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(Topic ID: 170183)

Bad Seller Alert


By jrpinball

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 51 posts
  • 27 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Xerico
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    There are 51 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
    -5
    #1 4 years ago

    Unfortunately I have to post this warning about a fellow Pinsider who decided to bone me on a deal. Be careful dealing with this guy.
    Follow the link. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/1952-skill-pool-395-free-delivery-to-york-working#post-3376417

    Moderator edit: Thread title edited to remove seller full name. The Pinside team believes that this is not necessarily a "bad seller" - but simply a case of a deal that didn't go through. While it is very unfortunate when a seller decides not to sell at the last minute, that does not warrant dragging someones name through the mud for all (including search engines) to see.

    -13
    #2 4 years ago

    Until the money changes hands, I don't see that anyone owes you anything. If you were driving to his house and the story changed when you got there, maybe then, but it sounds like he changed his mind or found a buyer for more money which is totally his right. You're out how much cash now? $0? That's right. Move on and find another machine. If you wanted it that badly you should have driven to his house ASAP instead of waiting for delivery or a meet part way.

    45
    #3 4 years ago
    Quoted from Darkwing:

    Until the money changes hands, I don't see that anyone owes you anything. If you were driving to his house and the story changed when you got there, maybe then, but it sounds like he changed his mind or found a buyer for more money which is totally his right. You're out how much cash now? $0? That's right. Move on and find another machine. If you wanted it that badly you should have driven to his house ASAP instead of waiting for delivery or a meet part way.

    You just summed up what's wrong in society right now. A man's word is worth nothing. Keep scolding the guy who thought he had the deal instead of the guy that broke his word. Great example.

    #4 4 years ago
    Quoted from Darkwing:

    Until the money changes hands, I don't see that anyone owes you anything. If you were driving to his house and the story changed when you got there, maybe then, but it sounds like he changed his mind or found a buyer for more money which is totally his right. You're out how much cash now? $0? That's right. Move on and find another machine. If you wanted it that badly you should have driven to his house ASAP instead of waiting for delivery or a meet part way.

    Yet there is a thread full of slander towards Craigslist sellers who sell to the douchebag guys who offer $1,000 on a severely underpriced $200 listing on something like a DMD game to skip ahead of all of the other e-mails that they were in line behind, compared to the good sellers who honor those that were first regardless. Can't remember the thread, but I must agree with that consensus and am failing to see the difference here.

    Sure, it's ILLEGAL once that money changes hands and you don't provide, but that isn't what JR is saying, he is just saying the guy broke his word and called him a "chump", not a criminal.

    Even if he just decided to keep it, it was an awful time to back out at the very end of things.

    #5 4 years ago
    Quoted from badbilly27:

    You just summed up what's wrong in society right now.

    I can actually cite like a million things that are more wrong about society right now. And to suggest that deals not going through is something new, and in fact not something that has been going on since capitalism was invented, is kinda silly.

    I'm sure cliff will have some version of the story that's different. This whole thing is kinda pointless, shit happens. I had a "deal" with a guy to pick up 3 games last week and then he changed his mind. Another pinsider ended up with them. Kinda blows but seriously what would be the point of dragging the whole thing out here?

    Shit happens sometimes. That's one of the many problems with society today. And yesterday. And next year.

    #6 4 years ago

    Easy come easy go

    At least you didn't buy a Predator

    #7 4 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Kinda blows but seriously what would be the point of dragging the whole thing out here?

    So other people don't bother wasting their time, IMO. It could only happen that one time, or it could happen a bunch more times. I guess nobody ever knows.

    #8 4 years ago

    Sorry about your deal going bad, but it could have gone the other way, he brings it to you and it turns out to be a turd and you back out. Shit happpens!

    #9 4 years ago

    I don't consider the "game is mine" until it is in my possession. The seller should of honored his word but I guess it isn't worth much.

    #10 4 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    That's one of the many problems with society today.

    Agreed.

    #11 4 years ago
    Quoted from Otaku:

    So other people don't bother wasting their time, IMO. It could only happen that one time, or it could happen a bunch more times. I guess nobody ever knows.

    Hasnt cliff been around this hobby for like a million years?

    I'm pretty sure dealing with him isn't a total mystery. Sometimes shit happens. "Bad seller" posts should be reserved for actual bad deals, not stuff like this, but some people just can't resist the drama.

