I got this on CL for a pretty low price in my opinion. I know it will be a lot of work, but the art and the (potential) gameplay look entertaining. I see it as a learning experience with a lot of fun at the end, so I went for it.

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Here are my questions/concerns:

1. The paint is pretty bad on the outside. It falls off if you look at it funny. I want to repaint it, probably the whole exterior. How can I outline items like the lance so that when I sand the old paint down/off I can have a starting point instead of starting from scratch? Do I spot sand and do the whole lance and then paint it, then sand the blue and repaint it, and then the white with touchups where needed as I go?

2. Is there any chance that this is leaded paint? My first EM and all, I'd like to know.

3. The backglass is fine in about 80% of the paint, but is flaking in spots of the blue and yellow. Can I retouch that and then try to protect it?

4. The playfield is more faded (or really dusty) and showing age cracks in the paint than peeling like the outside. I might try a complete touchup or I might lightly sand and clearcoat it so I can play the machine sooner.

5. The plastics are actually quite nice. A little yellowing, but only one broken piece. They are a little warped though. Is there any way to flatten them out (light baking perhaps?) or is it better off to not chance it?

6. How blasphemous is it to put LED's in an old EM like this?

Thanks all!

That's a good idea. I'll have to get some measurements and check out some craft places to see what they might have to offer.

I haven't taken it off, but I have lifted it. The guy I bought it from did it first when he was showing me the field. I did a little investigating last night and find it to be a clever way to have everything put together. It will actually make cabinet painting a little easier from the looks of things.

I found the zipper flippers on accident last night. I had the field up and was inspecting things when I noticed an oddly places solenoid assembly. I pressed around on it and all of a sudden the flippers closed up. Took me a little while to figure out that A) I didn't break anything, and B) how to unlatch them.

It's a long way off, but note the 2nd player score. The game is set to reset, but that 4 stays there. When the old owner powered it up the wheels just inside of the coin door kept spinning and never started a game. I think it is trying to reset that wheel, but can't, and therefor won't deploy the ball. A little research shows that the wheel might just have stiff grease from sitting, and I'm hoping that is the extent of the problem. That will get looked at in time though. I want to do as little playing until the field is fresh and clear coated, but I don't know how long I will be able to resist once the new rubbers, ball, and spring kit comes in.

I couldn't resist yesterday. I reset the score to zero with it powered off and when plugged in it plays. If that was the worst it would play due to dead rubbers and a neglected play field, this is going to be a lot of fun when it's done. I only played a few games, but could have been in the garage for hours playing, quite enjoyable.

Really looking forward to getting to the store and getting some paints for this. Rebuild kit should be here in about a week.

Here is a video I made of the current condition. I had the camera sideways for the gameplay and had everything in frame, but the editor cut off the 1st player scoreboard and the flippers when I rotated the video.

What do you guys think of the condition? The cabinet probably needs a complete redo, but the playfield really isn't that bad. Down by the knight and horse it's easy to see the streaks/splits in the paint, but the spots are just dust and will wipe right off. Do I redo the playfield (by that I mean a light sanding and then touchups, not taking it down to the wood, followed by a clear coat) or do I just sand it a little and go straight to the clearcoat?

I haven't even dusted off the play field yet. I will probably do that and wax it and see how things look.

That's a great idea about swapping reels. If the easy things don't work out, I will definitely give that a go.

Thanks MrArt. Can I get a transparent piece big enough for the cabinet?

B_R, I think he was talkIng about the type of glass. The glass and metal trim are all assembled together instead of something like a lockdown bar and then sliding glass. That Hi Lo looks really nice. Love the cabinet art.

Tonight's progress. It looks like I won't be able to just wipe off the dust and clearcoat, the playfield paint is fairly weak. Not nearly as bad as the cabinet, but still needs attention.

I can't figure out how to get those 3 pop bumpers off in the top left. The screws in the wood are undone, as are the nuts connecting the popper to the solenoid. It looks like the soldered points for the bulb are keeping it from moving, which isn't what I wanted to deal with. Soldering isn't a strong point of mine. Any other things to check out?

