(Topic ID: 106728)

ALIEN PINBALL - Game Over, Man, Game Over

By HeighwayPinball

5 years ago

Topic Stats

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  • 1,040 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 hours ago by Averell
  • Topic is favorited by 276 Pinsiders


Linked Games

  • Alien Heighway Pinball, 2017

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Topic index (key posts)

53 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

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Post #9151 Insight from Alien's programmer on tournament mode Posted by Ferret (3 years ago)

Post #9234 Update on distribution Posted by HeighwayPinball (3 years ago)

Post #9660 Here we show you a short clip from the 'Ambush Multiball' mode Posted by HeighwayPinball (3 years ago)

Post #10128 Photo of Alien at UK Trade Show Posted by unigroove (3 years ago)

Post #10230 game play video from EAG UK tradeshow Posted by Join_The_Cirqus (3 years ago)

Post #10231 game play video from EAG UK tradeshow Posted by Join_The_Cirqus (3 years ago)

Post #10914 Alien ships Posted by ZenTron (3 years ago)

Post #10916 Alien ships Posted by HeighwayPinball (3 years ago)

Post #11230 Key posted, but no summary given Posted by ezeltmann (3 years ago)

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#11507 3 years ago

Impressed with the videos, and really impressed with the way the Heighway folks respond to questions or concerns, no matter how stupid my questions are. You can feel they are genuinely excited about this product. Placed my deposit yesterday.......

#11661 3 years ago

Maybe a compromise on the "You Have Failed" message is just to put something like "Mission Fail"....it takes the personal attack out of it...you didn't fail, the mission did. I like being challenged as others have said, but we also need to keep in mind a lot of these games will be in arcades (we hope) where folks never exposed to pinball might be playing them. The last thing you want to do is to tell someone they are a failure...not good for repeat sales. People come to bars and arcades to get away from reality and criticism for a while.

#11667 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

Come on, "You Have Failed" is too harsh? heres an idea when you see that message pull ur skirt over head and run away crying.

Personally, I wear pant-suits, I don't have the legs for a skirt. The message doesn't offend me at all....I was merely looking at it from the viewpoint of some young adult in an arcade who has never played pinball before, and who has probably never seen the movie either.

#11668 3 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I like the "You have failed" Pinball machines used to heckle us and I ove that!
I like user options in the menu, but I would rather the time be spent on more important options than how "green ribbon" the failure screen needs to be.
Aliens is a pretty rouch theme to begin with. You fail in the movie and you die. Failure here just means another start button press

I agree, while making this an option sounds like an easy task, I am not sure it is that simple. You have to write a menu and put in code to toggle the option. Maybe later when the code is really mature, but right now there are bigger Aliens to fry......

#11708 3 years ago
Quoted from kermit24:

Wow - Personal attack? Really? Its a PINBALL MACHINE.

Lighten up, it was just a phrase. You know the point I was trying to make, and you are blowing that out of proportion for attention.

Do I believe anyone is going to cry over the message: No
Do I believe anyone is going to run away and hide under their bed when they see the message: No
Do I think anyone is going to quit high school, develop a drug habit, and commit suicide all from the lack of self-esteem caused by this pin: No

I was simply saying a different message might be a bit less personal in an arcade setting.....but to tell you the truth it was just an opinion and in the great scheme of things, I could care less what eventually ends up there.

I can't believe this is even a topic worth the debate. I stated my preference, and others stated theirs, but all of the rest of the insults and jabber is just crazy with so much other stuff going on with this pin that we could be talking about.

Gotta love this place........

#11726 3 years ago
Quoted from mtdouble:

Does anyone know the major difference between sending the deposit and paying in full difference is? If you pay in full does that mean you will receive the game sooner? Is that the only difference?

Paid in full gets first run, so when you pay, you go to the end of that run. Same with half-pay...if you do that, then you go to the end of that run. For me, the decision on how much to pay comes down to a couple of things. 1. While I have every faith in Heighway being a class act, there have been a lot of folks burned by other companies the past couple of years, and putting down a full deposit does have some risk no matter who you are dealing with. 2. Again, I am sure they will stand behind their product 100%, but I would rather be in a bit later run to make sure any kinks or bugs are taken care of ahead of time. But the decision to go that route means I will have to wait while others enjoy their pins! lol

#11734 3 years ago
Quoted from SadSack:

Don't be so sensitive. Your opinion is just as valid as anyone else's..........
even if no one agrees with you!

Not sensitive at all, and it doesn't matter to me if anyone agrees with me or not. I'm still secure in my manhood. The comment was in reference to the fact that we can't just give our opinions and leave it at that...it always has to twist into some sort of strange argument/personal attack. Take your comment for example.......

#11749 3 years ago

Ha...played that game many times a lifetime and many operating systems ago. But you have to admit, it is much better than "you shit yourself to death"...........

#11854 3 years ago

I think if you listen to the video, you will find those sheets are printed on and then laser cut for the playfield plastic set (slings, ramps, etc)......not for covering the playfield.

#11943 3 years ago
Quoted from PappyBoyington:

Has anybody looked into saving some money and buying directly from Highway?

