. do you buy duplicates to have spare parts on hand or ?

I do have duplicates and spare parts for 14/19 of the Ted Zale "zipper flipper" designs.
Some more than others, depends on the rarity of the title.
Presently six of the games are fully restored and set up, the rest are in storage.
The next Ted Zale up for final restoration is Dogies, Bazaar, then Alligator.

8 months later
#18 2 years ago

i have the aab relay wires soldered to the switches but there's something i can't quite make out. in the pic in post 11 above, it looks like wire 5 is attached to the right coil lug. from there is it also attached to the lower blade of the bottom switch (with wire 10 being the top half of that switch) and then it goes to the jones pug?

#19 2 years ago

answered my question.

Rocket III AAB Relay (resized).jpg
#20 2 years ago

i have the AAB relay up and running and here's a pic of it installed in the machine. not the prettiest wiring but it works. i have to give a huge thanks to ASTYY who provided me with tons of help and had previously researched the idea of building an AAB relay and made it happen.

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a big thanks also to Rolf Martin!

#21 2 years ago

hi beadwindow
i own some bally pinballs and i converted some to abb.
i began to work with asty's post on rocket 3, and this won't work on my dixieland.
the kk relay on my surfers (italian version) was different : all wires on the jones plug was wired (10) than 9.
i think this is cause the through on the railway is on the top of the playfield, on rocket 3, and later it is into the lower railway, who send the ball
after the outhole.in fact, when you win an extra ball, you don't loose it if you go into the top of the playfield, if you take the gate.
you have to add a bulb on the apron for extra ball, and a wire to draw from abb socket to apron, cause it is not wired on the original dixieland.
so it'seems there are two extra balls relays on bally, depending if you have the "self hold" on the top or lower railway.
sorry for bad english

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