The adult mode setting on Galactic Tank Force should be called Turrets Syndrome.

Stern's standard marketing procedure is to just release a sizzle reel of the designer playing the game. Probably costs the same or less than what AP did with this launch.

Heres a hot take for ya'll though. GTF> Scooby Doo.

Now...I really need to play a lot more GTF before I fully make up my mind on this but SD is...not a good game. What little I have played of GTF is way way more fun than Scooby. I have played Scooby a lot.

Now Scooby is much more charming, nails the theme, and is beautiful, I'll give it all that, but from a pure gameplay experience GTF is way better.

I find it odd that me as a lame player and you as one who can rack up high scores at shows we are miles apart ability wise, but I have the exact same opinion comparing both games. I want a SD so bad and will get a new one once people are jumping off on new ones. The price is going down just as I expected, figuring about 1-1.5k off in a couple of months. I actually want to go back and play GTF ASAP!

Yeah I have a feeling both Scoob and GTF will be readily available at discounted prices on the used market soon enough

You'd better tread carefully on this thread.

Scooby is incredibly crippled by code right now. Loaded game, great assets, but still very much immature game play code. GTF has a lot more developed game play and environmental show done.. but uncharacteristically for AP.. has some mechanical issues.

Spooky is a more 'hey, check this out!!'' kind of experience right now... where GTF has a more mature pinball player game right now. If American hadn't done that god awful launch video the world would be such a different place right now.

This we can agree on.

I've not played either one but GTF has a massive hill to climb against SD (and just about any other game) on theme alone.

The launch video should have spent more time on the game canon

Get the hell out of here with that kind of rationality. Sense making has no place here!

Some of my main gripes with Scooby are indeed code related (right now best strat: simply start captain cutler over and over and over) but also I just don't find it that fun to shoot, like theres no real satisfying shots, no "kinetic satisfaction". Ball times so incredibly long its borderline insanity. Van "mech" takes too long to do anything... I could go on. I do like the bookshelf flipper though, I think thats a neat idea that adds an interesting element to the game. As far as AP I don't know if not having one of the biggest blunders of all time with this game's launch is the real biggest divider between this game being a joke or taken seriously, but it certainly was a huge contributing factor no doubt.

I really want these guys in the Scooby Doo pin now

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Much needed levity from the coolest cat I've ever bought a pinball from.

Do you really have to be a "high stakes tournament player" to want a playfield that makes sense?

This is a new argument I'm starting a see a lot that you didn't see much in the old days.

"Yeah, you can never see the ball on Popeye, and the playfield layout is terrible. But I don't care cause I'm not some kind of highfalutin tournament player who wants to be able to see both the pinball and the shots I'm aiming for. I'm just having fun!"

"Yeah, bugs Bunny Birthday Bash is a horrible game in almost every way. But I'm not a high stakes tournament player so I love it!!!"

That was my take after playing at TPF and at my dealers. The game was flat out fun. I shot the shit out of the tank and it was a blast. I will agree that the launch was terrible but the only people who care are the same 5 people that hang out on Pinside all day arguing in hype threads. And as for the tank targets bending... so f'ing what. I have a Rush that I love but the game had a bunch of obvious flaws that were not caught and STILL have not been addressed by Stern. Did any of the haters here see the mangled scoops on Rush after just a few plays? The ridiculous scoop fix (hack) Stern came up with? And the constant node board failures? How about the rattling shooter lane? Or the airballs that fly over the switches? All of these issues were fixed by modders and not Stern.

At least with AP and my Houdini they were extremely responsive to the issues that game had after launch. Can't say I've had a better experience from Stern.

I'll respond to this ... Actually, even though I love the Scooby-Doo theme, I'm passing on that game because I don't like watching every shot I take disappear under the huge upper playfield. So, "my idea of fun pinball" does have some criteria; it's not anything goes.

Maybe I shouldn't have used the term "tournament players" and just said other pinball players that are more serious about their pinball playing.

As far as playfields that makes sense, are you referring to the tank's position on the playfield or something else?

To be clear, I have no horse in this race, and I'm not advocating anyone to buy or not to buy. I was simply sharing my take on flipping one game.

got an email that my Deluxe is ready to ship next week. Not going to go through with it. Maybe after I get a chance to play one.

