American Pinball Houdini thread

(Topic ID: 183206)

American Pinball Houdini thread


By lllvjr

1 year ago



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#101 1 year ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

I'm not really referring to Stern's faults but the finite amount of sales there are out there.

Quoted from arcademojo:

I think we have a long way to go before we hit that stage but understand what you are saying. There always is a chance that too much competition and cause a complete collapse across the board.

Definitely makes sense, but don't think it would be across the board.

And if the company that collapses is the "biggest name", and the one putting out cheap, playfield-pitting and ghosting, incomplete-code, overly-priced crappy games (and good themes wasted), than so be it. I'd rather support the boutique shops that build a rock-solid complete quality game, especially when the owners offer their damn cell number when you need support.

#102 1 year ago
Quoted from Colsond3:

Definitely makes sense, but don't think it would be across the board.
And if the company that collapses is the "biggest name", than so be it. I'd rather support the boutique shops that build a rock-solid complete quality game, especially when the owners offer their damn cell number when you need support.

History 101. The collapse of Bally Williams in 1999 gave way for the rise of the new Stern pinball in 1999.
Could AP be the next big thing? Could Spooky be? We'll have to wait to see.
Not saying Stern is going to collapse or have any wish they do. Love my two Sterns and they are both my "dream" themes.

94ac144cc614f8525acfac931e6e79252b6033f6 (resized).jpg

#103 1 year ago
Quoted from Colsond3:

And if the company that collapses is the "biggest name", and the one putting out cheap, playfield-pitting and ghosting, incomplete-code, overly-priced crappy games (and good themes wasted), than so be it. .

Dude, please take your negativity elsewhere. Do you ever have anything positive to say about anything?

#104 1 year ago
Quoted from arcademojo:

History 101. The collapse of Bally Williams in 1999 gave way for the rise of the new Stern pinball in 1999.
Could AP be the next big thing? Could Spooky be? We'll have to wait to see.
Not saying Stern is going to collapse or have any wish they do. Love my two Sterns and they are both my "dream" themes.

Along with that Spectrum on the left!

#105 1 year ago

Seeing all these "Ignored user post" blurbs is odd...but so much more enjoyable. Hopefully none of CL's posts have been bashing me. I think AP is going to put out a wonderful game, and I really hope it's complete by TPF. I wish I could make it down there.

REM (resized).png

#106 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

and Spooky makes 3 per day (15 a week)

Which is very cool. The last weekly volume I remember hearing about on the podcast was that they were doing 10 a week, but that was a little while ago. That's 33 weeks for the 500 machines to be run of the next title. I wonder how long it will take to do the full run of RZ. Things have obviously ramped up during that run, but maybe a sample of how many were done if the first 12 weeks compared to the current output. They are going to need to keep the contract games flowing as well, or maybe add another designer. *raises hand*

Honestly though, this TPF is going to have so many games to play from all of these companies. I'm super pumped!

#107 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Along with that Spectrum on the left!

Good eye! Now if only I could get a sound board for it.

#108 1 year ago
Quoted from arcademojo:

Good eye! Now if only I could get a sound board for it.

Direct replacement

http://mypinballs.com/electronics/store.jsp

#109 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

"Competition" is the main reason prices on new games have risen 50-150 percent in 5 years. Has that been good for consumers? It's been the source of endless complaint threads here.

Except that wasn't just competition, it was supply expanding to meet increasing demand with its concomitant spiraling pricing from the shortage.

I'm saying if AP presents a full-featured LE-level pin for a Pro price it will force Stern to up their game instead of their prices.

#110 1 year ago
Quoted from rammstein99:

Houdini himself was not a magician as much as arguably the greatest escape artist of all time

just a little help.

Public Performances of Spectacle, as well as his shows, he is indeed remembered for his Escape Artistry.
But he was always a Superior Magician, and noted for such. Card Tricks, as an example.

(I spent some time with his Sister in law years ago, and I was corrected by her on this too. )

#111 1 year ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

I'm saying if AP presents a full-featured LE-level pin for a Pro price it will force Stern to up their game instead of their prices.

I know this is a long time ago, and just about as much that could change in that time has happened, but back in Sept. Pinballnews.com was saying that it would be around $7K.

