Since so many Pinsiders restore games and other antiques, build gamerooms, landscape, etc. etc. (talented bunch, aren't we???), Pinside should be a good place to find someone who knows about vintage plastering. I'm learning about lime plaster so I can correctly repair the walls and ceilings and tuckpoint the stones on our home / gameroom, which was originally the First National Bank of Piedmont built in 1887 (pic). I'm also trying to find a good source of real vintage-type plasters (gauging plasters), and different limes and sands that I can pick up within 100 miles or so of our place in Piedmont, WV 26750. South or SW PA, Maryland, VA, are all close enough for us to drive out and pick up materials.
If any of you know someone we could hire who would travel to Piedmont (we can provide a free room and games to play to help us with plastering, painting, brick and stone foundation repair, tuckpointing, etc. I'd appreciate a reference. We have several other buildings that all need things, too , the newest one being a 1904 brick warehouse. I'm pretty much doing everything myself, because this is an area where all of the skilled laborers have left and found better jobs elsewhere. There are many small contractors here that have good intentions, but no idea what they're doing.
I figure if I do all the work myself, I will be about 145 years old when it's all done
Any vintage plasterers out there?

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Here's the little piece I'm working on...the building was horribly abused by cheap landlords for 75 years.
Water leaks ate away the plaster under the bathroom window.
It's disappointing to see the inside of the building now! Drop ceilings and drywall where it shouldn't be.
Gradually removing 7-1/2 foot drop ceilings and going back to 10 feet. Uncovering and repairing transom windows above every window in the building.
The former bank lobby has been stripped of all original fixtures. It makes a great game room, though!
I'll post a few pics when I can find some good ones.

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===Warning: Long-winded post!========
Bud Gorgeous house! Nice original details...
Our Bank was a fairly simply-designed commercial building, never intended as a residence. The bones are great, and its lack of ornamental detail gives us some freedom to re-design the interiors to our liking. Hey, that almost sounds convincing!!! It was originally 12 offices upstairs, converted to 5 apartments in the 1940s, and further butchered as the years went on. There are two large skylights in the stairwells that are wonderful. One skylight was hidden above a drop ceiling, and that "stairwell" is now a bathroom on each floor. Dumbwaiter and/or elevator is a high priority for us! There are a lot of stairs...
I've been working on my building(s) for almost 9 years, and my pace gets slower and slower, unfortunately. My health has not been good, and there is absolutely no one around here that is capable of doing quality work. Most of them I would never trust in my home, either.
I was hoping to engage the interest of my nephews/niece, cousins, friends, etc. in helping out with this huge project, but no one under about 55 years old seems to want to do any physical work. I have one sister who has been out here almost every year for a week or two to visit and help out. Sadly, her health has not allowed her to return this year.
This town and the entire area has fallen into disrepair in a way that has affected countless small towns in the U.S.A. It's a beautiful area, but everyone with any talent left years ago for better jobs. Those remaining are retired, disabled like us, on welfare, or squatting. A few have actual jobs and are more responsible. It's hard to know where to start in an area like this. But it feels like there is huge potential.
We came here for the cheap buildings, and nothing else! Our minimum plan has always been to make a comfortable space for ourselves to retire in and store all our stuff. We really wish we found this place about 20 years ago! But we will enjoy it as long as we're here and try to leave the buildings in better condition than we found them.
I may start a new thread to try to find some people who would like to consult or partner with us about possible business ideas that might allow us to generate enough income to be able to afford to properly rehab our buildings and get them all 100% useable and leased out. We have a million ideas, but we're not business people! We'll never get it all done at this rate...
Here is a picture from 1900 or so showing the original cupola on the building. It was removed in the 50s or 60s as far as I can tell. There are some old tiles in the attic, just like the ones seen on the "cone" in this postcard view. For a long time, the cupola was covered with copper like Bud 's house. The top of the cornice all the way around the building is still covered with huge green sheets of copper. They are just starting to come loose and need repair. I need to rent a high lift (or somehow find someone to do it!) and reattach some loose edges before it gets worse.
All of the transom windows you see in the postcard are now above the drop ceilings, and painted over. One by one, we are freeing them up as we raise the ceilings. The arched windows on the main floor were never blocked. They are beautiful, and they are designed to open inward, pivoting at the bottom, held back by a chain. Only one is freed up and working right now.
We also own the building to the left of the Bank in the postcard (we were able to buy all the adjacent properties that surround our building). It's called the "Bice Building", after it's builder, and was constructed in 1877. It's in horrible shape inside with a badly-leaking roof, but the exterior details are in quite decent shape. It needs some serious roofing and and brick work. I'm trying to get my butt up there to start working on putting a metal roof on it before it's totally ruined. That one keeps me awake at night...
We took on way too many old buildings, but they were cheap and we couldn't bear to watch them melt away. We at least want to stabilize them and try to save them! Total is about 50,000 square feet, with most of it useable but some major leaks to deal with.
I'll post more pics after I dig through the thousands I have...sometimes it's quicker just to take new ones!
Denny (and Cindi)
Piedmont, WV
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A shot of the skylights, and the chimney that needs repairs:

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A couple of interior shots...hard to photograph the stairs.
The big skylight is over this stairwell and provides a lot of light.
From the 2nd floor to the street there are 23 stairs on that long stairway. The stairs all have cast-iron treads screwed on over the wood. I want to take them all off and clean them up and refinish the stairs. Maybe if I get 9 more lives.
An old bank makes a great house.

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I don't know what's typical...the first floor, that was the bank lobby, has a 12 foot ceiling with some plaster rosettes. That room took a beating when it was used as Piedmont's Post Office from the 1940s until about 1989. It's our pinball room now.

They're out there, if you're pretty independent and willing to give up living in a nicer area.
We gambled and got lucky - there was a huge paper mill here that was active until only two years ago, and now it's shut down forever. We can see the Potomac from our kitchen window, and there are 3 large reservoirs nearby for boating. We're about 2-1/2 hours from Pittsburgh and 3 hours from Washington, DC. Some new development is happening nearby, and like I said, there's a lot of "potential"! LOL
We're only about 200 yards from the Maryland border, and about 30 miles from Pennsylvania. We would not have moved here if it was way deep in southern West Virginia...this was enough of a culture shock!

It's such a mess right now, I'm embarrassed!
You can see a scaffold above Twilight Zone...there is a big hole in the ceiling there we're working on (not visible in pic).
The ugly red paint on the box columns is from the Post Office. That marked where the fire extinguishers were hanging.
Windows are all covered to keep light off of the pins.
The floor is all original wood, and perfectly useable.
There is a cellar under that floor with about a 6 foot ceiling. It's made from 3 older foundations joined together. Some of it could be as old as 1850s-1870s. I need to do some archeological digging down there...most of it is concrete floor, but the older parts are dirt.

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Here are some pictures that some locals found and posted online of the interior of our building in the 1950s , when it was the Piedmont Post Office. Not too fancy - it looks pretty much the same today except for the service windows and PO boxes are gone.
The Post Office loved that sickly-green color that was used in those days. Several of the arched windows are still painted over in that green color.

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This is cool...the "Piedmont Ice and Locker" float, complete with bluegrass band, rides past our building sometime in the 1950s...

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One more piece of history...the First National Bank of Piedmont was one of the "chartered" banks that had currency printed with their own name and charter number (3629) on it. These are pics from the web - I'd love to find one of these bills, but I'm not paying what they want for these! Hundreds of dollars...
We did find a stack of handwritten deposit slips from 1901 in the basement. I'll snap a pic of some of them. Not too many traces of the history of the building left, but there are a few.
The two original Mosler screw-door safes from our bank are still in Piedmont, across the street at the First United Bank. First United Bank (the "FU" Bank, we call it) directly descended from our First National Bank of Piedmont. They still have a couple of old ledgers from here, too. We're trying to pry some of that out of their hands for display.
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In case you're bored, here are some more vintage pictures!
A few more old postcards showing our Bank, and an old photo of the Piedmont roundhouses from shortly after the Civil War. It's amazing to see the progression of time, from horse and buggy and cobblestones, to the 50s and no more cupola. I like the first postcard - kids still jack around on our steps just like they did in 1900.
We were able to find a number of different Piedmont postcards on eBay. Piedmont was a stop on the West End of the original Main Line of the B&O Railroad, beginning in 1851. CSX owns the tracks now, and still runs freight and coal through here. Passenger service ended in the 1960s, unfortunately. That was really the beginning of the end of Piedmont, and many other small railroad towns.