I did, but I think you get hit either way. The website cost does not include shipping, so I believe all shipments have to come through the US distro

#11967 3 years ago

Put my LE on order a couple of weeks ago and headed to London in a couple of days. Andrew was kind enough to extend an invite for a visit to the plant, but why oh why does he have to be 3 hours in the wrong direction?!! lol Regardless of whether or not I can figure out a way to get to their facility, that is some first class treatment of a customer. He doesn't know me at all, and was willing to humor me in his busy day. When you get customer service like that....the actual cost doesn't seem quite as high for some reason.

#12114 3 years ago
Quoted from PappyBoyington:

Oh, so the standard does not come with any LCD screen in the backbox? It's just a backglass?


1 week later
#12347 3 years ago
Quoted from robotron:

jeeze i feel like i am gonna be unboxing my le come around christmas time.

The "upside" to that statement is there will be a lot of games out there blazing the trail before yours. It will have the benefit of everything learned along the way, and will be a more complete and solid game.

#12378 3 years ago
Quoted from sed6:

Anyone considering skipping the LCD? I really like Aurichs work on the backglass. Without considering resale value or anyone else's opinion I don't have much of a desire for it. For less money I can add PDI and EL lighted side blades and get more playfield enjoyment.

Is there a way to get both.....have the artwork on the LCD when the game is not being played but in standby? Then when you play, it switches to interactive? Or were you just talking from a cost perspective?

#12384 3 years ago
Quoted from sed6:

Per Morgan at Heighway just now the LCD is factory installed only. However, I can, and did, purchase the full translight by itself, just to have! I already have a lighted backbox tho display it in.

No, I probably should have phrased that better. I was talking more of a screensaver type of deal. Have the artwork display on the LCD when it is just sitting and turned on. I have no idea of what actually is displayed, but if you like that artwork, a stationary digital image would be as good as a translite.

1 week later
#12570 3 years ago
Quoted from HeighwayPinball:

Apologies for the radio silence.
We are in regular contact with FOX to have the final LE package approved. We are waiting on one particular high res asset from them - and that's all that is holding things up.
We are very aware of two major dates coming up soon - Alien Day, and the theatrical release of Alien Covenant. We are as keen as you all to release the artwork to you by at least one of these dates.
The preferred date would of course be the former, but we are still planning on beginning LE production at the end of the month.
The other thing here is that there are no major holdups to LE production with regards to artwork or the fibre lighting. We already drive the fibre lighting anyway, with hardware and software used on Full Throttle. We can literally have LE artwork printed within hours, and installed on machines, once we have final FOX approval.
So, the bottom line is that we are pushing hard on all fronts - whilst doing everything we need to do to significantly increase production numbers.

Thanks for the update Andrew. The level of communication alone so far gets you my vote for manufacturer of the year. So looking forward to seeing the LE's roll down the line.

1 week later
#12632 3 years ago
Quoted from HeighwayPinball:

I can tell you now that we pushed the boat out with our financial offer to Sigourney's agent. It was substantial and it was rejected. I very much doubt our competitors bettered our offer. But we will never know.
Honestly - I don't care that we didn't get her in the end. Since the beginning of this game, the player is intended to be playing "as Ripley" so it really makes no sense for Ripley to also be interacting with the player. It would have been "nice" to have her - but we really don't feel the game is poorer without her.

Gotta agree on no Ripley...the position this puts the player in is just perfect. You interact with the other characters and ultimately battle the Alien just as in the series. Something else that got glossed over a few posts ago and that is the statement Andrew made about learning lessons and making changes based on the first games that went out. It's refreshing to see an actual human element back into this process and someone admitting they don't know everything there is to know, and are learning as they go. It is what we all do every day, but so few people admit to it any more. Can't wait for the LE's to start shipping!

#12651 3 years ago
Quoted from PACMAN:

The "you're playing AS Ripley" angle is still pretty weak.
Imagine these pinball machines with the main character replaced by the player.
T2 WITHOUT Arnold.
Nightmare on Elm Street WITHOUT Freddy.
Apollo 13 WITHOUT Tom Hanks.
The Avengers WITHOUT Hulk.
Tron Legacy WITHOUT Flynn.
Demolition Man WITHOUT Stallone.
Star Wars WITHOUT Luke.
Addams Family WITHOUT Gomez.
The Shadow WITHOUT Alec.
Kiss WITHOUT Gene.
Iron Man WITHOUT Stark.
Jurassic Park WITHOUT T-Rex.
Batman WITHOUT Batman.
That being said. The Game is still really amazing in spite of its main, beloved character being absent.

I think the comparisons you are trying to make would be more akin to having an Alien pin with no Alien. Ripley is a main character, but the creature is the star. The game is just fine without her in it, and so far as the "play as her" angle, I think it fits very well. Just my .02 cents.

#12679 3 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

April 2015 was NEVER taken seriously by anyone who knows anything. Andrew bit off WAY more than he could chew with that pronouncement and he has apologized for it.
Still....it's now April 2017! I think even the naysayers thought it would be in full swing by now.

I will take a pin with near completed code that is delivered late, any day over one that was pushed out the door just to meet a deadline.

