(Topic ID: 113713)

Bally Boomerang works for a couple of balls

By braincramp

9 years ago


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#1 9 years ago

Hi, I'm new here and I have a lot to learn but I love playing pinball. I recently bought a 1975 ( I think ) Bally Boomerang pinball at a auction cheap. It looks terrible but it does power up. If I let it sit unplugged for a while and turn it on it plays for one or two balls and then it quits working.It stays lit up but it won't kick out a ball and flippers won't work. Can someone give me some advice on where to start?

#2 9 years ago

When it stops working do you mean it it lighting the game over mode on the backglass? When you say you leave it sitting for a while are you hitting the credit button on the door to get it to start? Any details you can provide can help in the diagnosis. Congrats on the pick up!

#3 9 years ago

The flippers quit working and it won't kick out a ball. The scores all stay lit up but a few of the target lights in the playing field go out. The machine makes noise holding the credit button like it wants to work but it doesn't start to work again until it feels like it. Thanks for the response!

#4 9 years ago

you might want to get a moderator to move this to the em subforum for you, as "boomerang" is an em, not a solid state...

#5 9 years ago

Agreed with ccotenj, ask a moderator to move this to Tech EM forum. But to get you going, I am going to wager a guess that your Bally Game Over relay may be dirty or mis-adjusted given that the flippers quit working.

Take a look at Clay's pinrepair.com guides, particularly #3 at http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index3.htm which show pictures of the Bally game over relay and how that can be problematic. It is possible that it is not holding properly and kicking off or partially kicking off. If you aren't familiar with working inside an electro-mechanical machine, start with his page #1 at http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index1.htm.

#6 9 years ago

Thank you all for the information so far. How do I go about getting the mods to move this ? I'm an idiot.

#7 9 years ago

Thread moved to EM Tech, you will get more help there.
Chris

#8 9 years ago

Thank you Chris !

#9 9 years ago

Do you happen to have some more score and instruction cards?
I have just updated my website with a set for Boomerang.
I love to add some more cards...

Peter
Www.inkochnito.nl

#10 9 years ago

Sometimes I can play as many as 8-10 balls before it decides to quit. When it quits a couple of lights on the right side of the playing field go out.When that happens I know nothing is going to work no matter how times I hit the replay button.I unplug the machine for a day and turn it back on and I can usually play a few balls.Any help is appreciated since I know very little about pinballs.

#11 9 years ago

Which lights on the right side of the playfield go out? Can you describe or take a picture of them on or off?

#12 9 years ago

The C and D lights go out when it quits working.

#13 9 years ago

I took a rather poor quality video for you of my Flicker, which is the two player version of Boomerang. Please check the contacts on the Game Over relay. It is the only thing short of the actual A, B, C, D relays I can think of that is causing the lights to go off. You mention that the flippers quit working so it really sounds like game over or partial game over issue.

#14 9 years ago

Thanks a lot ! I will check it out more. Thank you for taking the time to do the video.

#15 9 years ago

When I push forward on the white nylon piece that closes the front relay on the game over relays,the score increases by 10,000 points. Also, how do I know it the relays are adjusted right ?

#16 9 years ago

Hmmm, I am not sure why you would get 10,000 when actuating the Game Over relay. I usually review switches visually for needed adjustments when I get a new pin. Stick a work light in the machine with it powered off and look at the switches on the relays. Basically they will close or open and if you manually actuate them by hand you can see this visually. If a switch is already closed when the direction of travel it is going in logically should make it closed it is probably out of adjustment. Same goes for the opposite, if it is traveling in a direction when it should close but never makes contact with its mate, it is likely out of adjustment.

Some folks including me like to unhook the bottom board of their EM and take it out of the machine entirely to work on switch review on a bench and in a more ergonomic position. To do this you would have to likely remove the head or partially remove the head to get your line power cord out and then remove a couple of jones plugs that run to the play field and take out a few bolts and possibly a couple screws that keep the bottom board in place. This makes it tons easier to see the switches, especially the ones in the far back of the cabinet. But this isn't always necessary to fix some problems. You may want to do this though to really investigate.

Pinwiki has a good set of explanations of switches and switch adjustments, take a look here.

http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=EM_Repair#Switches

#17 9 years ago

Thank You ! I will keep on plugging away. When the machine quits working it seems like the only way to get it to start again is to unplug it and walk away from it for a day or so. Then when I turn it on it works for anywhere from 5-15 balls.

