Pinball was pretty nonexistent in WI for along while.
MGC had a tournament and about 7 years ago their was WuanaAPinball Tournament.
Now there are 3-4 monthly tournaments during the week in Madison, a monthly or 2 in Milwaukee, 3 leagues in the state. The monthly are free to play to my knowledge and just for WRRP.
MGC, WUANAAPINBALL, NE WI, Flipping the Fox, Mad Rollin are the major ones and of course State(SCS) if I missed any my apologies.
I personally would like to see more larger tournaments in WI.
At the moment, there is only one location in Madison that has about 12-14 games but just does monthly events that are free to play (coin drop to play).

MGC can no longer charge a tournament fee as the gaming commission would fine the show. Sad but true!

The problem is the gambling laws in WI and do you want to take the risk.

Here are the gambling laws: http://www.gambling-law-us.com/State-Laws/Wisconsin/

Enjoy the read.

I'm not sure how these laws relate to pinball.

I agree. I'd play in a lot more tournaments if the pot were sweetened. If they were $20 entry and winner take all I would show up more often to play as it would give me something more to play for. I think the people that don't stand much of a chance of winning would stop showing up though. The idea of the free tournaments is to broaden the player base and bring new people in. I'd be fine with making them non-IFPA but I do think the SCS makes "free" tournaments more worthwhile to play since you have something more to play for than bragging rights since you get WPPR points to count towards the State standings.

perfectly stated. I dont want to run events that put off new players but like to have a reason for more seasoned players to play in them.

Up to this change, SCS and WPPRs were that happy medium of running free events but having a prize for those that want it.

While Wisconsin gambling laws allow betting on dog racing and a few riverboat casinos, most other types of gambling are prohibited in the state. Bona fide contests of skill like snowmobile racing are legal, as are bingo, raffles, and other charitable games.

You don't have to collect anything . Whoever doesn't pay into the WPPR system , doesn't get (previously) free rankings.

WI has dumb laws.

OK So who is gonna haul a Bank Shot over to the Statehouse and call their shot?

945.01  Definitions. In this chapter:
(1) Bet. A bet is a bargain in which the parties agree that, dependent upon chance even though accompanied by some skill, one stands to win or lose something of value specified in the agreement. But a bet does not include:
(a) Bona fide business transactions which are valid under the law of contracts including without limitation:
1. Contracts for the purchase or sale at a future date of securities or other commodities, and
2. Agreements to compensate for loss caused by the happening of the chance including without limitation contracts of indemnity or guaranty and life or health and accident insurance;
(b) Offers of purses, prizes or premiums to the actual contestants in any bona fide contest for the determination of skill, speed, strength, or endurance or to the bona fide owners of animals or vehicles entered in such contest;
(cm) Participation in bingo or a raffle conducted under ch. 563.
(d) Pari-mutuel wagering subject to ch. 562.
(e) Participation in a lottery conducted under ch. 565.
(f) An agreement under which an employee is given an opportunity to win a prize, the award of which is determined by chance, in return for the employee making a referral or identification described in s. 945.01 (5) (b) 2. h.

I am no lawyer but a bet does not include any offers of purses, prizes to actual contestants in a bona fide contest of skill

We have about 20,000 Raw Thrills stickers here in stock at work that we sell for more than $1 a pop in the 'real world'.

If anyone in Wisconsin wants to purchase one of these from us, I will go ahead and waive your endorsement fee for the event you're playing in.

No vote here, seriously, because it doesn't matter to me. So much rant to fact noise in Hiltons thread. I only host and play in tournaments to be social with other players. My rank is likely below people that have passed away. I'm sure I misssed a sensible post by Josh somewhere.

If I understand, you will now charge $1 per player at IFPA registered tournaments. TDs will have to collect and send the money collected to the IFPA or the results will not count toward IFPA points?

For the average player, I don't see an impact. I can still play in local or even some very large regional tournaments even if unranked.