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So here we have a little progress. I took the PF out since I was unable to remove 2 of the pop bumpers with it in. Not having a rotisserie, I set it on its end and am not crushing anything. I removed the trim, pins, pop bumpers, and gave it a good wipe down with a Magic Eraser. There are still some parts that need to come out and a little more detail work, but it looks much better.

Since the machine is 43 years old there are various levels of fade. Does that mean I get to pick which shade I want? :p

Oh, and just like SteveFury, I have a slight wear arc where the ball gets plunged to the top. It's not too bad, but on a 5 ball game with almost 15,000 plays on the counter, the wear definitely exists.

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I am planning on it. The biggest internal debate I'm having right now is deciding if I want to attempt touch ups or just clear coat it and get it back together. The playfield really isn't that bad, but some spots are definitely less attractive, but I can't blame a game this old for showing its age. I'm just concerned and counting on that if I start to do touching up I will end up doing the whole board because of the variation in faded areas.

Good point. The paint needs help, so I guess there's my decision being made. Hoping to get a little more done tonight. Not really a whole lot left to remove, just the roll over switches on the right and a few more odds and ends. Might even get into the black touch ups tonight just to see how things go.

I haven't seen this brought up before in a restoration thread. I founds a few links where it is discussed, researching now.

Everything is removed except for the free ball gate. I will take that out as I get close to it with the paint. I started with the white spots since they are under plastics and the learning curve won't be as exposed when it's back together. It's a decent start. I found that you have to put it on a little thick and let it dry, the opposite of how I started. I had been putting it on thinly and going over it again shortly after and it was gunky and caused poor results. That's the top right area. The other 3 were just done in one quick time period and will probably turn out much better. This is going to take a long time.

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Hey Steve. I have actually been following your thread, but appreciate the recap into a single post. I went over the PF with a ME, but the paint is quite fragile and anything harder than a swipe would pull flakes. Even then, I was still getting flakes. I'm going to see how coat 2 of the white goes and make a few decisions after that.

I actually didn't notice my arc until you pointed it out in yours. Mine isn't too deep at all and I might fill it in before clearcoating. I haven't even looked at it very much yet, baby steps. After breaking the ice with the painting, I am looking forward to making more progress. Work, school, family, and everything else takes up a bunch of time, but this is fun and I will make a greater effort to fit it in from now on.

Hello all. Had to take a break for an intensive class load, but I am back to working on this project.

Skybug; I actually don't have a lock for the coin door on mine, but do have a lock on the rear panel. I have two keys and they are identical, so I will guess that yours will work for both the front and the back.

Chrisbee; Where is the delay relay? I just did a bulb count for an upcoming order and only saw 44/47's and some N55's.

That brings me to my next point, what are N55's? Are they just a 55w version of a 44/47, because they fit in the same socket. There are two different sizes of plastic inserts on the PF, but if I can use all one type of bulb, I would like to. Say what you will, but after seeing burn marks at every bulb location, I'm going LED.

Here is the latest progress. The backglass was rough in some areas, but my fear has been reduced after several layers of Krylon Triple Thick.

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I finally got a little free time to work some painting in. Painting with a toothpick is giving much better results than a brush, but man is it slow. I learned that thinning out the paint with just a few drops of water helps things go down more smoothly. It's not error proof still at that point, but much better than straight out of the bottle.

I'm a good chunk through with the lower playfield and am one sitting away from having all of the yellow done. I will get new pictures after that. Things aren't perfect, but I'm doing the best I can. Besides, this is going to be played, not sit in a museum. It'll pass the 5 foot test, and that's good enough for me and my kids couldn't be any less bothered about paint condition.

Long time since I have worked on this. Actually, there was a pause, then I made some progress with a toothpick, and then a long pause. Now it's amateur hour in the airbrush dept. I'm going back over some of my earliest areas because they weren't very good. I'm not looking forward to all the black border, but the first solid area went pretty well.

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The colors were so faded that matching with the originals was over my head at this point. I have picked colors that should be close, but will not be exact.

