Quoted from LTG:Parts sent under warranty, cabinet issues, playfield issues, go through CGC. I have no say in it. So why get involved.
Voice of experience.
(Topic ID: 192072)
Linked Games
Attack From Mars (Remake - Classic)
Chicago Gaming Co., 2017-
Attack From Mars (Remake - LE)
Chicago Gaming Co., 2017
-
Attack From Mars (Remake - Special)
Chicago Gaming Co., 2017
-
Freddy: A Nightmare On Elm Street
Gottlieb, 1994
Topic Gallery
Arvada, CO
Quoted from pinballinreno:please go back to beating up CGC for no reason now
Weren't doin that in first place! 
Quoted from snaroff:Well we've both purchased a fair number of games and I've avoided the 3.5% credit/insurance tax and you've never benefitted from it. I understand if it helps you sleep better, but I'm glad we aired the issue since you were advising folks to do something which ultimately results in added cost. No free lunch.
My $.02...the distributor cost/profit should be all the insurance we need when purchasing these high cost items! Let's face it, as previously stated, a very high percentage of transactions are without issue, so expecting the distributor to "do the right thing" is what we should expect as a community. I would imagine most distributors are making 5-10% on each transaction.
If we were all purchasing directly from the manufacturer, I would have more sympathy for your suggestion to use a credit card (even if it costs an extra 3.5%).
snaroff
It is not a free lunch, but it is a cheap lunch at only $227.50 on a $6,500 machine. I am sure all of the CGC customers who are currently taking it on the chin would pay it now.
I am not sure what a distributor can do if CGC is unwilling to bend here. What do you think?
Quoted from whthrs166:Weren't doin that in first place!
Yes, you most certainly are. Plenty of rumour and Story telling. Shows you how self destructive some people in the hobby really are. Such a shame that a handful of people can cause so much drama. Doing their best to remove the smile from people that have spend a vey large chunk of their savings on a pinball machine.
Quoted from Mike_J:It is not a free lunch, but it is a cheap lunch at only $227.50 on a $6,500 machine. I am sure all of the CGC customers who are currently taking it on the chin would pay it now.
I am not sure what a distributor can do if CGC is unwilling to bend here. What do you think?
Many distributors are also collectors that have been "around the block". If a distributor is convinced a PF has significant flaws, then they should apply sufficient pressure to have the manufacturer correct the situation (not specific to CGC).
The distributor should be an advocate for the buyer. As I said in a previous post, that's what happened when my AC/DC PF had flaws. From my perspective, a distributor driven resolution is more desirable than having the credit card company intervene. Why? I really loved the game and just wanted it to be "right". I really wasn't interested in merely getting my money back.
In my case, Stern "did the right thing" for me and many others. If Stern didn't do the right thing, I would have spoken with the distributor about potentially buying back my game and issuing me a credit on a future game.
Like it or not, CGC will be compared with Stern and JJP quality and service. That's only natural and completely valid. On paper, CGC's LE has the best warranty in the business.
snaroff
Quoted from snaroff:Many distributors are also collectors that have been "around the block". If a distributor is convinced a PF has significant flaws, then they should apply sufficient pressure to have the manufacturer correct the situation (not specific to CGC).
The distributor should be an advocate for the buyer. As I said in a previous post, that's what happened when my AC/DC PF had flaws. From my perspective, a distributor driven resolution is more desirable than having the credit card company intervene. Why? I really loved the game and just wanted it to be "right". I really wasn't interested in merely getting my money back.
In my case, Stern "did the right thing" for me and many others. If Stern didn't do the right thing, I would have spoken with the distributor about potentially buying back my game and issuing me a credit on a future game.
Like it or not, CGC will be compared with Stern and JJP quality and service. That's only natural and completely valid. On paper, CGC's LE has the best warranty in the business.
snaroff
Well said. This is what I would be doing. Best option.
Quoted from snaroff:Many distributors are also collectors that have been "around the block". If a distributor is convinced a PF has significant flaws, then they should apply sufficient pressure to have the manufacturer correct the situation (not specific to CGC).