    #12 4 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Hadn't cliff been around this hobby for like a million years?
    I'm pretty sure dealing with him isn't a total mystery. Sometimes shit happens. "Bad seller" posts should be reserved for actual bad deals, not stuff like this, but some people just can't resist the drama.

    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Kinda blows but seriously what would be the point of dragging the whole thing out here?

    Not primarily to shame the guy, but to warn others about dealing with him. I've been shit on for NOT outing people who I've had bad experiences with! No one wants to deal with someone who can't keep his word, or do you?

    -2
    #13 4 years ago

    id still deal with cliff. Your story - if every word is absolutely true - really ain't enough to put me off of it. And we've all seen this movie a million times: if cliff comes here he will have a different side to the story.

    End of the day you are out absolutely nothing except you didn't get a chance to buy a game you wanted and are disappointed. So yes I guess we can all consider that if we ever want to deal with cliff. You probably shouldn't deal with him again since you don't seem satisfied with the experience.

    #14 4 years ago
    Quoted from Electrocute:

    I don't consider the "game is mine" until it is in my possession. The seller should of honored his word but I guess it isn't worth much.

    I didn't consider it mine, those were his words. I expect someone to honor his word once he posts something for sale and his terms are met. So someone offered him more. Be a man about it, and tell me straight up. Don't give me a bullsh*t excuse! You're right though that his word obviously isn't worth much.
    Levi said he's been in this hobby "like for a million years". So, he should know what he has and what it's worth to him before posting an ad in at least two places. He's not ignorant like some homeowner who is about to sell a Gottlieb "Mermaid" for $100 because it's in his way.
    In that case, I can somewhat understand someone changing their mind once they find out what they have.

    #15 4 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    f every word is absolutely true - really ain't enough to put me off of it. And we've all seen this movie a million times: if cliff comes here he will have a different side to the story.

    Do you want to see the text string between Cliff and me? I've quoted exactly what he's said. Go ahead and deal with someone who can't keep his word. I get burned once, and you're gone!

    -2
    #16 4 years ago

    You're allowed to back out of deals last minute. It's not a deal unless you paid in full.

    17
    #17 4 years ago

    Your not allowed to back out of deal once you've given your word unless you're a dick!

    #18 4 years ago
    Quoted from pinbum:

    Sorry about your deal going bad, but it could have gone the other way, he brings it to you and it turns out to be a turd and you back out. Shit happpens!

    I had seen the game in person before he acquired it, so I knew what it was. And, he gave a very accurate and honest description of it, plus photos. I've always honored my end of deals. I've bought turds that I've driven a long way to get, because I said I would. You make a deal, you honor it. Plain and simple. You win, you lose, but you always honor your word once you agree on a deal. It's your responsibility to make sure what you're buying is to your satisfaction, and what you're asking is what will make you happy.

    14
    #19 4 years ago
    Quoted from Msch:

    You're allowed to back out of deals last minute. It's not a deal unless you paid in full.

    It's a deal when both parties agree on terms. It's finalized when funds and goods exchange hands. In my world anyway.

    #20 4 years ago
    Quoted from Msch:

    You're allowed to back out of deals last minute. It's not a deal unless you paid in full.

    Legally, true. Morally, not true.

    Even if it was a legitimate emergency, he could have clarified or create an explained delay in the sale.

    #21 4 years ago

    I agree with The OP and badbilly. The same thing happened to me. The seller told me he needed to think about selling a game because he was having doubts but if he sold it I had dibs. We had been talking about it and I told him I wanted to buy it. I was patient, professional and courteous to the seller. Dude turned around and sold it to his friend, a Pinsider here, without as much as a mention to me.

    I have zero issue with the Pinsider who bought it and, in fact, he's been cool about the situation but that is a pretty crappy thing for the seller to do. Get a sack and tell me you decided to sell it to your friend instead. The funny thing is I called him out on it and he wouldn't even respond.

    #22 4 years ago
    Quoted from Msch:

    You're allowed to back out of deals last minute. It's not a deal unless you paid in full.

    That's actually not true at all. A verbal contract is just as legally binding as a written one. Obviously someone can go to court and lie about a verbal contract much easier, but going in and saying "I changed my mind" isn't a legal defense or a moral one.

