I still watch wrestling on a weekly basis but if I weren't into pinball, I'd have no idea this game existed. I have seen 0 advertising for this game on any WWE related program. It is really bizarre. Especially since the WWE has no shame when it comes to making money. The sneak advertising into their live shows all the time.

Doubt it and doubt it. Pinsiders could make a profit, they wouldn't be A) selling a WWLE at a $4K loss to begin with, and B) if it did sell that low there would be no lines waiting to buy a boring pin with a crap theme. Also, TFLE are rebounding last 6 months now that design/fun factor are becoming more apparent than hype spewed when first released ( both by Stern and community) and they never sold for $3k-$4k. Lowest I've seen is $4800 a year ago on a fire sale.

I disagree. I still don't think it was a failure. I think it was just a test game for SPIKE. They wanted low production on the first game of the new system, and thia was very low. It was a beta test that wouldn't have been that expensive to replace the computer or a subset of parts in the field because there were not that many of them. Imagine if the first SPIKE game had AC/DC sized sales and there was a critical problem. I think it was a planned soft release.

Not sure how many soft releases Stern could afford with the new digs. I could see if they were pumping at full throttle but they just moved in.

A planned failure? Come on. I played the game. The ring looks so cool and the execution is soooooooo boring.

Joe, this is bad. I know it's your opinion, but you sell JJP games. Saying that something the competition did sucks in a forum like this makes me question if I'd buy anything from you.

I've said this same thing to Stern distributors that said similar words about JJP products. This shouldn't be said by you on Pinside because it comes off as scummy to dis a competitor like that. And if you do need to say it, you should clearly identify yourself as a JJP distributor so that folks who don't know who you are can see it with your statement.

What's good for the goose...

Sorry to everyone else for going so far off topic.

Any two flat rocks and a piece of string.

Well, Pinballstar posted under his distro ID, not another handle, so anyone could look up his past posts I guess.

It's just, like, his opinion man.

I'm really surprised that Trudeau (and Stern) screwed up the ring design. It's great to do something different but everyone on here immediately saw that this was a flow killer. Putting a ring in the game is perfect but why got make it a separate mini playfield with flippers or a movable kicker. Definitely seems like they forgot the player and collector crowd and got caught up in trying too hard to mass market to WWE fans. Maybe they can still salvage a decent game somehow with the code. Hopefully they don't abandon it like Avengers.

If sale numbers aren't there code is doa. Btw, Trudeau screwing the design isn't a surprise. The guy compares designing a pin to designing a wrench. Same thing he says. I'm sure the wrench subculture is as passionate about their hobby.

WWE advertised the machine before one of their recent pay per views on their network.

Personally me, as a WWE fan, I wouldn't pay more than 4k for a used LE.

On a side note, if I won the lottery, I would've bought the LE NIB...what's 8k when you have $100 million in the bank...frankly, in that situation, I'd just probably purchase every NIB LE that were released.

I don't think that was the case. If it was they would have announced an even more limited run of LEs, like only 300. Every game Stern makes they want to be the next ACDC as far as sales go.

I'm really disappointed to see this game get so universally panned. Hopefully something develops with the code that changes people's minds on the game. BBH, one of my favorite games, was panned like this for at least two years after release (mostly due to theme), it is generally respected now.

If we see another code update for the game I would be surprised. I think Stern has abandoned ship on this title.

Recently they posted a pic of a bunch of hulk le getting built or ready to ship... Funny the only way vendors will have them is if stern forces them to take them... U want to be a vendor and sell kiss ok u have to take a wwe le too. O u have two metallica sold.. Sure we can send u them but u have to take a wwe... Lol have fun with that

This game doesn't appeal to many owners, but many thought this would do great on location. Anyone know how the machine is doing on route?

5k delivered feels right. I also think that the promotion opportunity with WWE was worth the expirement by stern.

we have a wwe that's been on route since the first week it was released.
don't have specific numbers, but star trek and ac/dc out earn it 3 to 1. TWD out earns it 2-1.
we've only gone thru 1 set of 3" white rubbers on the upper playfield if that tells you anything. hehe

personally, I like the game as I do REALLY well on it in league but I'd never own one. playing it once a week is enough for me.

