(Topic ID: 85292)

Bally/Stern AS-2518 Club !


By mof

5 years ago



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There are 1725 posts in this topic. You are on page 35 of 35.
#1701 8 days ago

You could have a little AC ripple from the 48+ volt bridge.
Spiking is definitely coming from the flippers.
You could also have a bad flipper diode.
I would try/test the flipper diodes 1st.

#1702 8 days ago

Future Spa, KISS, and Space Invaders use a unique power supply to these three games. This may have something to do with it. I think everyone so far is spot on from my experience. The little flicker does occur on pretty much every Bally to one degree or another. I'll let the engineer types chime in but I'd bet that the multitude of windings in the transformer to derive the different voltages plays a part. When the draw from four flippers happens on the +48v line, the emf puts the 7.5vac GI string sine wave out of kilter. Add that LED's are for the most part off or on, whereas incandescent filaments take a while (milliseconds) from cold to glow. Probably exacerbates the issue on this Future Spa. Anyone with a scope want to see what the 7.5vac GI line looks like when four flippers are energized?

#1703 8 days ago
Quoted from Nokoro:

I should say that I’m new to the club with a recently purchased, nicely refurbished Flash Gordon. I have a few lamp sockets that need buttoning up, but otherwise the game looks and plays great. Very happy with it.

Care to elaborate on the blacked out score windows?

#1704 8 days ago
Quoted from pinfixer:

Future Spa, KISS, and Space Invaders use a unique power supply to these three games. This may have something to do with it. I think everyone so far is spot on from my experience. The little flicker does occur on pretty much every Bally to one degree or another. I'll let the engineer types chime in but I'd bet that the multitude of windings in the transformer to derive the different voltages plays a part. When the draw from four flippers happens on the +48v line, the emf puts the 7.5vac GI string sine wave out of kilter. Add that LED's are for the most part off or on, whereas incandescent filaments take a while (milliseconds) from cold to glow. Probably exacerbates the issue on this Future Spa. Anyone with a scope want to see what the 7.5vac GI line looks like when four flippers are energized?

I have an Eight Ball with incandescent GI and I see the same effect. I also have a Future Spa and it behaves pretty similarly with LED GI. LEDs are current driven so they will dim with current changes, but without the same delay as a regular bulb. The GI winding is AC output and not regulated so very brute force design. I am not sure there is much you could do to change it. I also have a Xenon and a Flash Gordon and both have the bigger transformer in the cabinet with the rectifier board next to it. They do this a lot less. I suspect Bally beefed up the 6.3VAC winding on the transformer, maybe the old one was near its saturation point.

#1705 8 days ago
Quoted from pinfixer:

Care to elaborate on the blacked out score windows?

They aren't blacked out. The game is just off in the photo.

#1706 7 days ago
Quoted from BJM-Maxx:

I have an Eight Ball with incandescent GI and I see the same effect. I also have a Future Spa and it behaves pretty similarly with LED GI. LEDs are current driven so they will dim with current changes, but without the same delay as a regular bulb. The GI winding is AC output and not regulated so very brute force design. I am not sure there is much you could do to change it. I also have a Xenon and a Flash Gordon and both have the bigger transformer in the cabinet with the rectifier board next to it. They do this a lot less. I suspect Bally beefed up the 6.3VAC winding on the transformer, maybe the old one was near its saturation point.

Is there no way to use capacitors or some kind of capacitor circuit to solve these kinds of problems?

#1707 7 days ago
Quoted from jsa:

Is there no way to use capacitors or some kind of capacitor circuit to solve these kinds of problems?

Simplest thing to do is use a separate AC power supply and connect the GI to it. You could use a DC power supply which is likely easier to find since the GI circuit doesn't care if it is AC or not.
After doing all that I suspect there will always be some subtle effect from the flippers.

#1708 7 days ago
Quoted from barakandl:

I specialize is in Bally PCB repair. I have rebuilt hundreds of Bally / Stern MPUs. I know and have dealt with every about every failure in Bally boardsets. Feel free to ask me questions.

Does this sound like a PCB problem? Paragon boots (7 flashes). Put a quarter in and game racks up a credit. Credit button starts a game but none of the switches add points, no sounds, and no solenoids fire. It's like everything is dead. If I run the self test the lights flash, displays work, and the solenoids all fire. Any ideas?

#1709 7 days ago
Quoted from JethroP:

Does this sound like a PCB problem? Paragon boots (7 flashes). Put a quarter in and game racks up a credit. Credit button starts a game but none of the switches add points, no sounds, and no solenoids fire. It's like everything is dead. If I run the self test the lights flash, displays work, and the solenoids all fire. Any ideas?

Is it the playfield switch connector that feeds into the CPU?

#1710 7 days ago

Yeah sounds like your playfield switches are all unplugged or otherwise not registering

#1711 7 days ago

I didn't notice before, but the tilt light comes on after i start a game, and when I perform the self test, the tilt switch (one of three) is shown activated. Visually the switches are all open. I tested the diodes across the switches and they test good. The cap across the plumb bob doesn't appear to be shorted. What am I missing?

