(Topic ID: 183206)

American Pinball Houdini thread


By lllvjr

2 years ago



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33 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 20 (Show topic index)

There are 8891 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 178.
#51 2 years ago

I was just thinking the other day how we needed more magic themed pinball machines.

#54 2 years ago
Quoted from jwilson:

There won't be a flipping game in Texas. No way, no how.
Maybe artwork displays? But no game.

It's kind of sad that if true it would be the 2nd non-working Houdini design they've presented.

30
#55 2 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

It's kind of sad that if true it would be the 2nd non-working Houdini design they've presented.

I don't get it. Why are any of you upset with AP or bashing them. They have hired a professional pinball team and are working towards production of a game. They haven't asked anyone for anything. Stern showed you a box of lights at expo and it didnt stop you from buying Batman. AP is also the only reason that MG actually got made. Owners were going to get absolutely nothing for their 16k if it wasn't for AP's help. Sure the game is a mess but that's 100℅ on JPOP.

#56 2 years ago

Its about Sourcing.

The family business has all the board and electronics covered.
Joe has experience and knows Parts sourcing.
Artwork, we have an idea.
Code...If its Rosh, didnt he do the Casino game?
If so, it was Brilliant, and many ideas that are new come with it.

Its possible to have a new game, but Im hoping its advanced enough for its presentation
to gain interest and respect.

It doesnt have to be over the top, to be fun.
If Priced well, it can have a bigger affect in the market, if all happens.

Im rooting for them, and fresh ideas.

#57 2 years ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

Has Joe Balcer designed any good games? Was he with DE?

You be the judge...

http://www.ipdb.org/search.pl?searchtype=advanced&ppl=Joe%20Balcer

#58 2 years ago

3 games in the pinside top 20. So yeah, he's just horrible at this.

#59 2 years ago

Only Godzila was attributed solely to him. He was credited with mechanics on many games. I'm not sure what that entails.

I like Godzilla though. It's an interesting layout with very good code.

#60 2 years ago

I overheard some people talking about it during lunch at Portillos recently. Apparently its going to have a 52 ball multiball to commemorate Houdini's age at death.

#61 2 years ago
Quoted from jgentry:

I don't get it. Why are any of you upset with AP or bashing them.

Possibly AP would have had a much easier go of things and gotten more support from people here without the Jpop taint, but that is the hole they have to climb out of. Announcing appearances at shows for a non-flipping game, when they had previously showed a non-flipping game isn't the way to build confidence. Probably would have been best for them to skip TPF if they don't have an actual game for people to play and lay off the social media hyping till they have something people can, you know, play (and purchase).

#62 2 years ago

Houdini will be a flipping, playable game at TPF. Complete 180 from what we all saw in Sept/Oct in design, art, and function. The only thing the same is the name Houdini. Prepare to be completely in awe of the game and A.P.

They will be the 1st ones to admit JPop was a mistake.

#63 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Houdini will be a flipping, playable game at TPF. Complete 180 from what we all saw in Sept/Oct in design, art, and function. The only thing the same is the name Houdini. Prepare to be completely in awe of the game and A.P.
They will be the 1st ones to admit JPop was a mistake.

If there is a flipping playable game built from the ground up in the 5 months since Expo that will be impressive.

I don't want to be cynical but its hard not to be. So, lets hope there is an awesome game there.

#64 2 years ago

A.P. has kept to their word so far. They told M.G. buyers they were getting a machine and somehow they got machines. I called them in December and was told end of 1st quarter for Houdini and it looks like they are right on schedule.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/new-jpop-game-houdini-just-announced/page/50#post-3495706

#65 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Houdini will be a flipping, playable game at TPF. Complete 180 from what we all saw in Sept/Oct in design, art, and function.

Are you saying this as fact because you know, or just your speculation from the call you made to AP two months ago? Not trying to slam you...just curious if you have any new info.