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Depends on the age - that does look like it to me. If it's pre-1919, it is almost certainly lime plaster. It looks white or grayish-white, and you might be able to see the chopped-up hair in the base layer.
Later plaster is gypsum-based and very similar, but has cement in it. It can be a little pinkish-looking.
I hand-mixed my first test patch, but now I have a little Harbor Freight mixer. I scratched the surface with a nail so the top coat will adhere. It's hard as a rock and should work fine. Takes a couple weeks to fully harden, since there's no cement, only lime, sand, and water. It hardens by absorbing CO2 from the air, basically turning the lime back into limestone.
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Yes, we call it plaster and lath, too...and plasterboard starts showing up in the 1920s or so in the States, also.
The part I'm repairing now is plaster directly on top of brick. I never really knew you could do that! But my test patch seems to be sticking really well to the brick, so it is doable with my modern version of lime plaster.

Holy Shit rotordave ! You "UNDERSTAND" what I am going through...all the little holes and crumbly edges from years of neglected water leaks. Applying many different skills to fix the underlying problems and make it all look perfect again. Tricky corners and angles on everything. Sort of like restoring a giant pinball machine. Nice Job on your place!!!
The kiddie pool for a leak-catcher is classic. Our local Dollar General store sells kiddie pools year-round for this use.
I never understood the logic of putting bigger and bigger buckets under leaks instead of fixing the leaks. They do that stuff all the time around here. Lack of education and basic skills is a big part of the problem here in Piedmont, WV, and probably in a lot of places worldwide.
Many, many historic buildings are reaching the point of no return with water damage and other problems. They were built to last 100 years, and many of them are still in good shape despite virtually zero maintenance. But it's getting close to 150 years for a lot of them, and they are trashed, especially the roofs. If you can get one and save it, you will have something stronger, better, and more beautiful than anything made today.
Yes, it is a full-time job. I'm doing it the hard way, though - I've been disabled for 10+ years but I can work hard for a couple of hours a day most days. It takes careful planning, and making sure I have the right tools, etc. but the shit does get done. It's gonna take 20 more years to finish at this rate, but it really makes me feel like I'm doing something worthwhile. I pretty much had to give up or restrict everything I used to do for work and for recreation, and change my focus to things I CAN do.
This has been a difficult and very rewarding project. I'm glad to be able to share it with some people here that appreciate this kind of thing.

Manny65 That's exactly the way they do it..a thick basecoat, like 3/4", and a thinner coat on top. They use finer sand and maybe a little less of it for the top coat, but it's all the same stuff. What I like about it is you have all day to dink around with the plaster and smooth it and make it flat. It sets up really slowly compared to anything else I've ever gooped on to walls.
They do a whole lot more plastering in the UK, and there are a ton of great websites with information about lime plaster and other old finishing methods. This site is very informative - https://www.limeworks.us/. They get into the differences between so called "hydraulic" and non-hydraulic limes. The hydraulic limes have some cement in them, and are sort of a hybrid between the old lime-and-sand mix and more modern ones. There is really an unbelievable amount of information to be discovered on the topic of interior plaster and exterior stucco and other mixes.
This is both the fun part, and the problem with doing restorations. There are a million rabbit holes you have to look in for information, and that is distracting and takes a lot of time.
I've always loved being a Jack of All Trades, Master of None!
"...Specialization is for insects..." Sci-fi author Stanislaw Lem

Manny65 Here's a picture showing the layers in the area I'm repairing...almost an inch thick. I already pulled off the loose parts, and will fill it in with new plaster. I'm putting in some metal lath where it's wood underneath.
It's 133 years old, and it would have been fine except for the water leaks. Amazing shit!

