It doesn't sound like a power drop to me as that would cause the MPU to reset. The rectifier connectors and boards used in Xenon and later are not as prone to issues like the earlier models. I'm not saying they don't go bad, but they're typically more robust than the earlier generations.

That said.....and this is a big stretch because I don't know/haven't studied how the Alltek architecture utilizes the ROM.....but the programs for all of the games are stored in one ROM. If a power spike or dropout caused the CPU to jump off track...maybe corrupted the stack pointer or something, AND the other banks of memory were accessible, processing could resume in another game's program. I would assume because of the DIP switches used for selecting the game, that is not possible, but could be investigated.

Maybe a capacitor/diode issue on that particular switch.

maybe just take the win and say "hell ya told ya dad would win " lol

Bleh, nope. Not old enough to understand that kind of humor. He gets super pissed that he loses at all....still has to learn that you can't just expect to excel at everything without putting in any kind of effort, or that his dad is really typically pretty good at pinball. ~_~

I am looking for some help with an issue that just cropped up on my Xenon.

I resoldered a loose connection under the playfield on one of the pop bumper light sockets (the power to the machine was turned off during the work) and upon attempting to restart the machine, it boots fine and calls out "Xenon" when the credit button is pushed but the number of credits is not reduced and the game does not start. Upon pushing the credit button a second time (or third, fourth, etc.), there is no response (it is "locked up). Additionally, the diagnostics button works after rebooting but will not work once the credit button is pushed, "Xenon" is called out and no game starts (it is also "locked up").

I have swapped out all of the socketed chips with a set known to work and I have used a TwoBits Pinball Fixit board in place of the game ROMs, all with the same results as reported above. Thoughts?

The game is not detecting a ball in the outhole. There should be one in the outhole and one in the trough. It will let you coin up and start a game, but waits until it sees both balls before continuing and allowing more players.

Odd question, would be interested in hearing other's thoughts.

I was talking to my boss today about those 28-pin headers, and since he's been desiging PCBs for a lot longer than I have, I asked him how he would handle connections like that, if he was to redesign the MPU boards. (Something like Alltek and their boards..)

I am against re-desining the larger headers - i.e. leave them as-is, and like mentioned above, use two smaller connector housings and fit them together. (Two 14-pins. Or a 14-pin and two 7's, etc.)

He was strongly for redesining the headers. (i.e. J4, where you have sol data going out and power coming in, he was for making it 'logical' - make an 8-pin header for sol data going out, and then the rest of the pins for power coming into the board.) His argument was this - you're making a new product, use whatever connectors you can that will help make it last. If that means the end-user has to do a little more work (repinning a header), that's an acceptable set-back, if it means that in twenty years, the users can still get 7-pin housings and not have to worry about piece-mealing multiple headers together.

So, I was just curious on thoughts - if someone like Alltek or Rottendog came out with a new MPU board, but it had some small changes to the connectors, would that turn you off?

I've been pondering a similar problem. 28 and 25 pin connectors are quickly going bye-bye with no suitable plug-and-play replacement. Better connectors are out there but you would have to have a way to retrofit for at least awhile. There are no easy answers and I am still looking for something. I get what you are saying and I think that it will be unavoidable at some point. But from a manufacturing standpoint it makes sense. Then again, why mess with what has worked for decades?

If the design changes were sensible it wouldn't turn me off, but I do think it could potentially alienate some of their customer base. I'd wager a sizable number of people who buy repro's do so because they lack the skill to repair the original boards themselves, which means having to rebuild a connector would probably be a big turn off. I worked on a game just a few weeks ago where the owner replaced the original -35 MPU with an Alltek to address battery damage, but failed to realize the corrosion had spread into the J4 connector as well.

Another thing to consider is once you redo a game's connectors it instantly becomes incompatible with the original board. I really like what Ni-wumpf did on their newest system 80 boards so you can use either the original bifurcated connectors or a new IDE ribbon cable. Forward thinking, but still backwards compatible.

Interesting, thanks for the discussion guys - Yeah, I agree that if it's NOT backwards compatible (directly) there should be a way to make it - i.e. add a second header to the board, or a small adapter cable to be able to plug the original harness into the new headers.