Albeit I don't get into places with much of a pinball scene very often but I have checked everywhere I have went and have yet to see it on location. I tend to believe that it is not a very good game from the reactions to it but I would still very much like to try it out. Due to opinions on it however I doubt that I will get the chance.

I would drop Stern as a pin supplier then and support JJP or Heighyway or refurbish older titles. Forcing sales on a vendor of bad product is tantamount to virtual extortion. Well, not that far but you get the idea. It sucks.

"THE PIN" was the test system for SPIKE going back almost 3 years ago! Plus Whoah Nellie is an inherently small run to test as well. So I doubt they INTENDED for it to be a flop.

I don't have an MBA but I would never try to sell a luxury item branded with something *mostly* enjoyed by poor rednecks.

It'd be like a car lot putting NASCAR logos on a Lexus or Infinity.

I despise wrestling, so this theme isn't for me at just about any cost. I guess if they got to stupid prices, maybe. Still, I just don't see this game in my house, even if it was a great player. I'm a little weird about such things though, so I know that I'm not a good mainstream candidate for this thread. Still, on the bright side I think Stern is experimenting a little with some of their recent themes. That's okay, as long as 2 out of 3 hit big. Maybe they'll eventually bring in some fresh blood. I could have warned them about this and Mustang if given the chance. Not so much on the Avengers and X-Men themes, so what do I know.

I've only played a couple games of it so can't comment on the actual gameplay, but there were a couple of odd things to me.

First was after all the crap I took from someone not knowing the transistors on their node boards were through-hole, after looking at one up close, I was VERY surprised to see the diodes were SMT. Kinda negates the point of the through-hole transistor, doesn't it?

Second was that the monitor was interlaced. I guess maybe you don't notice from far away?

I bought a TF LE fully modded for 4k
Sold it a few months later for 4k too.

I don't think I'd buy a WWE LE for 4k

And you were....how close to it? I don't think that's someone that a non-programmer would typically notice unless there's very fast motion or something that would otherwise cause some kind of visual artifact. People lived with interlaced TV's for what...30 years?

I wouldn't take one if you PAID me $1, and that's not an exaggeration:

The SPACE I have for pins is more limiting than the $$$$. Hence, if you GAVE me a crappy game for free- it'd be at the expense of a game I necessarily LOVE.

A thread evicerating WWE and not one stern fanboy calling anyone a troll. Nice change of pace

Other games like X-Men and TF are pretty polarizing, but they do have their fans that will defend the games. No one is defending this game! That says a lot.

I usually roll my eyes at those who say they walked away from a new game rather than finishing 3 balls....that's how I felt when I played WWE (Pro). The first time the ball went into the ring, I was able to plop it around up there FOREVER and was instantly bored. I asked my girlfriend if she wanted to finish my game and she declined lol.

Is it true that the LE doesn't have the voice clips for the classic wrestlers implemented? If so - unreal!!! Once again we see speculation - "It was a flop so the code won't be finished" ...I hope that's not the case - any game left unfinished will keep buyers from buying future games. If it can happen to one, it can happen to all.

No, that is not true. The LE does have classic wrestlers already implemented in the game (Hulk Hogan, The Undertaker, Shawn Michaels, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Andre The Giant, The Iron Shiek, Ric Flair, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Ricky The Dragon Steamboat).

I have one & like it so far, but of course it needs a code update.

I was a big WWF wrestling fan when I was a kid, so the theme is very nostalgic for me.

And believe it or not, I'm not a redneck.

Waison + code update = wait for it

I would like to play one so I guess I would take a chance @ $2500.- If it was really bad I would just trade it for some Budweiser!

I don't know if code can improve the ring at the top. That was the feature I was most interested in, and it really stunk playing it.

It felt terrible playing the ring. The slings that you push the ball around with had to strike it just right or it would kinda slowly lob over to the other side, repeat ad nauseam. IMO, the ball in the ring should be wild and crazy, not slow and boring.

It could very well happen. That would be bad business. They have done this in the past and it will only lead to more people waiting to buy their games to see which ones offer better code support.

I try to be as positive as I can when playing & talking about pins. However, after numerous plays of the pro I have to say I don't care for the design at all. Im not sure I'd go over $1800 for it as there are pins in that range I would prefer.

