(Topic ID: 90903)

ANN: MMR assembly to be done by Stern Pinball for PPS/Chicago Gaming!


By PPS

5 years ago



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There are 539 posts in this topic. You are on page 4 of 11.
#151 5 years ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

Makes sense. From Rick's other posts I get the impression PPS is more about leveraging the Williams license than it is starting its own pinball factory.

Which IMHO is the right thing to do. Its a surprise to me that PPS is attempting to "bring back" older games and continue to support new mods for these games. I'd have thought that PPS was in it completely for the money... while I'm sure they are; it does at least APPEAR that PPS and the community can work together to improve the availability of the non-licensed themes.

#152 5 years ago
Quoted from Zitt:

Which IMHO is the right thing to do. Its a surprise to me that PPS is attempting to "bring back" older games and continue to support new mods for these games. I'd have thought that PPS was in it completely for the money... while I'm sure they are; it does at least APPEAR that PPS and the community can work together to improve the availability of the non-licensed themes.

If we were in it soley for the money we wouldn't be in it ... probably better ROI and alot less time to buy Apple or Samsung stock

#153 5 years ago
Quoted from mechslave:

The build of WOZ is all I have to go by, but it's a rock solid aircraft-quality build compared to some Stern stuff I've received.

WOZ has just as many issues, you just don't hear about it because the owners hide them all in the JJP forums which are private, because they're afraid of getting mocked and abused here. Which is lame on both sides frankly.

Repeated LED board breakings, power supply issues, clear coat chipping, pop bumpers creating metal shards that wear the playfield to the bare wood if you don't deal with it, monkey magnets, castle ball guides, slippers falling off, blah blah.

It's pinball, shit happens. I'm not dumping on WOZ, I'm simply saying that things aren't perfect. There's no magic in the JJP factory. Just like they weren't perfect on the original WMS built MM. If you're not willing to fix and adjust some things out of the box then don't buy NIB, get a dialed in HUO machine where someone else did it for you.

You know what WOZ has over most Sterns? Higher BOM. It's the parts that determine a good portion of the quality, not who put them together. Rick is still in charge of that part.

#154 5 years ago

This is fantastic news. Been out of the scene for a bit but ready to return. I've been on the PPS website as I had no idea this was happening in the first place. Anyone know off hand if us Canucks are able to get in on pre-orders and if this 'partnership' will bring about availability through suppliers other than PPS directly?

#155 5 years ago

This is awesome!

#156 5 years ago

Great move from all parties involved , well done guys.
Hopefully will see more title in the near future .

#157 5 years ago

I can only speak for the four games that I have bought NIB from Stern. WPT had a couple of minor issues with flipper adjustment. The others have all be issue free out of the box. My ACDC and especially STLE are gorgeous and worked flawlessly right out of the box. From listening to veterans like Vid and Lloyd, the new Sterns are better out of the box than the 90s WMS/BLY games were. So the way I see it, the MMr should have better out of the box quality than the original. That and the fact that they *will actually get built* are great news.

#158 5 years ago

When this is all said and done, PPS will buy Stern................You heard it here first. Rick has proven himself to be smarter than any of his competitors..............How could Gary or Jack for that matter let Rick buy the rights to Bally/Williams???? Rick is truly passionate about pinball and has listened to us..........He knew the size of the "prize", which is the sign of a good business man. God bless Gary for saving pinball, but Go Rick!!!! In the end, it's survival of the fittest and Rick is looking fit. EOM

#159 5 years ago

Parts are parts....and both manufacturers have experienced people putting them together. No manufacturer has put out every game assembled 100% perfectly.

This is great news for everyone involved including the buyers. Don't make more of it than it is. I'd rather have an experienced team of assemblers putting a game together than a complete group of new employees regardless of what game it is.

Good move Rick. Congrats.

#160 5 years ago

Yes, this is an epic announcement. Congratulations to Rick, Stern, and everyone else with a stake.

Makes me want to rethink the "my pinball room can't hold another machine" thing.

#161 5 years ago
Quoted from HOOKED:

Actually when I put down my 1k deposit with JJP I thought JJp might be building it.
Bigger question is did JJP think he would be selling Stern pinballs again lol.

Quoted from mechslave:

I think the real winners may be the original MM owners, actually.
But yeah, this was sort of inevitable, I suppose. I don't mean to bust up the Love Fest, but did the people who pre-ordered MMR's all those months ago have "Built by Stern" in mind when they put down their money?
Anyway, more pinball machines built is good for everyone, so hopefully this all goes well and everyone is happy!

Actually I think your wrong I am an owner of an original MM and I think it's probably worth less now that , the people who ordered a new just might get there's on time, including me. So if your gonna speculate "mechslave" you should first get off the sidelines and join in.