"On Friday American Pinball made the joint announcement firstly of their existence, and also details of their first title, Houdini: Master Mystery, which will be unveiled ahead of the Global Gaming Expo in Las Vegas on Monday 26th September, 2016. The game is expected to retail at around $6,995."

I wish they'd come out with LE games at Pro prices, but instead back then it just sounded like them jumping into the Premium price point pool where everyone else is log jamming. Bang for buck IMO cleary goes to Alien with all the screens, flippers, ramps, and overall package. Then Spooky #3 will be in the low-mid $6s, Stern Premiums aren't going anywhere, may as well assume AMFr will be at least in the $6s, and AP could possibly be launching a 2-flipper game in the high $6s.

The only way Stern has to up their game is by someone undercutting their Pro level price while including the same or more features, and I think AP has a very uphill battle if they want to come out with their first game at a Premium price point against proven manufacturers. More power to them for giving buyers another option, but that's a place where buyers already have many options.

#112 1 year ago
Quoted from Yoko2una:

I know this is a long time ago, and just about as much that could change in that time has happened, but back in Sept. Pinballnews.com was saying that it would be around $7K.
"On Friday American Pinball made the joint announcement firstly of their existence, and also details of their first title, Houdini: Master Mystery, which will be unveiled ahead of the Global Gaming Expo in Las Vegas on Monday 26th September, 2016. The game is expected to retail at around $6,995."
I wish they'd come out with LE games at Pro prices, but instead back then it just sounded like them jumping into the Premium price point pool where everyone else is log jamming. Bang for buck IMO cleary goes to Alien with all the screens, flippers, ramps, and overall package. Then Spooky #3 will be in the low-mid $6s, Stern Premiums aren't going anywhere, may as well assume AMFr will be at least in the $6s, and AP could possibly be launching a 2-flipper game in the high $6s.
The only way Stern has to up their game is by someone undercutting their Pro level price while including the same or more features, and I think AP has a very uphill battle if they want to come out with their first game at a Premium price point against proven manufacturers. More power to them for giving buyers another option, but that's a place where buyers already have many options.

Exactly. The market is saturated with "premium" offerings right now, with even Spooky well outpacing the Stern pro price point.

Stern - who takes ridiculously out of balance abuse with every meager annual price increase - is still the only company offering a full-featured, quality commercial pinball machine brand new for $5,500. We'll see if AP comes up with anything close but I don't think these newbies dove into the pool with that kind of pricing in mind.

#113 1 year ago

LOL - we haven't even seen a flipping machine yet and people think AP is the second coming.
I am going to reserve comments for when they actually have a machine to sell and keep my hopes up that it's awesome.

#114 1 year ago

I had forgotten them saying $7Kish, I agree that end of the market is ready overcrowded.

#115 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

z
...Stern - who takes ridiculously out of balance abuse with every meager annual price increase - is still the only company offering a full-featured, quality commercial pinball machine brand new for $5,500.

Can't tell if you are being serious. Recent AS pro was $5.2k plus shipping, close to your $ estimate. Never heard anyone claim a Stern pro was full feature.

#116 1 year ago

I am looking forward to the reveal on everything about this game.

#117 1 year ago

Josh did a really job with his 2 homebrew games , he has some great unique ideas for pinball . I am interested to see what he can contribute to houdini .

#118 1 year ago

Nice too see what AP is/can be doing as opposed to the crap pile they stepped into from the get go!
Personally I give merit to each game manufacturer anything released is under such scrunity!
Watching from the side and hoping for all the best!
Think we are just starting to see a major change for what we purchase to put in our homes!

#119 1 year ago

I feel for these guys, the poor bastards got mixed up with Jpop, spent a bunch of money to keep their word, semi-bailed out Jpop and now had to redesign a game from scratch. I'm looking forward to their game but can I say there isn't a single Balcer game that I like. *Sigh, why couldn't have these guys bump into Nordman instead. Oh well, don't mess up Joe!

#120 1 year ago
Quoted from kvan99:

I'm looking forward to their game but can I say there isn't a single Balcer game that I like. *Sigh, why couldn't have these guys bump into Nordman instead. Oh well, don't mess up Joe!

