(Topic ID: 255031)

Bally Fireball (1972)


By e3thomas

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 31 posts
  • 12 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Ospdk
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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Fireball (resized).JPG
Transformer-Wiring.pdf (PDF preview)
Score-Adjustment-Plugs.pdf (PDF preview)
Score-Motor-Cams.pdf (PDF preview)
Rules.pdf (PDF preview)
Right-Bottom-Relay-Bank.pdf (PDF preview)
Playfield-Stepper-Lube.pdf (PDF preview)
Playfield-Relay-Bank.pdf (PDF preview)
Patent-Notice.pdf (PDF preview)
Playfield-Care-Instructions.pdf (PDF preview)
Playfield-Fuse.pdf (PDF preview)

#1 1 year ago

Hello fellow pinsiders.

Problem one: When I start the game all the reels reset, everything lights up yet no ball, no flippers, still shows game over, total play counter added a game.
This is an intermittent problem, I can try it later and everything works fine.

Problem two: 10 point spots only on the playfield do not ring the bell (cushions, unlit bumpers, etc.), 100 and 1000 work fine.
I manually moved the 10 point relay on the back, it rings the bell as it should.

Any ideas?

Thanks, Ron

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#2 1 year ago

Also sometimes gives you 10 points on drain.

#3 1 year ago
Quoted from e3thomas:

Also sometimes gives you 10 points on drain.

This is the first problem to address because if the 10 Point relay is constantly energized you'll burn out its coil.

#4 1 year ago

Reset your score reels zero them out!

#5 1 year ago
Quoted from e3thomas:

Problem one: When I start the game all the reels reset, everything lights up yet no ball, no flippers, still shows game over, total play counter added a game.
This is an intermittent problem, I can try it later and everything works fine.

Intermittent problems are always fun (NOT) to track down. Check out the start sequence in the manual: https://www.ipdb.org/files/852/Bally_1972_Fireball_Manual.pdf

Quoted from e3thomas:

10 point spots only on the playfield do not ring the bell

I don't see the 10 pt. going to a bell.

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#6 1 year ago

Yeah you have a stuck 10 point relay. Shouldn't be too hard to find just check behind all of the rubbers those are your 10 point switches.

You probably stuck one closed when you replaced the rubbers.

As others have said this is a "fix now" problem, or you run the risk of frying your 10 point relay and your 10 point score reel coil, and that will just be messy.

I have a friend who runs a bar and had an EM in his place with that problem. I told him to immediately unplug the game. He said "Nah, it just happens sometimes." I told him he was being a moron.

A week later he called me again, apparently the game had caught on fire. Burned so many wires to that score reel it still isn't working 2 years later.

#7 1 year ago

Problem two: progress here, the previous owner had installed a playfield protector skin, it had shifted to where it was hanging up the 10 point rollover buttons.
I adjusted it, now the 10 point spots trigger correctly and ring the bell.

Problem one still exists: I looked over the entire machine, saw nothing unusual .

My original comments.
When I start the game all the reels reset, everything lights up yet no ball, no flippers, still shows game over, total play counter added a game.
One thing I did not mention, the score motor does one revolution.

Help!

#8 1 year ago

For problem one, take a look at the reset relay switches with the red/black wire, white/brown wire and white/blue wire. Make sure these switches are clean and adjusted properly...

#9 1 year ago

The relay switches are not labeled anymore, not sure where the reset relay is, do you know?

After I find it, should these switches be open or closed?

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#10 1 year ago

I think the reset relay was on the upper right near the back of the main cabinet, but I'm not really sure... You can do some detective work and find the reset relay using its wire colors. The reset relay will include these wire color wires connected to the switch stack:

red/black wire
white/brown wire
white/blue wire
gray wire
green/black wire
orange/red wire
orange/red wire (to coil lug)

So, look for relay coils with a orange/red wire connected to it, and then see if there are any correct wire colors at the switch stack.

With the power off, you can manually push in the relay to see how the switches open and close and you'll see which switches should be open and closed when the relay coil is not energized. One of the switches that will be closed when the coil is not energized is the switch with the white/brown wire and red/black wire.

#11 1 year ago

Checked my Fireball: left to right: Coin, 2nd coin chute, 3rd coin chute, credit, lock, reset, outhole, ball index, tilt, 3rd ball, ball release, player reset, open flipper, exit alley, kicker

Karl

#12 1 year ago

Hi Fred, here's the relay I found, I cleaned it, turned on the machine, no change.

This coil DOES energize momentarily when I press the start button.

See pics

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#13 1 year ago

Do any of the following reset when you press the start/credit button on the coin door:

Coin unit
Ball count unit
Player up unit

Maybe drdre can confirm we're looking at the correct relay...

#14 1 year ago

It is set on free play, ball in play does not light up, player up shows player 1, see pic.

Help!

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#16 1 year ago

Go to the ball count unit and make sure it's on the ball 1 position. If not, manually reset the ball count unit by pushing in the ball count reset solenoid plunger, and confirm it's on the ball 1 position. Then try to start a game again...