1 week later
#12888 3 years ago
Quoted from mountaingamer:

Wow - would xmas make it about 3 years late?

Not for those of us that came in late! lol

#12987 3 years ago
Quoted from bigdaddy07:

OK, I just got off the phone with Melissa at Cointaker and was told that there is supposed to be a video release of the LE today. This was as of her communication with Heighway earlier today. Let's see what happens.

Hopefully the video will also show completed pins rolling off of the line.

#13048 3 years ago

For those of us with the optional backbox LCD, there has to be a way to incorporate that artwork into the display when the game is idle. I realize there are clips playing etc in attract mode, but it would be nice for a menu option where you can display a static image.

#13055 3 years ago
Quoted from nwpinball:

Would you really want a static image in attract mode over movie clips and full motion color action? I wouldn't, it seems like a waste of technology.

Not all of the time...I would just want the option to turn it on. I really like the artwork, but want the LCD as well.

#13056 3 years ago
Quoted from robotron:

and you would probably burn-in the screen

Screen burn is pretty much a think of the past with the new displays. It can still happen, but nowhere near as common as it was with CRT screens. I wasn't wanting to have it on all of the time, but would love to have the option to turn it on. At the very least it needs to be in the artwork and clips that rotate during idle mode.

#13061 3 years ago
Quoted from JeffF:

Have you seen some of the menu screens at Dunkin Donuts, McDonalds, and/or Burger King? Screen burn still happens. We had it happen to our home theatre PC even.

I had already added an edit to clarify what I said. Yes, I know it still happens to some screens, but there is technology to prevent it, and in most home use situations it wouldn't be an issue unless the pins are left on all of the time. (hence the option to turn it off and on). We can start another thread to discuss screen burn, but as to the LE artwork, I think they nailed it. Now we need to get some pins shipping!

#13065 3 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

You get the full backglass (separately) even if you ordered the 27" display.

Might have to build a light box to display the back glass on the wall next to the game...I am already shopping parts! lol

#13092 3 years ago

Andrew, loved the video. Are there any production updates you can share? Thanks

#13121 3 years ago
Quoted from chrisnack:

I have requested a full refund as well as of a few minutes as ago. I was paid in full.
For $9k I am not comfortable with the lack of information and delays.

Understandable that a lot of folks are gun-shy, and my hope is the days of paying in full in advance are over for this industry. I don't mind minimal deposits, but you are correct in that 9K is a lot to risk or just tie up for a long time. If the games start shipping and are of decent quality, then the orders will roll in, but there needs to be more there than a few hand built prototypes out in the wild. I am still excited for these to come out, and I have faith in Heighway, but they need to show good progress or there are going to be more going the refund route...a point I am sure Andrew is well aware of.

#13169 3 years ago
Quoted from HeighwayPinball:

There have been some suggestions that we have only shipped 2 or 3 Alien games. This is simply not true.
I understand the knives are out for us on Pinside again right now.
We have shipped out a good quantity of games and continue to do so every week. We have a good number of customers with Alien games in 6 different countries right now.
For example, 3 more games left only 5 minutes ago - please see the photo below.
As for the Cointaker shipment - there have been no delays at our end. Please direct any enquiries about the shipment to Cointaker. Their consignment is due to leave very soon in any case.
More parts are coming in daily and production is already ramping up ... and will continue to ramp up until we reach our target of at least 100 games a month

Andrew, I don't think anyone was necessarily bringing the knives out for the company as a whole. You have a proven record of delivering games, and I think everyone believes these will be made (unlike many others), but people in general are impatient....especially when they have a good chunk of cash invested. Add that to the wealth of mis-information and innuendo that is out there, and it doesn't take much for things to turn dark.

Without mentioning names, I think the pot may have been stirred by our famous and so-called "reformed" podcaster who stopped short of making accusations that games would not be delivered, but led folks down that path with his "special edition" podcast. His defenders are going to say he just stated facts, but we all know why he laid out what he did, and that was to stir the pot so he could sit back and watch this thread.

But with that said, the way to take the wind out of that sail is simply to give a little information and dispel the rumors. I understand there are always going to be those that pick at anything you post, but the vast majority are just happy knowing games are rolling off the line, and I don't think that was publicly stated before...at least not formally. I for one am very happy and excited to see your post. My big concern with the industry as a whole is the "pay in full" deposits, and that has nothing to do necessarily with Heighway Pinball itself, but rather how the business has morphed.

#13398 3 years ago
Quoted from HeighwayPinball:

There are many questions about production so I want to give you an update.
We continue to manufacture and ship Standard Edition games on a weekly basis.
We are not at the point of 'mass production' yet as we continue to iron out any issues that may arise. We have had a lot more issues to deal with than we first thought, and we have made some significant changes as a result. Clearly, it is much better to make these changes when smaller numbers of machines have been delivered.
I'd like to take this chance to thank all of the early adopters for their patience, and their significant feedback. It really has helped us to develop a better, and more reliable game.
I understand everyone's frustration at the slow production figures - but this will change, and soon. We will continue to ramp up SE production to clear our current backlog. LE production is also beginning now and we expect to ship significant numbers of LEs in June and July to paid-in-full customers first.
We are 100% committed to delivering this game to everyone who has ordered - and as quickly as quickly as possible. It is our one and only priority

Thanks for the update Andrew. Looking forward to seeing these roll out (as I am sure you are as well)

#13464 3 years ago
Quoted from PinBackpacker:

That's easy to say when your money is in with someone that you know will give you a timely refund...