The distributor should be an advocate for the buyer. As I said in a previous post, that's what happened when my AC/DC PF had flaws. From my perspective, a distributor driven resolution is more desirable than having the credit card company intervene. Why? I really loved the game and just wanted it to be "right". I really wasn't interested in merely getting my money back.
In my case, Stern "did the right thing" for me and many others. If Stern didn't do the right thing, I would have spoken with the distributor about potentially buying back my game and issuing me a credit on a future game.
Like it or not, CGC will be compared with Stern and JJP quality and service. That's only natural and completely valid. On paper, CGC's LE has the best warranty in the business.
snaroff
They should be compared to Stern, and JJP....the reality is they are attempting to punt on a pretty significant issue, and if they would have stepped up to the plate originally they wouldn't see this backlash. The good news is not everyone has these big problems, but simply punting on the issue is total and complete BS. At least Stern stepped up to the plate when they had play field issues (i.e. GB). It appears CGC is trying to figure out a way to punt on the whole issue, which if they do will bite them in the ass (IMHO). Like myself I am waiting to see how this plays out. If they do nothing then I won't buy their machines any longer.....life goes on
Quoted from snaroff:Many distributors are also collectors that have been "around the block". If a distributor is convinced a PF has significant flaws, then they should apply sufficient pressure to have the manufacturer correct the situation (not specific to CGC).
The distributor should be an advocate for the buyer. As I said in a previous post, that's what happened when my AC/DC PF had flaws. From my perspective, a distributor driven resolution is more desirable than having the credit card company intervene. Why? I really loved the game and just wanted it to be "right". I really wasn't interested in merely getting my money back.
In my case, Stern "did the right thing" for me and many others. If Stern didn't do the right thing, I would have spoken with the distributor about potentially buying back my game and issuing me a credit on a future game.
Like it or not, CGC will be compared with Stern and JJP quality and service. That's only natural and completely valid. On paper, CGC's LE has the best warranty in the business.
snaroff
Hopefully, we hear from the distributors soon.
Do we know if the defective machines were purchased through a distributor or CGC?
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Yes, you most certainly are. Plenty of rumour and Story telling. Shows you how self destructive some people in the hobby really are. Such a shame that a handful of people can cause so much drama. Doing their best to remove the smile from people that have spend a vey large chunk of their savings on a pinball machine.
That's fine you can take the opportunity to attack me in your 
attempt to distract what is going on here if that's what you need to justify your position. I see through it and so does everyone else here. Your attacks are petty and meaningless. I do not have to explain anything to you. I support everyone who just wants what they paid for.
Quoted from whthrs166:That's fine you can take the opportunity to attack me in your attempt to distract what is going on here if that's what you need to justify your position. I see through it and so does everyone else here. Your attacks are petty and meaningless. I do not have to explain anything to you. I support everyone who just wants what they paid for.
No. you are so wrong. Using the the word "everyone" is not true as I do not agree with you at all. There are plenty of us. You are trying your best to derail CGC. I happen to support and like the company. You will not share your story like many of other genuine Pinsiders that are happy to share their experience, me included. You are making an opportunity to cause issues. I am not attacking you at all. Just calling you out on your BS. Notice I am supportive of all other genuine Pinsiders.
Quoted from Onwallst:can’t imagine the new clearcoats with the softer wood.
I really don't like to start drama and I know that some of the manufactures are dancing a fine line between appeasing shareholders and having happy customers but I have this one question at the back of my mind that I just have to ask...
Why is it that I can drive down the road and purchase a single full sheet (4' x 8' x 3/4") of finished plywood with a hardwood top top layer (oak, cherry, etc...) for under $100, yet the manufacturers that purchase this stuff by the truck load at vastly reduced prices cant use it to make a play field out of it?
Inserting a data point:
I wanted to chime in and say that our AFMr SE hit the floor on June 30th and has around 18,000 plays (We purchased from CoinTaker who we love). Between it and Addams Family make up two of the best earners. Since AFMr has been on the floor it has never been down. We've had to perform regular maintenance, flipper rebuilds, replace balls and rubbers etc.. but are extremely happy with the game.
