(Topic ID: 271561)

Artifacts of Gene Cunningham/Illinois Pinball

By dudah

3 years ago


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  • Latest reply 86 days ago by aztarac
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54 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

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Post #1 2020 photos of what’s left of Gene’s place. Posted by dudah (3 years ago)

Post #8 Dougram’s first installment of their part of Gene’s story. Posted by dougram69 (3 years ago)

Post #14 Dougram part 2 Posted by dougram69 (3 years ago)

Post #19 Link to an article about the history of Big Bang Bar. Posted by WODKA (3 years ago)

Post #28 Dougram part 3- some inventory arrives. Posted by dougram69 (3 years ago)

Post #83 Link to TOPcast episode 11, interview with Gene. Posted by wallybgood (3 years ago)

Post #87 Dougram part 5- musing about Atlas memories. Posted by dougram69 (3 years ago)


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#207 3 years ago

This is an incredible post, thanks to all the contributors for a fascinating piece of history.

Back in 2005 I had bought my first machine, an imported WH2O. I was spending a lot of time on RGP learning and asking questions. I started reading about Gene's attempt to make BBB, and exchanged emails with a guy who was looking to get out of his spot. I had the $4500 saved up and was really intrigued by the mystique behind the game. Ultimately I chickened out because I was worried about not being able to get parts, or how reliable the machine would be, and I didn't know jack shit about repairing machines and was having trouble with WH2O. Back then a lot of parts were hard to find and expensive, even for B/W machines. In fact there was a ton of B/W bias on RPG in those days and I never even considered other companies until years later. Plus there was a lot of speculation that Gene would never come through, which is why the spot became available in the first place.

I took $4400 of the $4500 that I didn't spend on BBB and bought both CFTBL and Scared Stiff in 2006 due to that B/W bias, and I'm okay with that, but I always wonder about "what could have been" and how awesome it would be now to have a BBB in my collection, since I have never got to play one.

Once again, thanks for pulling back the curtain. I agree with others that this is perhaps the best thread to ever appear on Pinside.

#284 3 years ago
Quoted from Skeets:

I purchased a few things from Bearcave back in the day and it always took weeks and multiple e-mails to get your item. One thing in paticular I remember was a NOS EATPM translite, must have taken at least 2 months. Reading here that they would take orders, then head over to Gene to find the parts, it makes sense why it always took so damn long, I never knew that. I eventually stopped ordering from them even if they had something I wanted, simply because it became such a pain in the ass.
This thread is funny because the newer Pinside crowd has no clue how nutty this hobby was during the 2000's. Lots of crazy personalities and parts drama, nothing like it is today.

Yeah, I quit ordering from them too. And Gene would only fill orders for distributors once a month (if I remember correctly), which definitely caused delays in getting parts.