#66 2 years ago
Quoted from SunKing:

Are you saying this as fact because you know, or just your speculation from the call you made to AP two months ago? Not trying to slam you...just curious if you have any new info.

He's correct

#67 2 years ago
Quoted from SunKing:

Are you saying this as fact because you know, or just your speculation from the call you made to AP two months ago? Not trying to slam you...just curious if you have any new info.

2 weeks

#69 2 years ago
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

It doesnt have to be over the top, to be fun.
If Priced well, it can have a bigger affect in the market, if all happens.
Im rooting for them, and fresh ideas.

Nicely said Art!

10
#71 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

...I can't be the only one who really thinks the last thing we need in 2017 is yet another pinball company, right?

The last thing this hobby needs to to turn back to a time where there was only one manufacturer. There should never ever be only one company for anything, period. Competition is the backbone of any healthy industry. It is essential that some of these 'new' manufacturers stay afloat to keep Stern honest.

#72 2 years ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

Competition is the backbone of any healthy industry. It is essential that some of these 'new' manufacturers stay afloat to keep Stern honest.

Even take them(STERN) head on. 2017 is shaping up to be a wild ride for pinball.

-5
#73 2 years ago
Quoted from SunKing:

Are you saying this as fact because you know, or just your speculation from the call you made to AP two months ago? Not trying to slam you...just curious if you have any new info.

He doesn't know anything that you and I don't. Just wants to feel cool by making it seem that way I guess . No one knows anything for certain.

I'm hoping for a flipping game at TPF, but we won't know until then.

#74 2 years ago

Consumer advocate Clark Howard will tell you competition is always good for the consumer.

Gary Stern's cunning plan of "less game for more money" is going to come to a screeching halt. With AP's parent company's resources and backing, they have the means to give GS nightmares. The JPop debacle was a bump in the road is all, he lied to them to make MG happen and keep his ass out of prison for the time being. If anything they are to be commended for following through to the degree they did.

I thought the original Houdini design looked great overall, kind of sad to hear they had to start over from scratch but I'm looking forward to seeing what they have come up with!

#75 2 years ago
Quoted from pinlink:

He doesn't know anything that you and I don't. Just wants to feel cool by making it seem that way I guess . No one knows anything for certain.
I'm hoping for a flipping game at TPF, but we won't know until then.

Excuse me, but do I know you? Have we spoken before? No, right? Please don't speak on my behalf because the one who has NO fucking clue is you. And that I DO know. You will eat your words after TPF.

18
#76 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

So far all we have to go on with AP is the disastrous Jpop/Houdini rollout, the most amateurish and silly pinball machine flyer in history

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

pretty much all of them post DMD have been terrible

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

As "hobbyists" I don't see why blindly supporting every johnny come lately who is trying to hop on the gravy train before it skids off the mountain is some kind of holy obligation.

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Still, I can't be the only one who really thinks the last thing we need in 2017 is yet another pinball company, right?

Dude, please take your negativity elsewhere. Do you ever have anything positive to say about anything?

You are the first person ever I am putting on ignore. I appreciate your knowledge and experience in the hobby, I really do. But you just ruin every single thread I read these days. Thanks to Iceman and JLM for pushing us to use the ignore feature. Sorry to bring the momentary drama into this thread Lorenzo. Back to the regularly scheduled program...

#77 2 years ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

To borrow Ben Heck's folksy aphorism, American Pinball inherited a "pig in a poke".

Hahaha.

Pig (resized).jpg

I can't wait to see the redesign of this game. Like others said, so many possibilities with a Houdini theme, and I'm glad it didn't go to waste after the first design that had a ramp that led into the side of the cabinet. This might be my first NIB.

#78 2 years ago

It is entirely possible that Joe had a playfield design mostly ready to go and adapted it to Houdini.

Therefore , we could see a flipping game of some sort at TPF. I wish them luck, but you have to maintain a degree of skepticism, based on the missteps of the Jpast.

vdojaq seems to know.