#18 9 years ago
Quoted from braincramp:

Thank You ! I will keep on plugging away. When the machine quits working it seems like the only way to get it to start again is to unplug it and walk away from it for a day or so. Then when I turn it on it works for anywhere from 5-15 balls.

Sounds like a cold solder joint somewhere_ I'm not too familiar with the game, so when you do the once over, check all the solder to see if it's looking a little rough or if it may not be connected.

I'm not sure how familiar you are with soldering, but, over time, the solder can get cracked or otherwise keep wires from making connections. Usually it's the opposite problem where warming it up makes a better connection, but the point may still apply.

http://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/25478/why-does-a-cold-solder-joint-appear-grainy-or-dull

#19 9 years ago

I've done quite a bit of soldering over the years and I really don't see anything that looks weird yet but I'm gonna keep digging. This might start me drinking. Oh wait...

#20 9 years ago

Replace the fuseholders, almost every Bally of that period has really bad fuseholders.
Is a real "first to do" on these games, the game plays intermittent or the lights on the backbox and playfield seem to have a own life.
Replace all four of them, will make life a lot easier!

#21 9 years ago

Hi braincramp,

Welcome! If you haven't done so already, be sure to read all the info at pinrepair.com as linked above. It really is the Bible for this hobby.

With respect to your Boomerang situation, I'm not sure we have all the info we need. Let's go through more slowly:

- You plug the machine in. There are credits on it. You press the start button. All score reels reset to zero, and the game serves a ball into the shooter lane. All correct so far?

- You play some number of balls (5-15?) before it "quits." So to me that means, you can play a complete 5-ball game, including Game Over, and then you press the start button to start a new game. Is that correct? Or is the game serving you balls continuously without ever reaching Game Over?

- When it "quits," is it in the middle of a game? Does it always happen when the ball hits something specific on the playfield? Is it possible that it quits when the game reaches a certain score? Or is it always when the ball drains?

- You said that once it quits, nothing short of unplugging it and walking away for a day will give you any results. What happens if you unplug it and then plug it in again right away, and try to press the start button? Are the playfield lights still out? Any other action? Any other sound?

- You said that you hear a sound when you press the start button after it "quits," as though it wants to start but can't. Can you be more specific? Is this a buzzing sound, or a clicking, or what? Is the score motor running?

- Did you inspect or replace the fuseholders, as wizardblom rightly suggested?

- Also, take a look at the coils for the Game Over relay, and the Lock or Hold relay (not sure what it will be called on this game). Are there any coils that have toasty brown wrappers? It could be a sign of a burned and weak coil.

(Digression: I have a Bally game that used to shut down completely at 3000 points. I couldn't figure it out, until I realized that the free game award was set at 3000, which sent a pulse to the knocker. The knocker coil was fried, and drew so much power that it caused the Hold relay (also fried) to let go, which shut the whole thing off. So instead of happy hooray free game, the machine would go black. Good times.)

If you can answer some or all of the above, maybe we can get your ugly friend back up and boomeranging again.

#22 9 years ago

Thanks Guys. Ok, here's where I'm at. I soldered in a new fuseholder like wizardblom suggested but nothing changed. When I plug the machine in I hit the toggle switch under the machine and hit the left flipper which resets all the scores. There aren't any credits on it because the way I understand it is set up for freeplay. When it quits there isn't any consistencies. It might quit after 2 balls or the most has probably been 15. It has quit right in the middle of a ball but most of the time its after a ball goes down.I've tried unplugging and plugging it back in right away but it has no effect.The backlight with the scores light up everytime.When I push start it goes through all the sounds like it's going to work but nothing works. Playfield lights stay out unless it decides to work.The game over relays are both open.If I push forward on the piece of nylon that makes the front relay close the score goes up 1000 points every time I close it. The delay and lock relays have very brown paper on them so I know they have been hot but the winding from what I can see are very bright copper. Hopefully I've shed a little bit more light on it and thanks for all your help.

#23 9 years ago

I'm still stumped. Maybe someone with lots more experience than me can jump in on this one - there are some true wizards around here. Following up on your answers:

Quoted from braincramp:

hit the left flipper which resets all the scores.