Can anyone tell me the shooter rod length for the beehive style (pre-1979) Sterns? Specifically Galaxy, in this case.

Thanks

I'll bump this as I'm curious as well.

Also add on, were the handles black, or steel? (Mine is steel/metal, and I haven't found a replacement online..)

8.5 inches, and i've only ever seen bare metal ends on these ,never painted as far as i know

Thanks much.

I'm throwing in the towel and admitting I need help. I know my way around B/Ws, but these older Bally's are new to me.

I have a Viking that I did a PF swap on and am putting it back together. The game barley played before teardown, and the boards were in so/so shape. A few direct solder jobs, some broken female housings, etc. So I decide to do it right and purchase a replacement Rectifer board (AS-2518-18) from K's arcade as my test voltages were boardline on the old one and it was toasty.

So I follow the instructions on pinwiki and get the new board soldered on. I turn it on, and no power. So I disconnect everything except J2 and still nothing. I check for voltages on the new rectifier board, nothing. Now, I don't have it fasted to the metal housing just yet.

So I look at my Frontier and noticed that there is connection between the metal housing, the metal bar with three drill holes, and the board. Maybe this is why I'm not getting any power. Trouble is, I don't know how to fasten the metal bard to the board. The holes are covered up by the heat sinks. See the picture.

http://ksarcade.net/new-rectifier-board-for-bally-and-stern-games.html

So, I'm hoping I'm really missing something obvious here, but I can't figure it out so here I am. I have reasonable faith that all my solder connections are correct...

Be gentle.

You're not missing a connection with the metal bar. It only serves as a spacer/heat sink so the board doesn't flex when screwed to the backing plate. With the rectifiers/heatsinks on the front you don't need the metal bar and don't need to screw it to the plate.

The first thing you need to do is look at the schematics and measure the AC voltages at the connect points on the rectifier. Post pics if you want us to look at it.

Hi guys, Centaur/Fathom & later owners whose games use the AS-2999 pop bumpers - where are you getting your A613-113 core plug assemblies when you have to replace them? I've searched for months and can't find them anywhere, and PBR, the one place I was sure would carry them, ran dry months ago. Or is there a service that will drill out & press in a new coil stop into the bracket when the old one wears down or mushrooms? This should be a pretty common part that's otherwise unobtainium.

Drill out the beat up stop and bolt in a Gottlieb A-4862+ that PBR has plenty of.

I am not getting any power to the rectifier.

I brought my Frontier and put the games side by side. With the Viking's J2 plugged into the rectifier board only, I get no test voltages, no power. When I bring the J2 plug from the Frontier and turn it on, I get test voltages. So there isn't any power getting to the rectifier board on the Viking.

Next I tested a light in the outlet at the bottom of the cabinet, nothing. No power and no AC voltage. So no AC is getting to the outlet. We next cut off the cord head and put on a new plug. Still no power to the outlet in the Viking cabinet.

So from here, I"m not sure where to go next. It appears that there isn't any AC power getting into the game. Should I replace the entire plug and cord and try that? What is frustrating is that I used to have power before I changed the rectifier board, so concerned on what I could have done to cause this. Any help is appreciated and here are some pics of the bottom of the cabinet, and the new rectifier board that I installed.

IMG_3122 (resized).JPG
IMG_3123 (resized).JPG
IMG_3124 (resized).JPG
IMG_3125 (resized).JPG
IMG_3126 (resized).JPG
IMG_3127 (resized).JPG

Do you get 100v AC on the top of the filter? (First pic..) If yes, do you get voltage on the BOTTOM of the filter?

Yes. Made some progress.

Not certain what I did, but there are a few twist nuts which I retightened, and we solidified the connection to the replaced plug. I now have 120V at the top of the filter, the outlet, and the switch lugs. Sure enough, I now have power to the rectifier board, however not out of the woods yet.

Here are the voltages at the test points with only J2 plugged in:

TP1 should be 5.4, I get 6.3.
TP2 should be 230, I get 128.
TP3 should be 11.9, I get 13.48.
TP4 should be 7.3AC, I get 7.3 AC.
TP5 should be 43, I get 45.2.