    #23 4 years ago
    Quoted from 7Warpig7:

    That's actually not true at all. A verbal contract is just as legally binding as a written one. Obviously someone can go to court and lie about a verbal contract much easier, but going in and saying "I changed my mind" isn't a legal defense or a moral one.

    Not so easy any more with email and text messages as evidence. I surely wouldn't even consider that though. Not worth it to me. I can let it go, but I feel the need to alert others about my experience dealing with this person. I feel I'm obligated to do so, so that others can avoid potential disappointments or worse.

    #24 4 years ago

    I am not taking sides here but I took 16 machines to Allentown this Spring and about 1/2 were suppose to be pre sold. Trying to be fair & honest I wouldn't sell the stuff I was holding for people. Guess what - of the 8 or 9 I had pre sold only TWO guys actually showed up and one of the two stopped by to tell me on Saturday he found another machine he wanted more. So I ended up bringing home a bunch of machines I could have sold.

    I sold all but one of the machines I took that I wasn't holding for someone and would have likely sold most of the ones I held if they were for sale during the show. (Two or three I had offers over my asking price but still could not sell them because I was holding them for people who didn't show).

    I see both sides of these stories but next year I will ONLY hold machines for people who send me a non refundable deposit.

    The BEST way to make sure someone is serious is to see some money. In my eyes 5 or 10% non refundable (unless machine isn't as described) is more than fair to both parts. But going forward I will no longer hold machines for people unless I know them personally.

    #25 4 years ago

    Same thing happened to me with a guy from Bakersfield that had a Sing Along. He was more blatant however and told me as I was leaving my house for the trip that he sold it to someone else who offered $50 more.

    #26 4 years ago

    Sorry for your loss thoughts and prayers. Thou shalt not cast harsh judgment on thy neighbor for ye know not the valleys he must ford.

    #27 4 years ago

    I had a verbal agreement to buy a game from a very reputable Pinside seller once. Based on his reputation, the pics, and the price I told him I would take it. We were having trouble coordinating our availability on when I could pick it up as it was about a four hour round trip for me. While we were ironing that out he got a trade offer that intrigued him. He said I was first in line but the trade was something he always wanted. I wasn't going to be a jerk so I told him it was up to him. He ended up taking the trade. I was dissapointed but a couple months later I found the same title for a little more but in excellent shape and with a few extra features the other didn't have. Sometimes these things work out for the best and I have no hard feelings.

    #28 4 years ago
    Quoted from Elvisinmypants:

    Sorry for your loss thoughts and prayers. Thou shalt not cast harsh judgment on thy neighbor for ye know not the valleys he must ford.

    Yeah, I guess so...

    #29 4 years ago
    Quoted from 7Warpig7:

    That's actually not true at all. A verbal contract is just as legally binding as a written one. Obviously someone can go to court and lie about a verbal contract much easier, but going in and saying "I changed my mind" isn't a legal defense or a moral one.

    Basic contract law states that consideration is a required component of a contract, ie payment of some kind. A verbal agreement without consideration is NOT a contract and even if it was, the next level of contract law will inform you that a court can't enforce the carrying out of the contract, it can only seek remedy. So unless there were damages to claim, the idea of court is pointless.

    #30 4 years ago
    Quoted from supermatt:

    I had a verbal agreement to buy a game from a very reputable Pinside seller once. Based on his reputation, the pics, and the price I told him I would take it. We were having trouble coordinating our availability on when I could pick it up as it was about a four hour round trip for me. While we were ironing that out he got a trade offer that intrigued him. He said I was first in line but the trade was something he always wanted. I wasn't going to be a jerk so I told him it was up to him. He ended up taking the trade. I was dissapointed but a couple months later I found the same title for a little more but in excellent shape and with a few extra features the other didn't have. Sometimes these things work out for the best and I have no hard feelings.

    That sounds like a totally different situation, and I'm glad it worked out for both of you.

    #31 4 years ago
    Quoted from TimeBandit:

    Basic contract law states that consideration is a required component of a contract, ie payment of some kind. A verbal agreement without consideration is NOT a contract and even if it was, the next level of contract law will inform you that a court can't enforce the carrying out of the contract, it can only seek remedy. So unless there were damages to claim, the idea of court is pointless.

    Yeah, you're getting into a much higher level here, which to me is ridiculous to even consider. Thanks for the input though.

    #32 4 years ago
    Quoted from Elvisinmypants:

    ye know not the valleys he must ford.