I know it is not ideal, but waiting 60 or 90 days is a whole lot better than getting nothing at all. Just ask the folks in the JPOP thread. Again, I am not saying you don't have a complaint....the ideal situation is that you would get your money back tomorrow. I have no idea how it became commonplace to just throw money at someone who says they are going to build us a machine, but with all that has happened lately, my sincere hope is that the practice of pre-paying is finished in the pinball world. These games cost far too much for working folks to risk.

#13483 3 years ago
Quoted from SadSack:

All this FUD would disappear if only there were pictures of the trucks being loaded. That's all anyone has been asking for.... to see actual shipments.. And I think it's a reasonable request.

Seeing trucks being loaded would not stop anything. Heighway has shown pics of some games going out, and that stopped nothing. It made things worse. He has also publicly stated today that they are not up to mass production yet, so no matter what happens, there will be no pics of full trailers for a while. Those that are going to complain are going to do so no matter what....... It's Pinside!

#13485 3 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

They should make a concerted effort to ship some games (right away) to some Pinsider's. That way Pinsiders get to actually see and hear about games showing up. That would buy them a little more time...hell it would probably even bring in more cash.

Except those games would not be finished, or have some latest part, and the Pinsiders would be all up on the boards screaming how they got taken and how they want their games fixed right now or a full refund, etc. This is a no-win for Heighway, and he is concentrating on getting changes made and a production line going, which is exactly what he should be doing. Those still in the wait for a game need to have a little more patience. We have seen more of the game over the last couple of months than has been shown for almost 2 years, so as long as they can stay solvent, they have to be close.

#13488 3 years ago
Quoted from SunKing:

Nope - if any Pinsider got the game I took home from TPF, he'd be on here singing it's praises. ...I'll bet on that.

Oh I agree that it is going to be a good game, but does your Alien head work? Aren't you waiting on a replacement board? Can you imagine the impatience of a bunch of Pinsiders waiting on that or any other part?

1 week later
#13784 3 years ago

Do we have any confirmation of LE's being produced yet? Or are they all SE to this point?

#13986 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Which is a bunch of F ing BS imo.
I don't really care when/if they get out after all the delays at this point but to ask for FULL payment to go to the front of the line on the LE's when you are clearly nowhere near ready for "production" of said LE's is a F ing joke!!!!

Ice, I agree with you on a lot of things, but in this case just stand back and look at this objectively. He is not forcing anyone to pay in full, and if you are ordering an Alien, then you are most likely an informed buyer. So with that said, I would not blame Andrew for asking, but rather the folks that threw the money on the table. With TBL, JPOP and others out there, I have no idea why anyone would pay in full ahead of time, no matter how stable the company is. If folks are that eager to plunk down 8K on something sight unseen (I have done it too) then they know the risks, and I cannot blame Heighway at all for the strategy he is using.

#14190 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Well I'll maintain my opinion anyhow that it sucked
When I think of the greatness of Alien Covenant is a joke and yes does NOT do Alien brand justice by any stretch
It was more of a comedy slasher with zero fear factor

Personally, I think a lot of the disappointment in the "fear factor" isn't really their fault. I really do think that a lot of society has become so desensitized to this stuff, there is no shock value anymore. Remember the days when your date would bury her face in your shirt when you were at the movies and the bloody scene flashed for just a brief second? Those days are long gone......if there are no bowels, entrails, and exploding brains, then people stop buying the popcorn.

#14192 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

I wouldn't say desensitized but I would say dumbified, too much thought is needed to become genuinely involved in a film and thusly scared in a way that results from it.

I agree with that thought as well, except a lot of the "gore" films don't require a whole lot of thought on the part of the viewer to begin with. But you are right in that movies have evolved from telling a story and creating thought to simply being entertainment or something to occupy our OCD brains for a few minutes. But I really do think there is some kind of desensitization that has happened, and no, I don't blame video games, but I do think they are a part of the problem. I could go on and on how society changed just in the 20 plus years that I was a cop, and how people have become so consumed in their own personal being, that nothing phases anyone anymore. Change is part of life, but change isn't always for the better.

#14197 3 years ago
Quoted from nwpinball:

I dunno, I watch a lot of horror and there are lots of great directors still figuring out how to find fear in their audience with their films. What was so great about the first Alien movie is the slow build up... creepy lighting, creepy music, slowly the audience figuring out something was going to happen and then waiting and waiting as the tension built up to see what would happen. Directors can still do that. When they jump straight to the action, yeah, you are right, we've seen it all before, what they need to work on is the tension and suspense.

Probably just as much credit goes to the editors as the directors. I can't tell you how many films that magically made sense after I went back and watched the Director's cut. If an editor and Director are not on the same page, or if god forbid 'money' is driving the editing....then a great movie can be reduced to total garbage with just a couple of bad snips.