Quoted from snaroff:I'd also be surprised if many pinball distributors even accepted a CC payment for 8K (considering costly transaction fees).
Actually MOST do, but they will also give you a decent discount for paying by check or wire.
Quoted from Onwallst:He said that I need to stop posting.
Did you tell him to stop posting too? I mean when he's ready to take more money, seems he's always posting here.
Quoted from pinballaddicted:No. you are so wrong. Using the the word "everyone" is not true as I do not agree with you at all. There are plenty of us. You are trying your best to derail CGC. I happen to support and like the company. You will not share your story like many of other genuine Pinsiders that are happy to share their experience, me included. You are making an opportunity to cause issues. I am not attacking you at all. Just calling you out on your BS. Notice I am supportive of all other genuine Pinsiders.
Pinsiders want to see CGC step up to the plate and fix these games as they should.
CGC has caused these "issues" and only they can address them or refuse to address them.
Fix the games, establish some good will in the community and move on.
Quoted from Mike_J:However, which distributors do not take a credit card? All of the big guys do and they typically add around 3.5% to the price which is good with me.
And since you are buying it with your Capital One Quicksilver Card you get 1.5% of that back immediately 
Quoted from ZenTron:Inserting a data point:
I wanted to chime in and say that our AFMr SE hit the floor on June 30th and has around 18,000 plays (We purchased from cointaker who we love). Between it and Addams Family make up two of the best earners. Since AFMr has been on the floor it has never been down. We've had to perform regular maintenance, flipper rebuilds, replace balls and rubbers etc.. but are extremely happy with the game.
On location it's an entirely different story. You're more interested in it performing rather than the esthetics. From a collector standpoint, there are certain qualities that matter more than pure performance.
Quoted from snaroff:AHHH...I take back my "WOW". Most folks aren't willing to throw another 3.5% down the drain for such a large purchase.
If you buy your game from a local distributor you are paying the 7.25% California state tax on that. If you order the same exact machine from say Automated Services in Connecticut with your credit card you are paying the additional massive 3.5% credit card fee and paying no state tax on your out of state purchase. Seems like it costs you 3.75% LESS to not pay cash to your local distributor
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Plenty of rumour and Story telling
Please tell us what rumors and stories you are referring to.... I love a good bedtime story! 
Quoted from whthrs166:Please tell us what rumors and stories you are referring to.....
All your stories. You are yet to post what your issue is with your machine. Always answering a question with a question.. sidestepping if you really have any issues with an AFMr or even if you really own one. This is an owners thread.
Quoted from LTG:I'm not ignoring it.
Some of this isn't my job. I help people get their games going if they have problems. That's it.
@LTG, you do provide overwhelming support to ALL of the folks here on Pinside; those who are aware of the scope of support you provide, are grateful for the time and energy you put forth on a daily basis to help folks out on this website. Your support is in the true spirit of Pinside and will never be overshadowed by a few folks casting a wide net of allegations.
Quoted from Pin_Guy:LTG, you do provide overwhelming support to ALL of the folks here on Pinside; those who are aware of the scope of support you provide, are grateful for the time and energy you put forth on a daily basis to help folks out on this website. Your support is in the true spirit of Pinside and will never be overshadowed but a few folks casting a wide net of allegations.
Hear hear. Three cheers for LTG who is a constant positive part of this hobby.
Quoted from Pin_Guy:LTG, you do provide overwhelming support to ALL of the folks here on Pinside and those who are aware of the scope of support you provide are grateful for the time and energy you put forth on a daily basis to help folks out on this website; your support is in the true spirit of Pinside and will never be overshadowed but a few folks casting a wide net of allegations.
Very well said. LTG we thank and support you every step of the way.
Quoted from pinballaddicted:All your stories. You are yet to post what your issue is with your machine. Always answering a question with a question.. sidestepping if you really have any issues with an AFMr or even if you really own one. This is an owners thread.