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We thought about that, too, but we decided it would always remind us of how hacked up everything was when we got it.
rotordave must know the feeling of obsession with filling every hole and smoothing out every rough spot...
When we first moved into our building, it was still owned by the evil hacker landlord, and we were renting an apartment from him. Every repair we do erases more of his evil influence over our building.
It was a dream come true, really - buying out our landlord and taking over the building. We let the two remaining apartment leases expire, then made the whole thing into our house.

Quite the solid little place - they built them so the Big Bad Wolf could never blow them down! I love the chunky rough-sawn lumber in the old places. Thick wood, unbelievably heavy and strong.
Looks like it'll be a nice rental or AirBnb.

Very interesting pics, Manny - these renovations force us to combine all sorts of materials and technology to make it all work. The bathroom I'm working on is a "practice ground" for every other room in the Bank. It had every possible variation of original materials and later additions and hack work.
There is drywall on top of plaster over wood lath. There's drywall on top of plaster on top of plasterboard. There is original wood lath on the ceiling with plaster. And there is plaster directly over brick.
There were "examples" of every kind of damage. Ceiling plaster coming loose from lath due to leaks, wall plaster cracking and falling off due to leaks, holes bashed in walls to route electrical wires...
I'm using multiple techniques on the bathroom to see which ones I like best. On one wall, I extended the framing and drywall up to the full 10 feet rather than tearing out a framed wall that was on top of the plaster. Mostly, I would like to avoid doing that, and go back to the plaster walls where possible.
I stabilized the ceiling with dozens of plaster washers, and removed all the loose and failing plaster. Then I covered the whole ceiling with drywall.
A mess of different materials, but it's coming out OK so far. More pics later as I make progress.

It is funny that our problems are so similar, even though we live halfway around the world from each other. We've seen many "creative" ways to deal with leaks (that never work).
I just stood up from my desk and snapped this picture of the building across the street with its decrepit peeling paint and a cooler in the window to catch leaks. Their building is full of kiddie pools and buckets.
It just sold recently for $8000. The plumbing store next door owns it, and probably has no plans but to use it for storage.
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If the plaster is intact, I would save it and use it "as-is". Drywall compound sticks nicely to both plaster and drywall, and you can blend between the two pretty easily.
If it's cracking and falling apart, then drywalling over may be the easiest and best way. I used plaster washers to keep the remaining plaster in place (visible in 2nd pic near drywall edge), and then screwed drywall right over it. I've seen people put furring strips up first, but the ceiling plaster and lath is so thick that I was worried that even 3" screws wouldn't reach through all the layers.
Here are a few pics of the ceiling progress. You can see where I extended the one wall up with framing instead of demolishing the rest of it.
This bathroom was carved out of the room next to it in the 1940s, so there's some old hackwork in there.
We're almost ready to tape and mud and then start painting.

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That's pretty much what we did...

That would be great!!! But I don't think I can afford one now...and I have reached my 20-game saturation level anyway.
I played a lot of Safecracker when it was at Lyons Classic Pinball. I've got a pile of the tokens around somewhere...
It was on loan from Dean Grover, who worked on the software for that game at B/W in the 90s, and played in the local Mile High Pinball League. You can see his name in the right outlane ("F/X: Dean Grover"). We always thought it was cool to play with someone who's name is printed on the playfield!
If you turn Safecracker on when the date is October 24th, it will display "Happy Birthday Ryan and Amanda", who are Dean's kids! How many kids get their birthdays memorialized on a 90s Bally DMD?
I've played Safecracker with Dean and with Ryan...Amanda wasn't so big on pinball.
I also played Safecracker and many other games against Escher Lefkoff in Lyons. I even beat him a few times...because he was 6 years old, LOL!!!! He beat the adults plenty of times, enough that we never "held back" against him during tournaments. That's why he's so good today.
Good memories from Lyons days...

