(Topic ID: 238527)

Bally Hoo circuit for outhole kicker


By Lambecka

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 31 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Lambecka
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 1 year ago

Need assistance for the following problem i have with my Bally Hoo. When starting game the ball does not kick into the shooterlane. It stays in the starting hole and the kicker moves slightly, but not enough to kick the hole out and some times it does not move at all. The spool to,move the kicker measures ok. What i need is the circuit to follow that moves the bal kicker. I only have the german schematic, but difficult to find the circuit i need to follow , the wording i do not understand
Can someone help please

#2 1 year ago

Well, all I can find is the German one, too, but I think it's a score motor sw. on 3, but I can't tell which one.

#3 1 year ago

Hi Lambecka
I think NO german Service Man did like the german schematics (at the times)
Please check the color of the wires on the Outhole-Switch - is the Outhole-Switch "my red 1" or is it "my blue 2" --- I guess "my red 1" so check Score-Motor-Cam 8, Make-and-Brake Switch (here also: look for color of the wires to find the switch on the switchstack). (((Maybe we need to dig-in into the german schematics - I hope not))) Greetings Rolf

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1 week later
#4 1 year ago

Difficult this one , for sure must be the score motor switch, but very difficult to acces

#5 1 year ago
Quoted from Lambecka:

Difficult this one , for sure must be the score motor switch, but very difficult to acces

Simple to verify with a jumper wire. Once verified, unscrew the switch stack next to the one with the bad switch to adjust & deburnish. If you need to replace, pull off the appropriate stack.

1 month later
#6 1 year ago

Finally solved the problem and cleaned the switches score motor, needed to take of all the switches.
But problem solved. Only problem remains is that after loosing the last bal, it goes in game over mode, but stil gives new bal on same moment. Machine stays in game over mode, but ball in the shooter lane.

#7 1 year ago
Quoted from Lambecka:

Only problem remains is that after loosing the last bal, it goes in game over mode, but stil gives new bal on same moment. Machine stays in game over mode, but ball in the shooter lane.

Might be Ball Index or Outhole relays.

#8 1 year ago

Hi Lambecka
when the fault happens - can You still actuate the Flipper-Bats ? See the JPG - the switch on Game-Over-Relay must open when reaching "Game-Over". Greetings Rolf

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#9 1 year ago

Rolf,
No any activity on playfield or flippers, the game is in gameover mode. When playing the last ball the game ends in gameover , but just before supplies new ball in shooterlane

#10 1 year ago

Hi Lambecka
see the JPG - I believe when the pin comes to Game-Over - just before actuating the Game-Over-Relay: The Number-Match relay is made to pull - its switch (in my orange wiring) opens and hinders the actuating of the Outhole-Kicker (?). Does in Your pin the Number-Match relay actuate ? and truely opens the switch ? Greetings Rolf

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#11 1 year ago

Rolf, did some test but then match relais does NOT operate,when ending the game.
Game ends with ball in the shooterlane
Can you help?
Albert

#12 1 year ago

Hi Albert
do You have paper tags in the pin telling the name of a relay or stepper ? If "Yes": Is the text in German or in English ?
Look at the JPG - along "dark blue" lines the Match-Relay should fire - check the wiring. The "Sp. R. Relay" is the Player-Reset-Relay - it must be pulling so its switch in the dark-blue-wiring is closed --- does the Player-Reset-Relay fire ? Greetings Rolf

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#13 1 year ago

Rolf
They all have paper tags and language is german. Will check the player reset rel as advised and let you know
Alberr

#14 1 year ago

Sorry rolf the tags are all in english. Watched the match relais and it is pulling

#15 1 year ago

Hi Alex
see the JPG in post-10 - "orange text: No Match Relay" and the switch to the right - DOES this switch on the No-Match-Relay truely opens when the relay is pulling ? Not only look at the long blades with the contact-points --- also look at the short studs with the solder-lug - a drop of solder there or a doghair crap of wire or one of the solder-lugs heavy bent, making faulty contact ? Greetings Rolf

#16 1 year ago

Hi Albert
I beg Your pardon - in my last post I addressed You "Alex". Greetings Rolf

#17 1 year ago

Rolf , will check this switch closer to make sure it opens.
Playing a few times learns that sometimes the game ends correctly and some times it ends with ball in shooterlane.
Can it be a timing issue??
In other words is it possible,that in between pulling the player reset and the match rel, the ball kicker fires??