WOW That's a lot of stories! I have posted on here a lot, for a long time and about a great many subjects and your saying they are all BS! . ALL of em Really
You know that sounds like an attack on me. You have no idea who I am buddy. And I do not have to reveal anything to you. If you have some beef with me you can PM me. This is my last response to you.
Quoted from whthrs166:WOW That's a lot of stories! I have posted on here a lot, for a long time and about a great many subjects and your saying they are all BS! . ALL of em Really
You know that sounds like an attack on me. You have no idea who I am buddy. And I do not have to reveal anything to you. If you have some beef with me you can PM me. This is my last response to you.
See... more stories and you are trying to twist my words. You still refuse to post what is wrong with your machine. I have no interest in PMs. It is not a personal attack and I have no beef with you. You have the right to post and so do I.
London
Quoted from snaroff:Well I'm happy it worked for your oven, but something tells me the process wouldn't be as smooth for a pinball machine (small vs. large company, hand-built vs. machine produced, shipping cost, etc.). I'd also be surprised if many pinball distributors even accepted a CC payment for 8K (considering costly transaction fees). Most car companies limit a charge to 2-3k.
I think the suggestion recently put forth (regarding buying/verifying from a reputable/local distributor) makes the most sense. The only problem is convenience, since pinball distributors are fairly small in numbers (i.e. not on every street corner
snaroff
I did a charge back on an Aston Martin DB9...
Neil.
Quoted from NeilMcRae:I did a charge back on an Aston Martin DB9...
Neil.
Did it have chips on it?
Quoted from bitpatrol:Did it have chips on it?
no, but it didn't go all of the time, and would stop in places were you didn't want it to stop.
in anycase.
Just a reminder to pinsiders. let either agree or disagree amicably, and not assume everyone is out to insult each other or call each other a liar; as per the rules if you aren't going to post something that adds genuine value then don't post it! I like this group because its been so amicable lets not make it less so please.
Neil
Quoted from PinMonk:Let's not get too hysterical. I think you'd have to be REALLY negligent and/or in a super arid climate to get to that level. I've had lots of Sterns and a few B/W with planking and zero progressed to splitting, but they were all waxed frequently and kept in a climate-controlled house/location.
I don't consider it hysterical to be concerned about something that might continue to get worse, it's my 8k. Hysterical would be my reaction to opening a box and finding I had to eat the playfield with the nude color and ribbed look under the clear.
Quoted from Crispin:I don't consider it hysterical to be concerned about something that might continue to get worse, it's my 8k. Hysterical would be my reaction to opening a box and finding I had to eat the playfield with the nude color and ribbed look under the clear.
I'd absolutely lose my shit if that happened. Which is why I still haven't decided what to do.
Quoted from Crispin:I don't consider it hysterical to be concerned about something that might continue to get worse, it's my 8k. Hysterical would be my reaction to opening a box and finding I had to eat the playfield with the nude color and ribbed look under the clear.
Of course you're entitled to whatever feelings you have.
However, the point is in my experience with a LOT of machines from Stern(mostly) and B/W with this "effect", it is very unlikely to get any worse if the machine is waxed regularly and kept in a temperature controlled house/location. Exactly zero got worse that I have had. So yeah, that concern is a little hysterical. I'm talking about the generally mild planking effect in pics here. If it was all over the playfield or the grooves were very deep, that's a different story, but none of the pics here have shown one like that.
The playfields with the incorrect nude color screened, however, are totally unacceptable and anyone with one should be offered a *correct* replacement. There's no wiggle room on that point.
Quoted from Pin_Guy:If you buy your game from a local distributor you are paying the 7.25% California state tax on that. If you order the same exact machine from say Automated Services in Connecticut with your credit card you are paying the additional massive 3.5% credit card fee and paying no state tax on your out of state purchase. Seems like it costs you 3.75% LESS to not pay cash to your local distributor
Hmm. Not sure how to respond, since state tax is a separate issue. Most of my games were purchased out-of-state (while living in Florida). Ironically, the AC/DC was purchased at Little Shop of Games in Florida (where I paid state tax). It was the only NIB I've ever had a major problem with and totally lucked out (having the full support of LSOG).