Apollo 13, Baywatch, Wizard of Oz, Godzilla, High Roller Casino, South Park, Starship Troopers, Striker Xtreme and The Simpson Pool Party? You don't like --any-- of those games?

10
#121 1 year ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

The Simpson Pool Party?

Not sure I've played that one.

#122 1 year ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Not sure I've played that one.

The art's very yellow.

#123 1 year ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Not sure I've played that one.

Quoted from Frax:

The art's very yellow.

#124 1 year ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

Apollo 13, Baywatch, Wizard of Oz, Godzilla, High Roller Casino, South Park, Starship Troopers, Striker Xtreme and The Simpson Pool Party? You don't like --any-- of those games?

Nope...Sorry, not trolling just telling you. I guess I'm on the opposite end of his pinball design language. I like Borg, Nordman and Ritchie.

#125 1 year ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

Apollo 13, Baywatch, Wizard of Oz, Godzilla, High Roller Casino, South Park, Starship Troopers, Striker Xtreme and The Simpson Pool Party? You don't like --any-- of those games?

I love South Park. One of Balcer's little beauties. It makes me laugh every time I play it.

#126 1 year ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

Apollo 13, Baywatch, Wizard of Oz, Godzilla, High Roller Casino, South Park, Starship Troopers, Striker Xtreme and The Simpson Pool Party? You don't like --any-- of those games?

I will say this as politely as I can, clearly indicating that this is my personal opinion and not fact, and is a subjective statement in the purest of possible forms: This is a pretty terrible list of games, for me. Financial considerations not in play (of course I'd trade my Bow and Arrow for a WOZ and take my girl out to Old Homestead for steak) there's not a single game on that list I'd trade for any of my 15 games. These just aren't my cup of tea.

That being said - and many people have said many bad things about most of these games over the years - Balcer would seem to be the anti-Jpop. He churns out unremarkable playfields but does them within the proper context of a project, on time, on budget, and to the benefit of whatever project he's been drafted for involvement.

For American Pinball, this very well may be enough. Their time with Jpop wasn't without benefit - they learned some very important lessons about pinball design, pinball designers, what the new breed of "collectors" will pay for and get excited about, and what it takes to get a machine out the door. And, WOZ proved that if you stick enough Jpop-style flash in a Balcer game: magnets, bright lights and colors, innovative display, "magic," and gimmicks, then it's really not that important what your playfield is like as long as it functions correctly and showcases the gimmicks. So, take Balcer, and add some classic Jpopisms like Escaping milk pop bumpers, a shitload of magnets, and real quickstep solenoids, flash it up with a bunch of blinky blinks and additional gimmicks, and it may well sell.

I really didn't know who Balcer was before he was hired by AP (as I said I've never been a fan of the games it turned out he was involved in). But clearly, he could well be the right guy for this project. They were smart to grab him, especially after their experience on the other end of the spectrum with JPop.

#127 1 year ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

I love South Park. One of Balcer's little beauties. It makes me laugh every time I play it.

And still a great location earning machine.

#128 1 year ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

Apollo 13, Baywatch, Wizard of Oz, Godzilla, High Roller Casino, South Park, Starship Troopers, Striker Xtreme and The Simpson Pool Party? You don't like --any-- of those games?

LOTS of great games!
LOTS of GREAT layouts!

A13, BW, WOZ, Godzilla, SST are all top tier layouts and plenty of well done unique stuff!

#129 1 year ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

...The Simpson Pool Party?

Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Not sure I've played that one.

Come on in, the water's cold.

tspp4.gif

#130 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I will say this as politely as I can, clearly indicating that this is my personal opinion and not fact, and is a subjective statement in the purest of possible forms: This is a pretty terrible list of games, for me. Financial considerations not in play (of course I'd trade my Bow and Arrow for a WOZ and take my girl out to Old Homestead for steak) there's not a single game on that list I'd trade for any of my 15 games. These just aren't my cup of tea.

Appreciated. But man oh man, you and kvan99 are waaaaaay more picky than I am. There are only two pinball games that I have ever played that I did not like at all, and those are Hercules and Orbitor1. If I could afford ANY of those games that Mr. Balcer worked on, I'd grab 'em in a heartbeat!

