Hah, I just posted the same thing...yeah, that bumped me. It's not that he was still in high school, but everyone who wasn't snapped should be 5 years older in the movie's present, like Antman's daughter. I suppose all of Peter's friends were snapped...but since that was never established, it was kinda weird...that woulda been creepy/crazy if they were all in college....but I suppose they had to keep them all the same age due to Spider-Man: Far From Home.

Also, fat Thor took his hammer and kept it in the new timeline. So young Thor no longer has a hammer?!?

Captain America returned it, this has been confirmed by the directors.

peter parker wasn't there for 5 years.. so he didn't finish school. And his friend ned either didn't need to goto school during the dark times.. or was dusted himself.

Read an interview today on yahoo by the directors and they explained that when Cap went back to put that stones, he went to another dimension to live with Peggy as to not mess up things in this timeline and dimension. So in addition to time, you have different dimensions, which fits with a lot of Infinity stories. So, that could be the explanation for some of the incongruities. Or, just a convenient excuse.

Well, spoilers pretty prominent so...

Did anyone else find it utterly sad that the only reason any of the Endgame even happened was because of a rat...that finally triggered the device that allowed Ant Man to return? A rat is basically the most important character in the film.

I have to agree with Red Letter Media that we are treated to a less-interesting version of Thanos in this one. He had so much more depth in Infinity War and he seemed to much more real. This pre-Infinity War version was still a very good Thanos, but it was different...maybe I'm reading too far into it.

And Hulk...he was there for comic relief. We literally didn't get to see him actually fight and do anything during the main battle. It was never really explained why he wouldn't come out in Infinity War and suddenly he's just back, and essentially merged with Bruce Banner.

Still, a great movie, just not as good as Infinity War in my opinion.

https://cosmicbook.news/avengers-endgame-plot-holes-answered

Russos do a Q&A and I'll be blunt, most of the answers are crap and nonsensical in some cases.

Almost like it was a 1 in 14,000,0065 chance of that happening.

A lot of overthinking going on up in here.

This movie was the graduation present from Marvel for all of us fans who have followed the movies since the beginning. Potentially sacrificing some of the science and logic, they gave me all the moments I wanted out of the past decade of the MCU while leaving just enough to connect it to the next big chapter of the MCU.

If you want a cool time travel movie that will take you 3-4 watchings to even really understand what happened, check out Primer.

I enjoyed this movie a lot, and did not overthink the time travel. But here is essentially what happened, and confirmed by the directors, for all the thinkers. : )

d8jfzJO (resized).png

If he went to another dimension to live with Peggy, how did he end up back at the current dimension when he was older? And if he went to another "time dimension" to live with Peggy, that means in that dimension Thanos most likely did wipe out half the universe and he lived with it. Some things I think are better left unexplained, because when you do try to explain them, it creates more inconsistencies.

The time loops are not terrible, my biggest beef was the fact they stated you only have so many pym particles left and then violated what they said. When Nebula comes back to Avengers HQ she has exhausted the supply but then opens a portal for the 2014 Thanos and ship to arrive in the future.

In the Q and A link I listed above Russos state:

"There is a guy called Maw in his army, he was a great wizard. Thanos himself was a brilliant genius as well. Those two easily reverse engineered and mass-produced Pym Particles."

Which is code for "we pulled it out our ass" when called out.

Also where did Rogers get an intact shield to give to Falcon? He steal it from the Captain America of that timeline?

I hear you there. Here is the article I referenced

https://news.yahoo.com/em-avengers-endgame-em-directors-124526621.html

More major spoilers below! (Although it’s kinda moot at this point in the thread).

It was good entertainment. It was mostly better than the generic stuff we get these days. Yes it got slow at times but it generally went by nicely and was enjoyable. Still there were too many problems with it to make it great, all mentioned here. Basically if you just sit and let it flow by it’s good. If you start thinking too much, then you have problems.

