(Topic ID: 220832)

Atari Middle Earth Need Help Prototype Machine

By shazam78

5 years ago


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  • 18 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by DreamCarr
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 5 years ago

Finally getting around to working on my Atari Middle Earth prototype pinball machine. Machine does not work of course. Looks like it has had some wiring done to it plus some pcb work. I did a video of it showing what it does when I turn it on and off and back on again. I checked all connections and cleaned all the edge connectors. As well as the socketed chips on the pcb. I have 5 volts on the board and 14.96 going into it. I am wondering if it is a board issue or something else that is causing the issue from the wiring that was messed with. Also thought about the big capacitors in the back of machine, but they look like they may have been replaced. From looking at other pictures of other machines the big capacitors that look original on the other machines are silver colored. Any thoughts or help would be greatly appreciated. Here is link on video

1 week later
#2 5 years ago

Interesting mods to that system. I've never seen anything like those huge caps with bleed off resistors on the solenoids.

In terms of what you're seeing though, my only guess would be an issue with the ROM, or maybe a short circuit causing the game to start automatically?

That's what my ME does on boot, much less activity before settling down into attract mode. The video was for a different purpose other than showcasing the startup , but you can hear the switch flip and see what happens. (Don't mind the pulsing coin door light, That is not intended operation and I fixed it.)

#3 5 years ago

I just about have my ME running 100% since aquiring it last week. So, the qualifier here is that Atari systems are "new to me too" FWIW

I would be happy to help in any way with close up photos or videos of any boards or parts. Just LMK.

So far I have:
Replaced a fuse that was not allowing the game to start (controlled ball eject to trough)
Replaced the largest transistor on the aux board.
Fixed a loose spade connector on upper left flipper
Replaced the PB board cover mounts
Added LED'S everywhere
Replaced all rubber
Polished the playfield

No real Atari expertise here but willing to help
Could also test game functions as well

Best of luck

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#4 5 years ago

Nice pin, MT45. I've seen so many ME's with great looking playfields, really highlights how terrible of condition mine is in lol. Mind you, according to the internal counter, my game is up to ~65,500 plays. Pretty sure about 60k of those was in someones shed! Plastics are all warped, inserts are loose (and because of that, the wood is damaged where the ball has been impacting)... all sorts of stuff.

#5 5 years ago
Quoted from DreamCarr:

Interesting mods to that system. I've never seen anything like those huge caps with bleed off resistors on the solenoids.
In terms of what you're seeing though, my only guess would be an issue with the ROM, or maybe a short circuit causing the game to start automatically?
That's what my ME does on boot, much less activity before settling down into attract mode. The video was for a different purpose other than showcasing the startup , but you can hear the switch flip and see what happens. (Don't mind the pulsing coin door light, That is not intended operation and I fixed it.)

The rom are you talking about 608 and 609, the Eproms? The machine locks up as you can see in video. It does a brief attract mode then locks up. As for those mods on flippers I am not sure why those was done. I recently picked up a working production model middle earth and I put the board in it from the prototype middle earth and it does the same thing in it. So it is definitely a board issue and not anything else in the cab.

#6 5 years ago
Quoted from shazam78:

The rom are you talking about 608 and 609, the Eproms? The machine locks up as you can see in video. It does a brief attract mode then locks up. As for those mods on flippers I am not sure why those was done. I recently picked up a working production model middle earth and I put the board in it from the prototype middle earth and it does the same thing in it. So it is definitely a board issue and not anything else in the cab.

Yes the 608/609 ROMs. Try taking them from the production board and putting them in the prototype. They might have gone bad over the years. Marco pinball has replacements: https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/1142?VIEW_SIZE=60&view=card&sortOrder=SortProductField:totalTimesViewed

#7 5 years ago

I would probably order them. As one on each board is in a socket and the other is soldered onto the board. I had thought about trying this mod. Not sure if it would help it or not. Or if I should just order the new eproms first.