#131 1 year ago

I enjoy a game of hercules! At least a multiplayer game.

Of those on the list I enjoy some Godzilla now and again.

Still I'll stand by what I said - Balcer's asset to AP is likely his competence and professionalism, not his accomplished record of playfield design.

#132 1 year ago

I'm cautiously optimistic on this title. I actually heard about magic girl too late, so didn't get in on it. It's probably just as well, as I wanted a good playing machine. I'm an amateur magician so it is a great theme for me. If AP can pull it off, and it plays well, I'll be in.
Love my magic, and my pinball! Go AP go!

#133 1 year ago

Interesting.....this is not the cabinet style I believe that is going to be used.

houdini (resized).jpg

#134 1 year ago

Old flyer. It has nothing to do with the redesigned game.

Quoted from vdojaq:

Interesting.....this is not the cabinet style I believe that is going to be used.

#135 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Interesting.....this is not the cabinet style I believe that is going to be used.

Quoted from luvthatapex2:

Old flyer. It has nothing to do with the redesigned game.

Is it me, or do those legs look odd? I understand it's just a flyer and/or drawing of the actual game, and luvthat pointed out that it's an old one at that. But I don't see leg bolts and the tops of the legs are flat? Not a big deal I'm sure and probably inaccurate, but just seemed odd.

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Of those on the list I enjoy some Godzilla now and again.

Holy shit!! Did I just agree with you on something?

#136 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Interesting.....this is not the cabinet style I believe that is going to be used.

Definitely not the cabinet

#138 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Interesting.....this is not the cabinet style I believe that is going to be used.

Is that the Forehead LE model?

#139 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Interesting.....this is not the cabinet style I believe that is going to be used.

Sheesh...I thought Houdini was holding headphones there for a while!

#140 1 year ago

I got a Magic Girl, If Houdini is in the same cabinet I will hate it. I hate any game that requires you to close the coin door to take the glass off! Quite a pain in the ass! regardless I will buy Houdini after they help JPOP get my half finshed Magic Girl pinball in!

#141 1 year ago

I hope the move the lcd/dmd to the backbox where it belongs

#142 1 year ago
Quoted from cppinball:

I got a Magic Girl, If Houdini is in the same cabinet I will hate it. I hate any game that requires you to close the coin door to take the glass off! Quite a pain in the ass! regardless I will buy Houdini after they help JPOP get my half finshed Magic Girl pinball in!

Jpop has zero to do with the new Houdini

#143 1 year ago
Quoted from chadderack:

Is that the Forehead LE model?

I thought it was the slaphead special edition

#144 1 year ago

For basic information the original Houdini advertising flyer was a partial drawing-photo composite using the Zidware cabinet style.
The only manufacturer other than Zidware that used a similar design was WICO Af-Tor back in 1984, but that was predominantly do to the standoff points on the head, and in that case the machine was built out of steel like a tank.

The AP cabinet has returned to more "traditional style", material composition is unknown to me as I did not inquire.

#145 1 year ago

I just got this flyer in the mail with my latest Pinball Life parts order...

HoudiniFlyer (resized).jpg

#146 1 year ago

A short video on the flyer they sent and my view on the situation in a nutshell...

#147 1 year ago
Quoted from HighProtein:

I just got this flyer in the mail with my latest Pinball Life parts order...

Reduced forehead edition

#148 1 year ago
Quoted from chadderack:

Reduced forehead edition

Makes me think,,,
Dang,,,
The Head (MTV cartoon) could have been a cool game!

TheHeadMTV (resized).jpeg

#149 1 year ago
Quoted from lllvjr:

Jpop has zero to do with the new Houdini

Yes but his stench remains.

#150 1 year ago
Quoted from Colsond3:

Dude, please take your negativity elsewhere. Do you ever have anything positive to say about anything?
You are the first person ever I am putting on ignore. I appreciate your knowledge and experience in the hobby, I really do. But you just ruin every single thread I read these days. Thanks to Iceman and JLM for pushing us to use the ignore feature. Sorry to bring the momentary drama into this thread Lorenzo. Back to the regularly scheduled program...

He's always so negative. It's depressing to see people that live their lives that way.

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