15
#370 3 years ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Somebody more intimate with the BBB game-specific parts could sit down and rough-up a crude BOM.
I remember doing it back during that period for myself... and I couldn't get over $2500 to make one. Keep in mind, you have to know wholesale costs based on *quantity* manufacture. For instance, pop bumpers wouldn't cost what you see at Marco to buy ONE or THREE... you'd have them molded fresh, in quantities of 1000, in Chicago, for like $1 each. Bulb sockets by the 5000. Dimes each. And so on.
The BBB playfields were "free" ... Gene didn't pay a cent for them. So put those on the BOM as $0.00. I know this for a fact. I'll elaborate a bit below. I think somebody earlier in the thread explained the backstory too.
In fact, Chicago Gaming (CGC) was so pissed at Gene during that era, that it almost ruined CPR's ability to work with the Duba's.
Back in 2007 or so, we had really wanted to switch from the initial baltic birch plywood stock we started CPR with, to the "real deal" playfield gameboard stock. We had found the ACTUAL mill that was still doing gameboard stock (the last place doing it). They were producing it exclusively for CGC, who were making Stern's playfields. They were called American Hardwoods (formerly Weber Inc.) and were located in Wisconsin. They wouldn't let us order any gameboard stock, a 'secret recipe' they had been doing for decades, treating it like Kentucky Fried Chicken's 11 herbs & spices. Not unless we had permission from CGC.
So this is where we had to reach out and meet Roger Duba... thee patriarch of Chicago Gaming Corp.
Roger was quite the character. Old and tough. But sweet as pie once you broke through, got comfortable with you, and lowered his defences. His main beef with me was that I MUST NOT be working with (or for) Gene Cunningham... and that not one penny of CPR playfields went to Gene's pocket (LOL). There could be not one stitch of involvement between IPB and CPR ... or Roger wasn't going to help us at all.
Roger loved to talk on the phone once he got comfortable. And we got comfortable! That is when he told me the entire BBB playfield story, and clarified why he had to vet us for IPB involvement. Yes, it is true that Gene 'held them over a barrel' to force their hand to make the BBB playfields, to cover a made-up "fee" that Gene wanted, for use of some kind of a patent CGC was allegedly breaching - and Gene threatened to sue. So under this duress, they grit their teeth, caved and made the BBB playfields. Gene had said that's all he needed to make everything square. So they did them... but man, Roger simply *seethed* in hatred for Gene. It was palpable. (On a side note, Gene had essentially already revealed this story in 2005 when we visited [see my BBB playfield photos earlier]. Standing right there, at the racks of BBB playfields, Gene told us "You know what, I didn't even pay anything for these - Chicago Gaming had owed me, so I had them pay me in playfields" or something to that effect)
So I assured Roger that we had recently completely cut ties with Gene, and were working with Wayne Gillard Mr. Pinball Australia instead. In fact, under that arrangement, we were actually COMPETITION to Gene. At least in Gene's eyes. Roger loved that ! I expressed my desire to make the best repro playfields, using his exclusive real-deal wood, and thus way better playfields than Gene (or his partners) could ever produce. So Roger Duba agreed to allow us access to the American Hardwoods runs of gameboard stock (which they ran once or twice a year for Roger). We were so happy. Roger personally called the president of the mill and instructed them to do any business with CPR that we wanted, and the rest is history.
We had a few good years with American Hardwoods, until their parent company closed and liquidated that mill to pay off a bankruptcy somewhere else in the country. But the president there, in his last days before they locked the place, passed the gameboard 'secret recipe' over to another nearby competitor - and referred us to them to carry on the legacy of that wood. Even set up a conference call to make introductions between us. We've been getting our wood from that mill ever since, trucking it up from Wisconsin USA to Nova Scotia Canada. Years later we even tweaked the original recipe, turning the dark brown cores (usually sweet gum) to white ash, and tripling the thickness of the face veneers. Roger and CGC never came along on that mill switchover (he didn't like that mill or something) and they decided to source their wood elsewhere. I don't know how that turned out for them. It's probably been a decade since we've talked to CGC. Does anybody know if ol' Roger is still with us ?

Gene had purchased TAG (Thomas A Grant) in 2001. Stern was using both CGC and TAG to make playfields at the time that Gene bought TAG. After the purchase, Stern switched to Churchill (CGC). Just speculation on my part but Gary was unhappy to have competition and did not want to put money into his competitor's pocket. Unfortunately for CGC, when they made playfields for Stern, they used the Williams process, which they didn't own because they had been contractors under license from Williams. Of course Gene had also acquired the exclusive rights to re-manufacture Williams parts, which included the playfield process. He leveraged those rights against CGC's unlicensed process to get the BBB playfields made as compensation.

I don't recall what happened after that, if CGC switched their playfield process to match Data East's, which Gary did own. Perhaps Wayne, or someone from CGC, or even Martin from Pinball News knows more. But it certainly appeared that Gene attempted to force CGC and Stern (his competition) into becoming a revenue stream.

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