(Topic ID: 106728)

ALIEN PINBALL - Game Over, Man, Game Over


By HeighwayPinball

4 years ago



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#21751 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

The post you quoted is at least 10 lines.
And it's a fair question, and I appreciate you not singling me out (unlike certain people).. But as long as certain people continue to go out of their way to personally insult me, I'll probably occaisionally chime in with a response. You would too.
Besides, I don't get the whole "why are you posting messages on a message board" thing. That's the whole point and the reason Pinside exists.
So I guess it's more of an existential question?

I have no idea. Which one is at Pockateers in Buffalo?

My question wasn't "why are you posting on a message board". It's why are you so actively participating in an Alien thread when you feel the game sucks? I see it's just to practice your wit. It could use some work.

#21752 1 year ago
Quoted from zeddex:

Heighway Re-Birth refunded my paid direct to Heighway LE machine cost in full last August or Sept. I had been in since Feb 2015. I was lucky, and their track record was not consistant obviously....but the new company was trying to make things right, at least initially.

Then why did Heighway Pinball 1.5 register a new company entity known as Pinball Brothers, at the same time that they organized themself? It just so happens HP 1.5 goes tits up in six months and all assets are moved (and old liabilities are left behind) to Pinball Brothers. Final straw happened so fast it was "like" they snuck away in the dark of night. Heighway Pinball 1.5 was never trying to make things right, as you say.

Instead they needed the company to continue operating at a slow pace. Legal hoops, strategy etc, so they hired Helmet to do what he could and gave him almost no parts. Once the appropriate time had passed, they fired all employees and contractors, removed all assets and disappeared. The upcoming liquidation is a joke. Bet those Cockroaches didn't leave many crumbs.

#21753 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Then why did Heighway Pinball 1.5 register a new company entity known as Pinball Brothers, at the same time that they organized themself? It just so happens HP 1.5 goes tits up in six months and all assets are moved (and old liabilities are left behind) to Pinball Brothers. Final straw happened so fast it was "like" they snuck away in the dark of night. Heighway Pinball 1.5 was never trying to make things right, as you say.
Instead they needed the company to continue operating at a slow pace. Legal hoops, strategy etc, so they hired Helmet to do what he could and gave him almost no parts. Once the appropriate time had pass, they fired all employees and contractors, removed all assets and disappeared. The upcoming liquidation is a joke. Bet those Cockroaches didn't leave many crumbs.

No.

#21754 1 year ago
Quoted from zeddex:

Heighway Re-Birth refunded my paid direct to Heighway LE machine cost in full last August or Sept. I had been in since Feb 2015. I was lucky, and their track record was not consistant obviously....but the new company was trying to make things right, at least initially.

Not my case. They wouldn't respond to my emails or calls after I informed them I wanted a refund in that same timeframe. I was lucky enough to have the CC company work on my behalf to obtain my deposits. It seemed they wouldn't respond to them either. Credit to my account even after over a 1 year time frame.

#21755 1 year ago

Anyone that lost money on this needs to report it:

https://www.actionfraud.police.uk/report-a-fraud-including-online-crime-questions

Be sure and include the new owners:

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08087382/officers

Their shell company Pinball Brothers

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/10822960/officers

And the other shell company Umbrella Corporation AS (a norwegian company) 50% owned by Roger Svanevik

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08087382/filing-history

15
#21756 1 year ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

I would of liked Sigourney Weaver in it

People have often said that, but I've never heard anyone explain how Sigourney would significantly improve the game. You would get the quote "Get away from her, you bitch!" at the start of Loader Battle ... and that is indeed an awesome, iconic quote. We probably would've used "I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit -- it’s the only way to be sure" somewhere. But, ummm, that's really about it. She doesn't have much else in quotes or action that would really enhance the game, IMHO.

#21757 1 year ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Sometimes posts get completely deleted. Like they never happened.

You don't say!

#21758 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Heighway Pinball 1.5 was never trying to make things right, as you say.

I’m not saying anything other than someone there wired me over $8K. I was lucky....it was total scattershot. No one ever confirmed it with me either, so the communication was terrible even when they did the right thing. Sending out refunds and pinball machines - regardless of how inconsistent - with no effort to champion any of that into a cascade of additional purchases were hardly the actions of some elaborate international scam to steal money. At least in my opinion. Business investors that got in way over their heads and then go at desperate towards the end. Just my take and I am genuinely sad for people not lucky on the refund part. It totally sucks all around and I hope some justice comes out of it somehow.