    Fjord ?

    #33 4 years ago
    Quoted from jrpinball:

    Yeah, you're getting into a much higher level here, which to me is ridiculous to even consider. Thanks for the input though.

    Exactly, you don't need to go there. It was a response to another post.

    #34 4 years ago

    ford - Dictionary Definition : Vocabulary.com
    https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/ford
    When you're out hiking in the wilderness, you may have to ford a river if there's no bridge. Roll up your pant legs because you'll have to wade through the

    #35 4 years ago

    Bah. I'm still saying fjord.
    You like Viking metal Joey ?

    #36 4 years ago

    Never played Oregon Trail? Gotta ford the river.

    #37 4 years ago

    If you Chevy it, you won't have to keep stopping for repairs.

    #38 4 years ago

    Whilst listening to Aamon Amarth, we fjorded that damn river. Right ?

    15
    #39 4 years ago
    Quoted from jrpinball:

    Unfortunately I have to post this warning about a fellow Pinsider who decided to bone me on a deal. Be careful dealing with this guy.
    Follow the link. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/1952-skill-pool-395-free-delivery-to-york-working#post-3376417

    Wow Joe, really? The only thing your post did was make me feel really good I did not end up selling you this game.

    I've known you for what, about 10 years? We never even had a harsh word. Last time you mentioned my name on Pinside was here:
    "I was at his place years ago, and he had a full blown hot dog serving station going. It was a fun night. Got a free Williams "King Pin" cabinet from him while I was there. Thanks, Cliff!".

    So because I had a change of heart on this particular deal and apologized to you for it, you decide to publicly slam my name?

    The way you wrote this post by saying "this person", it would appear you never even knew me before this - unbelievable.

    I honestly don't know what to say to the others reading this thread, other than I have a very solid reputation as both a buy/seller and anyone who has ever dealt with me would readily attest to it.

    Joe, I hope it was worth burning a bridge for - I would have never imagined you would do this.

    #40 4 years ago

    IMG_3358 (resized).PNG

    #41 4 years ago

    Viking bangs.
    For I cannot see the frost upon us...

    #42 4 years ago

    0e0bda (resized).jpg

    #43 4 years ago
    Quoted from cpiel:

    Wow Joe, really? The only thing your post did was make me feel really good I did not end up selling you this game.
    I've known you for what, about 10 years? We never even had a harsh word. Last time you mentioned my name on Pinside was here:
    "I was at his place years ago, and he had a full blown hot dog serving station going. It was a fun night. Got a free Williams "King Pin" cabinet from him while I was there. Thanks, Cliff!".
    So because I had a change of heart on this particular deal and apologized to you for it, you decide to publicly slam my name?
    The way you wrote this post by saying "this person", it would appear you never even knew me before this - unbelievable.
    I honestly don't know what to say to the others reading this thread, other than I have a very solid reputation as both a buy/seller and anyone who has ever dealt with me would readily attest to it.
    Joe, I hope it was worth burning a bridge for - I would have never imagined you would do this.

    I hope you guys get it sorted out. This doesn't seem to be important enough to lose a friend over.

    -1
    #44 4 years ago
    Quoted from dmbjunky:

    I hope you guys get it sorted out. This doesn't seem to be important enough to lose a friend over.

    No, it was REALLY important that someone decided to smear a longtime asset to the hobby over something so trivial without even trying to work it out with him first. It's great that people think the best thing to do is go running here with this stupid bullshit.

    What do you think badbilly? Is stuff like this what's wrong with society today?

    #45 4 years ago

    SO...you couldn't fjord that river.
    and I dont give a damn anyway (resized).jpg
    And maybe I don't give a damn anyway.

    #46 4 years ago

    Charge your phone!

    #47 4 years ago
    Quoted from Mudflaps:

    Charge your phone!

    He is!

    #48 4 years ago

    Why doesn't the guy with the machine just sell it after he is done dealing with the emergency and everything will be all good again.

    #49 4 years ago

    I've known Cliff a long time and this thread is unwarranted, imo. Cliff is one of the good guys. Things happen and the OP isn't out anything.

    #50 4 years ago
    Quoted from yellowghost:

    Why doesn't the guy with the machine just sell it after he is done dealing with the emergency and everything will be all good again.

    Because there was no emergency and he wanted to keep it.

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