Good feedback - thanks

It'd probably do oook on route,
Maybe trade for one?

I might be interested in a complete retheme starring Stacy Kiebler.

I'd post a photo - but it would break the new feel-good policy of eschewing all images of smoking hot women.

;-(

That's hitting the nail on the head. There are games that cost significantly less, and are in more demand. Just think of the games you can get for 4k-5k while this sells for close to 6-7k currently.

When the ball is in the ring, it seems to stay up there forever. When you own a game and are going to try to avoid the main feature, that is not a good design.

When I saw the LE I thought that was gonna be great but you still fight the newer wrestlers in the ring. I hope they eventually change that,

All true, Trudeau is a very talented and creative guy but most of his designs are not conducive to fun pins...not sure why. I would think he needs to team up with Borg or Ritchie to hit something out of the park design wise.

Three questions come to mind...

1. Does Stern do any sort of Home Market user testing with current customers to find out if there's a good market for their upcoming pin ideas in the Home Market?

2. Has Stern recently released a pin that's a DOG for the home market, yet VERY profitable for operators?

3. Does Stern have any sort of "feedback loops" to learn what the Home Market people want? I'll never understand why they seem to be dead silent on Pinside (unless I'm simply missing all the topics where they are vocal and asking questions.)

-mof

stern would have to pay me to put this pin in my garagecade

WWE is getting multiple code updates. Stern isn't going to abandon this one.

Stern couldn't pay me to take it.

I wouldn't sacrifice the footprint space for something out of my collection.

I guess I'll play a little devil's advocate here a bit. I do find it very funny how people say they haven't finished 3 balls and hate the game. The rule set currently is very different and hard to understand. Certainly not something you could figure out in 3 balls or less to enjoy, I'm still figuring a lot of it out 30 games or so in. I also get a kick out of people who say that the ball stays forever in the ring and you repeat ad nauseum. First of all, the only time you actually want to keep it in the ring are when you are in a match or right after a winning a match for showboating. You don't need to hit the scoop to win a match anymore either, you can pin your opponent and win just by hitting the slings. So if you are keeping it in the ring forever, then you must be winning every match and your showboating points must be off the charts and I can't wait to see everyone's high scores on this game...seriously. The key to success in the ring is knowing when *not* to flip. The ring itself is like an EM, nudging is much more important than just machine gun flipping. You want to have control in there cause the ball can and will drain out both sides and the bottom if you let it get out of control. You also want to keep hitting ramps and rollovers for maxing your bonus at 24.5 million which is very important for high scores, but if you are not in a match you don't want to keep the ball in the ring, you get basically no points and/or build up from it. So if you are doing that, you're doing it wrong...let it drain out. Then you can go for other things like Referee MB or Tag Team MB while you are out of a match before starting in on another one.

Is the game great currently, no, but it's much better than the firewood that people give it credit for and I do think good rules and theme integration could make the machine much better. The Pro already has one two way gate to send the ball all the way around from the left ramp shot during Referee Scoring and the LE has two so it can go all the way around from either ramp and bypass the ring altogether for all the ring haters out there. I've put up over 200 million on WWE and I haven't even won the Tag Team Championship Belt yet, so this game still has a lot more to offer as it sits now. I don't own a WWE, so this isn't just biased opinion from an owner defending their purchase, but some people are just so ridiculous with their I played 1 ball for 10 seconds and it is the worst pinball machine I have ever played comments I thought I had to say something. I would encourage people to actually put some meaningful games in on one and try to figure it out so they can make educated comments before just blindly jumping aboard the hate train.

I would take two shipped at the right price if anybody needs cash or a distributor has some to move. I will try them on route and hope that the extra monet spent over a pro could be made up after 3 years on route. The LE might make it easier for a later home sale. It would be a cheap way to get a pinball on location for low cost or risk with a sale on the backend with the LE more desired than the pro. Sometimes it's best to take the loss and move on to the next pin.

This is a big problem for location play. No way I'm dropping $30 on a game that I didn't enjoy the first 5 times.

The number of times I got it in the ring didn't bother me, it was how long it stayed in the ring. I could have kept lobbing it between the slings for a very, very long time.

Normally I'd never suggest eBay but after this thread it definitely seems the way to go for selling WWE.