#21759 1 year ago

Just read this now. Astonishing, what an A$$h&le

I would have liked to see the face of Andrew when he heard this after he desperately wanted R. to work on the game to get it ready for shipment:

A: 'This is NOT a request. I'm telling you, as your boss, to be there please. Thanks and goodnight.'

R: 'I won't be there. And neither on Monday. Sorry i got to go, I've computer games waiting for me you know !'

#21761 1 year ago
Quoted from Tim_may:

Anyone that lost money on this needs to report it:
https://www.actionfraud.police.uk/report-a-fraud-including-online-crime-questions
Be sure and include the new owners:
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08087382/officers
Their shell company Pinball Brothers
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/10822960/officers
And the other shell company Umbrella Corporation AS (a norwegian company) 50% owned by Roger Svanevik
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08087382/filing-history

This needs to be posted everywhere.

#21762 1 year ago

Saw in the Mr Pinball classified email today that Wayne (Australia) has a few LEs & standards he's selling NIB. $10k / $9k.

Not sure why, but somehow I'd still feel like I was supporting Andrew if I bought one. What could have been for this pin...

#21763 1 year ago

Yes well we all have to recover our losses as well

Losses not profits

#21764 1 year ago
Quoted from Ferret:

People have often said that, but I've never heard anyone explain how Sigourney would significantly improve the game. You would get the quote "Get away from her, you bitch!" at the start of Loader Battle ... and that is indeed an awesome, iconic quote. We probably would've used "I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit -- it’s the only way to be sure" somewhere. But, ummm, that's really about it. She doesn't have much else in quotes or action that would really enhance the game, IMHO.

Im not aware of anyone knowing the exact reason why she wasn’t licensed. Obviously there is a cost but was the money that could of been used pissed away by Andrew? If that was the case, what your argument is, is whether there was enough value in the fee to license her. I don’t think either of us could or care to perform a price analysis on this though. What i will say is that she could of been used in the art, the video and the audio. If Andrew did license her i dont think you’d tell Andrew it was a mistake as she only has two quotes and he wasted his money. What you’d do is have some additional options with integrating her into the game.

#21765 1 year ago

The game plays great without her, I didn't miss her while playing.

#21767 1 year ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

The game plays great without her, I didn't miss her while playing.

Well, we don’t have a version with or without her to compare. What if the version with her was superior but mishandled funds prevented that from occuring. The game would be compromised at that point, thats all im saying and this is in response to a post i made yesterday.

#21768 1 year ago

Ripley has tons of great lines in Aliens. Again, should have just made Aliens (not a dig against first movie but 2nd is much more "pinball")

That said, they did a pretty amazing job of making an Alien game without her

HP is like an Alien. If one scrap remains there's still danger. Should just nuke the whole site from orbit. Only way to be sure. (Ripley line)

#21769 1 year ago
Quoted from Tim_may:

Anyone that lost money on this needs to report it:
https://www.actionfraud.police.uk/report-a-fraud-including-online-crime-questions
Be sure and include the new owners:
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08087382/officers
Their shell company Pinball Brothers
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/10822960/officers
And the other shell company Umbrella Corporation AS (a norwegian company) 50% owned by Roger Svanevik
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08087382/filing-history

Quoted from hank527:

This needs to be posted everywhere.

I think this is a bad idea.

Unless you actually have some verifiable evidence, or reasonable suspicion of them acting in a fraudulent manner towards you, you should not do this.

It is unlikely to harm them if you're wrong.

HOWEVER, it may well harm any investigations into what Andrew did and didn't do. If they get a bunch of erroneous reports about the investors' actions post takeover, they're more likely to regard what Andrew did as not worth their time. Whilst there appears to be a growing mountain of evidence against him, as more and more people come out of the woodwork, it's unwise to jeopardise that with potentially spurious or frivolous reports against the investors. TLDR - don't muddy the water or confuse things if you don't need to.

#21770 1 year ago

Can the OS not be made open source at all? ferret

#21771 1 year ago
Quoted from Ferret:

She doesn't have much else in quotes or action that would really enhance the game, IMHO.

Ferret...I forgot...did you get paid?

#21772 1 year ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

Im not aware of anyone knowing the exact reason why she wasn’t licensed.

No one on the team could tell you even if we wanted to. As with anything controlled completely by Andrew you can only go by what he said, and trusting his narration is foolish.

All I can say is as far as I know Fox said we couldn't use her without her permission, likely as a courtesy to their star, not a legal thing, and she declined to give it. I'm sure Andrew reached out in some fashion, but Sigourney may have never even known about it, maybe he was blown off by an agent or someone down the chain, no clue.