#79 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

Gary Stern's cunning plan of "less game for more money" is going to come to a screeching halt. With AP's parent company's resources and backing, they have the means to give GS nightmares. The JPop debacle was a bump in the road is all, he lied to them to make MG happen and keep his ass out of prison for the time being. If anything they are to be commended for following through to the degree they did.
I thought the original Houdini design looked great overall, kind of sad to hear they had to start over from scratch but I'm looking forward to seeing what they have come up with!

Quoted from vdojaq:

Excuse me, but do I know you? Have we spoken before? No, right? Please don't speak on my behalf because the one who has NO fucking clue is you. And that I DO know. You will eat your words after TPF.

Wow to both.

#80 2 years ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

Has Joe Balcer designed any good games? Was he with DE?

https://pinside.com/pinball/archive/joe-balcer

Here are the games he has credits on.

#81 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Excuse me, but do I know you? Have we spoken before? No, right? Please don't speak on my behalf because the one who has NO fucking clue is you. And that I DO know. You will eat your words after TPF.

Impressed to see you step up to the plate. I hope you are right as I'd like to see something new from somebody new.

#82 2 years ago
Quoted from Manic:

Impressed to see you step up to the plate. I hope you are right as I'd like to see something new from somebody new.

Thank you....but it's not a prediction. I would love to say what I do know, but I am on the " If I tell you, I will have to kill you" witness protection program. Beating around the bush is the best I can do.

#83 2 years ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

The last thing this hobby needs to to turn back to a time where there was only one manufacturer. There should never ever be only one company for anything, period. Competition is the backbone of any healthy industry. It is essential that some of these 'new' manufacturers stay afloat to keep Stern honest.

The possible problem I see is if the pinball sales pie is only so big and if enough little manufacturers eat into Stern's slice without making the pie bigger Stern could see some financial problems which could cause them to make some drastic decisions.

We all want competition for Stern but I'm afraid the manufacturing side is growing faster than the customer side.

#84 2 years ago

How about the art vdojaq? Seen it? The art better be really great because it was kickass before they changed everything.

#85 2 years ago

St

Quoted from dmbjunky:The possible problem I see is if the pinball sales pie is only so big and if enough little manufacturers eat into Stern's slice without making the pie bigger Stern could see some financial problems.
We all want competition for Stern but I'm afraid the manufacturing side is growing faster than the customer side.

Stern would not lose anything if they were building a quality product, with finished or nearly finished coding. Sorry, they are bringing this upon themselves. They opened the door to competition with pure arrogance. Reap what you sow.

#86 2 years ago
Quoted from foureyedcharlie:

How about the art vdojaq? Seen it? The art better be really great because it was kickass before they changed everything.

You mean like Houdini not looking like Adrien Brody anymore?

-1
#87 2 years ago
Quoted from DanQverymuch:

Consumer advocate Clark Howard will tell you competition is always good for the consumer.
Gary Stern's cunning plan of "less game for more money" is going to come to a screeching halt. With AP's parent company's resources and backing, they have the means to give GS nightmares. The JPop debacle was a bump in the road is all, he lied to them to make MG happen and keep his ass out of prison for the time being. If anything they are to be commended for following through to the degree they did.
I thought the original Houdini design looked great overall, kind of sad to hear they had to start over from scratch but I'm looking forward to seeing what they have come up with!

"Competition" is the main reason prices on new games have risen 50-150 percent in 5 years. Has that been good for consumers? It's been the source of endless complaint threads here.

#88 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

You mean like Houdini not looking like Adrien Brody anymore?

Lol.....I really loved the art before, but now i have to rethink that.....ha

#89 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

"Competition" is the main reason prices on new games have risen 50-150 percent in 5 years. Has that been good for consumers? It's been the source of endless complaint threads here.

Lots of people complaining about prices, yes, but lots of people happy with JJP, Spooky, and Heighway games too. So yes, I think it has been good for consumers.

#90 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

"Competition" is the main reason prices on new games have risen about 50 percent in 5 years. Has that been good for consumers? It's been the source of endless complaint threads here.

