(Topic ID: 265873)

Bally Congress Bowler not scoring

By seanduffy

4 years ago


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  • Latest reply 3 years ago by seanduffy
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    #1 4 years ago

    I have several problems with my Bally Congress Bowler. The first is the step up coil on the frame unit stays energized all time unless I lift a wiper on the disc of the frame unit. The it will release the coil and advance the frame until the puck is slide again. Even when it is released it doesn't score.

    It also advances the frame before the player can make a second throw.

    I do have a manual and schematic.

    Any help is greatly appreciated.

    #2 4 years ago

    Is your Congress a 1955 that scores regulation bowling?
    For sure a switch in the Score Motor is closed, and should be
    open once the Score Motor is in its run-out/resting position.
    I'm not sure if the switch is not adjusted properly, or maybe
    the Score Motor isn't making it to the home position.
    If your machine has multiple problems, most likely it's been
    put together, plucked in, then turned on. You'll want to go through
    the entire machine (all components), then turn it on and do the
    trouble shooting..

    #3 4 years ago

    I'm not sure if its a 1955 but I do believe it scores like regulation bowling. The game was a fully functioning game last time I played it about 3 years ago. No one has messed with it during that time.

    #4 4 years ago
    Quoted from seanduffy:

    The game was a fully functioning game last time I played it about 3 years ago. No one has messed with it during that time.

    The thing is, no one has to mess with it. It's possible a machine can sit for 3
    yes and play okay, actually especially Ballys, but that is not always the case.
    These electrical mechanical games like to be played. They like to be excersized.
    I'm not sure if you're good with these machines, but it really needs it's components
    to be gone through. Even if there's more to it, one things for sure. There has to
    be a switch off the Score Motor's cam that is closed and it suppose to be open..
    Edit: btw, you don't want any coils stay on for any length of time. Don't want them
    to get hot. You might want to make sure the Score Motor is running properly.
    It could be as simple as the motor isn't making its full revolution because the run-out
    switch doesn't have good contact while it's on route to its home position (when the
    switch is suppose to open)..

    #5 4 years ago

    I have a lot of experience with EM pins. But very little with shuffle games. I did go through a big ball bowler and straitened out many problems that it had. I will check the run out on the score motor tomorrow as well as all the switches on the score motor. The score motor does run. I have not seen the director unit move but once. I agree with what you are saying about coils getting hot. I can't work on it for any length of time because the coil starts to heat up. I also agree that all em games are better being exercised. I find this to be even more true in humid climates. I will post my findings tomorrow.

    #6 4 years ago

    If it is the Score Motor's run-out switch, then it has to be loosing its contact exactly
    when the Frame Step Up Score Motor switch is exactly in it's notch or on its lobe on its
    cam. It could be, but most likely it is the Score Motor's switch that energizes the Frame
    Step Up itself. If you can make out the schematic, the #1 cam would be the one closest
    to the Score Motor..
    On the Director Unit not stepping up, it could be a few things, but you'll want to first check
    the switches on the Director Unit itself.
    If you want to do some investigating while the machine is fired up, you could put a small piece
    of paper between that Frame Unit's wiper blade and the wiper board to keep the coil from remaining
    energized. But unless there's bare wires touching (which I doubt), nothing can energize the
    Frame Unit's switch if the switch on the Score Motor's cam that energizes the Frame Step Up
    is open, which it normally should be.

    #7 4 years ago

    If I remember correctly, The score motor switch that energizes the Frame unit step up coil is on cam or switch stack 9. But i will verify that in the morning. I do precipitate the help.
    i'll be back tomorrow.

    #8 4 years ago

    There is no closed switches that shouldn't be closed on the score motor. There are no terminals touching. The score motor does stop where it should.

    #9 4 years ago

    I don't have the schematic for your machine, but the only other thing you can check
    is the switches in the Start Relay, but chances are slim the problem would be there.
    If you look at the Frame Unit's step up circuitry in the schematics, I think you'll find
    the Player Up Reset Relay is one of the first to be in the circuitry near the Frame Step Up
    coil. Then near by, the Score Motor switch which suppose to be normally open, and then
    the circuitry breaks away in a couple directions, but if that score motor switch is open, it
    breaks the circuit to the Frame Unit. You'll see where it ties in the Frame Unit's wiper itself,
    but that's after the open switch on the score motor. Are you sure the solder tabs aren't
    touching, or any type of metal particles aren't causing problems?
    Are you able to locate the exact set of switches on the Score Motor that fires the Frame
    Unit's Step Up coil?