At TPF David Fix said they were making all the LE and SE first (because the people that ordered "deserve to have those first") so the fact that my Deluxe is ready to ship is interesting and something to speculate on. (did they already make all the LE/SLE that were ordered?)

Anyway, hadn't heard of someone actually receiving one that wasn't a show pin, so just offering some production update.

It's okay, the ball still exists even when you can't see it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object_permanence

Not according to simulation theory (e.g. Thomas Campbell's My Big TOE)

Very interesting indeed. I’ll be watching these events as they unfold.

Makes sense.
Play one and then go full TANK!

Tanks for nothing.

I laughed way more than I should have at this. Good job.

I get the inclination to compare the two given they are both part of the class of '23... But comparisons between the games are really irrelevant... it's not GTF vs. Sd vs. Pf vs. GF vs. FF... It's GTF vs. every other option out there... Pinball money isn't only new releases... My bet, is GTF is a pretty sought after game a few years from now... unfortunately, I think that will be in part because it doesn't sell well, but I think this is a title the collectors market will ultimately vindicate... The BIGGEST issue with it (if you take this thread as gospel) is the crappy release...

Remove that, and the other issues with the game are on par with alot of other new release games... I have a GNR that I love, with a disintegrating playfield, an SD on order with all manner of known issues, a GZ that shipped with 2 blown node boards, and a STh that was supposedly the crappiest game ever when I bought it NIB that is supposedly worth twice what I paid for it.

Take the advice of some here, and if you are interested in the game, do yourself a favor... tune out this thread, and PLAY THE GAME!!! Buy what YOU like--and that's something nobody but you can determine.

Your comments would make more sense if these highfalutent tournament players weren't designing the Whitewoods, coming up with rules and dictating the direction of the hobby.

Not true. The detractors in this thread could really care less about the debacle of the release. The problems are that this game really fails on every level. Its like a film striving to become a cult classic but cant achieve B level fame due to its D level production, acting, plot and direction. Im not saying someone cant have a bit of fun flipping GTF and could well get their moneys worth if they bump into it on location, but shooting that tank will be frustrating and become painfully repetitive within a couple of weeks if not days. Hearing the cow moo for the 100th time in the span of 10 plays would make me want to avoid that shot entirely. All of the pilots seem to have been hired from a day labor agency making the ball lock call outs awkward at best. I think we have plenty of ice cream and cows to share with the galaxy so the entire premise falls off the cliff of satire and lands in stupid. That's right, I don't like this game and Im not buying it. I don't need to play it to know that it would never have any longevity in my home. Ive played shitty games before and I dont have to stick my hand in the fire to know it burns.

TBD on the scarcity. Their other games aren't scarce despite modest production numbers. Some sterns are scarce because they weren't hits right away so they moved onto other games that would sell. You want a Houdini? They'll make you one, man. Especially unlicensed pins. If they're still in business in 3-4 years and you want a GTF, they'll make you one. Unless they've come out with a bunch of bangers that are just way more profitable somehow.

Damn never thought about it that way. Why don't they just offer to share the ice cream? There didn't even need to be a giant ass tank in front of the flippers!!

How many plays do you have on it so far?

Well based on your interpretation of the video performances and reasons... you obviously are ready to make rash decisions based on poorly informed positions. So thanks for sharing.

Cool dude. My post isn't trying to convince you to buy it.

I do have to question your unwillingness to play it though... Even more so given your post in this thread, but to each their own... You've been around long enough to know alot of games which were hated on release (Cirqus Voltaire and Stranger Things to name two) have since become collectible.

But if YOU don't like it, and are completely unwilling to give it a play, I respect that.

I will say though, for me, while gameplay video is useful, it doesn't reflect the actual experience of most games. When watching, call outs and video assets are the most material part of the experience. But when playing, those things tend to fade into the background quite a bit, and things I found obnoxious on YouTube aren't as important in "real life." In any event, the game may not be for you--but find it hard to believe everyone could decide that without playing it.