I also ended up getting LED's for every spot. Not the retro ones either, bright, bold colors.

Thanks. Is that for covering it up, or creating the border so I can paint the thin stripes?

This group might need another coat, we will see. At least I am making progress now, I want this playable and inside getting use.

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More progress. It is slow, but it is happening. I have a spot that is not exposed to sawdust (unlike the workshop) so it should be able to get more done. The wall section is pretty brutal, but the white should be done in another several days, then I can do the same thing to the bricks in the wall.

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That was from yesterday, this one is from today.

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Thanks guys.

New rule. Wait 48 hours before peeling off tape. Had a few of the thin sections come off with the tape. If I had done each side independently I probably wouldn't have had that problem. A thicker area was still elastic at the edges, had to use the knife on those few edges and cut right along the tape.

Also, some days I think things are going well, others I think I should have just cleared it to a finish (and not just to keep the paint from flaking off) and put it back together. The colors are certainly going to be more vibrant when I'm done, but I'd honestly just pay for a new PF at this point. I don't have the patience to make this fun for the whole process, but I'm going to finish it because I don't like to give up.

Fighting with my airbrush doesn't help either. Was a little too watery last night, was just barely too thick tonight to get it to cooperate from the get go. Ugh.

I have had this machine for ~2 years now. In my defense, I was in school until last May, so time to work on it was nil. Then, I got as far as I reasonably could with a toothpick (like I read somewhere on this forum) and had to go with airbrushing for really thin lines. Now I'm finishing the thin areas and some of the larger areas that I hadn't done.

There is comfort in knowing that each time I go out to do a spray - is it a layer, a coat, a what? It's been the same color for 5 sprays and counting because it's a different area each time - that I will be that much closer the next time I take the tape off. It's still really hard some times.

At least I have played the machine and know that it's pretty fun. The guy I bought it from lives about 3 miles from my house and he sold it because he was renovating and needed the room. I bet he's done with the reno now, and I'm not nearly there.

Once the blue wall with the white mortar is done I will feel much better. I've been dreading that area since I first decided to paint. It's not hard at all, just so many lines that you have to break down into seperate sprays when you are doing this with tape.

I still have no idea how I'm going to do the million little 'M' shapes that the people have in their clothes.

Another spray. The 2-day+ dry time works much better than trying to do a spray a day and having some edges come up.

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Good info Steve, thanks. I did a coat on the PF prior to anything, so the paint is protected and isn't coming off with the tape. For larger areas, and even pinstripes, this is working. It is slow, but is now within my comfort level. However, for the lettering in some areas, I just might need those stencils. Time to go on the hunt for them.

My local offerings are either Hobby Lobby or Michael's, and Michael's web site if very poor. Are they literally called 'airbrush stencils'?

Another shot. I fit in a lot of thin sections today which was a first. I have been able to do some vertical lines in the wall too, first time for that.

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The playfield, or the cab too? My cab is flaking really bad. Would have made for a really nice rat rod type of project, it was that bad. Oh well, just looking forward to playing it again.

Resprayed the set up seen in the most recent pic. I was getting really bad spitting, and very frustrated, so I did some research on my exact paint brand. I found a forum that had used various thinners and somebody said a 50/50 mixture of paint and rubbing alcohol worked really well.

I tried that out with a little practice. It did in fact spray nicely and because it was alcohol, dried pretty fast. It takes a few coats since it's a little on the runny side, but it went down nicely and there was nos spitting or bubbles. I have lots of medicine cups from what we have collected with my two boys over the last few years. I took one of those to do my measurements, so I'm expecting the same behavior every single time I spray. Much better than the hit or miss spitting and long dry times I was getting in the past.

Well the magic 50:50 mix didn't work so well. I pulled tape off today and most of the areas completely lifted with the tape. Very mad. I'm going to try it again with a 2 paint to alcohol and if that doesn't work, giving up and going back to water.