#162 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

WOZ has just as many issues, you just don't hear about it because the owners hide them all in the JJP forums which are private, because they're afraid of getting mocked and abused here. Which is lame on both sides frankly.
Repeated LED board breakings, power supply issues, clear coat chipping, pop bumpers creating metal shards that wear the playfield to the bare wood if you don't deal with it, monkey magnets, castle ball guides, slippers falling off, blah blah.
It's pinball, shit happens. I'm not dumping on WOZ, I'm simply saying that things aren't perfect. There's no magic in the JJP factory. Just like they weren't perfect on the original WMS built MM. If you're not willing to fix and adjust some things out of the box then don't buy NIB, get a dialed in HUO machine where someone else did it for you.
You know what WOZ has over most Sterns? Higher BOM. It's the parts that determine a good portion of the quality, not who put them together. Rick is still in charge of that part.

Quoted for too much truth.

#163 5 years ago

wow.... i thought jared's party was epic..... now THIS is truly epic

-1
#164 5 years ago

should we call it a willstern?

i guess it's a good move for everybody.

------------

now how about predator built by jjp?

#165 5 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Have George, Lyman, Steve, etc. roll around on the parts!

Just not the dragon wings please!

#166 5 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

They have always subcontracted work through the years.
Larger facility is probably a reflection of the things they've done in recent years. Stern is on a roll.
LTG : )™

Who was stern building for?

#167 5 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Quoted for too much truth.

Truthiness, as Colbert said. I was at Betson open house a little while back and a manager was venting to me about all the operator complaints he had listened to about WOZ. His opinion was WOZ is a commercial failure. There have just been too many problems for ops to deal with. Not many ops are pin enthusiasts and they aren't willing to put in the time that collectors are.

#168 5 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

NIB Sterns are much better than NIB Williams ever were, ask anyone who was around back then routing them.

Gottlieb System 1's were the best out of box with Bally close behind. Bally's board system was good but you would have switch adjustemnts etc. Williams SS from the late '70's to mid '80's sucked hind tit. Board reset issues, transistors that would crap out in the first few games, switch & flipper issues galore. But, they made money so we fixed 'em and put 'em out on the route. Stern Electronics pins had cheaply made assemblies which translated into problems.

#169 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinballmike217:

was at Betson open house a little while back and a manager was venting to me about all the operator complaints he had listened to about WOZ. His opinion was WOZ is a commercial failure. There have just been too many problems for ops to deal with.

Don't let Panzer see this !

#170 5 years ago
Quoted from mechslave:

Slower does not equal stupid. The build of WOZ is all I have to go by, but it's a rock solid aircraft-quality build compared to some Stern stuff I've received.

It all depends on what brand of aircraft you are comparing a JJP machine to.

#171 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinballmike217:

Truthiness, as Colbert said. I was at Betson open house a little while back and a manager was venting to me about all the operator complaints he had listened to about WOZ. His opinion was WOZ is a commercial failure. There have just been too many problems for ops to deal with. Not many ops are pin enthusiasts and they aren't willing to put in the time that collectors are.

Betson is upset that we don't need them to sell WOZ. The game was #1 on Play Meter Operator Survey last month and we have operators ordering the game every day. Biggest problem is getting them more games.

Anyone that wants one on location will get one, eventually, soon, as I will gladly operate it if given the opportunity.

Some operators are too focused on the cost of new games instead on being focused on what games earn and ROI. I'm an Operator so we built a game for an operator that makes money because new players play it, including women and children.

#172 5 years ago
Quoted from beatmaster:

should we call it a willstern?
i guess it's a good move for everybody.
------------
now how about Predator built by jjp?

I wonder if the back cabinet will be autographed by someone the way every WoZ has a "Jersey Jack" autograph. I find it funny that it is signed in the pen name coined by Eddie Adlum of RePlay Magazine. Will the MMR's be autographed by "Planetary Pinball" or "Chicago Gaming" or will Gary Stern make up a hybrid "Stern Williams" name and sign each one himself?

#173 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

WOZ has just as many issues, you just don't hear about it because the owners hide them all in the JJP forums which are private, because they're afraid of getting mocked and abused here. Which is lame on both sides frankly.
Repeated LED board breakings, power supply issues, clear coat chipping, pop bumpers creating metal shards that wear the playfield to the bare wood if you don't deal with it, monkey magnets, castle ball guides, slippers falling off, blah blah.
It's pinball, shit happens. I'm not dumping on WOZ, I'm simply saying that things aren't perfect. There's no magic in the JJP factory. Just like they weren't perfect on the original WMS built MM. If you're not willing to fix and adjust some things out of the box then don't buy NIB, get a dialed in HUO machine where someone else did it for you.
You know what WOZ has over most Sterns? Higher BOM. It's the parts that determine a good portion of the quality, not who put them together. Rick is still in charge of that part.