I want my GTF (x4)

Look at that campy , that's the way you do it
You play the GTF on the meltdown mode.
That ain't playn that's the way you do it
Money for ice cream and your fudge for free

Now that ain't workin' that's the way you do it
Lemme tell ya them mordman ain't dumb
Maybe get a blister from all that Flippin.
Maybe get a blister on your pointers.

We got to install those tank treads
Custom cabinets, deliveries.
We got to move these tank units.
We got to move these chocolate Sundies.

"BBBBBBBBBBBBBEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEPPPPPPPPPPPPP"

We got to install those tank treads
Custom cabinets, deliveries.
We got to move these tank units.
We got to move these chocolate Sundies.

We got to install those tank treads
Custom cabinets, deliveries.
We got to move these tank units.
We got to move these chocolate Sundies.

We got to install those tank treads
Custom cabinets, deliveries.
We got to move these tank units.
We got to move these chocolate Sundies.

I shoulda learned to make them shots.
I shoulda learned to play them pop bumpers.
Look at that mama, she got it stickin' in the camera man
We could have some fun

And he's up there, what's that? Tanks noises?
Booming with the tank guns like a chimpanzee
Oh, that ain't work'in that's the way you do it
Get your ice cream for nothin', get your fudge for free

Listen here

Now that ain't workin' that's the way you do it
You play the GTF on the Danger stream.
That ain't workin' that's the way you do it
Money for icecream and your fudge for free

We got to install those tank treads
Custom cabinets, deliveries.
We got to move these tank units.
We got to move these chocolate Sundies

We got to install those tank treads
Custom cabinets, deliveries.
We got to move these tank units.
We got to move these chocolate Sundies

Dire Straits is calling.

The whole ToUrNaMenT PlAyEr thing really annoys the pants off me too. Yeah, I play in tournaments but I also play for fun. In fact, I'm playing for fun a lot more often than I am playing in tournaments. Once I graduated from being a super casual player to being an enthusiast player but not yet a tournament player, it was really easy to see why a lot of people would say a game like South Park actually stunk. Its just not fun even if you are somewhat skilled at playing pinball. Maybe "skilled" isn't even the right word, maybe the phrase "understanding pinball" or something would be better. Now that I am a tournament player, theres not one game that I enjoyed playing for fun that now stinks because its "not good in tournaments". Literally not a thing that has ever happened to me, and not a thing I have heard from any other player either. Turns out, I play in tournaments for the same reason I play pinball: to have fun.

Yeah because tournament players need super deep code with 7 wizard modes and 50 modes to get through and all the stuff we all love in modern games. Us tournament players are always getting super deep into games every time we play. Each round is 2 hours long. Thats how it works. Oh wait...its not. Its almost as if these "Tourney players" designing white woods are making games that are fun for casuals AND tournament players AND home players. Seriously, have you ever said one thing that wasn't just completely and laughably wrong? If these guys were designing strictly tournament games they'd all play like old ballys and sterns where you have to risk everything to build up spinners and shit and thats the whole game. MAYBE...I know this is wild, but hear me out, MAYBE some of these guys just understand pinball and what makes them fun for almost everyone? MAYBE theres some overlap at being good at pinball and figuring out how to make fun games. I don't know, just a thought...

Yeah, Keith Elwin keeps designing games that are only fun for “tournament players” and nobody else likes them.

Genius observation by Umad.

But, does the ball simultaneously exist and not exist? Schrodinger's cat wants to know.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schr%C3%B6dinger%27s_cat

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The first time I played it was like nothing special. The sound is still terrible like all American Pinball tables (I swear they don't have anyone with audio engineering working at that place) and you can't really skip the animations. Aside from that the shots weren't that great and I played it a few times and would have decently long games, maybe 10 minutes and you get a score like 100-200 million. I get a high score like ~170M. I come back a few days later and the low score on the leaderboard is 1 billion and top score (by what I'd consider an average player) of 19 billion.

Certainly there is something I am missing and I will have to figure out some sort of strategy before I have to play it in a tournament.

Damn, GTF doesn't even have an entry on IPDB yet - talk about no respect!

have you tried the intergalactic pinball database? It may be a more popular title in other galaxies.