TP6 is ground and fine. So all looks ok, except TP2. So where do I go from this point? It is a brand new rectifier board, but since the voltage at TP3 is only half of what it should be, could it be from my solder connections to the transformer?

I refuse to give up as I love these games and want to learn how to work on them. Thanks.

If you measure across E8 and E10 you should be reading 173VAC. What do you get?

Just so I am doing this correctly...

Taking one lead and putting it on E8, the other on E10, I only get around 4.8 VAC. Switching the leads and I get the same. Is this where I should be getting the 173 VAC?

Actually doesn't look like anything is coming from E10, it's all on E8. All other Test points are the same as before.

One more question, appears that TP2 is the HV for the display. I'm going to be running new Pinscore LEDs for display in the game, so do I even care that TP2 is only half of what it should be?

TP1 (on AS2518-18) = 5.4 volts DC +/- .8 volts (4.6 to 6.2 volts). Fuse F1, bridge BR1. Used to power the "switched illumination" (feature lamps).
TP1 (on AS2518-49 & -54) = 6.5 volts DC (5.8 to 7.2 volts). Fuse F1, voltage regulator RP1 and RP2. Used to power the "switched illumination" (feature lamps).
TP2 = 230 volts DC, +/- 27 volts (203 to 257 volts). Fuse F2, diodes CR1 to CR4. Used to power the score displays.
TP3 = 12 volts DC (11 to 16 volts). Fuse F3, bridge BR2. Used to power the regulated +5 volts DC for the game's logic circuits.
TP4 = 7.3 volts AC, +/- 1.0 volts (6.3 to 8.3 volts). Fuse F5. Used to power the general illumination.
TP5 = 43 volts DC, +/- 5.4 volts (47.6 to 48.4 volts). Fuse F4, bridge BR3. Used to power all the coils.

Yes, one lead on E8 and the other on E10. And you're right, you don't need the HV for LED displays so you could just pull out fuse F2. Out of curiosity, what color wires do you have soldered to E8 and E10?

Looking for xenon sling plastics if anyone has extras. Thanks!

Does anybody make a replacement for this rectifier board? AS 2518-151? Some websites say a Dash 54 will replace it, but the inputs from the Transformer are clearly different.

bly-54pm_b_1 (resized).jpg

IMG_20161108_215221756 (resized).jpg

Rottendog makes the new version of the board.

The Rottendog one is the Dash 54 board ( two transformer input connectors). The 151 board I need has one transformer input

What game is that in?

Made some progress, then took a step back. Got all voltages within acceptable limits. Started to do the mods to the Driver and MDU. Then the high voltage stopped on the rectifier board, and the F2 fuse blew. Also the larger ceramic resistor is getting really hot.

I"m going to take a break and maybe post some photos of the back of the board. This project is taking too damn long.

Bally Gold Ball. It's burning on the back side. Still plays ok... for now. I'd like to replace it with a new board. Don't know of a direct plug n play replacement

IMG_20161117_050021464 (resized).jpg

If it ain't broke - don't fix it.

Gonna have to agree with the others here and say keep it going. I gave a cursory look to the schematics for your -151 vs a -54 and there are some fundamental differences, mostly concerning a separate circuit for the feature lamps of your particular game. I wanted to see if I could construct a sort of pigtail that would be plug and play to go from your transformer to a -54 board but it would require a lot more study and may not be possible.

At a minimum, I would recommend getting a replacement for R-1(600 Ohm, 10 watt) and solder in the new one off of the board to lessen the heat transference. Leave maybe a 1/4" or so between the body of the resistor and the board. You may also want to inspect closer where the one pin from the transformer is heating up the board and check for a cracked solder connection. Reflowing the solder will not hurt anything. Otherwise, leave it be and enjoy the game! That board looks pretty good for being 34 years old...

Shawn
3rd Coast Pinball

Thanks for the suggestions. I did notice the pin at the Transformer and reflowed the solder, it was cracked. And I will replace the resistor and lift it. I would rather replace with new and updated components, but that may not be possible. Gold Ball has some weird boards. Besides the 151, it has the Lamp Driver and Solenoid Driver on the same board ( only used in a few games).