Pinball machines are never perfect, sure. I can only speak from experience. My WOZ has been perfect, no issues at all, and simply feels more solidly built out of the box than any of the Sterns. Again, not talking board design or things like that, simply build/assembly quality. The stuff I saw on my XM LE left a bitter taste, seeing the way it was butchered in assembly and sent out non-functional after they basically drilled so many holes in Wolverine they had to leave it askew and inoperable. Yes, partly a crap design, but also shoddy assembly and a "throw up my hands cause I give up" before they boxed it up the way it was. Back to my original post, I was sort of hoping MMR would not be built by the workers who made my Wolverine look like he got shot with an Uzi. That is all. I know, I know..."Epic" was the only appropriate response to this thread.

#174 5 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

What???

JJP can't get a single game's production finished from 3 years ago, and they are going to take on an even larger production run from another company?

JJP announced WOZ the same day as Rolling Stones. Stern has built 10+ different new pins since then, and will probably build MMr before all the original WOZ preorders are built.

#175 5 years ago
Quoted from JerseyJack:

Biggest problem is getting them more games.

That about sums it up doesn't it?

Here's hoping everyone who wants a WOZ can get it soon, and that goes for Hobbit too once it's ready.

#176 5 years ago
Quoted from mechslave:

Pinball machines are never perfect, sure. I can only speak from experience. My WOZ has been perfect, no issues at all, and simply feels more solidly built out of the box than any of the Sterns. Again, not talking board design or things like that, simply build/assembly quality. The stuff I saw on my XM LE left a bitter taste, seeing the way it was butchered in assembly and sent out non-functional after they basically drilled so many holes in Wolverine they had to leave it askew and inoperable. Yes, partly a crap design, but also shoddy assembly and a "throw up my hands cause I give up" before they boxed it up the way it was. Back to my original post, I was sort of hoping MMR would not be built by the workers who made my Wolverine look like he got shot with an Uzi. That is all. I know, I know..."Epic" was the only appropriate response to this thread.

Oh shit... Another my WOZ is perfect and your Stern stuff is shit comment .. Whatever !

-1
#177 5 years ago
Quoted from mechslave:

The stuff I saw on my XM LE left a bitter taste, seeing the way it was butchered in assembly and sent out non-functional after they basically drilled so many holes in Wolverine they had to leave it askew and inoperable. Yes, partly a crap design, but also shoddy assembly and a "throw up my hands cause I give up" before they boxed it up the way it was. Back to my original post, I was sort of hoping MMR would not be built by the workers who made my Wolverine look like he got shot with an Uzi. That is all.

That's a design problem, not a factory problem. The Wolverine design was stupid. Stern's fault. MMr isn't being designed by the same people who did X-Men. Frankly very little from a factory standpoint is even new, just the boards and the way it's wired, but the actual physical build playfield stuff is old hat.

#178 5 years ago

...

#179 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

That's a design problem, not a factory problem. The Wolverine design was stupid. Stern's fault. MMr isn't being designed by the same people who did X-Men. Frankly very little from a factory standpoint is even new, just the boards and the way it's wired, but the actual physical build playfield stuff is old hat.

I acknowledged the design problem, but hey, I fixed it and made it work. And I'm buying it, not making a career of assembling them. It was crap assembly and QC in addition to crap design. And yes, I fully acknowledge all pinball manufacturers will always box up problematic machines.

This still feels very "Wndows on a Mac" though, and like I said, I guess I'm just disappointed the world doesn't have one more pinball manufacturer than it did yesterday. But hey, good for Stern and good for anxious buyers who will get their machines soon.

#180 5 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

Oh shit... Another my WOZ is perfect and your Stern stuff is shit comment .. Whatever !

That's not what I said.

#181 5 years ago
Quoted from JerseyJack:

Operator so we built a game for an operator that makes money because new players play it, including women and children.

Many pinheads were mad because you didn't market the game to only them. They don't understand the need to reach out to different markets and expand that way.

You put a woz in an arcade full of pins and people are drawn to that one.

#182 5 years ago
Quoted from herbertbsharp:

Rick is like Cyrus in the Warriors, combining all the gangs into one super power.. Can yoooooooouuuuuuuu diiiiiigggggggg ittttttttttttttttttt?

Awesome Movie!

#183 5 years ago

Didn't take long to derail into a JJP/WOZ thread.

You know who I'm talking about.

#184 5 years ago

Holy shazbot! This is huge news, great stuff. I'm no expert but this really seems to bode well for all parties involved.

#185 5 years ago
Quoted from herbertbsharp:

So PPS is licensing a game by WMS, which is manufactured/assembled by CGC and Stern and sold by JJP/Pinball Sales?
Rick is like Cyrus in the Warriors, combining all the gangs into one super power.. Can yoooooooouuuuuuuu diiiiiigggggggg ittttttttttttttttttt?

warrior5.jpg 10 KB

It's all about the dollar.