I get confused by the 2, IGPDB and the IPDB, all the time.

None of the new releases of the past several months are on IPDB. No GTF, no Foo Fighters, no Godfather, no Scooby Doo, etc. The managers of that site don't put much energy into it anymore.

Leave it to pinside to suck the life out this and spit out a lifeless corpse.

Maybe look in Uranus.

I got to play this at pin fest last weekend.. I played one at the coin taker booth and one at pinballstar

First impression..great looking game. Cab, artwork and playfield all really nice. 3d sculpts are ok… would it be better molded, yes…. But they were not that bad when you are staring at the entire machine.

Animation and screen. I liked it. Sound overall was ok. Dub step is what it is. Sound effects were better than the dub step.

Now the machine at the coin taker booth was no fun…. Brutal to the point of not fun.. I don’t think the ball save or the cow were working. However. I played the game at pinballstar… and it was way better for some reason, still tough but better)….. I enjoyed that one. One issue on that one was the upkicker in the back would not up kick enough. I liked the second one… but they do need to make sure the games play right…. Look forward to getting more time on them.

You forgot to use your GTF tank pun.

Leave it to pinside to suck the life out this and spit out a lifeless 'corps'.

Don't blame pinside for this game tanking. Pinside was dying for a game to glom onto and fawn over from AP. Look at the early portions of this thread. There are always haters, but a half decent LE trim package and better gameplay and flow would have gone over BIG here with this cool theme and awesome art (classic at least). Even the bungled release could have been overlooked if the game hadn't had so many critical flaws. Too many other games released at around the same time gave people options to compare GTF to. And yes, the truly bizarre decision to go with the tank body, turret and treads alone was enough for many here including me to cancel LE orders and say no tanks.

Exactly. The decision not to purchase had a lot of factors.
Some of those weren't AP's fault, namely all the great new games released at same time..
IMDN and DP from 2018 having another productiom run at same time..
MMr showed up a few hours away at a decent price.

If I didn't have so many amazing options within a 3 month window, I might have gotten GTF despite all the other shit (fortunate enough to be able to get 4 other pins this year and I couldn't convince myself GTF was a better purchase than any of those)

What is your list of critical flaws?

Tank location (close)
Tank Targets (fix coming but no movement on when)
VUK stuck balls
Code issues (locking up and center save pop up not really working well)

for me not really any "fatal" or many 'critical" flaws, just a list too long of things i don't like.

tank targets taking up too much shot area
overall design... multiple vuks, poor visibility in the rear.
unsure if atomic shield works reliable assuming no airballs (haven't been able to see much video on it. unfortunately 3 AP employees avoided tank when streaming so couldn't see that feature)
unprocessed unpainted FDM printed toys (not big deal for some, big deal for me. would seriously have to spend 20+ hours working on them to be ok with having it in my house. Not how i want to spend first weeks with a new pinball machine)
slightly cringy live action
no settings to change questionable music
engineering/build flaws/issues, incl airball targets, lack of sling washers, ball lock mech, atomic shield too big for hole? some no big deal but multiple flaws that should have been obvious adds up to uncomfortable feeling.
General lack of faith in AP leadership due to reveal and subsequent launch of the game.
price is too high and demand is too low, likely poor resale value.
no documentation of the rules. AP employee even said "I want you to figure out the rules yourself." What? Ok dude, I don't want to pay 9400 for a game with mystery rules. I've pieced together the gist of it watching the various streams. But no rules doc, no rules oriented game play video. They aren't helping themselves there. What do those "lucky break" switches under the flippers do?? How complete do the rules seem?

A lot of that could be responded to with "play the game!" yeah, I will one day. And maybe I'll want one afterwards. But the reality we are in is that a lot of people buy games now without playing them. AP is certainly expecting people to (probably literally NEEDS people to at this point). FF I waited til the moment gameplay was released and I didn't even make first run. I'm OK sometimes buying game without playing it, but the marketing/presentation/info sharing / resale value plays into it.

After seeing the game in person, the closeness of the tank targets is really overblown IMO. Once they get the reliability dialed in and implement the tank target fix, this game will be just fine.

Let's put it in ice cream terms, expectations vs the actual product

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