Which is strange, but also makes sense. Nate laid out the Taylor guitars example on his show a while ago. They could make a ton of them at $300, or they could make far fewer (and far nicer) and charge $3,000. It seems that nobody wants to get into a Ford v Chevy value war with Stern, they (most companies not names Stern) instead want to test the higher-end lower volume market.

Stern can make 50 machines a day. JJP claims they can make 300 a month, so ~10 a day. JPOP made .0104 games per day.

#91 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Thank you....but it's not a prediction. I would love to say what I do know, but I am on the " If I tell you, I will have to kill you" witness protection program. Beating around the bush is the best I can do.

Clearly Vdojaq's hands are tied or he would say more.

Houdini 5 (resized).jpg

#92 2 years ago
Quoted from oohlou:

Lots of people complaining about prices, yes, but lots of people happy with JJP, Spooky, and Heighway games too. So yes, I think it has been good for consumers.

Agreed 100%. It wasn't "competition" that caused price increase it was Stern seeing what people were paying for games with better features (LCD) and and taking advantage of the lengthy delalys and rising there prices. How many people were saying JJP would fall when waiting on WOZ? They didn't. Or the same of PPS and MMR or Spooky?
You are always going to have setbacks and delays when starting out but once they get going we will see prices level out.

#93 2 years ago
Quoted from mbaumle:

It'd be nice to see them really use new technology to their advantage. I feel like a magic themed game has a lot of potential.
I'd like to see a design that leaves the player with a "Wow...How did they do that?" effect. Pinball Magic gets close to that with their levitating ball routine, ToM to a lesser extent did that with their ball locks and ball vanishes; but in this day and age, I feel like a lot of ideas can be borrowed from actual magic tricks that one can easily buy at a magic shop, or done with software and hardware.
Like incorporating a lens that bends light around objects (in the case of a pinball machine, it'd be a pinball) for a TRUE vanishing (or appearing) trick like in this video:
» YouTube video

All good points, but if they want to stay really 'on-topic' for the theme, Houdini himself was not a magician as much as arguably the greatest escape artist of all time- so a timed mode or three re: box or straightjacket escapes might be in order.

He was also living in the era of spiritualism and seances, and Houdini hated mediums, calling many out as fakes. They could even base the pin theme somewhat around those aspects.

#94 2 years ago

Houdini-Truth copy (resized).jpg

#95 2 years ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

St

Stern would not lose anything if they were building a quality product, with finished or nearly finished coding. Sorry, they are bringing this upon themselves. They opened the door to competition with pure arrogance. Reap what you sow.

I'm not really referring to Stern's faults but the finite amount of sales there are out there.

#96 2 years ago

edit: not worth it

#97 2 years ago
Quoted from desertT1:

Stern can make 50 machines a day. JJP claims they can make 300 a month, so ~10 a day. JPOP made .0104 games per day.

and Spooky makes 3 per day (15 a week)

#98 2 years ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

I'm not really referring to Stern's faults but the finite amount of sales there are out there.

I get it, but pinball is hot and the "in thing" that is cool to collect now. The barcades, the news stories, the expos, all of this is a contributing factor. We have Stern, which produces 3-4 games a year, JJP that produces 1 game every 2 years(average), and now A.P. which plans on being a major player, not a boutique company.

Then there is Spooky, and all the others following behind.

So what happens if A.P. were to have a 2nd game ready to go in October @ Expo? Yes there is a finite number of sales to be had, but I think that ceiling has been raised.

#99 2 years ago
Quoted from dmbjunky:

the finite amount of sales there are out there.

Hence the boutique manufacturers selling smaller numbers of pins at higher price.
I would say we are in the "Modern" era of pinball. More and more noobs are coming into pinball by the day. Even the Stern is backlogged with orders from time to time. I think we have a long way to go before we hit that stage but understand what you are saying. There always is a chance that too much competition and cause a complete collapse across the board.

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