#186 5 years ago
Quoted from QuarterGrabber:

It means I get my MMR faster then I thought I would and will be battling trolls

You could have saved a lot of money as there are tons of trolls to battle on here daily

#187 5 years ago

Four pages and I don't even see the question let alone an answer. Ok, I will put it out there...WHO is "ANN" and why are we seeing her private message on this board???

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#188 5 years ago
Quoted from mwong168:

You could have saved a lot of money as there are tons of trolls to battle on here daily

Hiyo!!!!

#189 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

You joke, but I didn't even think about this game being built where Lyman works. That feels right to me!

Code update?.....

#190 5 years ago

Those that decided to sling crap about JJP in yet another unrelated thread, you know your tools right?

#191 5 years ago

I'm getting my MMR in a Stern Tron LE cabinet.

#192 5 years ago

Speaking of this, did anyone know that MMR uses as much cable as the Ford Taurus?

This is mind boggling!!

205347-cebit-brain-powered-pinball.jpg

-1
#193 5 years ago
Quoted from PEN:

Those that decided to sling crap about JJP in yet another unrelated thread, you know your tools right?

It's just nice to see Jack take a break from reading Letters of Resignation to come into a competitor's thread and do more shameless WOZ promoting.

#194 5 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

WMS is getting the licensing cash, Stern is assembling, CGC is engineering, JJP is selling it, and PPS is pulling it all together. Is there anyone left in the business NOT making a buck off of MMR?

^^^^Brian Eddy

GarySternDanniHarwood.jpg

#196 5 years ago

Looks like additional money may be due sooner than even us optimists expected.

Knowing the overall build quality, we know pretty much what to expect for better or worse. Short of there being a catastrophic electronics defect, or other similar bugaboo popping up, it seems like MMR will be the game of 2014.

If 10 Hobbits ship to showrooms this year in late December to say "hey its released" that does not count...

#197 5 years ago

This is pretty interesting to me, only because I really thought that the remakes were taking money away from the limited amount of funds available by customers to buy NIB pinball machines, and in fact are direct competition to Stern. Sure Stern is profiting short term from this, but the $8K people are plunking down is $8K not being spent on a Stern machine (or even forcing someone to sell their beloved Stern LE that they thought was going to hold it's value but instead they lost $2K because of the remakes hitting the market, hence leaving a bad taste in their mouth and not buying another $8K NIB Stern LE).

I'm not arguing that remakes are good or bad, but there's not doubt remakes have effected the pinball market pretty substantially... and now stern is the one helping to pump them out.

I also recall that Stern was pretty aggressive against JJP when he was trying to get off the ground, which is another reason I'm surprised.

I own a lot of older machines and some Sterns nor do I plan to buy anything NIB in a long time so I have no dog in this fight..

#198 5 years ago
Quoted from Cobray:

This is pretty interesting to me, only because I really thought that the remakes were taking money away from the limited amount of funds available by customers to buy NIB pinball machines, and in fact are direct competition to Stern. ..

Silly.... do you really think a few "Pinball Novices" like Stern know as much about the industry as the self-appointed pinball market experts on pinside?

Duh....

Guess Gary should stop goofing off and, you know, building & shipping pinball machines and lurk here in the forums like the other gurus do.....

#199 5 years ago
Quoted from PEN:

Those that decided to sling crap about JJP in yet another unrelated thread, you know your tools right?

Quoted from MrDo:

It's just nice to see Jack take a break from reading Letters of Resignation to come into a competitor's thread and do more shameless WOZ promoting.

See above. More like Mr. Don't.

#200 5 years ago
Quoted from Cobray:

This is pretty interesting to me, only because I really thought that the remakes were taking money away from the limited amount of funds available by customers to buy NIB pinball machines, and in fact are direct competition to Stern. Sure Stern is profiting short term from this, but the $8K people are plunking down is $8K not being spent on a Stern machine (or even forcing someone to sell their beloved Stern LE that they thought was going to hold it's value but instead they lost $2K because of the remakes hitting the market, hence leaving a bad taste in their mouth and not buying another $8K NIB Stern LE).
I'm not arguing that remakes are good or bad, but there's not doubt remakes have effected the pinball market pretty substantially... and now stern is the one helping to pump them out.
I also recall that Stern was pretty aggressive against JJP when he was trying to get off the ground, which is another reason I'm surprised.
I own a lot of older machines and some Sterns nor do I plan to buy anything NIB in a long time so I have no dog in this fight..

i don't think there's any good reason to lament the industry over this. a shrewd entrepreneur is meeting a legitimate demand in the marketplace. this is how it's supposed to work. the fact that Stern has found a way to be a part of that is good news for them, and simultaneously good news for customers of this product in my opinion.

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