(Topic ID: 209706)

[Announcement] PinSound reveals the PinSound +


By PinSound

2 years ago



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  • 129 posts
  • 56 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 11 months ago by Mr_Tantrum
  • Topic is favorited by 39 Pinsiders

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    There are 129 posts in this topic. You are on page 3 of 3.
    #101 2 years ago

    Are there any plans to emulate the YM2151 sound chip on older games rather than rely on sample playback for everything? I ask because of the incalculable amount of "on the fly" dynamic programming tricks the sound designers used in these games is simply impossible to recreate faithfully through samples. For example, on Rollergames, they actually wrote into the code what chord was playing during each measure of music and almost all of the sound effects play "in key" with that chord (meaning if you were to hit the same target twice during two different measures of music with different chords, the sound you hear is slightly different to match the underlying music track).

    YM2151 emulation has been pretty perfectly achieved in PinMAME, so I'm curious if this emulation would be ever be ported over to Pinsound for more faithful recreation of the original sound packages. I realize Pinsound's primary goal is to replace the old audio with custom audio, but for those that prefer the original, emulation really is the optimal way to go with the older games that use the YM2151.

    #102 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinwizkid:

    Are there any plans to emulate the YM2151 sound chip on older games rather than rely on sample playback for everything? I ask because of the incalculable amount of "on the fly" dynamic programming tricks the sound designers used in these games is simply impossible to recreate faithfully through samples. For example, on Rollergames, they actually wrote into the code what chord was playing during each measure of music and almost all of the sound effects play "in key" with that chord (meaning if you were to hit the same target twice during two different measures of music with different chords, the sound you hear is slightly different to match the underlying music track).
    YM2151 emulation has been pretty perfectly achieved in PinMAME, so I'm curious if this emulation would be ever be ported over to Pinsound for more faithful recreation of the original sound packages. I realize Pinsound's primary goal is to replace the old audio with custom audio, but for those that prefer the original, emulation really is the optimal way to go with the older games that use the YM2151.

    A PinSound product that was a synthesizer instead of a sampler would be amazing! Come on France! You won the World Cup! Now is the time!

    #103 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinwizkid:

    Are there any plans to emulate the YM2151 sound chip on older games rather than rely on sample playback for everything? I ask because of the incalculable amount of "on the fly" dynamic programming tricks the sound designers used in these games is simply impossible to recreate faithfully through samples. For example, on Rollergames, they actually wrote into the code what chord was playing during each measure of music and almost all of the sound effects play "in key" with that chord (meaning if you were to hit the same target twice during two different measures of music with different chords, the sound you hear is slightly different to match the underlying music track).
    YM2151 emulation has been pretty perfectly achieved in PinMAME, so I'm curious if this emulation would be ever be ported over to Pinsound for more faithful recreation of the original sound packages. I realize Pinsound's primary goal is to replace the old audio with custom audio, but for those that prefer the original, emulation really is the optimal way to go with the older games that use the YM2151.

    Chris Granner was on here a little while ago talking about this in relation to Twilight Zone (a bit), and Whitewater in particular - he talked about how on WW the music will speed up in certain multi alls, and that this couldn’t be replicated in the current Pinsound

    It seems a big stretch to be able to emulate the synthesiser chips - at that point, why use PinSound at all? It would be prohibitively time consuming to somehow re-map all the sounds to higher-quality synth patches, and I don’t know if it would ever be possible to get every combination of sound and settings

    But the brothers could implement a speed-up and a key change aspect to the playback, which would roughly emulate what you are referring to

    #104 2 years ago
    Quoted from FlippyD:

    A PinSound product that was a synthesizer instead of a sampler would be amazing! Come on France! You won the World Cup! Now is the time!

    XLOL!

    #105 2 years ago
    Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

    It seems a big stretch to be able to emulate the synthesiser chips - at that point, why use PinSound at all? It would be prohibitively time consuming to somehow re-map all the sounds to higher-quality synth patches, and I don’t know if it would ever be possible to get every combination of sound and settings

    I was talking more about the original YM2151 audio rather than any upgraded audio. YM2151 emulation has existed for over a decade and I feel as though if it could be implemented, it would save a TON of time on Pinsound's end due to not having to sample every sound effect and music track from the games that use this chip. This would also turn Pinsound into a plug and play repro sound board for pretty much every system 11 game, early WPC game, and even a few Gottlieb and Data East titles (not to mention you'd get 100% accuracy in all the dynamic programmed based sound alterations that simply cannot be accurately sampled).