For the competitive player, isn't a thriving IFPA a good thing? Someone has to put in the time and run it.

I can do it. I'm awesome at Bank Shot.

Send Daluga with my SpiderMan machine.

sounds good, now just let players buy a bunch of them form you in order to gain membership and take the onus of individual TD collecting off the single events

That puts the work back on me . . . no thanks

Gotta put my TD's to work!

This doesn't make sense to me if you are trying to pay out everyone who makes state, if they are paying in $20 more, then what is their payout for making state? Pay $20 then get $16 back for 16th place or something lol. I thought this was going to make getting to state a payout not a buy-in again after paying a buck all year? I guess maybe for states that don't run enough events to pay out the whole top 16? I dunno. If I am guaranteed a payout but am also paying to play in it that just seems silly.

The key thing to remember is Madison prohibits the sale of alcohol in stores after 9pm.

and yet our per capita alcohol consumption is crazy high.

I think that means we just plan ahead to get drunk?

It would add $320 to whatever the prize pool is. So for Illinois if the SCS Pot was funded to $680, then the total purse available for the State Championship would be $1000 . . . minus the $16 endorsement fee that the State Championship has to pay in order to fund the following year's SCS pot

Where is the Who Cares vote option?

Then you vote Yes I guess or you don't even enter the discussion

Naw just means it's a Big "10" town.

It's getting very close to 51%.

So let me get this straight. People in WI have been playing free tourneys for a while now and the possibility of having to pay $1 is going to make them not want to play anymore? Seems pretty cheap considering the amount of work that the IFPA people are doing for all their meetups.

Too bad they don't have the cheapskates emoticon yet.

no, I think one of the main points for WI is it is illegal to have any payouts at all and this puts their TDs in a sticky situation and is also why the events there are all free currently.

Also, its super shitty to internet shame people over money because everyone has different incomes and there is the ability to participate in this hobby at all ranges of financial wealth.

Then I guess in WI it would be considered an administrative fee? $1 per person doesn't seem unreasonable for the amount of work it takes to get the players rankings input. Also how much does it cost to play games in WI, I'm assuming its .50 minimum. If that dollar is really going to effect someone standard of living maybe they shouldn't be out spending money on playing pinball??

The cost I could care less about- it's what the cost is going to that I don't agree with. Seems asinine to take away the IFPA rankings to those who don't support it. If the $1 went to the upkeep of the IFPA I wouldn't care and I'd understand.

IFPA said they making the change, WI has made their point, we'll see how it works out in 2018. If someone gets hard time in state prison im sure IFPA might make some changes.

I don't think there were any arrests at their SCS in February..

The IFPA feels this will improve and help with the upkeep, time will tell.

So the fact that they are not keeping a dime of the money & in fact putting it towards the State & National tourneys is whats bothering you? Id assume it would be the other way around.

The $1 will now go to IFPA administrative fees.

For those interested in competing for bigger prizes, I will fund those prize pools out of my own pocket.

Better?

ha I was waiting for that one

I do have two kids to feed, and my 3 year old daughter is an absolute ANIMAL

As a casual player who attends MGC and Expo, I think there are a lot of new people who are willing to get in on a "free" tournament, and have a good time. Charge a buck a person and there will be a drop off, just like co-pays on health insurance to go see a doctor. The co-pay doesn't need to be large, but it has a huge impact on how often people go to the doctor. You will see the same thing with a $1 charge for a tournament, not that it is a lot of money, but that it "IS MONEY". People overuse a free resource, there is no down side to doing so. When it comes to getting new people to play, I think this overuse of a free resource(tournament) is a great thing.

Just how many times have you sold a game to pay for car repairs or keep the lights on?

My kids are 7 and 12, boys, and trust me...you ain't seen jack squat for food costs yet....but I won't have to pay for 'feminine products', makeup, ridiculous clothes, or 30 pairs of shoes so I guess we'll call that one a wash? =Þ

My wife is totally NOT into shoes, yet my daughter is shoe CRAZY . . . we have no idea how this happened. I blame Disney?