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#8 5 years ago

Also could you possibly post some close up pictures of your lower right flipper and upper right flipper. The production one I have I am trying to figure out a problem with it. I noticed the upper flipper one of the diodes was blown. Flipper still works but when you hold button it hums and will get hot. So I ordered a new one and got it yesterday and hooked it up, but now when you hit the button it blows fuse on the transformer. If you hit flipper button briefly it will dim lights and right side flippers wont do anything. So for some reason having 2 diodes is making it not work. So I put the old coil back in which is not the correct one. I think it might be a bally. But anyway it works, but you still can't hold right flipper button for long period as that upper coil will start to get hot. I'm not sure why it's having that issue with that's extra diode

#9 5 years ago
Quoted from shazam78:

Also could you possibly post some close up pictures of your lower right flipper and upper right flipper. The production one I have I am trying to figure out a problem with it. I noticed the upper flipper one of the diodes was blown. Flipper still works but when you hold button it hums and will get hot. So I ordered a new one and got it yesterday and hooked it up, but now when you hit the button it blows fuse on the transformer. If you hit flipper button briefly it will dim lights and right side flippers wont do anything. So for some reason having 2 diodes is making it not work. So I put the old coil back in which is not the correct one. I think it might be a bally. But anyway it works, but you still can't hold right flipper button for long period as that upper coil will start to get hot. I'm not sure why it's having that issue with that's extra diode

If you're blowing fuses, my guess is you've got power/ground reversed, and you're shunting the coil power directly to ground through the diode, effectively shorting the power supply.

Front right
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Upper Right
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As for the mod, I can't really give you much advice on that - although it sounds like it might be the fix you're looking for. Did the previous owner of the game say it was ever working?

#10 5 years ago

Thanks for the pictures. I will look it over and compare to mine. I noticed in the manual it says micro switches, but see yours has leaf switches like mine. But I have seen some with the micro switches. I wonder if ours are early production runs and later they switched to micro switches?

#11 5 years ago
Quoted from shazam78:

Thanks for the pictures. I will look it over and compare to mine. I noticed in the manual it says micro switches, but see yours has leaf switches like mine. But I have seen some with the micro switches. I wonder if ours are early production runs and later they switched to micro switches?

Maybe? The majority of the game has microswitches from Cherry. Only the flipper buttons and solenoids have the leaf switches on mine.

#12 5 years ago

So I tried that reset mod and I thought for a second it was gonna work. All the lights was working and such, but then a coil started firing non stop and sounds locking on. So I undid that mod and its back to the way it was. So i think Ill order new eproms. On my production middle earth I mentioned the flipper coil issue, I took that new coil and ohm tested it and it shows bad. So they sent me a new one. I got that today. I ohm tested it before I put it in and it showed good. So I installed it on the left side first to see what it would do, And it did not fire at all. I thought what the heck. What is going on. So I put the old one in and it worked fine. I then put that new coil on the right side where the one is that I want to replace and I fire game up and hit the flipper but and it blew the fuse again. I put old coil back in and it works, but that coil does not have both diodes. One looks like it blew at some point, only the leads are left. So I don't know what to think of that. Not sure if these new coils are not made right for this machine or what. And when it blows a fuse it blows the bottom one on the transformer. It doesn't take out the one that is on the edge connector assembly.

#13 5 years ago

I read somewhere that many replacement coils were being sent with diodes installed in reverse? Maybe that is your issue. Also here’s some pics of mine. These were installed in this way when I bought the game so no changes by me.

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#14 5 years ago

Yeah my wiring for the coils appears to be correct. and the diodes are in the right direction. So perhaps its the coils themselves. Maybe they are not made correctly.

2 weeks later
#15 5 years ago

I just got a middle earth yesterday, 2 actually.. sort of.. the seller said he acquired it from a man that had it since new and claimed to be one of the founders of sega, and used to work at atari.. the 2nd game.. is a fully populated playfield in cabinet, not stenciled yet, and no back box etc.. it looks brand new.

1 week later
#16 5 years ago
Quoted from Mitoska:

I just got a middle earth yesterday, 2 actually.. sort of.. the seller said he acquired it from a man that had it since new and claimed to be one of the founders of sega, and used to work at atari.. the 2nd game.. is a fully populated playfield in cabinet, not stenciled yet, and no back box etc.. it looks brand new.

I would like to see some pictures of them. Would you mind posting some.

1 week later
#17 5 years ago

So I replaced the 608 and 609 roms last night and it still does the same thing as it did in the video. I also changed out the dip switches for new ones and still no change. Anyone else have any thoughts?

#18 5 years ago

Maybe check the rectifiers near the transformer? I'd also measure voltages once it's int he "failed" state to see if you're still getting 5V to the board. might be a power supply rectifier or something dropping out once a bit of load is applied to it.

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