(Topic ID: 215551)

Bally - Black Pyramid - switch issues

By simonsrat

5 years ago



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#1 5 years ago

I have a problem with a couple of switches on my Black Pyramid. This is way out of my expertise, I can repair "mechanical" issues but this seems to be more electronic. I actually can not work out any start points from reading the repair guides or the forum.

The 3x roll over drop target "score" does not register

Started as an intermittent problem then became constant.
Replaced the switch and diode
- also swapped diode from 3x to working 2x switch and this switch continued to work

The "I" switch also does not work.

Both of these switches are on the same row of the switch matrix
- saucer and tilt are also on this row and both work.

I have chased the row wire
- 3x is the first switch in the chain, then it goes to "I" switch, then saucer and finally the slam tilt on the play field.
- there is continuity everywhere

Also I have now discovered the self test button on the door does not work.

If anyone can point me in a direction for more reading or can give me some pointers in where to go to from here, I would be most appreciative.

Attached is the switch matrix for the game.

Cheers,

Steven

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#2 5 years ago

Try to determine if the problem is in the board or the playfield. Disconnect the playfield, then use a jumper to ground pins A4J2-14 and A4J2-4. Does the game indicate switch 31 is closed now?

http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Bally/Stern#Switch_Matrix

Regarding your self-test switch here is more info from the Pinwiki link above: "It is worth mentioning that the self test switch, which is located on the inside of the coin door and used to enter tests, audits, and bookkeeping, is not part of the switch matrix. A single signal is sent to the self test switch from the U10 PIA on the CPU board via connection A4J3-1, and returned to ground via a connection A3J2-7 on the solenoid driver board."

#3 5 years ago

Hi YeOldPinPlayer

I am not sure how to test the board by jumping as there appears to be some "logic" involved in making switch 31(3x) work.

This seems to be the "logic" process as I have seen it while working on the problem.

2x switch activates on rollover drop target
then 3 x switch activates on rollover drop target
then 5x switch activate on rollover drop target
then rollover behind these drop targets activates
- spells "black"
- spells "pyramid"

then rollover becomes "letter D"
then goes back to
- spells "black"
- spells "pyramid"

The above 3 processes continue until the ball drains.

Nothing happens to any switch unless the prior process has occurred.

Note: The drop targets do not reset until the start of each ball.

At the start of a new ball it resets the whole process to the start.

While testing/investigating certain things with my multi meter I shorted out the x3 switch and the switch activated. Then the rest of the processes worked properly.

Further to this investigation everything appears identical between switch x2, x3 and x5. But switch x3 will not activate when the drop target falls even though I have conductivity on the switch according to my meter.

Now I am even more confused.

I have not looked at the test switch issue yet, wanted to just get this info down while it is clear in my head.

Thanks for your help,

Steven

#4 5 years ago

It sound like you have a broken wire somewhere.
In the Tech Chart I created you can see all the switches being used.
http://www.pinballrebel.com/pinball/cards/Tech_Charts/Bally_Black_Pyramid_Tech_Chart.pdf
In the original schematics you are missing a few to get the complete picture.
And there is an error in the original schematic for switches 24-32-40.

Check for connection between the "I" return lane and the In-Line drop target 3X (Brown-White) wire.

Peter
www.inkochnito.nl

#5 5 years ago

Peter,

Thanks for putting that tech chart together. It certainly cleared up a few things that were confusing me about the original schematic when I was chasing wiring around the machine. I know very little about switch matrixes and what I was finding and trying to understand on the web made little sense.

This is where I am at with the problem.

Potentially solved, but I did not get a huge opportunity to play the game for long so hopefully I did get the issue.

Problem is I do not know what actually may have fixed the problem as I got frustrated turning the machine on and off with each thing I have been trying and just went "all in"

- disconnected, stripped back wiring and resolded a number of switches x2 x3 x5 and "I"
- replaced diodes on the switches I worked on (even though meter showed they were good and I had replaced them already as part of the process)
- unplugged boards and plugged them back in
- wiggled and pulled wiring on a whole lot of switch connections

I had already done most of these things already except for stripping back wiring (but I had continuity on the wires when testing, maybe not enough?)

This was all before I saw your tech sheet

"I" switch still does not work ..... but "I" has always come on with "M" so I am not overly concerned but will look at this issue seperate after playing the game for a while and seeing if the x3 issue comes back. x3 is way more important as the game is basically useless with out the multiplier progressing.

So lets cross fingers and toes and pray to the pinball gods.

Cheers,

Steven

#6 5 years ago

The "M" and "I" lamps can be set to light seperatly by setting dipswitch 14 to off.
I also have a file for the back box cards, but would like to have some pictures from the real cards.
Maybe you can shoot a few for me...... please.....

Check the brown-white wire comming from the 3X drop target (if it has a double wire).
It should be connected to the "I" rollover switch in the return lane.

#7 5 years ago

Hi Peter,

Do you want clear photos of all of these?

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#8 5 years ago
Quoted from simonsrat:

Hi Peter,
Do you want clear photos of all of these?

Yes please!
You can send the images to inkochnito @ kpnplanet.nl

Peter

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