#14206 3 years ago
Quoted from lapean111:

Agreed. . When Stern announces Star Wars, if there hasn't been any movement, my money is moving on over to Stern.

As much as I hate to admit it, there are some other options that are beginning to look more attractive.

#14376 3 years ago
Quoted from FalconPunch:

Did Heighway send you the replacement armor? Or did you just do it yourself out of your own pocket?

Might as well give up asking....it's obvious Circus is playing games with his/her answers and has not put out the full story all along.

#14396 3 years ago
Quoted from FrederikFrost:

Imagine all the confusion that could be avoided if people didn't insinuade or vaguely describe things. A lot of misunderstanding could be avoided. I don't want to take sides, but sometimes all the vague responses from people makes it a lot easier to be sceptical, and could surely be grounds for conspiracy theories - Which sucks if there's no grounds for it.

This was done on purpose. When people start playing games like this, I start to get nervous.............

#14401 3 years ago

It's obvious to me that games are not shipping in mass because there are still pieces that are missing to the puzzle. In this case, the buyer just said ship what you can get me and I will take it from there. Not a bad way to go if you are going to do your own custom colors and don't want fiber ramps. etc. It would just be nice if someone would post the truth about the wait. I still have faith Heighway will eventually get this right, but I hate games.

#14402 3 years ago
Quoted from Buzz:

Starting to seem like a cash grab con unfortunately. Get people excited if they buy now they can get their game but the majority will just join the rest of us with no game then trickle out another one or two to try to get more money

But keep in mind, if this taking place is the difference between getting a pin and the company being insolvent, then I don't think most will gripe too loud. They will not like it, but at least we will see movement. I have an order and a deposit, but I am not paid in full. I can't in good faith send in more money until I know my pin is being built, but I would have no problem with new orders coming before mine if they paid up and gave the company a shot in the arm.....so long as I eventually get mine.....lol

#14438 3 years ago

To add some fairness to all of this...how many of you reading are getting PM's from RubberDucks urging you to withdraw your funds? He/She may fully have our best interests at heart, but I have to question getting multiple e-mails really trying to get me to pull my money, even after I said I fully accepted the risk. This may very well be the beginning of the end, or maybe Heighway will surprise us all, but whatever decision you make, do it with an open mind and do what YOU want to do, not what someone else is urging you to do.

#14441 3 years ago
Quoted from ultimategameroom:

I got my refund back from Cointaker about a week ago.
Melissa was Great to deal with as usual! My CC was credited within 48 hours of my refund request.
I'm going to sit back and see how this all plays out. If Cointaker has machines for sale,new in the box at Allentown next year I will probably leave with one. I'm Sick and tired of this preorder BS.

Agreed, and I sincerely hope this part of pinball is put to bed forever.....I don't care what company it is, including Stern themselves....I refuse to pre-pay anything again.

#14449 3 years ago
Quoted from rubberducks:

You seemed to be labouring under the delusion that I specifically tried to clarify the legalities of vis-a-vis solvency yesterday, whilst being worried about your order. I tried to offer you some advice privately.
I haven't e-mailed you at all, either, and after an initial brief message, I simply replied to your responses. You expressed much greater doubt about HW and the situation than you publicly did here, remember. Do as you wish.

I have expressed a LOT of doubt here.....and yes you responded to my messages, but you started by PM'ing me first, and kept responding with advice to pull my money no matter what I said. I can take care of my own finances and if there is a lesson to be learned, then I am big enough to do that on my own as well.

#14506 3 years ago
Quoted from ultimategameroom:

I hear ya....
Until Elvira 3 gets officially announced !!!

Probably for some, but not for me.

#14513 3 years ago
Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

You gotta be shitting me...60 day refunds so he can buy a Porsche?

Who knows if that is even true....if he does have one, it could be a lease, rental, or just belongs to a neighbor......Only gold-diggers judge wealth by the cars people drive these days. There are too many ways to be a poser.........

#14535 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Here is the HUGE plus factor going on, Heighway has a great pin, home run theme on its hands and big sales in the future if the numbers can work out for an investor.
Let's hope the "investor" meetings go well.
Deep pockets can fix a lot, look at JJP.

Ice, I love ya man, but this is how shit gets started. We have no knowledge of "investor meetings" taking place. All Andrew said was there would be an announcement coming. The conclusion regarding an investor is purely conjecture, just like that crazy claim of a new Porsche. Let's just keep our ideas in our own heads and wait to see what the announcement is. If it is what you suspect, then we can all high-five. But we also have to be prepared the announcement may be something totally different.

#14590 3 years ago
Quoted from rvdv:

It does not take a genius to figure out that Andrew needs a financial partner/infusion to continue.
If there are enough financial assets and sales nrs on the books he should be able to secure a short term loan or maybe investor.
Timing needs to be right , longer he waits to get financing, the more orders he will loose and upset everyone with orders in place and request refunds( no money there the refund anyway , all tight up)
Preordering games is high risk and always has been, like riding stock market. If you can't afford to loose that kind of money don't do it.
Andrew please show more clarity in your communication, all will be revealed answers will just infuriate people.
How many Aliens were ordered/sold?
From there people can do the math since we all know math, at least some of us
Hope you succeed mate!