We also couldn't use the non-US actors, because they had different contracts apparently. Shrug.

Honestly of all the issues we faced this feels like the most minor to me. I don't think anyone can say the sound and visuals of this game aren't immersive for the universe.

#21773 1 year ago
Quoted from Aurich:

All I can say is as far as I know Fox said we couldn't use her without her permission,

I think plain and simple, it just came down to money....

#21774 1 year ago
Quoted from spfxted:

I think plain and simple, it just came down to money....

Entirely possible, but my instinct is if you see her at a convention or something and ask her about the Alien pinball you'll get a blank look and she won't know what you're talking about.

#21775 1 year ago
Quoted from ZenTron:

Well, we don’t have a version with or without her to compare. What if the version with her was superior but mishandled funds prevented that from occuring. The game would be compromised at that point, thats all im saying and this is in response to a post i made yesterday.

You could say that about pretty much any themed game to be honest. I mean, with hindsight is there many games that couldn't be improved in one way or another?

Apart from the "Get away from her you bitch" quote, the more memorable ones were Hudson (RIP), Apone etc.

#21776 1 year ago
Quoted from Aurich:

ask her about the Alien pinball you'll get a blank look and she won't know what you're talking about.

Oh I totally believe that. Andrew probably just spoke to an agent, got a figure and said, "Ahhh, we don't need her anyway!"

#21777 1 year ago
Quoted from spfxted:

Oh I totally believe that. Andrew probably just spoke to agent, got a figure and said, "Ahhh, we don't need her anyway!"

I wonder if she would be offended if she came across the machine and discovered she wasn't in it.

Little chance of that happening now.

#21778 1 year ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

I wonder if she would be offended if she came across the machine and discovered she wasn't in it.

Little chance of that happening now.

Don't know if she likes pinball. Met her once, nice lady. For her, it would just be a job. Ask about rights, if ok, pay fee, use her image and/or voice. Happens all the time...

#21779 1 year ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Entirely possible, but my instinct is if you see her at a convention or something and ask her about the Alien pinball you'll get a blank look and she won't know what you're talking about.

I did and she did that exactly

#21780 1 year ago
Quoted from spfxted:

Ferret...I forgot...did you get paid?

I already got bashed for a similar question many months ago:

Quoted from DCFAN:

Are you getting paid for doing the software?

It is not surprising that Whysnow was one of the downvoters.

23
#21781 1 year ago

Ripley: Best efforts were made to secure the rights to use Sigourney Weaver's likeness and voice from both movies. Andrew made an offer to her agent which was refused. I don't participate in the mechanics of licensing but after 12 years I have a notion of what is generally paid and HP's first offer was on target. HP responded with a better offer and that was refused as well. This offer was well above what actors generally get for permissions.
Keep in mind, we were not getting any of Ms. Weaver's time for custom callouts, just permission to use her likeness and voice from the films.
Her agent was doing her job as she saw it. I have no idea of whether her agent brought either offer to Ms. Weaver.

At that point AH made the judgement that it was too costly per game to get the rights.

As you get to the end of each film it becomes harder to dance around the fact that you cannot use Ripley but the team danced very well. It turned out to be a nice to have and not a deal breaker in our judgment (unless you still have that poster with Ripley in the tee-shirt, by now your wife should have taken that down).

This is what happened to the best of my knowledge.

ddt

#21782 1 year ago

Licensing is hard
I heard $100k was what Johnny Depp was asking for use of his voice for pirates
Most license holders won't pickup a pen for less than $20k

#21783 1 year ago
Quoted from zeddex:

Heighway Re-Birth refunded my paid direct to Heighway LE machine cost in full last August or Sept. I had been in since Feb 2015. I was lucky, and their track record was not consistant obviously....but the new company was trying to make things right, at least initially.

Quoted from neverahighscore:

Not my case. They wouldn't respond to my emails or calls after I informed them I wanted a refund in that same timeframe. I was lucky enough to have the CC company work on my behalf to obtain my deposits. It seemed they wouldn't respond to them either. Credit to my account even after over a 1 year time frame.

I put in my paid-in-full refund request about 3 weeks before Andrew left & everything went to hell. I believe the only reason I got my refund was because I asked immediately when new group took over, and I would not stop hounding them until the wire transfer went through. They were pretty good at communicating that first month after the takeover.