    #106 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinwizkid:

    I was talking more about the original YM2151 audio rather than any upgraded audio. YM2151 emulation has existed for over a decade and I feel as though if it could be implemented, it would save a TON of time on Pinsound's end due to not having to sample every sound effect and music track from the games that use this chip. This would also turn Pinsound into a plug and play repro sound board for pretty much every system 11 game, early WPC game, and even a few Gottlieb and Data East titles (not to mention you'd get 100% accuracy in all the dynamic programmed based sound alterations that simply cannot be accurately sampled).

    I see - perhaps that will make its way into a Pinsound 2.0!

    1 month later
    #107 2 years ago

    I want to bump this for anyone that has one. If I put this on a doctor who, what ELSE must I buy besides the board? Do I HAVE to make this stereo? Do I need the 40 dollar wpc"reset board" thing from their website? How easy/hard is this to install? Does it use the same connections that the old board uses?

    #108 2 years ago
    Quoted from jorant:

    I want to bump this for anyone that has one. If I put this on a doctor who, what ELSE must I buy besides the board? Do I HAVE to make this stereo? Do I need the 40 dollar wpc"reset board" thing from their website? How easy/hard is this to install? Does it use the same connections that the old board uses?

    All those answers are “depends” - do you need stereo? No. Do you want it? Yes. You may not need Rob Kahr’s reset board - My game did not, and I had every mod conceivable on it. ColorDMD, pinsound, lit speaker panel, moving Dalek, etc.

    Yes it uses the same connections. From your questions though I STRONGLY encourage you to read the install instructions and download and play around with pinsound studio. It can be a lot to deal with the first time you install one. Installation is easy as far as the hardware, the sounds can be complicated to install the first time

    1 year later
    #109 1 year ago

    About to order my first kit, speakers
    Shaker etc for Fish Tales

    Pinside what can I expect?

    Thanks!!!

    #110 1 year ago
    Quoted from whitey:

    About to order my first kit, speakers
    Shaker etc for Fish Tales
    Pinside what can I expect?
    Thanks!!!

    Wait....i got mine last year on a Black Friday special. Free stuff thrown in.
    But, if it were me I would throw it in Indy before fish tales. Good mixes available. Go stereo harness too.

    #111 1 year ago

    I'm a huge fan of their products. I've got them in all my machines. T2 and Data East Star Wars have great shaker soundtracks. I'm sure Indy rocks as well, I just haven't spend much time trying it out yet. Headphone station is a must IMHO for ease of changing sound tracks.

    #112 1 year ago
    Quoted from whitey:

    About to order my first kit, speakers
    Shaker etc for Fish Tales
    Pinside what can I expect?
    Thanks!!!

    I don’t believe there are any Fishtales HQ mixes, so don’t get your hopes up that the $600 you’re about to drop will change your life. For
    That particular game you may want to just go for a PinWoofer. Way less $$ and same result

    Were you putting this in TZ, IJTPA, FH, CFTBL, LOTR, DW, TAF, Getaway, STTNG, etc, I would say go for it, but FT does not benefit -as much- as those games do.

    IJ is the best of all of them IMO

    #113 1 year ago

    Don’t forget BSD, I have FT and wouldn’t waste my money as it’s not going to get much better with a PinSound set up at the moment.

    #114 1 year ago

    A high quality version of TSPP would be awesome. Original audio is muddy.

    3 weeks later
    #115 1 year ago

    I have recently purchased a Pinsound+ to put in my Star Wars Data East. The initial board was faulty and I had to send it back and pay a repair fee, as well as shipping to France. Aside, from that frustration and despite them sending me a brand new product to replace the bad one, I still have pretty muddy sounding audio. I have tried 2 different soundtracks and both don't really sound much different in terms of quality. I have Pyle aftermarket speakers and subs that have been installed about a year ago and they sound fine with the factory soundcard setup. I have everything hooked up properly but im just not getting good sound. It's loud but not in a good way. More of just eardrum piercing noise on some of the effects like R2D2 sfx.

