(Topic ID: 246871)

Bally 6M$M pop up not working during gameplay


By robm

9 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 12 posts
  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 months ago by Ballypinball
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

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#1 9 months ago

Have a 6 million dollar man that I am repairing. The original mpu had leaky batteries so put a weebly mpu in there. Also put a new rectifier board and repinned and replugged most connectors.

So the only issue I have is the pop up post between the flippers does not work in gameplay. It however tests fine in test menus.

Verified that switch in top hole which activates pop up works in test menu along with rollovers in mid playfield work.

When I ground each of the coil signal wires or drive transistors from solenoid driver board, they all work including the pop up and pop down post.

In gameplay, when the ball lands in the top hole, it makes the appropriate sound and the light for the pop up post comes on, however it doesn't pop up. And when I hit the lower rollover switches, the light goes out.

It's almost like there is a software setting to disable the coil, but the menu doesn't detail anything like that.

Any ideas or further tests?

#2 9 months ago

The standup target in front of the centre pop bumper also raises the "play more" post - does that standup do anything?

Note in solenoid test mode, the solenoids are activated for a slightly longer period than in normal game mode. Maybe there's a mechanical issue that the shorter in game pulse causes the post to fail springing back up. Put your finger on the lift coil bracket to see if you can feel any movement when the coil is being activated to raise the post.

When you briefly ground pin 10 of U3 on the solenoid driver board, does the post lift?

#3 9 months ago

you really should re-pin all the connectors, that games 41 year old
if those are the original. sound like sign is getting to light, and sound boards, but not the driver board.

#4 9 months ago
Quoted from Quench:

The standup target in front of the centre pop bumper also raises the "play more" post - does that standup do anything?
Note in solenoid test mode, the solenoids are activated for a slightly longer period than in normal game mode. Maybe there's a mechanical issue that the shorter in game pulse causes the post to fail springing back up. Put your finger on the lift coil bracket to see if you can feel any movement when the coil is being activated to raise the post.
When you briefly ground pin 10 of U3 on the solenoid driver board, does the post lift?

Standup target does the same as the hole - ie: lights post but doesn't pop up. That stand up works fine in switch test.

Coil test will NOT fire the coil to pop post up, only grounding the Q12 TIP102. Also grounding pin 9 (that is the one that goes to Q12) of U3 does nothing.

Does this indicate U3 is cactus? Are the CA3081 chips available, or is there a substitute? I am in Australia so parts are not quite as common as US.

#5 9 months ago

Sounds like Q12 is bad. Grounding the tab of the transistor replaces what the transistor's function is but it doesn't prove that the component is good. Grounding the component farther back would be the test for Q12, which it sounds like you're doing, and finding out it's not working.

#6 9 months ago

Can you please elaborate on the statement below you originally made because it came across as the pop up post working in solenoid test mode: How did it "test fine in test menus"?

Quoted from robm:

the pop up post between the flippers does not work in gameplay. It however tests fine in test menus.

The next test is to grab a jumper wire, hook one end to test point TP6 on the solenoid driver board. Briefly touch the other end on the banded side of diode CR12.
If the pop up post raises then transistor Q12 is good and the fault is either U3 or diode CR12.
If the pop up post doesn't raise then transistor Q12 is faulty.

CA3081 are available internationally on ebay and AliExpress. If you're doing board repairs it's worth grabbing a couple to have on hand.

#7 9 months ago
Quoted from Quench:

Can you please elaborate on the statement below you originally made because it came across as the pop up post working in solenoid test mode: How did it "test fine in test menus"?

The next test is to grab a jumper wire, hook one end to test point TP6 on the solenoid driver board. Briefly touch the other end on the banded side of diode CR12.
If the pop up post raises then transistor Q12 is good and the fault is either U3 or diode CR12.
If the pop up post doesn't raise then transistor Q12 is faulty.
CA3081 are available internationally on ebay and AliExpress. If you're doing board repairs it's worth grabbing a couple to have on hand.

OK - i was a bit flakey on memory when i wrote the first post, and it was all the switches worked, but not that coil in the test - apologies about that.

Jumpered TP6 to banded end of CR12 and the post raises, therefore, based on the above info, i will try and replace the diode first (assume 1N4001 is OK?) as i have them, and then scout around for the elusive CA3081 if there are no alternatives

#8 9 months ago
Quoted from robm:

(assume 1N4001 is OK?)

Nope, 1N4001 is no good - it's a 50V part. Solenoid voltage spikes coming back through capacitor C7 next to it will end up killing that diode. Scrounge a 1N4004 from somewhere.

Measure the voltages at pins 9 and 10 of U3.
Compare them to the voltages at pins 9 and 10 of U1 and pins 9 and 10 of U4. Are the U3 voltages different?

The CA3081 is just a transistor array. Potentially one of its internal transistors is faulty. There are ways of getting around it, but lets see what happens with the voltage measurements and CR12 replacement first.

#9 9 months ago

Update... New diode and its all sorted. Thanks heaps for the assistance!

#10 9 months ago
Quoted from robm:

Standup target does the same as the hole - ie: lights post but doesn't pop up. That stand up works fine in switch test.
Coil test will NOT fire the coil to pop post up, only grounding the Q12 TIP102. Also grounding pin 9 (that is the one that goes to Q12) of U3 does nothing.
Does this indicate U3 is cactus? Are the CA3081 chips available, or is there a substitute? I am in Australia so parts are not quite as common as US.

All those parts are common as in any Country, we have thousands of both in stock

#11 9 months ago
Quoted from Ballypinball:

All those parts are common as in any Country, we have thousands of both in stock

Good to hear Wayne. Yeah TIP102's are easy to come by, however i can't find the CA3081 when i search on your site - is it listed under a different part number? I'm probably doing an order in the next few weeks, so might grab a few

#12 9 months ago
Quoted from robm:

Good to hear Wayne. Yeah TIP102's are easy to come by, however i can't find the CA3081 when i search on your site - is it listed under a different part number? I'm probably doing an order in the next few weeks, so might grab a few

need to email we don't list the millions of electronic Components we use for repairs

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