They just underestimated how many people were going to ask for refunds, which they paid out of their own pockets. I think that severely screwed up their relaunch plans. It was almost comical at the time when they said "well the price is going to increase very soon, if you drop out now & change your mind, you're going to end up paying thousands more...."

Yeeeeeeeeah ok......just give me my effing deposit ASAP & get me off this sinking ship thanks.

As more people waited to see what would happen, and communication dried up, the odds of getting your refund became practically impossible.

#21784 1 year ago

I remember reading that text exchange, but I don't recall how I stumbled on it. It wasn't on pinside. It was a huge eye opener for me that (among other factors) lead to me dropping out. For me, it was the first real look at how things were really effed up behind the scenes. It was appalling to see how Andrew spoke & treated his employees. Writing was on the wall for years, if only customers had the opportunity to see the real shitshow.

#21786 1 year ago
Quoted from Marv:

Can the OS not be made open source at all? ferret

The OS is already open source, it’s Linux.

I would be surprised if the game code was ever open sourced.

#21787 1 year ago
Quoted from Ferret:

The OS is already open source, it’s Linux.
I would be surprised if the game code was ever open sourced.

Sorry game code, I'm guessing it wouldn't be too hard to rename certain files then if you wanted to shoe horn Ripley in.

#21788 1 year ago
Quoted from Ferret:

The OS is already open source, it’s Linux.
I would be surprised if the game code was ever open sourced.

You think the code update will drop soon?

#21789 1 year ago
Quoted from Ballypinball:

Licensing is hard
I heard $100k was what Johnny Depp was asking for use of his voice for pirates
Most license holders won't pickup a pen for less than $20k

If Johnny Depp wanted $100k to use his voices from all 5 films JJP should have paid it in my opinion, sounds like a "deal" considering the importance of the character. Over 2,000 games that's only $50 per game and would have added heavily to immersing the player in the POTC world.

JJP is likely saving at least $50 per game now by switching to a single disk on POTC and the trunk remaining open...

#21790 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

If Johnny Depp wanted $100k to use his voices from all 5 films JJP should have paid it in my opinion, sounds like a "deal" considering the importance of the character. Over 2,000 games that's only $50 per game and would have added heavily to immersing the player in the POTC world.

Depends what you get for that price. If he's doing custom made call-outs... yeah, great, no doubt.
Just a few quotes from his movies? Then you'll have to check the movies to see if it's worth it.

#21791 1 year ago

It is crazy for JJP NOT to make a DEAL for Depp. Let's do the math - in reverse. How many (maximum) dollars do you think could be added to current prices for POTC, in order to have Depp included? Even if you don't care about Depp, having it included would make a positive difference to many.

I am going to suggest a number of $2k, which is assuredly more than you were thinking, but we want the maximum. That will be spread across 2000 machines (#pikDFromaZz). That equals $4M going to Depp, and it would cause a per pin cost increase of $2k. So that pin you thought was expensive before, is now EXPENSIVE!

However, if you thought you could stomach paying $500 more to have Depp included, then $1M is the max JJP could offer. A few hundred g's would make it happen imo, and that is easily doable. How else can Jack expect to to be remembered as the hero of pinball and Disney's second favorite son? I'd pay $500 to add Depp into the mix. JJP just needs to announce a $500 price increase around the end of year to cover games going forward. I'll wait.

#21792 1 year ago
Quoted from jlm33:

Depends what you get for that price. If he's doing custom made call-outs... yeah, great, no doubt.
Just a few quotes from his movies? Then you'll have to check the movies to see if it's worth it.

If it was $100k to use audio lines and video featuring the character from all 5 films then that seems "cheap" considering Jack Sparrow is the main character across all 5 films.

#21793 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

If Johnny Depp wanted $100k to use his voices from all 5 films JJP should have paid it

Here is the thing - if its custom call-outs, then there is the expense for that as well. Studio and Audio Engineer time. Recording, prep and delivery fees. Is it near Depp? Transpo, Room & Board my or may not be in that $100K...the list goes on an on. And lets not forget everything else. JJP is not saving any money on a playfield re-design, its costing them money. The design itself, the proto-typing, the code changes. These things can creep quickly and it starts to matter if you have blown above your budget on one VO actor.

#21794 1 year ago

I dig the license discussions, but why so much talk about POTC in the Alien thread

13
#21795 1 year ago
Quoted from zeddex:

Studio and Audio Engineer time. Recording, prep and delivery fees

There is more to consider as well. My work to include the new callouts in the build is no charge as I do the work for a fixed bid (boy am I dumb). However, just having them in the build doesn't get them invoked. It takes considerable effort to call a few hundred callouts properly and that is on the JJP programmers. Do you want a finished game this year?