Peeled the test of the tape off today. The lifting wasn't as bad as I was expecting. Still there, but not 50% of the areas, like I was worried about. Tried a 2 paint to alc, and that shot just like the 1, so I will do that from now on. Here is the recent pic.

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I did indeed. Figured I gotta deliver on something. Here is the full area btw:

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Hockey playoffs have severely affected my project time. Almost done with the whites in the center where the giant wall is. That will be nice. In fact, almost done with the white completely.

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Did another spray. Forgot to take a picture and now I'm ready to crash. There want as much to paint tonight because the wall is almost done. The spacing of the lines just doesn't allow me to tape it all up and do it in one pass. Going to do the lettering soon, so it's time to hunt down that stencil stuff. Not really looking forward to that part, but I said that about the wall too.

I did something tonight and I think it will make some people mad. I painted a section on the cab without sanding all the old paint off. I wanted to see how it came out. It came out pretty much as expected. Looks just like it did as far as details, just a different color.

Feels a little like a rat rod where it will be proper(ish) and finished under the hood but the body will be a little ugly. I don't think I want to take the paint down, just keep trucking and play the game within the year, instead of in a decade.

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I've come to realize that I should have just cleaned and cleared the old pain on the PF. The detail areas are going terribly. I'm going to scan the PF and do an overlay like this (https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-ruins-of-camelot) , since I can fix everything on the computer. At least I don't suck at that.

The cab however is going really well. One side is almost done, the head is coming along nicely, and that should be done in a few weeks.

So after a lot of searching, I found a place in town that was able to give me a 1 scan of the playfield. I took it into them late last week and got it back mid this week. I was able to start on the 'redraw' today in AotoCAD. Gotta say that I'm pretty stoked with how it's going. I'll see how far I get tonight and maybe post up a progress pic. I'm not great with color matching, so I'll have my wife help me out later with that.

I have a question for anyone with text experience. Can anyone give some suggestions for the font to use? I went through the list and there are some things that would be acceptable, there was always one thing that was off. The numbers are the hard part. In the top there is a yellow area that says "1,000" and that is what I'm using as my reference. Some fonts are bold, but do the comma wrong, others put the base at the bottom of the 1. AutoCAD is actually pretty good at importing texts, so if anyone can give me a few leads, I'll probably be able to pull it in for a final test. Thanks.

About 6 hours into this. I'm not blazing through it, but I'm liking the progress that is happening. I have one concern about what to do in the third picture. There are black stripes over bare wood and this will never work on white vinyl. I don't have a wood grain texture in autocad, but wouldn't be opposed to filling in the blank area with a solid color. One restoration of a surf game that I saw ended up with an octopus painted in a previously bare wood area.

Oh yes, I know the colors don't match. I'll finish matching them as best I can later. Everything that is gray will be changed to black when done. It's easier to see how on target I am when putting down lines if they are contrasting colors.

The purple dots are going to be cut out when the printer prints this for me. They have to set this up and asked for a single color that they an use to make sure they get them all.

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Quite a bit more done recently. The horse and knight are really all I have left to do. The obnoxious green background is just to show how much area is left. It's really not all that much, but the details in the horse and knight will take about 2 hours. The picture quality is junk, but that is because I did a quick crop in MS Paint. The raw data is very high quality.JOUST PROGRESS PICTURE2.JPG

Good info, thanks.

I worked on the lower left area a little since the last post. The knight has a diamond shaped grid pattern in 2 areas and that took a ton of time. I finished one of them, so the second one shouldn't take as long. Also did some of the larger areas of the knight and the horse. Will try to get some more time in on it soon so I can finish up, tweak colors as needed, and get the overlay print started. I'll do a picture when it is pretty much done and see if anyone has any color tweaks they would like to suggest.

And done! With the art that is. I need to tweak the colors a little, and I think there is an extra blue in there because one area was faded so bad that it threw me off. I tried a ton of ways on this computer to get the vibrant view from autocad into an image file, but they are all coming out like junk. The full size PDF is 25mb though, and looks pretty decent.

