(Topic ID: 169172)

Bad girls again

By gregh

7 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 22 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by gregh
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#1 7 years ago

So as my last post said, I finally had my bad girls working. My buddy who is an electrical engineer and repairs circut for dnd looked at my mpu. He replaced a few broken traces, fixed up the daughter board and repaired a broken connector on the reset circut. After that it is working beautifully. We played it the other night for a few hours, but today we went to have a game and it's locking up again.

Basically, it will boot up, go into attract mode, take credits, but when you hit the start button it locks up. I've gone into diagnostics mode, and everything tests fine. It shows switch 75 closed when a ball is in the trough as it should.

Any ideas where.to start? I'm a little frustrated at this.point.

Cheers
Greg

#2 7 years ago

Before everyone starts too shout "Ground Update".....

Bad Girls needs 2 balls. If there is a switch problem in the trough and the game doesn't see 2 balls it will "stall" after you hit the start button. You can check in the switchmatrix test.

If that doesn't bring a solution check if you have a proper +5V at the 100uF cap on your CPU board. You can adjust the +5V at the power supply with the tiny potmeter located there (which is often flakey after all those years).

You can resolder the connectors at this powersupply but if the Original is still present, thise one has a dual sided circuitboard, cracked solderjoints are less common here.

At later system80B games, Gottlieb used decent connectors at the transformer assy; i don't believe in the so called "Ground Update" here.

Marco

#3 7 years ago

What MarAlb said.

#4 7 years ago

I'm thinking it's with the switch. It was flakey when it was working. Example, I was in the midle of a game and my buddy drained his ball. It didn't seem to recon is the ball was in the trough and wouldn't spit out a new one to start the next round.

And for the record, whoever I bought it from did all the ground mods already. When I do test mode, it shows switch 75 closed when there are 2 balls in there. That's correct yes?

#5 7 years ago

Cleaning and readjusting the switch doesn't hurt. Remove the balls, enter switchmatrix testmode and insert the balls again to see if they register properly. 75 is the switch located in the trough. You can check 65 and 73 as well. Cleaning the A6 edge connector at the CPU board with an eraser might be a good idea also. Check the pins from this connector...they are often victim of battery corrosion in the past. Under the playfield there are small circuitboards with the switchmatrix diodes. Clean the edge connector ones and reflow/solder the ones with 0.156" headerpins (many times the headerpins have cracked solderjoints).

NICELY executed ground updates don't hurt although I think they are not necessary for this game. Many times I remove the spaghetti-ware I encounter when repairing these sys80B games. And.....if the heatsink from the +5V supply is used as a common for grounding please remove this. Gottlieb carefully isolated this power supply from the grounded backside with nylon washers because the case of the LM338K regulator is the +5V output. Connecting the heatsink to ground is creating a potential short / problem.

#6 7 years ago

I checked the +5 at the cap and got 6.10v. Adjusted back down to 5.03v. Cleaned the switches and made sure it was registering fine. I looked at the diode boards but didn't see any cracked solder joints. It still seems like it doesn't see the balls, in the trough, but the switch works for sure. I obviously pushed on the daughter board but that didn't do anything.

Thanks for the suggestions so far. If you have any others I'm all ears.

#7 7 years ago

Just to be clear: are the switches registering in testmode?
6.1V is high hope your electronics survived....

#8 7 years ago

Could it be a coil?
After hiting the start button a bunch of coils activate.
Do all the coils work in test mode?

#9 7 years ago

Yes all the electronics seem fine it would seem. Like I said it was working perfectly fine 2 nights ago. The switch tests fine in switch mode. I never thought about the coils. I'll test them later when I'm down at the shop again. I kept bypassing the coil test chasing after the switches.

2 weeks later
#10 7 years ago

Hi Guys,

I'm getting back to this thing now and have a couple updates.

1 - I changed all the switch matrix (and all other cpu single sided) connectors
2 - I confirmed the switch matrix is functioning correctly
3 - When there are 2 balls in the trough, sw 75 is closed
4 - +5 is holding stable since I turned it down

Tonight I want to start probing the cpu to see if I can find anything wrong with the IC's. But can someone point me in the proper direction? What specifically tells the ball to shoot out after you hit the start button?

Thanks for any help you can give me

1 week later
#11 7 years ago

Try this...

- turn ALL dip SW's on MPU to OFF

(make some "notice backup" before

Try start game

#12 7 years ago

Unfortunately that didn't work either. I think I'm just gonna bite the bullet and purchase a new swemmer board.

#13 7 years ago

Does the eject coil work in coil test?

#14 7 years ago

Yes all coils and switches pass the tests.

#15 7 years ago
Quoted from gregh:

But can someone point me in the proper direction? What specifically tells the ball to shoot out after you hit the start button?

I had a problem with a switch not registering, had to follow the wires back to the mpu I think it was @ Z11, it took a while to trace it back because of gottliebs wires all being white with some colored stripes, not saying that's where your problem is but if you trace the wires back from the coil it might help you find where your problem is. I have to say on the mpu where there is 4 chips in a row including Z11 on a couple of the gottlieb mpu problems I have had were in that area.

#16 7 years ago

If all switches are registering and all coils operate okay......maybe there is a memory location failing in one of the RIOT's? You can test the RIOT's with a testrom.

Marco

#17 7 years ago

Had a similar problem. Game started but the ball would not eject. Changed the fuse at F11 and all is good.

#18 7 years ago

My game won't go into start mode though. Basically it locks up with a couple playfield lights lit. I've decided I'm going for a repo MPU for it as soon as I save up the cash. It's 100% been hacked before I got my hands on it. The new board will save me a really large level of frustration haha. I still have a broken DE Playboy 35th I have yet to start looking at. Luckily, parts seem to be much more common for those games.

4 months later
#19 7 years ago

Back at bad girls and I'm hoping for a little bit of advice. I got the mypinballs board and it's working great so far. But I'm trying to track down a little problem. It's all in the "ball" drop targets, and 8 ball drop target.

I'll try to explain it as clear as I can without confusing anyone or myself. Basically this is what happens, when a game is started, the 7 targets will reset no problem. They seem to keep the memory fine from player to player, but where the problem is, if you finish a re-rack bonus, they will reset but immediately go back down like you have hit them all again, thereby starting another re-rack bonus mode.

The 8 ball target is acting funny too. A lot of the time it won't pop up when a game is started, but if the lock is lit, and you shoot the eject, it also won't pop up; releasing the ball right away (it's supposed to pop the target up, then you shoot the ball, and then it releases the captured ball) It will work properly sometimes, but not very often.

I hope this explanation is clear enough. I can't help but think these 2 issues are related, but i'm stumped on where to start. I have already put new connectors on the CPU. I didn't do the ones on the driver, except I did do the interconnect cable (new kit from docent)

If you have any ideas, they would be most welcome.

#20 7 years ago

I immediately think connectors reviewing your problem, then I see you did the interconnect. inspect the connectors you have not done on the driver, and you can put a small spring clamp or chip clip on the corresponding connector to apply more pressure to it to see if that helps, and try to replicate the behavior...

#21 7 years ago

Are the coils in coiltest behaving normally? Also the A-relais (tripping relais) and its contact? The contact at the a-relais selects the transistors at the driverboard from either tripping the droptargets or controlling the lamps regarding its position.

#22 7 years ago

The coils, switches and relays all seem to be working fine in test mode, so I think I'll start with the connectors on the driver board and relays and see what happens.

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