Sorry for using this quote as an example....I am NOT singling you out here, just trying to make a point.

As hard a pill as it might be to swallow, we the buyers really have no say in Andrew's company, and we have no right to demand or dictate anything. Yes, we all sent in money that he is either holding or has spent, but that still does not give us any rights other than the rights of any consumer with any other company, and that is to either keep our money into the game or to file for a refund. Even if you do not get your refund and you have to fight for it, you still have NO rights to information or to how the company is run unless dictated by a court of law. We don't do it in any other industry, and I can't for the life of me figure out why folks think pinball is different. For some reason, we all automatically think we are all major stockholders because we put in a deposit. Andrew has a company, and he advertised a product. We all sent money for that product (knowing the risk), and we should be receiving a product for that money. If you are mad at the lack of communication, lack of production, or all of the "lies", then file for a refund and go through the proper channels. If you are staying in the game, then you have no choice but to go along for the ride. All of the second-guessing and demands do nothing but stir up a bunch of crap. It changes nothing, and Andrew still does what he thinks is correct. I am as frustrated as everyone here, but we do not run this company, and we are all jumping to stupid conclusions. The Porsche story is a prime example.....I am glad Andrew put it to rest, but because someone mentioned something, it became a fact and sent folks into orbit. Again, I am not suggesting we should not protect ourselves and our investment......but that DOES NOT mean we get to tell Andrew or anyone else what to do. Put yourself in his shoes....with the shitshow this has become, would any of you respond if you were him? Really?

#14594 3 years ago
Quoted from rvdv:

No offense taken.
Just wandering to what extend in preordering with payments in advance for a year or more will warrant some reasonable information from a company that was Partially funded by this.
You can call each a shareholder.
Examples for recent promised games with money payed in advance all turned sour and sure lack of transparency.
I hope Andrew succeeds but this "hobby" and "funtime" sure turning

I agree with your statement that things have been looking bleak for a while and I totally understand the frustration levels. Hopefully this new announcement will be good, but keep in mind Andrew did not say an announcement was coming....he said they "Hoped" to be making an announcement, so we all need to be prepared that the announcement may never come.

#14607 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Sorry Manimal but i totally 1000% disagree. That's ok, no biggie.
If I or any other business owner treated our PAID clients or prospective clients this way I'd be out of business so fast it would make your head spin.
This is pinball though so for some reason, people seem afraid to confront the truth. And it's not just Andrew, its Stern, JJP and everybody else except for possibly Spooky.
See little ole Spooky for how to treat a customer and being honest and upfront and setting EXPECTATIONS properly!
And I respect Andrew for acknowledging the deficiencies and hopefully is able to move forward and do great things.
As a Woz customer from day one, Jpop customer from day one and Alien customer from day one, my PATIENCE meter is still ok. Life is too short and plenty of other pins to play in the meantime.

Ice you just made my entire point. YES, you would be out of business so fast it would make your head spin.....BUT, that would be because your customers would exercise the only rights they have, and that would be to stop buying your product. Even though you treated them that way, you would argue to your last breath they have no business in your business........and you can't say you wouldn't, you have far too many posts on this forum for anyone to believe you! lol

As to the Spooky reference...they are great folks for sure, but what they do has absolutely nothing to do with Heighway Pinball, nor does JJ, Stern or JPOP for that matter. I never suggested anyone avoid the truth for anything, I simply pointed out we have no right to demand and make accusations and assumptions about his business.

#14608 3 years ago
Quoted from Razorbak86:

From a legal perspective, a "buyer" who has not yet received either a game or a refund is a creditor.
In the UK, when a company is solvent, there is no reason for directors to consider the interests of creditors. However, when a company is insolvent, the directors must consider creditors in priority to shareholders (West Mercia Safetywear Ltd [in Liquidation] v Dodd [1988] BCLC 250). It is the period in between solvency and insolvency which causes most difficulties - i.e., the "zone of insolvency", aka the "twilight zone".
Source: Director's Duties in the "Zone of Insolvency", Simon Baskerville and Inga West, Ashurst LLP, 6th edition of The International Comparative Legal Guide to: Corporate Governance 2013; published by Global Legal Group Ltd, London (www.iclg.co.uk).

And did I not say "outside of a court of law"? If a court ruling opens up the business for everyone to see, then so be it. But until then, we cannot judge a company insolvent on a bunch of rumors and things posted on forums. I stand by my statement.

#14611 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I'm not sure wtf you are talking about right now manchild and i don't know if i believe myself on anything other than i love pinball!
Btw, its a 2000% given that regardless of planes, trains and automobiles, Heighway pinball is insolvent
And THAT i will stand by Captain Dan!

Sorry Ice, I kind of stated that a little vague. What I meant by the comment is you are very passionate and vocal about your beliefs, and although I don't know you personally, I can judge a little bit from what you post. I doubt seriously you would take kindly to personal attacks and business demands from those customers you pissed off, no matter how right or wrong you were.