So while it's possible to buy games across state borders and avoid paying state taxes, it can bite you in the arse if/when you need local support!
snaroff
Quoted from NeilMcRae:I did a charge back on an Aston Martin DB9...
Neil.
What does that mean, exactly? That your made a 100k-ish charge to your credit card? Then returned the car?
snaroff
So, here I am up in Ottawa, playing my friends LE #905 and it’s beautiful. And he has a crowd of folks from work here, and everyone has huge grins on their faces playing this game and having a wonderful time. I love pinball!
Quoted from Mike_J:Hopefully, we hear from the distributors soon.
Do we know if the defective machines were purchased through a distributor or CGC?
Mine is a distributor and he is great! Working on it.
After 22 years on the want list, AFM is home!! ckorth, one of the Cleveland guys is amazing (well TBH all of the Cleveland gang is amazing). Definitely in the top 5 pinheads I've met and that's going against some tough competition. Can't wait to get this setup. Loaded SE with the Lazeriffic topper! I'm giddy.
Quoted from Crispin:I don't consider it hysterical to be concerned about something that might continue to get worse, it's my 8k. Hysterical would be my reaction to opening a box and finding I had to eat the playfield with the nude color and ribbed look under the clear.
Well stated. 
Quoted from pintechev:So, here I am up in Ottawa, playing my friends LE #905 and it’s beautiful. And he has a crowd of folks from work here, and everyone has huge grins on their faces playing this game and having a wonderful time. I love pinball!
Hey, I"m near Ottawa!!! Glad to hear you guys are having an awesome time over here. I'm playing mine too, just taking a break
Quoted from Mike_J:Hopefully, we hear from the distributors soon.
Do we know if the defective machines were purchased through a distributor or CGC?
To many dealers/distributors that are posting on here recently. I know who many of you are and the biased agenda. This is an owners thread and let’s keep civil!
Quoted from bitpatrol:Hey, I"m near Ottawa!!! Glad to hear you guys are having an awesome time over here. I'm playing mine too, just taking a break
Maybe we can grab a beer next time I’m up. Probably in a few months.
Quoted from wxforecaster:After 22 years on the want list, AFM is home!! ckorth, one of the Cleveland guys is amazing (well TBH all of the Cleveland gang is amazing). Definitely in the top 5 pinheads I've met and that's going against some tough competition. Can't wait to get this setup. Loaded SE with the Lazeriffic topper! I'm giddy.
Awesome man! 22 years is a long time to wait. Congratulations! How fun. Enjoy and post some scores. Post some pictures of that topper!
Quoted from Onwallst:To many dealers/distributors that are posting on here recently. Know who many you are and the biased agenda. This is an owners thread!
I just need a little help on the grammar.
What are you trying to say? What is the biased agenda?
Quoted from NeilMcRae:no, but it didn't go all of the time, and would stop in places were you didn't want it to stop.
in anycase.
Just a reminder to pinsiders. let either agree or disagree amicably, and not assume everyone is out to insult each other or call each other a liar; as per the rules if you aren't going to post something that adds genuine value then don't post it! I like this group because its been so amicable lets not make it less so please.
Neil
I agree!
Quoted from Mike_J:I just need a little help on the grammar.
What are you trying to say? What is the biased agenda?
Attack people and say everything is great! CGC can address the problem or deal with the PR storm. They decide the outcome.
Quoted from Onwallst:CGC can address the problem or deal with the PR storm
And right now it's pretty stormy! 
Quoted from pintechev:Maybe we can grab a beer next time I’m up. Probably in a few months.
sounds good!! Maybe I'll have a MBrLE by then, wink wink...
Quoted from EricHadley:You Colorado boys need to chill just bit
well what about you? 
Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
Reply
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!
Donate to PinsideGreat to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