The left flipper should activate the lights but should not reset the scores or start a game (someone correct me if I'm wrong). But maybe someone wired yours to start a game with the left flipper button.

Quoted from braincramp:

When I push start it goes through all the sounds like it's going to work but nothing works.

Can you be more specific about the sounds? Is there a buzz? Are there clicks? From where? Is the score motor running, and if so does it stop running? Do the score reels reset?

Quoted from braincramp:

I've tried unplugging and plugging it back in right away but it has no effect.

The cooldown time (letting it sit overnight) suggests that something is heating up and either expanding to break electrical contact, or increasing resistance (as in a coil) to the point where current is interrupted. It sounds like there could be several possible culprits in either case. It would be hard to know without looking at it, testing continuity in lots of places, testing resistance on the toasty coils, etc.

Quoted from braincramp:

The game over relays are both open.

This seems like a good thing to investigate. With the machine off, can these be actuated manually with ease? Do they stay locked in position when they're actuated manually?

Quoted from braincramp:

If I push forward on the piece of nylon that makes the front relay close the score goes up 1000 points every time I close it.

Wild guess, but maybe this is part of the reset sequence -- trying to zero out the score reels. Will it continue incrementing 1000 points indefinitely, or only till it gets back to zero?

Last thing: it might be very helpful to see a picture of the game over relays at rest -- even better a video showing them being activated manually (with the machine off).

#24 9 years ago
Quoted from textrivers:

Following up on your answers:

The left flipper should activate the lights but should not reset the scores or start a game (someone correct me if I'm wrong). But maybe someone wired yours to start a game with the left flipper button.

Agreed, left flipper should turn on G I lighting only. Coin door button (if set on free play) should reset and increment player unit.

#25 9 years ago

Maybe a long shot: are the jones plugs of the door and the flippers at the right place?

Sounds like they are not at the right socket or right place.

#26 9 years ago

I was wrong about the left flipper. it only turns on the playing field lights. When I push start, a bunch of relays make noise,the score resets to 0 and the scoring motor seems to work. I can move the game over relays easily but neither one stays locked when it's turned on but not working.I'm going to see what they do if I get it to come back on and play. I'm not sure I know what Jones plugs are and I have no idea where they are supposed to be.

#27 9 years ago

Those are the male plugs, one coming from the door sitting on the left/front side.
Beside it sits the other one for the flippers, you can clean them with sandpaper.
Before you do so, unplug the machine!

#28 9 years ago
Quoted from braincramp:

I can move the game over relays easily but neither one stays locked when it's turned on but not working.

Sounds problematic! That'll probably need to be fixed, and might eliminate your problem.

About the jones plugs, see here: http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index2.htm#connect

#29 9 years ago

Made a little progress. I've discovered if I manually close the front relay on the game over relay the machine will work. How do I tell if the relay is shot or just out of adjustment ?

#30 9 years ago
Quoted from braincramp:

How do I tell if the relay is shot or just out of adjustment ?

I guess it depends on why it's not locking in. You'll have look closely at it, and actuate both parts back and forth (with machine off) to see what's preventing it from locking. If there's a broken nylon or something, it might be shot and just easier to replace. HOWEVER, my gut feeling is that it's just out of adjustment or needs some small modification so it will lock in, and stay locked in, instead of going to game over.

If there's any way you can take a picture and post it here, that would help. Video would be even better. Most phones can do both of these things. Any chance you or some young up-and-comer in your vicinity could create some digital media?

#31 9 years ago

I shot another video for you showing the Bally game over relay and it's states. Hoping it will help and as textrivers says if you could do the same that would be great.

#32 9 years ago

Thanks a ton for the video ! I have a much better understanding of how the game over relays work. When I was messing around with it the other day I did discover some things I think are my problem and ordered parts. When the game over relay is closed and working the machine had a fairly loud buzz. I found one of the coils on the total reset to be pretty well toast. It was so hot that when I touched the plunger in the coil it burnt the crap out of me. If I don't get it going I'll have my son come out and give me a quick lesson on posting videos.

#33 9 years ago

If you are ever looking for a boomerang schematic you can find one here in post #4.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bally-boomerang-1974-will-not-add-bonus-to-total-score-upon-drain

#34 9 years ago

Thank you TVP !

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