It is an odd bunch of boards. And being solid state, the components really haven't changed much. Take care of it and it should last another 35 years.

I have an MPU from and EBD that was working fine and then locked on (no flashes, just a constant-on LED). I replaced it with an Alltek MPU but I have been working on the original board trying to get it working. I tested all of the socketed chips (6800, PIAs, 6820 and 5101) in a working MPU and they are all fine. The reset section is working fine (voltages check out on the 6800 and pin 40 goes low when shorting the resistor junction to ground in the reset section). I went to a shotgun approach and replaced every chip and all of the sockets on the board, but it is still locked on.

I put the board on the bench next to a working AS-2518 and powered up both at the same time so that I could check voltages and probe outputs for each one. I have discovered that pins 10 through 19 of U11 on the locked board are dead (no reading with the multimeter nor the probe). Thoughts? Any help would be appreciated.

I need to replace the connector at the MPU - J1 of my Kings of Steel pinball machine. Anyone know the part number of the connector & the tool I need to replace it?????

Cracked solder joints and/or a bad socket. (Is it a "Scanbee" socket by chance?) It the chips are known good I would reflow the solder on the socket (with the chip removed) and then do a continuity check between the top and bottom of the socket.

The plug that connects to the MPU or the part on the MPU it plugs into?

All sockets were removed/replaced and all of the unsocketed chips were removed, sockets installed, and new chips installed.

My display #2 shows the same as the credit display. I replaced the MPU with a different MPU & it didn't fix the problem. The connector continuity from the MPU to the displays checks out but I think I need to change the plug. The header pins are fine. I need the part number for the plug & whatever tools I need to replace it....

Go to greatplainselectronics.com and get this crimping tool: https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=W-HT-1921

Go here: https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/categories.asp?cat=7 for pins, housings, contacts, etc. Ed has it all.

I have a question that y'all will make fun of me for, I know it:

I have a Mr. & Mrs. Pac-Man (Bally) that I'm shopping it for someone, and I see that there's a bulb under the apron with a frosted white "insert plug" in the apron. ..What's that for?

That the credit light.

Thanks I definitely love GPE but more specifically, do you know the part number for the connector housing pictured below?

image-36 (resized).jpg

22-01-2281

Except it's obsolete and has been for a few years I think.

There's some listed on eBay:
ebay.com link: Molex connector 22 01 2281 28 position

I think I have a few as well.. but literally just a few.

Not sure if there's an alternate part number, I don't think I found one with limited searching a while back -- so it might just be something used in such few products that Molex completely did away with it. Doesn't look like Ed has any in-stock.. or anything above a 24pos in the GPE Value Line connectors. You could of course combine 2x 14pos connectors, etc but it's kind of nicer to have the 28pos one.

Big Daddy still has 28 pin housings:

http://www.bigdaddy-enterprises.com/electronics/e_connectors-100.htm

Regarding the crimpers, I'd recommend springing for the 1026-CT crimpers GPE sells. Much better quality than the Waldom crimpers linked to above and they'll do just about any size crimp you're likely to encounter in pinball.

Hello all, new to the club. Just bought my first Bally Kings of Steel. So far having a little trouble getting it fired up.

I brought it home and got it all cleaned up and started to diagnose.. here's what I've discovered so far:
GI lights come on.
No displays.
Game won't start.
No sound.
All flippers move freely,
No burnt up coils, although really dirty.
One drop target looks like it needs fixed.

Went ahead and reseated all the connectors in the backbox... nothing. Has a lithium battery on the board but no corrosion whatsoever.
I got the playfield lifted up and reset all the connectors on the board down there and I notice some fuses on the board below.

I check the fuses and I find one blown fuse that says 5v unreg, I didnt have a 4 amp 250 fuse on hand (that's what I pulled out of it)

What do you think? that fuse may be my culprit?

Thanks for the advice.

Page 33, http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/1382/Bally_1984_Kings_of_Steel_English_Manual_Schematics.pdf

No MPU gurus out there???