And as to insolvent...it's possible, I will admit the evidence points that way....but there isn't one of us that knows for sure. Maybe a family member was sick, or maybe his dog died, or any number of other possible issues......the end result is you have no actual figures to base that assumption on.

#14612 3 years ago
Quoted from Dee-Bow:

Ok, I'll say it.. Iceman & Manimal ! & Enough boys! Haha..faaak, go play some pinball!! Or sip scotch or smoke a doobie

It's all good....I agree with ICE more than not....we are just passing the time and taking you all along on the ride! lol

#14631 3 years ago

Holy cow people, can we just give this a rest for a little bit?

Stop with the rumor, innuendo, accusations, and the "You didn't hear it from me, BUT......."

If you have any questions about the posts from above, go back and read them. Right now there is NOTHING to report, and Andrew does NOT own an RV! lol There may or may not be an announcement coming soon, and people may or may not be happier than they are right now.

3 weeks later
#15318 3 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

It is sad and disgusting what so many of you are insinuating regarding the team that worked to put this game together!
I suggest taking a step back and realizing that they are not schilling for a game so they can get paid. If anything they have all been the opposite and have been open about the situation and provided insight to others that may feel left out of the communication loop.
These guys are all first and foremost pinheads and have so much passion that they have been working for free in many cases. They have so much passion and desire to help that they made arrangements to NOT get paid unless the game does well and actually sells. Many of them take payment of an actual game and pennies for the time they put in. Please take a moment to reflect on the reality of this situation and stop attacking your fellow pinheads. If anything you should be supporting them and commending them for their hard work to get the game this far, their passion to keep pinball alive and keep it moving forward, and their willingness to come here and provide info when they are able.
They are all super genuine guys in real life and frankly some of you are being HUGE dbags to them.

And I suggest you stand back and take a look at the situation as a whole and realize a lot of folks here have been lied to and misled for years. I fully understand the development team were not the problem, and they were misled like everyone else, but I can also see how anything said by anyone connected with the company right now could be suspect. But with that said, in this case I didn't even see that intention....I took it as an honest question as to whether they were now getting paid for their work, no more-no less. I am not sure how you can read an attack into a single question. We get your position, it has been well documented here.....you just need to respect and accept the fact others may have questions they want to ask, and/or opinions that differ from yours, none of which constitutes an attack on anyone.

#15335 3 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

you need to also respect that there are a few people that have either never had money in, have already gotten funds back, or purposefully are in every HP thread on a daily basis trying to constantly stir for the drama effect only. When these same people go out of their way to attack the character of people that dont deserve it then frankly it pisses me off. This is not about 1 question... This is constant pot stirring from the same handful of people. They need to get off their loser butts and do something constructive for pinball if they want any leg to stand on when attacking these developers that are not even remotely part fo the problem.
We all need to also keep in mind that ANYONE that paid even a penny over the 1k deposit needs (on their own and so long as not lied to about game being ready to ship) to take on some blame in this situation. These people opted to pay in more than needed for their own personal reasons (jump the line, get a game sooner, etc...) but those funds enabled this all to go on/ go on longer. So sick of all the people in this hobby taking no personal accountability for anything in life.
Lets face it, at this stage in pinball if you pay anything for a game in advance then that risk is on you. If you pay anything more than a nominal deposit then you are enabling a situation (good or bad; that is your decision but you automatically take some ownership of the situation once you pay more than deposit).
Want to be mad at someone, be mad at Andrew. Be mad at new managment team as they are now the new Andrew and took on that finacial risk and potential reward. However, dont be mad at the guys that worked for free at this stage and put in countless hours for the love of pinball. Attacking their character will not stand man.

And just what the hell does any of that have to do with the question that was asked? He simply asked if the person posting was getting paid. That person could respond in any number of ways ranging from politely answering the question, to telling him it was none of his business, but I never took it as any kind of shit-stirring. If you were going to interject yourself into the conversation, maybe you should ask for a little clarification before you immediately fly off the handle.

And as to the people that pre-paid.....well you need to send then all a little thank-you note. Had they not put money into the company, you just might not have your nice Alien pin out there on route earning you money. Andrew might have folded shop long ago, and you don't know if the investors would have taken over at that point of the game. For that matter, I am betting most folks didn't pre-pay in full...most were deposit only. In fact, I was not going to put any deposit down and wait for the pin to hit the street, but it was your famous string of wonderful posts that the game was starting to ship and "oh what a glorious thing it is" claims that pushed me to put down a deposit. I am sure others were in the same boat, and I fully realize you will come back with something about telling everyone not to put money down, etc....and yes, we are all adults and responsible for our own decisions. But the truth of the matter is your game and a couple of others went out for one reason...to generate interest and pre-orders. You were either a willing participant in that lie, or you were played like a fiddle like the rest of us. I'll admit, I was lucky....I got all of my deposit back from the cc company. A lot of other folks are not going to be near that lucky, and I don't blame them or anyone else in the hobby that has an interest in this game from being skeptical, or downright mad at what has happened here. You don't need to lose money on an Alien pin to see how this (and others) have damaged the hobby for us all.