One thing that bothered me that I didn’t see mentioned...if the Cap figured out how to stay back in time and live with the love of his life, why would he age into an old man? I was under the impression that he as some sort of immortal, like Wonder Woman. Shouldn’t it have been the skinny version of him dancing with her, before he was turned into Superman? Then he would age with her and live a normal life. And wait, if he stayed behind when he got back in time, what happened to the other version of himself that was already there?

Another puzzling moment. When he gave the shield to the dude and said now you are Captain America. Wouldn’t you need to go in the machine to be Captain America? Otherwise, you’re just a human with a shield.

There were 4 times when the theater burst into applause.

When Captain America wields Thor’s hammer. Well that was pretty damn cool, might be my favorite part of the movie.

When Black Panther steps in. Huh? Sorry I’m with Cartman on the Black Panther movie.

When Captain Marvel appears at the fight scene. Cool effect.

The previously mentioned scene when all the females line up to “help” Captain Marvel, who has the powers of 20 Supermen and a dozen or so gods, go 50 feet across the battlefield. This is one of the worst things ever put onto film. I threw up in my popcorn. Came close to ruining the whole movie for me. Pathetic.

The whole theater was bawling their eyes out when the hero died. Seriously you could hear the sniffling.

Watched it 3 times and finally going to see it in the theater this morning.

It's weird that it bothered so many dudes. Yeah it was basically a copy and paste of the scene from Infinity War, but Marvel has traditionally been at the forefront of current social issues and I think that scene really resonated with my daughter. It was a moment for her the same way Cap picking up Mjolnir was for me.

I definitely cried multiple times. Black Widow's scene? tears. Stark's kid? tears. Stark's father? tears. Spiderman shows back up? tears. Cap dancing with peggy? tears. The ending? tears.

I’m a woman and I found that scene irritatingly patronizing. I greatly preferred all the moments of women matter of factly kicking ass right there with all the guys to this weird pause to line up all the girls and then have them ultimately fail.

Well me and my daughter loved it, thought it was a great scene, so I guess different strokes.

Hopefully it means we might get an A-Force movie, which is the all female avengers.

I don't think it bothered me. It just felt forced and cheesy. The scene in Captain Marvel where she finally learns about her powers and just start decimating everyone gave me goosebumps. Awesome, amazing, kick ass scene. Show more of those scenes featuring females. Don't force this female empowerment crap down our throats.

Interesting how there's multiple ways to look at the same scene - I interpreted that more like "we all stand together" than "omg the ladies are here!" It was a little clunky (not sure if the dialogue or the delivery), but thought
It was a good scene to remind everybody how many other characters are involved

Exactly! Patronizing is a good word. But, lot of people gobble up that kind of thing so you can’t really blame them for putting it in. Movies these days are primarily about making money and Hollywood is very good at it.

I don't have a problem with how they dealt with time travel. Essentially, the past is the past, and you can't change the past in your timeline (that's why they couldn't kill baby Thanos). But if you travel to the past, you change that timeline, and will create a new timeline (but wouldn't effect your original timeline). I think the whole point of the time travel gps watches that stark created, was that it let them come back to the same timeline they left from.

Based on that, you could travel back in time, nuke the universe, and still come back to your original time and nothing would change.... but a new timeline would be created where the universe was nuked.

So to me, the only real hole was Captain America showing up at the end of the movie.... unless (which i guess what was stated above), he lived in a new timeline created when he traveled back in time, and then lived for the 50 years or so that passed, and then used his gps watch to travel back to the original timeline.

Which all this raises a big question for me.... They are essentially saying there are infinite timelines out there.... so who give's a Fu<k about fixing your current timeline, if you can just go back and create a new timeline in which it all works out? Especially since they just created new timelines where Thanos, and all his people are now dead, and will never be able to collect the infinity stones.

Alt timelines are bullshit & just a lazy way to not cleverly write your way out of paradoxes.