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Does anyone have a picture of the front of the cab? As head on as possible is best. Before I sanded everything, I took pics of the cab side and the head, and thought I had one of the front. It looks like I don't. I did the art for the cab side and the head yesterday and finished color matching the PF. The colors won't be perfect, but neither are the images I'm referencing and who knows how much things have changed from exposure over time. It's time for this project to be done, and that's the direction I'm heading.

That's pretty interesting. Mine had yellow triangles about 1/3 of the way down the cab. I wonder if there was a different art style, or if that one just painted over them since they were that far gone.

The last of the painted items was sanded today. Going to start clearing soon.

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Stained twice and there is still some tone difference. I think it's just going to be like that. Hoping the overlay I designed will cover those edges. Shot a coat of clear tonight outside since the wind was actually calm. Another coat tomorrow and then bugging the print house until they actually start the job I sent them weeks ago. Stain is straight on picture, clear is angled, just in case the pictures are flipped.

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Fantastic, thanks for the info. I thought the caps had the paint wear off, but I guess not.

I have struggled to get things done on this game as far as art because I redid the art in AutoCAD and the place I was having print the decals couldn't pull in the PDF without it crashing the computer. I was able to convert it to the format they use and now things are rolling again. I don't think the colors are going to be accurate, but my machine was very faded and wasn't certain of the clarity of the images I was finding. I've only played a few games on this before starting the project, but it was a butt kicker for sure. The slings (especially the right side) are aimed right for the outlanes, and the gap on the left side outlane is pretty large. Looking forward to getting this one done and flipping again.

I recently found a shop in town who would print my overlay. So I trimmed it and put it down wet. Worked out as many bubbles as I could and a lot settled overnight. That turned out way better than it started.

I did a few layers of clear and dropped some clear over all of the inserts to bring them up to level. It’s been curing for over a week so I started sanding last night. Knocked the inserts down and then gave everything a once over to fix a few other surface floaters. Have a few more passes at 800 grit before moving on to the next step. I have 1500 or 2000 as my finest level.

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The parts shelf is empty, and the hardware in the cup is all gone. So it looks like we are ready to put the playfield back in. Hooking up the jones plugs and plugging it in went well enough.

Press start. The score motor spins and things click. Scores reset to zero and a ball pops out. The lights flicker. Not just the insert or GI, but both groups at the same time. Flippers work though, so let’s give it a go.

Playing a few games over the course of 30 minutes the lights flickered a lot, so I’ll check out the condition of the fuse holder since I’m guessing they are all on the same fuse. A few switches didn’t register, while some came around after a little use.

The bell works, normally. The could gets hot though, as if it’s always on, but it can’t be. Maybe it’s just in most of the time and when it is told to fire it lets go and locks back on again, seeming to work.

I’m pretty excited to be at this stage. This has been a very long term project and it’s nice to at least have the art part done and the parts no longer spewed over a shelf. The little fixes are probably 50/50 as to if I will have to seek help. The things common to SS games will be fine. EM specific stuff is going to need to be researched.

Woot! Woot!

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Thanks. I went to put a spare part in the cab this morning and noticed the game counter. This was from my last game of the night yesterday.

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Thanks. I’m truly wondering myself if that is actually 15k plays, or if it’s been rolled a time or two. I plan to put a ton of plays on the game, so it’ll get out of the minor league at some point.

Nice! I was digging in mine a little yesterday working on one of the several issues I have yet to track and resolve.

Does anyone have a schematic for Joust? My biggest issue is the lights, all of them, will flicker on and off. Most often it's when coils fire. Because the game can be plugged in and turned on with the left flipper or credit, I'm thinking there is at least one relay that turn on lights. I'd like to check it out and start by cleaning contacts and see where that gets me. I have a feeling going through every switch (relays and others) with IPA and q-tips is in my future, but I'd like to get the lighting issue understood and resolved first.

I hit the high voltage contacts (well, did the low voltage ones too) of the anti-cheat relay with some IPA and q-tips. The light flickering seems to be gone after playing several times to confirm.

I’m going to go through and do that to everything since it cleared up a lot of issues on my Doodle Bug as well.