#18 1 year ago

Hi Albert
it can be a timing issue --- see the JPG in post-10 - following top-down "my orange" wiring. The No-Match-Relay must pull-in, stay pulling - have its switch truely open - quite a while - the Score-Motor does run and close its switch "3". So the switch on the No-Match-Relay must be open until the running Score-Motor has closed and reopened its switch "3". (((We may have to have an closer look at Sp. R. Relay is Player-Reset-Relay , see JPG in post-12, to not cut to early the feeding current to Coil on No-Match-Relay))) Greetings Rolf

#19 1 year ago

Rolf, took me a while before solving the problem, but finally solved the problem by cleaning and where nesecarry adjusting the stack of switches from SC 8
So as always problem solves but another showed up.
So the problem was that after loosing the last ball gameover, but before gameover a ball in the shooterlan, thats one solved.
But now if playing one player game and loosing the first ball it goes to player two three and player four never ending the game.
If starting four players game it works as it should be,
Any suggestions??

#20 1 year ago

Hi Albert
the tags in Your pin have english text - the ipdb-schematics is written in (crummy) german. I show a snippet from ipdb-schematics "Gator" - this JPG covers the same what I show in post-12 (in german) to "Bally Hoo". When it comes to stepping to next player and/or next ball: Williams and Bally pins try FIRST to step on the ball
- IF (if, if) successfully stepped on the ball: The Player-Reset-Relay pulls-in and the Player-Unit is resetted (THIS happens in an 2,3,4 player game AND also in a ONE-Player-Game.
- IF no stepping on the ball (so the Player-Reset-Relay does not pull-in) then the Player-Unit is stepped forward / up.
Grumble, the written above is "theory I learned" - it does not really match with the JPG here and the JPG in post-12 --- I believe the "Player-Advance-Relay" troubles me.
Anyway - for the problem (post-19) - see the JPG here - look in Your pin at the Coin-Unit and the Player (Up) Unit - has a wire broken-off somewhere ?

Off-topic - I learned something on "drawing stuff in schematics" --- see here in the JPG "encircled blue" - drawn at TWO places --- then look at the JPG in post-12, upper right corner: Drawn only in one place (the position-zero on the Player-Unit). Greetings Rolf

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#21 1 year ago

Ok rolf will check wires of both units tomorrow.
I don,t think that is the problem, because problem is not repeately. I can play few times without having the problem. Also when playing a four players game there is no problem.
But then suddenly when starting for example a one player game, it starts with player two.

#22 1 year ago

Hi Albert
Your description in post-21 does not match with description in post-19. Please write a more detailled decription.
"Sometimes faults" are often caused by a wire broken-away from a solder-lug --- wires are stiff - stay in place (connection) --- a bit of shaking / vibration - the broken-off end moves away a bit (no connection) - again some vibration (connection again) and so on. I once had an sometimes fault on an Extraball-Feature - it turned out to be a broken-off wire to the coil on Extraball-Relay staying in place (sometimes) ...

Since then I do not only look at soldered-on wires --- I grab a wire and gently pull a bit - broken-off ? I go to sleep, till tomorrow. Greetings Rolf

#23 1 year ago

Rolf , sorry that i not very clearly explained the problem, but there is of course a language problem as well.
Lets try it again.
When started a FOUR player game, there is no problem and the playerup unit works ok, also ball counts are correct.

When started a ONE player game, the player unit direct goes to player two and after loosing the ball to player three and so on. The ball count unit works ok.
This is not always the case, sometimes it works in a one player game ok
Also problem occurs in a two players game, it not stops at player two, but goes on to player three and four

#24 1 year ago

Hi Albert
thanks for post-23. I still have a problem of understanding. You want to play a ONE-Player-Game so You press the Credit-Button, the pin resets and finally kicks out a ball - of course it must be Player-1-Ball-1.
(AAA) I can interpret post-23 as "after resetting the pin kicks out a ball - Player-2-Ball-1".
(BBB) I can interpret post-23 as "after resetting the pin kicks out a ball - Player-1-Ball-1. Launching the ball and making point lets the pin step to Player-2-Ball-1.
(CCC) You write what exactly happens.
Please write AAA or BBB or CCC.
(((We cannot start a FOUR-Player-Game without first having a "ONE-Player-Game but the Ball is not launched".)))

