(Topic ID: 262219)

Bally KISS - How to confirm German and US versions


By meSz

5 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 13 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 months ago by meSz
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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kiss3 (resized).JPG

#1 5 months ago

Looking for a Bally KISS machine I was presented with one machine that the seller claims to be a German version. Well I wasn't really looking for a German one as I would rather have the original KISS logo I started to wonder A. what's the differences are between the two machines and B. how can one prove a machine is a German one?

I know that the German playfield and backglass have the altered logo. I also have been advised that the German playfield has more black to it. IPB had reproduced the German playfields and the backglasses were also reproduced so it would be nothing for someone to be able to make a German KISS machine.

I am wondering if it was ever advised as to how many German KISS machines were produced and if the serial numbers were in a bank (i.e. if 3000 were made were the serial number EKI2000 - EKI5000)?

So, again, interested in the differences as well as to how to tell today if a machine is an original German machine.

#2 5 months ago

#3 5 months ago

your first post got it right - the only differences between the 2 (as far as i know) were the 2 different logos.

the german having KISS on the backglass and across the the bonus lights.

the more well known has the old school 'lightning bolt' 'S' in the logos

#4 5 months ago
Quoted from meSz:

Looking for a Bally KISS machine I was presented with one machine that the seller claims to be a German version. Well I wasn't really looking for a German one as I would rather have the original KISS logo I started to wonder A. what's the differences are between the two machines and B. how can one prove a machine is a German one?
I know that the German playfield and backglass have the altered logo. I also have been advised that the German playfield has more black to it. IPB had reproduced the German playfields and the backglasses were also reproduced so it would be nothing for someone to be able to make a German KISS machine.
I am wondering if it was ever advised as to how many German KISS machines were produced and if the serial numbers were in a bank (i.e. if 3000 were made were the serial number EKI2000 - EKI5000)?
So, again, interested in the differences as well as to how to tell today if a machine is an original German machine.

I've never researched that. Good question though.

I've only ever noticed the difference in logos. But you're right, with the repops someone could, and probably has made one or two that aren't originals. I would think you're on the right track with serial numbers.

#5 5 months ago

If you can confirm it's an original, I would certainly grab it if it's in your budget.

#6 5 months ago

I could be wrong, but I think the German ones also hold scores over 1Mil without rolling over

#7 5 months ago
Quoted from BallyTim:

If you can confirm it's an original, I would certainly grab it if it's in your budget.

That's just it .... there appears to be no way to confirm if one is original or not.

Quoted from wolfemaaan:

I could be wrong, but I think the German ones also hold scores over 1Mil without rolling over

This is the first I am hearing of this difference, thanks for the post.

Also, wondering if the lights for the SS is the backbox were different? For the "standard" version there are four bulbs that light up each S in KISS and they're positioned for the lightning bolt S' so were the German bulbs set differently to light up the rounded S'?
kiss3 (resized).JPG

#8 5 months ago

Good question as far as the lights behind the backglass. Ask the seller to take a look.

The only know differences between the 2 versions are logos on the backglass and playfield.

Now Illinois Pinball (Gene Cunningham) did reproduce playfields and backglasses. The backglasses were exact reproductions as far as I know. Variations in colors only due to silkscreening process which is normal.

The repop playfields were not painted grey on the backside as the original ones were. The only other difference on the playfield is the the images of the band members towards the bottom had color added. The original was black and white images of the band members. And the repop playfields are clear coated.

#9 5 months ago
Quoted from Pickle:

Good question as far as the lights behind the backglass. Ask the seller to take a look.

Unfortunately the seller is not a pinball person so he’s reluctant to take glass off. Said I can when I go to look at it.

Quoted from Pickle:

The repop playfields were not painted grey on the backside as the original ones were. The only other difference on the playfield is the the images of the band members towards the bottom had color added. The original was black and white images of the band members.

Actually just noticed this. To your point the repo appear to have skin tone colors whereas the original was just b&w. I also did notice the primer underside is not present on the repo. Thnx for the post!

#10 5 months ago
Quoted from wolfemaaan:

I could be wrong, but I think the German ones also hold scores over 1Mil without rolling over

That’s an aftermarket item from Xpin
https://xpinpinball.com/product/xp-7volution/

1 week later
#11 5 months ago

Bumping to see if anyone else has any info to offer up!

#12 5 months ago

Here is one for sale. Looks fairly authentic to me

ebay.com link

#13 5 months ago
Quoted from wolfemaaan:

Here is one for sale. Looks fairly authentic to me
ebay.com link

Just overpriced.

Actually had a Pinsider that has an original German machine and he PM'd me advising that the only difference was the SS in the playfield and the backglass. Even the bulb layout, as I described in post 7, is in the same pattern as all other machines.

Makes sense that no other differences as any differences would mean additional manufacturing and cost.

With both the German backglass and playfield being reproduced there's no real way to determine whether or not a game is an original German machine.

Also some info found:
"the similarity between the “SS” logo and KISS’ wasn’t an issue until around 1980, when the Nazi “SS” logo was used in a political ad in West Germany. KISS decided to modify it prior to a September 1980 tour of West Germany by rounding the edges. Since then all of their German-issued albums and marketing materials have used this modified KISS logo."

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