(Topic ID: 79721)

Are new Stern pins in Stereo or not?

By Part_3

10 years ago


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  • 115 posts
  • 35 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by kermit24
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    #80 10 years ago
    Quoted from jimmyb:

    For $5G and up you think Stern could give us stereo??

    Just a thought...If they asked 100 people and more than half agreed to up that to $5.5G or something, then maybe they would consider adding stereo, a basically pointless feature. Even though it is inexpensive: every single screw, washer, 5 inches of wire, and any labor to design, any software coding to produce, is in the bottom line.

    #83 10 years ago
    Quoted from snaroff:

    I see you largely like/collect pre-90's pins. For these pins, I agree stereo is pointless. When you purchase a 5-7k rock-and-roll pin, it's reasonable to expect modern audio. It's also easy for you to defend Stern's cost cutting when you are on the sidelines. If you were to spend this kind of $$ on a pin, you might be more demanding.

    I am not hardly on the sidelines, I was looking at it from that perspective because I am employed in production in a modern electronics company. Many times I have scratched my head and said "Why did they leave this or that out the design" and all the while thinking how much better the product would be or whatever.
    ...then I get my answer.

    The pointless comment is because the speakers are darn near next to each other in a pin, now if you are talking about headphones, or external 'extension' speakers I could see there could be a big difference. You can't tell me you can really hear well the center channel and stereo imaging between speakers that are around 5 feet away only around 2 1/2 feet apart. The importance of proper speaker placement can't be overemphasized in stereo. Having the table in front of you also distorts the imaging and the frequencies by offering a point of early reflection. Then you are going to put these games in places not great for listening, well....that's what I mean by pointless.

    #87 10 years ago
    Quoted from snaroff:

    The audio dramatically enhances the game.

    Which is why I have a powered subwoofer on my F-14 Tomcat

    I just think the money would be better spent on higher power/higher quality amps and speakers, rather than stereo. It's your money your spending on the pin, so yeah by all means complain they should throw it in for free. I'm sure at some meeting of the minds they decided it wasn't worth the effort, would not increase sales. Guess we will see if anything has changed with the next game released.

    #93 10 years ago
    Quoted from roffels:

    I can and will tell you that. Not when playing on location, but if it's the lone game turned on, sure, how couldn't you hear the difference? I liked the stereo effects on my old Data East Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

    But are you really listening to stereo? I'm not making this up, this is a property of a stereo sound field. For a stereo image based on music content you must have separation between the left and right speakers. You must have open space in the middle. Without it you are listening to summed mono.

    "Stereo in one sense of the word is designed to trick the human auditory system and eliminate our ability to localize. How does this work? Take two speakers and space them a sufficient distance apart. The source can be either stereo or mono for the effect to work. The position of the listener forms a triangle with the two speakers. Ideally the listener would be 1.5 times the distance away as compared to the distance the speakers are apart. Once you are listening from double the distance or farther than the distance the speakers are apart then the information collapses to mono. So to have stereo you have to be in the middle, and you have to be no farther than 20 feet away if the speakers are 10 feet apart. In this scenario the sound can be heard from the space in between the speakers rather than from just two distinct sources. This alters your perception. This stereo image is rather fragile. You have to be facing the speakers. You have to be very close to the middle position so that the distance from the two sound sources are near equal and so that the amplitude is near equal. You have to be a precise distance away. Turn around, sit off to the side, sit too close or too far away and the contrived stereo image collapses."

    #95 10 years ago
    Quoted from roffels:

    That's an interesting read but yes, there were stereo effects. I'm not sure what the point of writing all that out was, I understand the importance of speaker placement and room acoustics.
    The game had parts where if you hit targets on the left field, sounds would come out of the matrixed center and left speaker, and if you hit the right, out of the matrixed center and right speaker. I could hear the effect.

    But that's my point - that is not stereo that you are describing. That's panning. A mono signal that is panned somewhere between the two channels does not have the requisite phase information to be a stereo signal, although there can be a level difference between the two channels that simulates a position difference, it's a simulation.

    This is why your home stereo system has a "sweet spot" between the two loudspeakers, where the level differences and arrival time differences are small enough that the stereo image and localization are both maintained. This sweet spot is limited to a fairly small area between the two loudspeakers and when a listener is outside that area, the image collapses.

    #98 10 years ago
    Quoted from Lethal_Inc:

    Yeah, I don't get it. For the price of NIB games these days, we should at the very least get these games in stereo and awesome sound.

    Well, then don't buy it and tell them why.

    #100 10 years ago

    Is the next Stern release going to have stereo?
    Are you going to NOT buy it if it doesn't?

    #103 10 years ago
    Quoted from roffels:

    I don't understand the point you're trying to make. The pinball machine is not trying to compete with a home stereo, it's providing some neat and simple sound effects. And it makes a difference when compared to a simple mono system. Is it that big of a deal? Not really.

    You can do effects panning in 2 channels of mono or stereo. I thought the complaints were about stereo music and fidelity/quality, not about effects. If you want an effect to be hard panned it is as simple as lowering the volume of that effect in one channel and raising its volume level on the other channel. That would give the illusion of motion that you are looking for (granted it's not much motion, but centered, leaning over the game while playing it would be noticeable)

    Now for music, there is really no point in stereo without the separation. Most of the information between left and right channels is the same anyway. The investment is better spent on higher fidelity/higher quality mono components. The game will sound much better. Or, perhaps try to figure a way to stick in one of my company's audio processors. I have an extra one I don't know what to do with...

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