(Topic ID: 243585)

Bally SS Grand Slam low voltage from power supply module for displays

By Pin_Bob

4 years ago



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  • 10 posts
  • 2 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Quench
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 4 years ago

Hi Everyone! I have a Bally Grand Slam 1983 pinball that has flickering displays. I substituted all the displays into another game (Mystic) and they checked out fine. I checked the voltage at the high voltage section of the solenoid driver board and I am only getting 135 volts with the adjustment pot turned all the way up. The unregulated voltage is about 163 V DC. The voltage at the test point on the power supply module that drives the high voltage is also at 163V DC (should be 230 V DC). The voltage into the set of diodes CR1, CR2, CR3, CR4 (essentially a bridge rectifier) is correct at 170 V AC. The voltage into the back side of the 4 diodes (bridge) is correct at 6.5 V AC. I replaced all 4 diodes but the output from the high voltage section is still 163 V DC. Any ideas?

#3 4 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

It sounds like you've got an open circuit at the high voltage capacitor at C5 on the solenoid driver board. Its purpose is to filter DC ripple and store energy to raise the voltage going into the high voltage regulator circuit.
Check the back of the solenoid driver board at C5 for cracked/fractured solder joints. If solder joints are ok, replace C5.
The flickering you're seeing is the lack of C5 filtering the DC ripple.

Quench, thank you for your help. I am not sure if I am missing something here. The voltage as it leaves the Power Supply Module is below spec. It is supposed to be about 230V DC but it is only about 163V DC. I also used two different meters to measure it with the same reading. Would a problem with a capacitor on the solenoid driver board affect the voltage level leaving the Power Supply Module? I wouldn't think so but please let me know...
.

Bob

#5 4 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

The unregulated voltage out of a standalone rectifier board when the solenoid driver board is not connected is about 170V. In your case capacitor C5 is not working for whatever reason that you need to investigate.

Absolutely. The capacitor stores energy and brings the voltage up to what you are expecting.
Unfortunately the voltages listed on the Bally schematics are a bit all over the shop. For example, TP5 on the rectifier board is listed as 11.5VDC. You will only read this voltage when the solenoid driver board is disconnected. When you connect the solenoid driver board the large capacitor at C4 stores energy, filters a lot of the DC ripple and brings the voltage up to between 14.5 - 16.5 volts range.
So, the 11.5V voltage at TP5 is listed with respect to the solenoid driver board NOT connected.
The 230V voltage at TP1 is listed with respect to the solenoid driver board being connected.
See the waveform diagram below. The RMS readings are what your meter will read out.
The DC voltages on a standalone rectifier board are represented by the "Rectifier DC Waveform"
When you connect the solenoid driver board which applies the filter caps to the unreg HV and Logic supplies, the waveforms become "Filtered (via capacitor) DC waveform". You can see the capacitor in circuit raises the voltages.
[quoted image]

Fantastic information. I am still learning how circuits work! I will try this and circle back later. Thank you VERY much for your help!

#6 4 years ago

Quench, you were right! I re-flowed the solder at the C5 capacitor and I now have the correct voltage! The displays no longer flicker.

On one of the displays it works for a few seconds then all of the segments light and stay lit. On one of the other displays it works fine except the top segment in each of the six characters stay lit. The others work fine. Any idea where to start on these two problems?

#8 4 years ago

Quench,

I already reflowed the header pins of the display that shows all 8s previously. I will try the freeze spray and the other recommendation for the display with the stuck upper segments and circle back later. Thank you for all of your help!

#9 4 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

The top segment is listed a segment "a" on the display schematic. Transistor Q13 drives that segment. Test Q13 for a short (use transistor Q14 as a reference for measurements). If Q13 is ok, suspect the 4543 BCD decoder chip. Pin 9 from the chip drives segment "a".

I tested the transistor and it was good. I then replaced the decoder chip and now this display works perfect. I socketed the chip as well. Thank you!

Quoted from Quench:

Check that you're getting good continuity on the display latch strobe signal on pin 15 on that displays connector.
Also check that you're getting good continuity on the display blanking signal at pin 10.
Effectively check the solder joints on the pin header of that display for fractured/cracked solder joints.
But my suspicion is that the 4543 BCD decoder chip on the display board is faulty. If you have electronic freeze spray or aerosol air duster (it expels cold air) spray some on the 4543 chip to cool it down and see if the problem goes away for a few seconds.

I re-flowed all the header pins but that did not solve the problem. I then replaced the decoder chip as well and now this display works perfect. I socketed the chip as well. Thank you!

I have one other display from my Mystic game that I replaced with a 5v replacement display because it was completely dead - no lights at all. How would I confirm my suspicion of a bad glass on this one? Thank you for all of your help!

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