    #10 4 years ago

    It is switch 6 on the score motor. switch 6 energizes player-up, step-up and reset coils, and frame unit step up coil. I will triple check switch 6. It is the only switch on cam 6.

    #11 4 years ago

    I added a few images

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    #12 4 years ago

    Yes, Score Motor Pulse Switch #6. Not having a letter, must be the only set of switches
    in the stack. On your machine, the circuitry also takes another route where it avoids the
    #6 switch and goes to the Frame Units wiper board. I can't see where that circuit ends up going,
    but it looks like it's involved with the Frame Step Up coil only when the Frame Unit is in one of
    its position. I don't recognize that circuit. I'm not sure why it goes to the Frame Step Up coil, but
    it must have to do with the Trophy feature. Maybe worth checking out that circuit also.
    There is also a 3rd circuit route that it goes, but 3 different set of switches (and a couple of other things)
    need to be closed when they're N.O. (Normally Open) for that to be the problem..
    I actually thought Bally's first multiplayer shuffle that scored regulation was produced in 1957 (1956
    at the earliest), but yours is a 1955. When you get a chance, can you send a pic of the backglass?

    #13 4 years ago

    Here is a pic of the backglass. I havnt had any time to work on it today.

    20200410_125012 (resized).jpg20200410_125012 (resized).jpg
    #14 4 years ago

    New clue! Player up reset coil is also staying energized. I have looked a cam 6 multiple times and dont see a problem there. If I check across the switch when it's open I get 7.5 ohms. When its closed I get .05 ohms.

    #15 4 years ago

    Yea, Congress looks just like Bally's ABC Shuffle. It scores regulation..
    Where the Player Step Up and Frame Step Up intersects is in the Player Reset Relay,
    but that open Score Motor switch 6 would break that circuit even if there was a problem in
    the Player reset relay.
    In the schematics, if you follow the Frame Step Up's circuitry straight up, there's a set
    of switches in the "Number Matched Relay". Those switches are N.O., but if they're closed,
    that would keep the Frame Unit Step Up energized, but unless all 3 make break switches in
    the Player Reset Relay is touching, that wouldn't be energizing the Player Step Up, but I'd check
    the switches in the Number Matched Relay and also make sure that Relay isn't staying energized.

    #16 4 years ago

    Another new clue. The match unit coil is also staying energized.
    I can post more schematic pictures if you like.

    #17 4 years ago

    Also the the player up and frame step up coils become and stay energized only after the first shot is made.
    The match unit coil is energized anytime the game is on.

    #18 4 years ago

    Ok, I took the switch on the start trip relay out of the circuit. Now the player up reset does not stay energized. But the frame unit step up still does. I will take the number matched switch out next.

    #19 4 years ago

    You took the switch out of the Start Relay?
    I'm not sure about the feature of the number match relay,
    but maybe disconnecting it's coil with so it's not energized
    is one thing to try. I wouldn't mind seeing a pic of the Number
    Match relay's circuitry..

    #20 4 years ago

    I unsoldered the wire feeding the that particular switch. The center wire on the make and break switch. Here is a pic of that circuit.

    1587137860869838336504336470458 (resized).jpg1587137860869838336504336470458 (resized).jpg
    #21 4 years ago

    If I lift wiper a on the frame unit it steps up to frame two. When the player taks a turn the frame unit steps up one step and sticks. When I lift the wiper again it will advance again to frame 3 and so on until frame 5. Then the coil doesn't stay energized.

    It also is only letting the player have one throw per turn.

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    #22 4 years ago

    I have taken the wipers of the director unit disc and the problem persists.

    #23 4 years ago

    If I remove wire 60 from the frame unit disc I don't have te problem with the coil staying energized.

    It is still only letting the player have 1 turn per frame.

    I am soooooooo confused.

    #24 4 years ago

    So it's the 0 - 9 Match Unit that's also staying energized? It does goes through the Frame Unit wiper board,
    but there's a couple of Score Motor switches that are NO (normally open) that should keep the 0 - 9 Unit from
    staying energized. I would put the wires back that you took off, and first concentrate on why the 0 - 9 Match\
    Step Up is staying energized.
    The schematic shows Score Motor switches 2B and 2C should normally be open which would keep the 0 - 9
    Step Up from staying energized.

    #25 3 years ago

    Ok, all the switches are back in the circuit. I have looked at score motor switch stack 2 and it is as it should be. All switches are open. I went as far as to remove it from the score motor frame to be sure I wasn't missin a stray solder glob or crossed wire at the terminals. From looking at the schematic. There is nothing else to check. I must have a wire crossed or two wire have the insulation gone. Some foriegn piece stuck completing a circuit that shouldn't be. Is this correct?

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