I think this was terrible in terms of the "Story" it was a blatant attempt to raise the appeal of the Marvel Universe to the female population, and had nothing at all with being at the forefront of current social issues.... I mean come-on... If they were really trying to tackle current social issues, maybe when Stark was commenting on Cpt America's Ass, he should have been ostracized by the group, rather than making a big joke about it. What about poking fun at Thor's belly and body shaming him, rather than accepting him for who he is, and tackling the psychological problems he's dealing with?

No... this had nothing to do with social issues.. purely a marketing play, which in my opinion cheapened then movie.

What is even weirder is that so many dudes going off about it seem completely unaware it makes them look like an incel. For like the vast majority of these movies it’s been just an endless parade of man candy in spandex. Scarlet Joe has never been more boring or plain. Karen Gillian and Zoe are incredible but both are visually muted. Natalie Portman was out of there. Finally Cate Blanchett drops a beautiful bad ass female character. Black Panther keeps things rolling. They give us Brie Larson and finally we are getting some equal screen time for the eye candy, but no. It’s just to much for dudes and they just can’t deal with her distracting from all the maleness. This is why we can’t have nice things.

P.S. It was funny as hell to hear the young women complain about the Dad bod and the Moms finding it attractive.

I dunno how a paradoxless time travel story could have worked in this movie....but I would have at least changed/removed two huge things that bugged me:

-Nebula killing her younger self. That just cannot happen in any time travel logic. If you killed yourself, you wouldn’t exist from that point on - and if you didn’t exist, you couldn’t kill yourself. PARADOX!

-Past Gomora will have a different life path now...that means she was never sacrificed for the soul stone, she never met Quill....yet everything still still
happened & Quill remembers their relationship. PARADOX!

I really hope people check out the movie Time Crimes. It’s an amazingly clever time travel story with no paradoxes.

As for younger people watching long dialog-heavy stuff....they love Game of Thrones, so sure!

It’s Timecrimes all one word if you are looking it up on Netflix, I put it in my queue at the top, I was running out of things to watch. I mean, I still have Aquaman and Venom coming, but I don’t have high hopes for either one of those.

I enjoyed this interview with the directors, it helped me let go of some issues I had and just enjoy the end cap to the story.

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/movies/la-et-mn-avengers-endgame-spoilers-explained-russo-brothers-20190503-story.html

Why was it important for the women of the MCU get a special moment during the final battle?
AR: Looking back on the entire road that the MCU has traveled, it just struck us how many amazing female characters have entered the [landscape]. I think it was really, for us, a moment of celebration and acknowledgment of the intensity and empowerment in that.

Cool. Seems silly to not just allow these moments of celebration after 22 films.

I put Primer in my queue also, haven’t heard of it before, should be fun.

Weird, it’s not on on Netflix in the US - but it is on Hulu. It’s also free on something called Tubi, apparently.

Definitely check it out if you want your "more scientific time travel" scenario.

Then watch it two more times.

Then refer to the official timeline of what happened:

https://unrealitymag.com/at-last-a-definitive-timeline-for-primer/

We get it, you pirate movies. We're all so, so happy for you.

Whatever. I’m commenting on what I’m doing and participating in the thread. Lighten up.

Just got out of the theater and I thought it was going to look a little brighter and vivid. Maybe it was the theater, but was expecting it to pop more.

Still a great movie and I just sat and enjoyed it for the 4th time. No issues with the movie at all.

That's what ruined it for me. They didn't even follow their own logic.

"Can't kill baby Thanos" is like "Can't kill baby Hitler" because the ramifications are so vast. But then they kill a 9 years younger Thanos which is essentially the same thing! Younger Thanos comes to the future and gets killed as a result of the Avengers trying to undo something older Thanos did. That's a paradox.

What if Marty McFly said "My dad is lame I'm gonna build a time machine to go back and make him cool!" If he succeeded then he'd never need to go back in the first place = paradox. But that's not what happened because the script was good. Marty ACCIDENTALLY goes back in time which (as Rare says) is a clever way around paradoxes. Even better, when warned about being shot to death Doc doesn't postpone the experiment he puts on a bullet proof vest. So to Marty he still appears to die and the car chase still happens. Man, remember good scripts?