If the licensor has the same constraints as they did last time around Jack is not allowed to say anything anachronistic. Captain Jack cannot talk about balls or ramps or shots or anything useful so having a custom session is nearly pointless. Extracting all the Captain Jack from five movies will result in some 'color' callouts, "nice to hear Jack" but very few functional callouts.

Kevin McNalley is doing a fantastic job. The team wrote a great script. The callouts are steeped in POTC flavor and are very functional. It is one of the better callout packages I've been associated with.

Now, stop hijacking this thread and continue on a JJPOTC thread if you yearn for Jack.

where's Ripley?.........

ddt

#21796 1 year ago
Quoted from daudioguy:

There is more to consider as well. My work to include the new callouts in the build is no charge as I do the work for a fixed bid (boy am I dumb). However, just having them in the build doesn't get them invoked. It takes considerable effort to call a few hundred callouts properly and that is on the JJP programmers. Do you want a finished game this year?
If the licensor has the same constraints as they did last time around Jack is not allowed to say anything anachronistic. Captain Jack cannot talk about balls or ramps or shots or anything useful so having a custom session is nearly pointless. Extracting all the Captain Jack from five movies will result in some 'color' callouts, "nice to hear Jack" but very few functional callouts.
Kevin McNalley is doing a fantastic job. The team wrote a great script. The callouts are steeped in POTC flavor and are very functional. It is one of the better callout packages I've been associated with.
Now, stop hijacking this thread and continue on a JJPOTC thread if you yearn for Jack.
where's Ripley?.........
ddt

Still think JJP Pirates (original campy theme) would have been so much better than JJP PotC ... and much less of a headache. But I suppose that would bring, to some extent, the agony of choice and unlimited artistic license.

#21797 1 year ago

Alien at pinfest. I thought it was good. Got interesting on my third ball after I got the hang of it. Fun

#21798 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

I dig the license discussions, but why so much talk about POTC in the Alien thread

I don't know why?

Quoted from daudioguy:

There is more to consider as well. My work to include the new callouts in the build is no charge as I do the work for a fixed bid (boy am I dumb). However, just having them in the build doesn't get them invoked. It takes considerable effort to call a few hundred callouts properly and that is on the JJP programmers. Do you want a finished game this year?
If the licensor has the same constraints as they did last time around Jack is not allowed to say anything anachronistic. Captain Jack cannot talk about balls or ramps or shots or anything useful so having a custom session is nearly pointless. Extracting all the Captain Jack from five movies will result in some 'color' callouts, "nice to hear Jack" but very few functional callouts.
Kevin McNalley is doing a fantastic job. The team wrote a great script. The callouts are steeped in POTC flavor and are very functional. It is one of the better callout packages I've been associated with.
Now, stop hijacking this thread and continue on a JJPOTC thread if you yearn for Jack.
where's Ripley?.........
ddt

If Depp was added, all artist should be paid to cover the extra effort. But that aside, could JJP get a sound alike voice for Depp and include it amongst the game's other callouts, and without video?

#21799 1 year ago

I hope there will be an unofficial mod of Alien at some point, with all the quotes from Sigourney Weaver, Ian Holm and John Hurt added. I would love the line: "Did IQs just drop suddenly when I was away?" for the tilt or ball drain. And Ian Holm's line: "I can't lie to you about your chances. But.....you have my sympathies" for game start.

#21800 1 year ago
Quoted from daudioguy:

There is more to consider as well. My work to include the new callouts in the build is no charge as I do the work for a fixed bid (boy am I dumb). However, just having them in the build doesn't get them invoked. It takes considerable effort to call a few hundred callouts properly and that is on the JJP programmers. Do you want a finished game this year?
If the licensor has the same constraints as they did last time around Jack is not allowed to say anything anachronistic. Captain Jack cannot talk about balls or ramps or shots or anything useful so having a custom session is nearly pointless. Extracting all the Captain Jack from five movies will result in some 'color' callouts, "nice to hear Jack" but very few functional callouts.
Kevin McNalley is doing a fantastic job. The team wrote a great script. The callouts are steeped in POTC flavor and are very functional. It is one of the better callout packages I've been associated with.
Now, stop hijacking this thread and continue on a JJPOTC thread if you yearn for Jack.
where's Ripley?.........
ddt

Great points David, very interesting. Thank you.

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