I have never in my lifetime seen so much discussion over a $1.00 or loonie as we call them. I commend the IFPA on trying to take competition pinball to the next level. I also commend a number of passionate posters who have stated good cases on not doing this. Unfortunately someone has to take a stand and the IFPA is doing this so everyone has to decide what they are going to do about it. Do I submit and pay the man or not submit and not be officially ranked by the man. For a buck per player per tournament small price to pay to get free administration/hosting of rankings and a chance at a fully funded prize pool for Provincials/Nationals seems like a no brainer for our group. Competitive or not people like the rankings and are willing to contribute to keep on getting them.

It's 1.34 loonies just FYI.

This is an actual 'Merican Dollar we're talking aboot sir.

Standard child rebellion versus the proclivities of the parents. My 7 year old likes pinball, but LOVES playing sports, which I completely abhor.

Yes for sure, come to Canada where we get free health care and have wages to afford the new $1.34 IFPA tax... Go figure from a bunch of ice hockey maniacs who say eh way to much.

Dang the poll is nearly 50/50, maybe you should increase the fee to $2 (~2.7 loonies)!

They call that 2.68 Toonies up yonder i believe

A toonie is 2 loonies. So, 2.7 loonies is 1.35 toonies. I have been to Windsor on numerous occasions and can respect the loonie!

Awe yes don't even get me started on the toonies lol

Ah right, I made a math equation when it really was 2usd=2.68cad. Funny...at least 'Mercia still has the best schools in the world.

Pretty certain Josh already said it will be $1 CAN.

Why charge for IFPA points?

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Or you charge a $1 & if someone says no thanks you say you can play for free but you will not get WPPR points.

I have been reading these threads and haven't made any comments but wanted to get a few thoughts out.

First of all, I run tournaments in Madison, WI. For a long time, WI was a pinball wasteland. There was literally ONE tournament a year that people started going to. Yes, there was an entry fee and everyone was happy to pay it. Even us schlubs who knew we wouldn't be getting anything back out of it!

Fast forward a couple of years. Games are now available to play in public locations, monthly tournaments are occurring. Why? Two-fold. First and foremost, to introduce (or reintroduce) pinball players, get together, and hang out and have fun doing something we enjoy. Secondly, to introduce NEW people to playing by making it casual and fun. Mixing new people in with seasoned veteran players has always worked out well. They learn the ropes, and many of them have found their way into the "fold" so to speak. There's absolutely no barrier to entry such as asking for $5 to participate - if we had done that I feel that most people who have never played before would probably just say "No thanks, I'll just watch". We still get new players participating every month. Because of this, there's a really fantastic crew of players in WI / MN that now get together to play some pinball and hang out.

TD's already do a lot of work. Have to coordinate the space, figure out the rules of the tourney, setup a web page so that it can be accessible for public, promote it so people show up, submit the request to IFPA, actually RUN the tournament (there's never any drama in pinball, right?!??), consolidate results, submit to IFPA. This is done voluntarily. I personally enjoy meeting new players, getting people (especially kids) interested in pinball, etc and don't mind doing it. Now we will be asking for $1 per player, and adding a few additional tasks of collecting and paying money to that list.

Will doing so Promote Pinball? My opinions: For seasoned players and regulars, SOMEWHAT. For new players, NO.

I understand the prize pools for SCS and National is what's trying to be raised here so that we can promote these larger annual events. However, in doing this I really hope that sight of all the smaller events that are used to rank players isn't lost. If those start going away due to lack of interest / ambition / whatever, pinball will once again crawl back into it's hidey hole.

I'll be keeping an eye on how this unfolds in the coming months.

- Sean

We also hope they don't get lost.

If they do we have our "Stage 2" for 2019 ready to go with our "Professional" ($1 fee) and "Amateur" (no fee) systems so people who are serious can enjoy one rankings system, while the larger group of non-serious players can enjoy our second rankings system.