#17 1 year ago

Good job Fred!
That's a start, I played a few more games, the stepper is not returning, I had to manually return it after each game.
The springs look original but I would think they just assist the linkage to return.
I think voltage is not going to the return coil as it should, I my thinking correct?
I have a schematic, it looks like a white/blue and a gray wires control it, would that be a problem in the reset relay switch?
As you can tell I'm just a beginner!

Ron

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#18 1 year ago

There should be a white/blue wire and black wire attached to the ball count reset solenoid. There is one switch that should close on the reset relay that will send power to the ball count reset solenoid. That switch has a white/blue wire and a white/brown wire. With power on and the machine in game over mode, you can manually push in the reset relay. See if this will send power to the ball count reset solenoid.

If the ball count unit is on the underside of the playfield or in the backbox, it could be a Jones plug issue where the Jones plug would need to be cleaned...

#19 1 year ago

Fred, before I read your latest post I went back and again cleaned and adjusted the switches in the reset relay, it appears that took care of the problem!

I later tried what you said, it did not trigger the solenoid.

Then I watched it when I hit the start button, it reset!

Thanks for your help, I will keep this open for a day or two in case the problem returns!

And thanks DrDre for the relay list!

Ron

#20 1 year ago

Ron,

If it helps, here are all the relay and cabinet labels. The original ones were just stapled in place, and usually disappear over time.

5-Ball-Price.pdfBackbox-Relay-Bank.pdfBackglass-Removal.pdfBell-Adjustment-Plugs.pdfFire-Gods-Target-Relay.pdfFuses.pdfGame-Adjustment-Plugs.pdfInspection.pdfLeft-Bottom-Relay-Bank.pdfPatent-Notice.pdfPlayfield-Care-Instructions.pdfPlayfield-Fuse.pdfPlayfield-Relay-Bank.pdfPlayfield-Stepper-Lube.pdfRight-Bottom-Relay-Bank.pdfRules.pdfScore-Adjustment-Plugs.pdfScore-Motor-Cams.pdfTransformer-Wiring.pdf
#21 1 year ago

Thanks Eric

Where did you find those, I may need some for my other machines!

Ron

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#22 1 year ago
Quoted from e3thomas:

Thanks Eric
Where did you find those, I may need some for my other machines!
Ron[quoted image]

IPDB under "Fireball". I don't know how many others (if any) are available for other machines though.

2 weeks later
#23 1 year ago

Hi, I just got a old Fireball 1972 it have been standing still in over 30 years and is all coved in dust, i have blown it clean and powerd it up, but no light ore other action, fuces and power supply is ok, is there other Security, a diagram and function diagram would help if any one have that ?
Hope any of you have some suggestions
Thanks in adwance
Ole

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#24 1 year ago

On this type of game you have to press the left flipper button to turn on the lights, after using the bottom switch..
Then you can put credits on.
Schematics are on ipdb.org I think.

#25 1 year ago

Wow!
Nice find, check the fuses too, sometimes they are just loose.
Bottom of the cabinet near the coin box.

#26 1 year ago

You are going to want to change the fuse holders first thing. These are crap on this game (and on other Bally machines).

#27 1 year ago

Thanks for fast reply, correct the fuse holders are bad one of them broke when turning the fuse. I found diagram on ipdb.com
Is it a good idea to clean all contact with Grit 1000 sand paper, and what about the score Reels must i clean them ?
What do you use to clean playfield

#28 1 year ago

Hi Ospdk, Welcome to pinside!

Quoted from Ospdk:

Is it a good idea to clean all contact with Grit 1000 sand paper

You may be able to get the game mostly working by fixing what's broken. Later when you have more experience you can go through all the contacts etc. Although your game looks like it may have suffered more abuse than most so it's really a judgement call.

#29 1 year ago

Think i got all the Broken wires fixed and and score wheels reset and adjustet. But got one Error i cant se what cause, when power op machine the score motor reset but when i hit the play button the score motor Inside the machine starts rotating and the two reset relays in the back flipping (image) and it just keep on turning.

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#30 1 year ago
Quoted from Ospdk:

when i hit the play button the score motor Inside the machine starts rotating and the two reset relays in the back flipping (image) and it just keep on turning

Every one of the 16 score drum units has (in addition to other switches) a switch that tells the reset circuit when it's found its way back to zero. One of them is most likely stuck closed.

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#31 1 year ago
Quoted from HowardR:

Every one of the 16 score drum units has (in addition to other switches) a switch that tells the reset circuit when it's found its way back to zero. One of them is most likely stuck closed.[quoted image]

Thanks for the help
I disambled all the Schouw wheels and checked all the switches, so now it is running
But the previus owner have maked something withe the Coin door and credit wheel, to start i have to open the door and hit the Coin switch once, then it seems like player 4 can play endless. In the model of a game it stoped and game over relay was stuck and i could not reset and adding credit dident help, i manuel pushed all the relays and suddently i could reset the game over. Dos that make any sense ore a clue what have been done ?

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