#15339 3 years ago
Quoted from MK6PIN:

Completely agree. People do things for their own reasons, and see zero relevance to why the company is in the state it's in. Aurich gone from here, now I'm sure Ferret will be hesitant to post, as well. If/ how much compensation is given to an employee is between them and their employer. F**king rude question, period.
I'm out of pinside for awhile (at least)....really turning south for me. Love pinball, Hate this shit......

And he never asked how much a person made.....he just asked if he was getting compensated. I am sure Ferret can answer or decline and life goes on. I find it really strange how one simple question can cause so many hard feelings.

#15345 3 years ago
Quoted from Dee-Bow:

either way it's NONE of your business. how much are compensated for your efforts at work? you also didn't answer if you paid in full or just a deposit! So I'll assume neither and you're talking out your ass. Sonny_Jim is now the self appointed voice of the "short changed" staff members?! who the hell asked you to do that!? this thread is asinine! I come here in hopes of hearing news on alien pinball, not a bit of dip shits talking out their ass about shit they know nothing about!

And who gives a crap if DCFAN has any money down or not? So you are saying he has no right to ask a simple question or to form an opinion because he hasn't invested in the game? last time I checked, the forums were open to just about anyone, and I think you will find a LOT of posts in other threads from people that have no financial interest in a game...have you ever posted in a thread for a game you don't own? If the thread is "asinine" as you put it, then feel free to leave. This was all from a simple question as to whether these folks were getting paid yet.....the only "asinine" part of it is all of the people coming out of the jungle to make assumptions and to interject themselves into a conversation they were no part of.

#15372 3 years ago
Quoted from Agent_Hero:

I saw in one of these threads that some were contacted for final payment since shipping was imminent. Probably back when machines were said to be shipping in April/May.

There were others who paid more or paid in full to be at the front of the line. The way Andrew structured the ordering, the more you paid, the farther up the line you went. I believe those were the folks he is referring to. There were others that were asked to pay because their games were supposedly shipping, and there were many that jumped in late when a couple of games hit the street and they saw the deadflip video and were also told production lines were up and games were going out the door.

#15378 3 years ago
Quoted from jonesjb:

I see. I suppose to each their own, but my personal thinking is that the potential benefit of getting your game earlier isn't worth the risk of having more money to lose. Additionally I'd prefer to get a later pin that has had kinks worked out.

Totally agree, but there were several folks that wanted the first ones off the line. Of course Andrew was promising they would be updated if any new parts came out, etc. I can see how folks got caught up in the hype, and he tried his best to talk me into paying in full, but I only did the min deposit. Sadly, I will never even do a deposit again...doesn't matter who the manufacturer is. The only way that practice will go away is for us to stop handing over the money.

#15379 3 years ago
Quoted from robotron:

i would never do such a thing. i would wait for later games especially with early model issues.

I never said you did .....lol If you had used the full quote, I just laid out the various groups of folks Andrew was drawing from..

#15382 3 years ago

No I didn't..........

2 weeks later
#15571 3 years ago
Quoted from TimeBandit:

I feel the line in front of me getting shorter.

If you are living in Jonestown and someone is offering you KoolAid, that may not necessarily be a good thing....

9 months later
#21527 2 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

My posting history on Alien has been pretty clear. great game, super fun, love the layout, built well. But DON'T PREORDER PINBALL MACHINES UNLESS YOU UNDERSTAND THE RISKS and take accountabilit for your actions.
DEspite some people being incapable of understanding that I learned from the SkitB fiasco and have been explicitly clear numerous times about why people should not preorder these toys... my posting history has been very clear for anyone to read without improper edits.

Hilton, I don't know you, and I don't know your history or have any bias towards you. But with that said, regardless of the quotes that may have been "cherry picked", it is my opinion you and Andrew knew EXACTLY what you were doing when you made such a big deal about having the 1st machine on location and constantly bragging about what a great machine it is (or was). I don't know the deal you guys worked, but it was obvious he needed the pre-order money to get games out of his factory, and he needed to generate some hype to make that happen. You generated the hype he needed, knowing full well what you were doing and why, and several people jumped in with deposits when it was represented these were going into full production. I doubt you knew the extent to which Andrew had already run things into the ground, but none the less, you were a lot of the reason some folks put their hard money down. Yes, they are responsible for their own actions, and everyone should know at this point in time about plunking down a bunch of money on an un seen game. I myself put down the minimum and got a return from my credit card very shortly thereafter when it became obvious the games were not actually going into full production as claimed. Maybe you did not tell people to put those deposits down, but you still acted as a shill to help drive needed revenue for Heighway pinball, intentional or not. (EDIT: This is not a personal attack on Hilton, but more an observation regarding the motivation for some orders that were placed. It seems to me Hilton is trying to distance himself from the product and he wants folks to believe he was actually the "good guy" here, trying to warn people not to be foolish with their money. While it is true he did not hold a gun to anyone's head to get them to write a check......he sure made one heck of a sales pitch.)

#21568 2 years ago
Quoted from colonel_caverne:

to blame him as if he knew what was going to happen is purely foolish

If you read what I wrote, I am not blaming him for anything other than the hype, which is well documented. I specifically said I doubted he had any idea as to how far Andrew had run the company into the ground, and I don't believe he had any idea how this would end up.

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