Back to Endgame, so they talk about "timelines" which I guess is string theory? The idea that all actions create infinite variations of reality? (probably so they can bring Gamora back) But they don't follow this logic either because Captain America goes to return all the stones. Why bother? Young Thanos is dead before he can collect them. Also how does Cap get the stones to space? Also we see Nebula knock out Chris Pratt before he finds his stone. Cap returns at the exact right moment after he wakes up but before he reaches the stone? Come on. I assume that stone sat there for hundreds or thousands of years? Why not snatch it then? Oh because that makes too much sense and we won't tip off Thanos = no 3rd act.

"Oh but they're creating NEW timelines!" one might say. OK, so again, no point in sending Cap back. Also it means original timeline Avengers are selfish a-holes as they leave their timeline of misery to go live in one where half the population comes back.

I don't care how many actors in front of Atlanta parking lot greenscreens I get to see punching CGI monsters. If the story makes no sense it's dead to me.

Bingo bingo bingo. That’s why I liked the first hour the most - it’s a “realistic” way to portray a fantasy circumstance. Antman coming home and seeing his daughter again was a true emotional beat. Seeing Tony & Pepper with a kid is a true emotional beat....but once they got into the time travel stuff with wonky rules, nothing meant anything anymore...so, I didn’t get emotional at all later on during the “OMG the whole theater was crying” moments. I was just thinking “how does this logic fuck up all the other stories and now this is going to ripple effect into GOTG3....bleh.”

Theater was packed for the 9am show. We already had tickets and were surprised to see the theater full when we picked our seats on the screen at the ticketbooth. Only two seats together were behind the handicapped section in the first row. Worked out great because I had a railing for my feet and center row seats.

Guy next to my wife was blubbering and crying at the end. Like a lot!

Yup. I'm just along for the ride man. I'm not looking to examine plot holes or to pick apart time travel. Tony explained to the Avengers, and to me, how time travel works in this movie universe. How everything played out in the movie, I'm along for the ride, and it all works because that's what I saw happen. If the Avengers are cool with it and understand what's happening, so am I.

I still laughed on the outside and cheered on the inside this time around. Having a full audience was really cool, being able to hear and watch, sometimes feel, their reactions to what I know is coming. The woman next to me was jolted out of her seat by several scenes and hit my arm each time. We both were cracking up at her reaction. Good times!

Nuff said.

I saw it in IMAX 3D! Best of both worlds! Looked stunning!

tenor.gif

It was good but I liked Infinity War better,Thor Lebowski was very funny.

Finally saw it, loved it. The beginning kind of caught me off guard, I was wondering once a certain character was killed off what the heck the rest of the movie was going to be like... and wow, they didn't disappoint!!

100%. I still don't care how cap growing old with Peggy worked, just that he got a great appropriate ending.

I was thinking about who was left for future movies. We've got Hulk, Loki, Thor, Scarlet Witch, Nebula, Gamora, Winter Soldier, Falcon, Spider-Man, Dr. Strange, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Ant-Man, Wasp, Shuri, Okoye, Star Lord, Rocket, Groot, Drax, Mantis, Hawkeye, Hank Pym, Janet van Dyne, and I'm sure i'm forgetting a few.

I also think they will bring Vision back the same way they did in the comics.

Wanda and Vision are going to have a show on the Disney streaming service. Hawkeye, Loki and Falcon/Bucky also have shows.

Yeah I'm super excited about Disney+. I'll definitely be a subscriber.

If you are into time travel movies check out Triangle (2009) and Time Lapse (2014)...more exciting than Primer and you don't need need a flow chart to figure it out...but still helps to watch all the commentary videos afterwards especially for Triangle.

Triangle is my favorite time travel movie...it's fun and still makes you re-think what's going on, it's not as obvious as it may seem at first.

Here's a list of the upcoming Marvel Movies

https://screenrant.com/marvel-upcoming-movies-list-release-dates/