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We only heat/cool the parts we are using, which is a small percentage of it all. The hallways get very chilly in the winter!
The upper 2 floors that we use as our home are about 4000 sq. ft. total, including the halls. There are separate electric meters for each of the 5 former apartments plus one for the Bank, so we know exactly how much we are using everywhere.
The previous owner took out the central steam heating and installed electric heat. He also removed a hanging gas heater from the bank lobby, but it would be pretty easy to hook up again.
We want to start installing solar panels soon, since we have a lot of unobstructed roof space. Then, electric heat makes more sense.
We get a lot of passive solar heating on sunny days - the stone and brick absorb the sun and it warms up the whole building.

Some progress is starting to be visible...
Amazing how much material is needed to fix up an 11'x5-1/2' room. We did add about 64 sq.ft. of wall area by removing the drop ceiling.

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The roundhouses were built in 1852 and 1855, and were repaired after being attacked multiple times by Confederate raiders. They were torn down between 1905 and 1918 when the B&O was modernizing their shops.
Our cupola seems to have vanished sometime in the late 1940s to early 1950s, probably because it was needing repairs and looked "old-fashioned" by then.
Many historic buildings were butchered in the name of modernization before we learned more about preservation.
We've thought about building an observatory dome in the general shape of the old cupola in memory of my Dad, who loved astronomy.

Last month's Halloween decorations. Cindi usually does more, but we're really busy working on the inside of the house...
Google Street View came by here several years ago, around 2015, shortly after half a block burned down across the street from us. You can see our Halloween decorations from that year, and the generally run-down condition of our town.
Here's a link that should take you straight to the street view in front of our house:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/hg3MhQvjSamwAjiz8

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Nope, that's just an area where it was not really repairable. The bathroom wall below the window and a wall downstairs are getting plaster next. I'm worried that it's too cold to plaster now...might wait until spring.

We've got PLENTY of raw brick at our warehouse! We originally bought a 1904 warehouse and were planning to live in the old offices. Once we were able to acquire the Bank, the warehouse became our storage unit and garage. Eventually it will have living space fixed up in it.
The office needs some plaster work - the whole warehouse is another giant black hole of a project...I'll post a few pics of the office when I dig through my photos. The interior pic below shows part of the 4th floor...there's a freight elevator, too...

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A lot of people in the States go Halloween-crazy! Those bank windows are about 5 by 6 feet, and just beg to have displays put in them. We want to try projectors next. There is nothing going on in town at all, so any displays are morale-boosters.

Thanks, you guys! The warehouse is what drew us out here. It is a type of building known in the U.S. as "Mill Construction", with thick brick walls and a massive interior wooden structure.
It needs a LOT of work, including a bunch of plaster in the office (pics soon, I promise), but most of the space is useable and dry. The freight elevator works, but will not go all the way down to the first level due to warpage of the wooden elevator tracks.
If any of you old-building fans somehow find yourselves near our area, I'd be happy to give you a memorable tour! It takes a couple of hours just to see every level of every building...
There weren't too many artifacts from the old Grocery Company days, but there were a few things. Pics will be posted as I dig them up or retake them...
Compare this picture on a 1906 invoice to the picture I posted yesterday...you can see how they had their own railroad siding and loaded directly in and out of boxcars. The siding no longer exists, but you can still see the bricked-up loading dock doors today.

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Took a few pics in the old Piedmont Grocery Company offices today...all of the material around the windows is plaster on brick.
We want to open up all of the bricked-up windows and make an apartment out of it.
When we first got the building, the office was filled up 4 feet deep with trash and tires and junk.
Why did they use that hideous green color in many 1950s offices?

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Yes, stop by next time you are Stateside!

Here's an interesting article about how to make plaster walls flat and true. You use plumb dots and screeds, of course!
https://www.adrianwest.org/plastering/dots.html