    Not sure if anyone has any suggestions or have had any issues or if this is the best thread to post about it on. I'm leaning towards pulling it back out and trying to sell it and recoup any of the over $400 i have into it.

    #116 1 year ago
    Quoted from DJY2J:

    I have recently purchased a Pinsound+ to put in my Star Wars Data East. The initial board was faulty and I had to send it back and pay a repair fee, as well as shipping to France. Aside, from that frustration and despite them sending me a brand new product to replace the bad one, I still have pretty muddy sounding audio. I have tried 2 different soundtracks and both don't really sound much different in terms of quality. I have Pyle aftermarket speakers and subs that have been installed about a year ago and they sound fine with the factory soundcard setup. I have everything hooked up properly but im just not getting good sound. It's loud but not in a good way. More of just eardrum piercing noise on some of the effects like R2D2 sfx.
    Not sure if anyone has any suggestions or have had any issues or if this is the best thread to post about it on. I'm leaning towards pulling it back out and trying to sell it and recoup any of the over $400 i have into it.

    Did you buy it in new condition? If so don’t they warranty the products?

    #117 1 year ago
    Quoted from DJY2J:

    I have recently purchased a Pinsound+ to put in my Star Wars Data East. The initial board was faulty and I had to send it back and pay a repair fee, as well as shipping to France. Aside, from that frustration and despite them sending me a brand new product to replace the bad one, I still have pretty muddy sounding audio. I have tried 2 different soundtracks and both don't really sound much different in terms of quality. I have Pyle aftermarket speakers and subs that have been installed about a year ago and they sound fine with the factory soundcard setup. I have everything hooked up properly but im just not getting good sound. It's loud but not in a good way. More of just eardrum piercing noise on some of the effects like R2D2 sfx.
    Not sure if anyone has any suggestions or have had any issues or if this is the best thread to post about it on. I'm leaning towards pulling it back out and trying to sell it and recoup any of the over $400 i have into it.

    What else did you buy that pushed it over $400?

    Have you tried dialing in the backbox and cabinet relative volumes? Games generally sound best when the cabinet is boosted to ~3 o’clock and the backbox is either at 12 or even 11. You can add a bit of a bass boost as well on the cab.

    #118 1 year ago
    Quoted from PinRob:

    If so don’t they warranty the products?

    We do guarantee our products, except when the product is not used properly. But even in that case, we'll always try to find the best solution for our customers.

    For information, the first board was perfectly working, but it has been damaged by the user, it wasn't mounted properly: just loosely setup on top of the original sound board, creating many short circuits.

    I think the exchange we offered was more than fair as we only asked for a small reparation fee and we sent a brand new board.
    We are always here to help, don't hesitate to contact us as you already have our support contact email

    #119 1 year ago
    Quoted from PinSound:

    For information, the first board was perfectly working, but it has been damaged by the user, it wasn't mounted properly: just loosely setup on top of the original sound board, creating many short circuits.
    I think the exchange we offered was more than fair as we only asked for a small reparation fee and we sent a brand new board.

    From my exchange with you I can definitely second your very fair overall approach. If this user actually set the board up as you describe, I would have not replaced it.

    Some people really push the limits of how big of a vacuum I thought can be maintained in a human head, despite being able to read and write...

    #120 1 year ago

    My very first experience with PinSound was a faulty board. They supported me completely, and after trying all of the basics they exchanged my board at no cost. Since then, I now own a multitude of PinSound products for multiple games and haven’t had a single issue. I’ve created multiple orchestrations and shaker routines for games I own and others, and absolutely love how their products bring life to classic pins.

    #121 1 year ago
    Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

    What else did you buy that pushed it over $400?
    Have you tried dialing in the backbox and cabinet relative volumes? Games generally sound best when the cabinet is boosted to ~3 o’clock and the backbox is either at 12 or even 11. You can add a bit of a bass boost as well on the cab.