#1712 7 days ago
Quoted from JethroP:

I didn't notice before, but the tilt light comes on after i start a game, and when I perform the self test, the tilt switch (one of three) is shown activated. Visually the switches are all open. I tested the diodes across the switches and they test good. The cap across the plumb bob doesn't appear to be shorted. What am I missing?

Have you checked all the tilts?
There's the plum bob, ball roll, coin door slam, and under-playfield slamp.

-Hans

#1713 7 days ago
Quoted from HHaase:

Have you checked all the tilts?
There's the plum bob, ball roll, coin door slam, and under-playfield slamp.
-Hans

Yes, checked them all. Also checked at the MPU for closed switches and found none. Wondering if I am not checking something correctly? I checked across A4J2 pins 1 and 14. Checked across A4J3 pins 3 and 16, then across pins 2 and 15.

#1714 7 days ago

Could it be the capacitor on the tilt?

#1715 7 days ago
Quoted from newovad:

Could it be the capacitor on the tilt?

Yep! That was it! I checked it for shorts deenergized and it was ok, but when energized it conducted. I cut it out and game works!

#1716 4 days ago
Quoted from desertT1:

On Stars, on occasion 500 points and +1 bonus will trigger when the ball kicks into the shooter lane. I think it's one of the two button switches doing this. Aside from banging on the PF in game or switch test is there anything more I should be looking at for these potential phantom switch hits?

I think I fixed this. There are no caps on the rollover buttons. There are some on the 5 switches for the star inserts. When inspecting things I found a diode on one of those 5 that had one end pop free very easily when given a slight tug. On another it was already broken free and the other side was spinning freely, but snugly held inside the hole of the switch tab. Re-attached these 3 leads securely and tested a bunch of times and no free 500 point events happened.

#1717 4 days ago

Anyone have any recommendations on how to get rid of the yellow discoloration on the early Bally SS white chime boxes (is it even possible)? I've got my tilt board apart and decided to clean up the chimes in a Bally Black Jack. Ultrasonic cleaner took years of dirt and grime off of all the parts, and now I'm tumbling the metal bits over the weekend. I've got a chime rebuild kit for when things are ready to be re-assembled.

With the dirt and grime gone, the white chime resonance boxes show yellow discoloration. I've tried scrubbing with Mean Green and other cleaners, as well as Magic Eraser, and even tho I didn't expect that to help with the discoloration it did improve it slightly.

Can the discoloration be eliminated/further reduced somehow? Painting it doesn't seem like a good idea.

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#1718 4 days ago

Peroxide & UV method seems to be the way for this problem. Plenty of info on the net about it.

http://www.retrofixes.com/2013/10/how-to-clean-whiten-yellowed-plastics.html?m=1

#1719 3 days ago
Quoted from Joydivision:

Peroxide & UV method seems to be the way for this problem. Plenty of info on the net about it.
http://www.retrofixes.com/2013/10/how-to-clean-whiten-yellowed-plastics.html?m=1

Retrobriting is the way to go. Use liquid hydrogen peroxide over the paste.

#1720 2 days ago

Isn't there a new MPU replacement board out there that custom ROM can be used with? Alltek are definitely out, and so are Weebly board right?

#1721 2 days ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

Isn't there a new MPU replacement board out there that custom ROM can be used with? Alltek are definitely out, and so are Weebly board right?

This one? https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/mypinballs-custom-pinball-controller-for-ballystern-games/

#1722 2 days ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

Isn't there a new MPU replacement board out there that custom ROM can be used with? Alltek are definitely out, and so are Weebly board right?

Check w barakandl but the weebly mpu's do have an extra socket to run external roms

#1723 2 days ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

Isn't there a new MPU replacement board out there that custom ROM can be used with? Alltek are definitely out, and so are Weebly board right?

Quoted from Thrillhouse:

Check w barakandl but the weebly mpu's do have an extra socket to run external roms

Yes, barakandl's replacement Bally/Stern MPU board has a socket for an optional 27512 ROM that gives you 61k bytes of usable ROM space (up from the standard 8k bytes) and also increases the standard RAM size from 384 bytes to 3968 bytes.
If you're writing custom code you won't have to worry about running out of ROM/RAM space.

No other after market native 6800/6802 MPU board offers these expanded ROM/RAM features.

#1724 2 days ago

Able to coach me on this? QUENCH? barakandl? others?
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bally-2518-17-led-locked-on

#1725 2 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Yes, barakandl's replacement Bally/Stern MPU board has a socket for an optional 27512 ROM that gives you 61k bytes of usable ROM space (up from the standard 8k bytes) and also increases the standard RAM size from 384 bytes to 3968 bytes.
If you're writing custom code you won't have to worry about running out of ROM/RAM space.

No other after market native 6800/6802 MPU board offers these expanded ROM/RAM features.

ok so that was the only one i found as well:
https://pinside.com/pinball/market/shops/1055-nvramweeblycom/01281-new-universal-bally-stern-replacement-mpu-

I was just worried it wasn't going to be a straight pass through of custom ROM since there is only one socket (You know that cool Bally ST custom ROM comes in 2x 2732 chips )

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There are 1725 posts in this topic. You are on page 35 of 35.

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