Player-Unit and Ball-Unit --- it is like when we drive on the Freeway, we miss the Exit (we want, wanted to leave the Freeway) - we (must) drive on - we then see the next Exit-Sign - we say "for us a wrong exit" so we drive on - and on and on ... Greetings Rolf

#25 1 year ago

Rolf.
Try to play one player game.
Presh credit button, machine resets and ball arrives and kicked into shooterlane. Playing the ball making point and the
point going to player one as it should be. After loosing the ball the machine goes to player two instead of ball two for player one, loosing that ball it goes to player three etc.
So everytime i loose the ball the playerup unit steps.

Four player game.
Presh button , machine resets and ball kicked into shooterlane. Then push button for player two etc,
Can playing full game without any problem, and player unit steps as it should be.
Albert

#26 1 year ago

Hi Albert
first theory (in the first JPG) what happens in a functioning "Gator", One-Player-Game, the first ball is played, lost, enters the Outhole --- along my numbering stuff happens. In short "pink/rosa": The ball enters the Outhole - the "Ball Return Relay (Outhole-Relay)" pulls-in, stays pulling for a while, throws its switches (also makes the motor to run). "Brown": The "Player-Reset-Relay" pulls-in, stays pulling, throws its switches. "Green": The ball is kicked over to the shooter alley and the Ball-Count-Unit steps up. The plunger on the firing Ball-Count-Step-Up-Side closes the E.O.S-Switch and the Player-Unit resets completely (to position-zero (((below position-1 is Player-1 plays))) ). "Blue": The ball traveling to the shooter alley closes (below the apron) the Through-Switch - the Player-Advance-Relay pulls, the Player-Unit steps from position-zero up to position-1.
Now the player (is player-1) can launch the next ball.
Write when You want to discuss "my numbering".

Troubleshooting - see the second JPG - side by side the snippets of schematics "Gator" and "Bally Hoo". Toggle-off the pin and unplug the main power cord (Safety Reasons) - establish an permanent Jumper-Wire (my dark-red line). Plug-in, start a ONE-Player-Game - can You play a ONE-Player-Game ? If "Yes": We have learned "there is a good connection through the Player-Up-Unit in a ONE-Player-Game. If "No": We have learned "at least one fault is in the unit.
(((IF, if You have "Yes" You then may do a second test - see my "gray jumpering" - we will learn about the original connecting wire "Player-Up-Unit to Coin-Unit for Player-One"))). Greetings Rolf
0Gator-Work-07 (resized).jpg0Gator-Work-08 (resized).jpg

#27 1 year ago

Rolf,
Just before i received your post 26 , solved the problem.
As advised by your in earlier post is started to check switch not only visual, but also by hand. I removed stack #1 #7 #8 #9 from score motor and cleaned and adjusted them. On stack #10 found a bad solder, and brook only by touching it.
After making new solder and placed all stack back in position, the main problem was solved.
Everything works correctly.
Only thing i observed during playing is as follow:
When loosing the ball, or ball is placed in one of the bonus holes, the score motor makes one turn. In few cases score motor makes two or three turns before it stops. Any idea

Albert

#28 1 year ago

Hi Albert
I hope I do not have to stumble through the german schematics (to look for an answer to Your question (Score-Motor sometimes turning more)) - You can build up some bonus - sometimes much bonus --- when collecting the bonus then the Score-Motor runs --- in a turn of 180 degrees the pin can count down (up to) 5 bonus (Bonus-Ladder)--- when there are more bonus to be counted down: The motor must do a second turn of 180 degrees. Please give more details to "motor turns three times". Greetings Rolf

#29 1 year ago

Rolf , score motor makes more than one turn when it hits the hole in the top, see picture, you recieve 100,200,300,400 or 500 points. Noticed also that when the 400 points are lit, the problem occurs and also gives 100 points instead of 400.
Score motor keeps running few times and also when loosing the ball it giver three or four
Understands the bonus points when collecting more than five.

Albert

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#30 1 year ago

Hi Albert
only to the problem "on the Eject-Hole, top left --- only 100 points instead of 400 points given" - see the JPG. The No-Match-Unit is involved and some Score-Motor-Switches (I have encircled green). See "getting 400 points" is "get 100 by SCM-4" plus "get three times 100 by SCM-9" - and there (encircled orange) You must investigate. Greetings Rolf

0Bally-Hoo-Work-09 (resized).jpg
#31 1 year ago

Hi Rolf,
I always hate to work on scoremotor switches, because once solving a problem another arises.
But in this case problem solved, by cleaning and adjusting switches from stack 9 , did solve my problem, not only the 400 points is working now, but also extra turns scoremotor for some reason solved also.
May i thank you for helping me out with you knowledge but especially your patience,
Thanks Rolf i will close this subject as being solved.

Regards. Albert

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