    I had also purchased the power booster harness. Shipping from France isn't cheap either. As far as "misuse" that was stated in a following post, that's funny. The board wasn't working properly out of the box and had presented that evidence. I could have mounted it to the top of the back box and it would have worked the same. Pinsound was very nice and prompt as sending me a replacement board to which it worked much better and didn't have any issues other than the sound still wasn't all that great.

    I'm done messing with it. I've tried every calibration combination. Just doesn't work well in that specific machine. I installed the original sound board and am back to what i started with and for whatever reason the sound quality is much better albeit just with the boring factory SFX.

    If you want to purchase this exact card. I have it posted on Pinside marketplace and will be taking a loss on it as a whole. I just didn't have the "great" experience other people have had with Pinsound products. Too bad.

    #122 1 year ago
    Quoted from DJY2J:

    I had also purchased the power booster harness. Shipping from France isn't cheap either. As far as "misuse" that was stated in a following post, that's funny. The board wasn't working properly out of the box and had presented that evidence. I could have mounted it to the top of the back box and it would have worked the same. Pinsound was very nice and prompt as sending me a replacement board to which it worked much better and didn't have any issues other than the sound still wasn't all that great.
    I'm done messing with it. I've tried every calibration combination. Just doesn't work well in that specific machine. I installed the original sound board and am back to what i started with and for whatever reason the sound quality is much better albeit just with the boring factory SFX.
    If you want to purchase this exact card. I have it posted on Pinside marketplace and will be taking a loss on it as a whole. I just didn't have the "great" experience other people have had with Pinsound products. Too bad.

    Whoa, just noticed the Bullet Club logo on your avatar. Are you following AEW or are you all NJPW?

    #123 1 year ago
    Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

    Whoa, just noticed the Bullet Club logo on your avatar. Are you following AEW or are you all NJPW?

    Both. Ill subscribe to NJPW streaming for a few months out of the year. Mainly in the summer months and then January for Wrestle Kingdom. Went to an AEW show a few weeks ago. Kenny Omega, the Bucks, G.O.D., Marty are my all time favs. Not a huge Jay White fan but I can appreciate that he's a great heel.

    #124 1 year ago
    Quoted from DJY2J:

    Both. Ill subscribe to NJPW streaming for a few months out of the year. Mainly in the summer months and then January for Wrestle Kingdom. Went to an AEW show a few weeks ago. Kenny Omega, the Bucks, G.O.D., Marty are my all time favs. Not a huge Jay White fan but I can appreciate that he's a great heel.

    Wow pretty much same here. I do the NJPW for Wrestle Kingdom as well, and took my kid to the first AEW Dynamite in DC. Electric, that night. Still hoping AEW can pull some of the more under-utilised WWE guys over to get a more diverse roster (Sin Cara, Harper...)

    1 month later
    #125 11 months ago

    Any recommendations on USB devices for a Pinsound1? No point getting USB3.1 etc I assume?

    #126 11 months ago
    Quoted from Junglist:

    Any recommendations on USB devices for a Pinsound1? No point getting USB3.1 etc I assume?

    Fastest USB 2.0 or 3.x you can find. 3.x is starting to be as cheap or cheaper than 2.0 but you’ll only get 2.0 speeds. It’s worth looking up the “fastest usb drives of 2019/2020” article and choosing one. Some games have way worse behavior with A slow drive so it’s money well spent

    #127 11 months ago

    I use the SanDisk Cruzer Fit drives for my PinSounds and my vehicle audio drives. Speed is good, and I prefer the small formfactor.

    #128 11 months ago

    Also I've seen some comments on volume level issues between music and effects and various mixes have been updated (LOTR) for Pinsound+. Since I have a Pinsound1 is there any difference or are the mixes interchangeable? (Should I be using older mixes instead?)

    #129 11 months ago
    Quoted from Junglist:

    Also I've seen some comments on volume level issues between music and effects and various mixes have been updated (LOTR) for Pinsound+. Since I have a Pinsound1 is there any difference or are the mixes interchangeable? (Should I be using older mixes instead?)

    Update your firmware to the latest and utilize the newer convention orchestrations on your PinSound 1.

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